Topic: Is the MTGox - Coinlab deal in trouble? Yes. It is in litigation! (Read 6628 times)

Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 09:54:17 AM

Someone mind explaining to me why you have to claim them on your taxes?
I thought legally Bitcoin was in a grey area at the moment.

It is legally grey as a currency. As an asset its very clear - when it increases above what you paid for it, you are supposed to pay taxes on that.

Only when said asset is converted back to money (sold)

Herodes

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Quote from: sounds on March 22, 2013, 01:36:57 PM

Quote from: Herodes on March 22, 2013, 11:20:33 AM

It wouldn't take much effort on Coinlab and Mtgox's part to have a blog where they could spend 3 minutes a day updating people about the situation..

They did post on another thread that they wanted to hire a PR person. I suspect that's because whatever Mtgox or CoinLab say will have a noticeable effect on the market.

So in one sense, they're being fair by not posting anything. If they did post something, someone would start to claim they were insider trading on the volatility they can cause.

Still I would personally rather see regular posts. It would be more fair if they posted exactly one article at exactly the same time each day (0:00 UTC maybe?).

Oh yeah - updates are better than nothing. Even a twitter stream would do. You do not have to make a press release every time you have something to say.

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Quote from: Herodes on March 22, 2013, 11:20:33 AM

It wouldn't take much effort on Coinlab and Mtgox's part to have a blog where they could spend 3 minutes a day updating people about the situation..

They did post on another thread that they wanted to hire a PR person. I suspect that's because whatever Mtgox or CoinLab say will have a noticeable effect on the market.

So in one sense, they're being fair by not posting anything. If they did post something, someone would start to claim they were insider trading on the volatility they can cause.

Still I would personally rather see regular posts. It would be more fair if they posted exactly one article at exactly the same time each day (0:00 UTC maybe?).

Herodes

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Quote from: pcexpress4less on March 22, 2013, 09:58:31 AM

I'm in the USA and because of withdraw limits and the balances I have on MTGOX I have been withdrawing a $1000 per day. It has hit my Dwolla in less then a few hours and then to my bank by the next day.So in less then 24hrs from MTGOX to my bank. I've had good result with MTGOX over the last year or two. I'm not sure how the the Coinlab deal will play out and being how slow info has been from Coinlab on this deal I think it's safer to watch from the sideline. So I have been trying to get all my funds under my full control until the dust settles. As of today the 22ND I have all my cash out but still have about 11-12k USD worth of Bitcoins in MTGOX. I thought it would be moved today but so far it is still on MTGOX in Japan. I will be pulling to my offline wallet shortly. Anyone in the USA get the new MTGOX USA web page when logging in?

It wouldn't take much effort on Coinlab and Mtgox's part to have a blog where they could spend 3 minutes a day updating people about the situation..

pcexpress4less

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I'm in the USA and because of withdraw limits and the balances I have on MTGOX I have been withdrawing a $1000 per day. It has hit my Dwolla in less then a few hours and then to my bank by the next day.So in less then 24hrs from MTGOX to my bank. I've had good result with MTGOX over the last year or two. I'm not sure how the the Coinlab deal will play out and being how slow info has been from Coinlab on this deal I think it's safer to watch from the sideline. So I have been trying to get all my funds under my full control until the dust settles. As of today the 22ND I have all my cash out but still have about 11-12k USD worth of Bitcoins in MTGOX. I thought it would be moved today but so far it is still on MTGOX in Japan. I will be pulling to my offline wallet shortly. Anyone in the USA get the new MTGOX USA web page when logging in?

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Quote from: Herodes on March 21, 2013, 08:57:13 PM

http://coinlab.com/transition

Live -- March 22

We'll have everyone moved over by March 22!

https://mtgox.com/press_release_20130228.html

Mt. Gox, the owner of the world’s dominant Bitcoin exchange, announced today that they have selected CoinLab as their exclusive partner in the United States and Canada. As of March 29, all US and Canadian customers currently transacting with Mt.Gox will transact through CoinLab, Inc.

So what's the story - if coinlab want to do serious business, they should at least ensure the information on their webpage is correct. Has everyone been moved over at this point ? If not, then update the webpage !

It appears that they will be able to have everyone moved over a week early. Not bad.

I wonder if it is in the US if I will be able to skip the Dwolla step in transferring money.

Herodes

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http://coinlab.com/transition

Live -- March 22

We'll have everyone moved over by March 22!

https://mtgox.com/press_release_20130228.html

Mt. Gox, the owner of the world’s dominant Bitcoin exchange, announced today that they have selected CoinLab as their exclusive partner in the United States and Canada. As of March 29, all US and Canadian customers currently transacting with Mt.Gox will transact through CoinLab, Inc.

So what's the story - if coinlab want to do serious business, they should at least ensure the information on their webpage is correct. Has everyone been moved over at this point ? If not, then update the webpage !

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Quote from: cloudTc on March 20, 2013, 12:12:21 AM

If I am not mistaken, didn't he just say they were hiring for a communications person? someone that would communicate to the public what was happening? It seems to me that the main people in CoinLab are very busy right now, hence why they need someone to help communicate to the community what is happening.

and hence why I just sent over my resume...

Severian

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Quote from: niko on March 20, 2013, 12:07:16 AM

Unrelated to your or my idiocy, this is about the trail in fiat, not in Bitcoin.

Fiat > gold/silver > bitcoin is the way to go. We just have to get a little better at our metal and trading skills.

BTW, I confess to situational idiocy. Usually involving women.

cloudTc

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If I am not mistaken, didn't he just say they were hiring for a communications person? someone that would communicate to the public what was happening? It seems to me that the main people in CoinLab are very busy right now, hence why they need someone to help communicate to the community what is happening.

niko

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There is more to Bitcoin than bitcoins.

Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:38:38 AM

If audited, you will have to explain how you sent 1k to japan and received 5 back. Doesnt matter where it came from.

What idiot leaves an auditable trail in Bitcoin? It was created to allow your financial life to be private.

Unrelated to your or my idiocy, this is about the trail in fiat, not in Bitcoin. Sure, I could painstakingly try to exchange for cash only in person or via SR mail at a huge premium - but this does not work well for me. I use government fiat, I get paid in fiat, and those who issue, own, and control fiat are entitled to whatever entitlements they come up with, tax included. I don't want to waste time fucking around with them so I can pinch a few thousands or tens of thousands more. Not worth it.
Don't fight the Babylon, step out of it.
Sure, I prefer to issue, own, and control my own money under my terms, that is why Bitcoin is attractive, but we are not there yet, and idiotic battles will not get us there.

🏰 TradeFortress 🏰

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Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 09:54:17 AM

Someone mind explaining to me why you have to claim them on your taxes?
I thought legally Bitcoin was in a grey area at the moment.

It is legally grey as a currency. As an asset its very clear - when it increases above what you paid for it, you are supposed to pay taxes on that.

When you sell them. If you just hold then, you don't pay taxes till you sell

arklan

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Quote from: solex on March 19, 2013, 10:33:12 PM

Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 09:54:17 AM

Someone mind explaining to me why you have to claim them on your taxes?
I thought legally Bitcoin was in a grey area at the moment.

It is legally grey as a currency. As an asset its very clear - when it increases above what you paid for it, you are supposed to pay taxes on that.

So, if you own assets like an old master painting, a vintage car, a hundred kilos of silver, and they all double in value - you pay tax on that gain???

Not in most countries.

only when ya sell it, i believe. (for the US anyway.)

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Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 09:54:17 AM

Someone mind explaining to me why you have to claim them on your taxes?
I thought legally Bitcoin was in a grey area at the moment.

It is legally grey as a currency. As an asset its very clear - when it increases above what you paid for it, you are supposed to pay taxes on that.

So, if you own assets like an old master painting, a vintage car, a hundred kilos of silver, and they all double in value - you pay tax on that gain???

Not in most countries.

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Quote from: Herodes on March 19, 2013, 07:23:10 PM

Quote from: ArticMine on March 18, 2013, 12:12:26 AM

Since many feel that this deal can have an impact on the BTC / USD exchange rate I am posting a link to my post here in speculation. https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1636501

Any thoughts on the impact on the price if this deal were to get delayed or to collapse?

Do you remember how long it took MtGox to get back to trading after they got hacked, and how many deadlines they set, yet nothing happening ? Things takes time, and this community seems to be plentiful with people who are not good at judging how long things will take! Grin

I for one can say that I am a horrible judge of time ! And I mean absolutely horribly.

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Quote from: Herodes on March 19, 2013, 07:23:10 PM

Quote from: ArticMine on March 18, 2013, 12:12:26 AM

Since many feel that this deal can have an impact on the BTC / USD exchange rate I am posting a link to my post here in speculation. https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1636501

Any thoughts on the impact on the price if this deal were to get delayed or to collapse?

Do you remember how long it took MtGox to get back to trading after they got hacked, and how many deadlines they set, yet nothing happening ? Things takes time, and this community seems to be plentiful with people who are not good at judging how long things will take! Grin

The amount of time the MTGox was down due to the hack back in 2011 was six days. http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/mtgoxUSD#rg60zczsg2011-06-01zeg2011-06-30ztgSzm1g10zm2g25zv. By comparison there has not been any updates by Coinlab in their official thread for over two weeks including zero response to the questions raised. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=148147.0;all. I will let the reader be the judge.

Herodes

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Quote from: ArticMine on March 18, 2013, 12:12:26 AM

Since many feel that this deal can have an impact on the BTC / USD exchange rate I am posting a link to my post here in speculation. https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1636501

Any thoughts on the impact on the price if this deal were to get delayed or to collapse?

Do you remember how long it took MtGox to get back to trading after they got hacked, and how many deadlines they set, yet nothing happening ? Things takes time, and this community seems to be plentiful with people who are not good at judging how long things will take! Grin

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Quote from: ArticMine on March 19, 2013, 12:00:00 AM

Quote from: repentance on March 18, 2013, 11:44:53 PM

Quote from: repentance on March 18, 2013, 11:44:53 PM

The deal's not in trouble.

We've moved a few key customers over, will announce more information soon.

We are in the market for a communications person -- send your resume's to [email protected].

Given how close the target transition time is, there needs to be a lot more communication from both CoinLab and MtGox about what's happening. You've got a hell of a lot of customers who need to agree to CoinLab's ToS before the transition date and that really needs to be happening now, not at the eleventh hour.

People are also going to have a ton of questions about the FinCEN guidance statement and how it relates to CoinLab's operations.

This transition can go very badly if MtGox and CoinLab don't constantly remind customers that it's happening and what actions customers themselves need to take. Maybe you and Mark could take it in turns to keep customers updated because this close to showtime someone needs to be making statements pretty much every day.

+1

+1

I am surprised this is not a hot topic right now. 3 days to go.

ArticMine

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The deal's not in trouble.

We've moved a few key customers over, will announce more information soon.

We are in the market for a communications person -- send your resume's to [email protected].

Given how close the target transition time is, there needs to be a lot more communication from both CoinLab and MtGox about what's happening. You've got a hell of a lot of customers who need to agree to CoinLab's ToS before the transition date and that really needs to be happening now, not at the eleventh hour.

People are also going to have a ton of questions about the FinCEN guidance statement and how it relates to CoinLab's operations.

This transition can go very badly if MtGox and CoinLab don't constantly remind customers that it's happening and what actions customers themselves need to take. Maybe you and Mark could take it in turns to keep customers updated because this close to showtime someone needs to be making statements pretty much every day.

+1

repentance

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The deal's not in trouble.

We've moved a few key customers over, will announce more information soon.

We are in the market for a communications person -- send your resume's to [email protected].

Given how close the target transition time is, there needs to be a lot more communication from both CoinLab and MtGox about what's happening. You've got a hell of a lot of customers who need to agree to CoinLab's ToS before the transition date and that really needs to be happening now, not at the eleventh hour.

People are also going to have a ton of questions about the FinCEN guidance statement and how it relates to CoinLab's operations.

This transition can go very badly if MtGox and CoinLab don't constantly remind customers that it's happening and what actions customers themselves need to take. Maybe you and Mark could take it in turns to keep customers updated because this close to showtime someone needs to be making statements pretty much every day.

miter_myles

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Quote from: ArticMine on March 18, 2013, 12:10:21 PM

The deal's not in trouble.

We've moved a few key customers over, will announce more information soon.

We are in the market for a communications person -- send your resume's to [email protected].

BFL_Josh may be interested in that gig... he has demonstrated superlative communication skills for quite some time now...

roflcopter...

vess

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The deal's not in trouble.

We've moved a few key customers over, will announce more information soon.

We are in the market for a communications person -- send your resume's to [email protected].

jimbobway

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Basically Coinlab could end any possible FUD by providing an update and answering questions. At that time depending on the update and answers I will amend my title.

Ok, sounds fair and thanks for pointing me to your links. I must have overlooked them.

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Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 02:29:17 PM

Quote from: Dalkore on March 18, 2013, 02:16:56 PM

I am not sure if the is our "civic duty" to upend dominant political and economic.

If one is of a more accepting nature when it comes to centralized authority and the power of the collective, then civic duty would be perceived as upholding that authority. If one is more inclined to favor the rights of the individual over the power of the collective, the civic duty would entail defending against that power.

I don't fault anyone for their perceptions but I will fault people for not exploring other avenues of political thought.

Quote

"That" is not what Bitcoin was created for.

Bitcoin's creator was explicit in his intentions. Bitcoin is a political weapon creating a new territory of freedom for users. While I don't adhere to all of Satoshi's thoughts, this one is unmistakeable in its clarity.

I am open to all forms of political thought to weigh out their benefits and failings. That is why I am here supporting this project. We have needed competition in money for too long.

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Quote from: Dalkore on March 18, 2013, 02:16:56 PM

I am not sure if the is our "civic duty" to upend dominant political and economic.

If one is of a more accepting nature when it comes to centralized authority and the power of the collective, then civic duty would be perceived as upholding that authority. If one is more inclined to favor the rights of the individual over the power of the collective, the civic duty would entail defending against that power.

I don't fault anyone for their perceptions but I will fault people for not exploring other avenues of political thought.

Quote

"That" is not what Bitcoin was created for.

Bitcoin's creator was explicit in his intentions. Bitcoin is a political weapon creating a new territory of freedom for users. While I don't adhere to all of Satoshi's thoughts, this one is unmistakeable in its clarity.

Severian

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Quote from: lebing on March 18, 2013, 02:06:10 PM

If you are implying something other than (potential) evasion happening in general with these folks, I would tend to disagree. Just because you speculate doesnt mean you sell drugs.

It's not about drugs. TPTB will possibly see Bitcoin and its users as an economic threat in the near future.

Remember that these are the mindsets that invaded Iraq, set up Gitmo and enforce the Patriot Act, among other things. Thugs don't care about law or due process.

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Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:45:17 AM

Quote from: coqui33 on March 18, 2013, 10:40:55 AM

you have the civic duty as a citizen to voluntarily fill out the appropriate forms and report yourself to the government. Failure to do so is a federal crime.

We have a civic duty to upend the dominant political and economic system. That's what Bitcoin was created for.

I am not sure if the is our "civic duty" to upend dominant political and economic. I for one liked on paper our constitutional democracy, the problem is that our representatives don't actually follow the rules and we can't seem to actual elect someone who will.

"That" is not what Bitcoin was created for. It was created and a alternative and given to the people for many purposes. With that said, you can use it for those ends if you would like.

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Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:38:38 AM

Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 11:09:02 AM

If audited, you will have to explain how you sent 1k to japan and received 5 back. Doesnt matter where it came from.

What idiot leaves an auditable trail in Bitcoin? It was created to allow your financial life to be private.

Well if someone seized your wallet computer then there would be a trail. Also if you transferred money from your bank to an exchange, that would be a trail.

lebing

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Quote from: lebing on March 18, 2013, 10:50:44 AM

It might be easy to create an unauditable trail for 1k dollars... not so much for 500k. Then again, thats a good problem to have I suppose.

The guys buying half a mill worth of Bitcoins already have their balls in the IRS vice. They won't wander far from the reservation anyway.

It's us hoi-polloi leaving ourselves open to the wolves that worry me. If the political powers ever decide to crackdown on Bitcoin users, all of those Coinbase, Gox, etc. customers that gave up details are in the crosshairs.

What makes you think they are already in the crosshairs? There are plenty of nerds who got lucky playing around with mining rigs over the last few years and some average joes that went all in and held their strong hand. If you are implying something other than (potential) evasion happening in general with these folks, I would tend to disagree. Just because you speculate doesnt mean you sell drugs.

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Quote from: jimbobway on March 18, 2013, 11:47:44 AM

Quote from: ArticMine on March 18, 2013, 11:43:43 AM

I recognize that the IRS instils great fear into the hearts of every United States citizen and resident, but the issue here is will this deal actually happen, get delayed or even get cancelled, and what impact this will have if any on the Bitcoin price.

Why would you speculate that the deal is in trouble? Are there any links you can provide for this? Also, the title does seem a little like FUD.

I posted my concerns in another thread which I linked to in my OP. Here they are for clarity

Quote from: ArticMine on March 18, 2013, 12:04:09 AM

I am starting to have some doubts if this deal is even going to happen as it would appear that things are not going according to plan.

1) According to http://coinlab.com/transition, the alpha and beta phases were supposed to be completed by March 15, 2013, last Friday. Has anyone been transitioned?
Furthermore all the United States and Canadian accounts are supposed to be migrated by this coming Friday March 22, 2013, I am starting to wonder if this is going to happen at all.

2) There has been silence on the part of CoinLab for two weeks in their "official thread" https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=148147.0;all

Basically Coinlab could end any possible FUD by providing an update and answering questions. At that time depending on the update and answers I will amend my title.

jimbobway

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Quote from: ArticMine on March 18, 2013, 11:43:43 AM

I recognize that the IRS instils great fear into the hearts of every United States citizen and resident, but the issue here is will this deal actually happen, get delayed or even get cancelled, and what impact this will have if any on the Bitcoin price.

Why would you speculate that the deal is in trouble? Are there any links you can provide for this? Also, the title does seem a little like FUD.

ArticMine

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I recognize that the IRS instils great fear into the hearts of every United States citizen and resident, but the issue here is will this deal actually happen, get delayed or even get cancelled, and what impact this will have if any on the Bitcoin price.

optimator

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Quote from: inbox on March 18, 2013, 10:07:51 AM

It is legally grey as a currency. As an asset its very clear - when it increases above what you paid for it, you are supposed to pay taxes on that.

IANAA.... but in the US when an asset appreciates (gold, stocks, etc) you don't pay taxes on the appreciated value. You only pay taxes on the appreciated value when you sell it.

Rygon

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Too bad I lost all my bitcoins on a unfortunate internet super highway accident.

I lost it all on Satoshi Dice. Cheesy

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Why would you want to trade bitcoin back to fiat?

And for those with a half million in USD worth of bitcoin, where 99% of it is considered profit, I would assume they would be looking to make "investement" in big screen TVs (bitcoinstore.com) or cars. Ironically, holders of bitcoin looking to exchange for fiat might help expand the marketplace for bitcoin, in an effort to hide income.

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Quote from: lebing on March 18, 2013, 10:50:44 AM

It might be easy to create an unauditable trail for 1k dollars... not so much for 500k. Then again, thats a good problem to have I suppose.

The guys buying half a mill worth of Bitcoins already have their balls in the IRS vice. They won't wander far from the reservation anyway.

It's us hoi-polloi leaving ourselves open to the wolves that worry me. If the political powers ever decide to crackdown on Bitcoin users, all of those Coinbase, Gox, etc. customers that gave up details are in the crosshairs.

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Quote from: RodeoX on March 18, 2013, 10:45:53 AM

To be clear, bitcoin was not invented so that you may evade taxes.

According to the creator, it was made to "win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of
freedom for several years."

If you can find the "don't forget to pay your taxes" part of the Bitcoin code, please indicate it.

lebing

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Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:38:38 AM

Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:38:38 AM

If audited, you will have to explain how you sent 1k to japan and received 5 back. Doesnt matter where it came from.

What idiot leaves an auditable trail in Bitcoin? It was created to allow your financial life to be private.

It might be easy to create an unauditable trail for 1k dollars... not so much for 500k. Then again, thats a good problem to have I suppose.

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Quote from: coqui33 on March 18, 2013, 10:40:55 AM

If audited, you will have to explain how you sent 1k to japan and received 5 back. Doesnt matter where it came from.

What idiot leaves an auditable trail in Bitcoin? It was created to allow your financial life to be private.

To be clear, bitcoin was not invented so that you may evade taxes. You are absolutely responsible for paying your taxes. Failure to do so can result in the same fines and prison time as any other criminal.
If you don't want to pay your share of tax, then work through your elected officials and change the tax law. There is *basically no such thing as tax free income in the U.S.

Severian

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you have the civic duty as a citizen to voluntarily fill out the appropriate forms and report yourself to the government. Failure to do so is a federal crime.

We have a civic duty to upend the dominant political and economic system. That's what Bitcoin was created for.

Severian

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Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 10:40:19 AM

Just because I ask the question doesn't mean I intend to do it. I just want to know the legality of it.

That "you" was meant in the universal sense, not in the humanitee sense. Apologies for confusion.

My meaning is that we have a tool to protect us from predators and I see people practically begging to tell the predators exactly how much meat will be supplied by their corpse. That's idiotic.

nobbynobbynoob

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Annuit cœptis humanae libertas

If you draw fiat through the US banking systems, the IRS can find out about it. Enter localbitcoins.com and the like. You should just pay all your taxes to your wonderful, benevolent government, however, because, you know, they give you free health care and edumakation and roadz, OMG roadz! And they protect you from those bad terrists too. Grin

coqui33

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FWIW, here is are two paragraphs from a bitcoin explanation that I wrote some time ago (at http://ccwvslaw.org/item/1652):

Quote

Bitcoins are transferred directly and privately from one person to another. Unlike the transfer of gold, stocks, or bonds, you need not involve a bank or broker. This means that no one will ask you to prove your source of funds and demand that you fill out U.S. federal form 8300 if the value of the transaction exceeds $10,000. No banker or broker will secretly report the transfer on federal form 4789. No one will secretly report on federal form 4790 that the transfer crossed national borders. Finally, no one will send the IRS a copy of form 1099 reporting that you paid $100 for bitcoins, then sold them for $150, thereby owing capital gains taxes on $50.

On the other hand, although bitcons’ privacy makes it hard for the government to look over your shoulder, this does not reduce your taxpayer obligation. If you transact bitcoins in a way that uses over $10,000 in currency or that transfers that amount across a national border, or if you sell bitcoins (or anything else, for that matter) for more than you paid, then you have the civic duty as a citizen to voluntarily fill out the appropriate forms and report yourself to the government. Failure to do so is a federal crime.

Just sayin..

humanitee

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Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:32:33 AM

Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 10:22:21 AM

Oh well. Here's another question.. If you don't cash out, do you have to pay taxes?

Even if you do cash out, what idiot would pay taxes on bitcoins?

Just because I ask the question doesn't mean I intend to do it. I just want to know the legality of it.

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Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:32:33 AM

If audited, you will have to explain how you sent 1k to japan and received 5 back. Doesnt matter where it came from.

What idiot leaves an auditable trail in Bitcoin? It was created to allow your financial life to be private.

lebing

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Enabling the maximal migration

Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 10:22:21 AM

Oh well. Here's another question.. If you don't cash out, do you have to pay taxes?

Even if you do cash out, what idiot would pay taxes on bitcoins?

If audited, you will have to explain how you sent 1k to japan and received 5 back. Doesnt matter where it came from.

Severian

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Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 10:22:21 AM

Oh well. Here's another question.. If you don't cash out, do you have to pay taxes?

Even if you do cash out, what idiot would pay taxes on bitcoins?

humanitee

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Thank you for clarifying.

I was hoping you had a link with some techno-wizardry that said "no."

Oh well. Here's another question.. If you don't cash out, do you have to pay taxes?

Severian

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Quote from: humanitee on March 18, 2013, 10:22:21 AM

Then say why.

I see the "you're supposed to pay your taxes" meme thrown around here like it's a magic charm or a spell uttered by the superstitious against an evil spirit. I wish people would grow a pair and, at least internally, ignore the fuckers that would tax them. You now have a tool that protects you from banks and their vassal governments. Act like it.

Quote

Great response. Roll Eyes

Saved it just for such a moment.

lebing

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Enabling the maximal migration

Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:21:15 AM

Quote from: Severian on March 18, 2013, 10:21:15 AM

As an asset its very clear - when it increases above what you paid for it, you are supposed to pay taxes on that.

Horseshit.

key words: "supposed to"

humanitee

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As an asset its very clear - when it increases above what you paid for it, you are supposed to pay taxes on that.

Horseshit.

Then say why. Great response. Roll Eyes

Severian

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Quote from: inbox on March 18, 2013, 10:07:51 AM

As an asset its very clear - when it increases above what you paid for it, you are supposed to pay taxes on that.

Horseshit.

arruah

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Too bad I lost all my bitcoins on a unfortunate internet super highway accident.

how it may be possible?

humanitee

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