Topic: Is there a market for large escrow transactions? 10k or 100k BTC? (Read 2740 times)

When the potential for a transaction is bigger than 100 BTC, I have been asked to be one of many in a multi-signature address. And this thread was started in 2013, when the fiat value equivalent was much lower ($100 USD per BTC or thereabouts.)

Some people have held the forum's money or a portion of it up to 1000 BTC. I haven't seen much bigger than that so far.

One person was entrusted with about 60k BTC at one time, but he was the operator of a dice site.

You live in some kind of parallel universe where these big transactions don't happen.  Some people have to send them, and when they do, someone will have to escrow them.  Or would you rather they tried converting all those coins to fiat before making the transaction?   

Who knows, this could be the biggest scam of a lifetime, but there are no actual "warningsigns".

I don't have any mental issues, perhaps you do? They (escrow contracts) were all done. Baka ikaw ang nahihiya? (Maybe you are ashamed?) I don't advertise myself any more than these threads do. You really do stereotype our infamous crab mentality. Ako ang nahihiya sayo. (I'm ashamed of you.)

People don't entrust me with fiat. People trust me with bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies.

100% scam. You have the audacity. Nakakahiya ka!

You boldly, brazenly and shamelessly advertise yourself as someone people should entrust with $250,000,000. You have mental issues. See a psychiatrist.

Largest was 700. More recent ones were 400 and below, for some ICOs last year and this year.

Just curious, did you escrow any big transactions?

I'm bored, so I'm bumping this thread.

I almost got a contract for 75,000 BTC, but that was before the rate went above $130 USD per BTC, and I think it was more a publicity stunt for his company. (No offense to Mark, he's the one who was selling his vtc.com for 75k bitcoins.)

At this point in time, large bitcoin transactions are probably unlikely to happen, much less an escrow for them. No more 10k pizzas. The current average exchange rate has been above 800 USD for more than a couple of months now, I don't think it's about to crash.

No one opposed to me starting small anyway? What's a good starting rate? Is 1% good enough, or would 0.5% be better considering I don't have as much rep as other escrow services?

I might have a potential client, offering 35k BTC for his offline business. But this one will take several months before anything materializes. So I'm throwing it out there in case there is a buyer reading this. Also at least two other entities have expressed an interest, but of course if it happens in fiat, then I'm outta the picture.

I do realize the potential for foreigners to attempt to bribe my own security. Reminds me of the movie SWAT with the rich drug lord offering a hundred million dollars and giving the team headaches.

I also know, the security I will hire, don't accept bitcoins. They might accept cash. But I'm already paying them a portion of my fee (converted to fiat first) to do their job.

@MPOE-PR, I'll take both. The big ones, and the small ones. As for the Tortilla, I believe he is in a different league, way above me (or us?) But I'd gladly take him as a client. For all I know, he sends someone else to buy his own stuff with his own bitcoins and just wants to have some fun in the Philippines. I'll take 1% either way.

You need to realize that a guy holding 10k+ BTC has WAY MORE than it takes to have the security answer to him, rather than to you.

There's this thing called rhyming slang, which works something like this: rather than write titties you write Bristols, because everyone knows Bristol cities rhymes with titties.

So therefore, rather than write rpietilla....

I think i m getting the sarcasm here but care to explain the Uppity Tortilla's stuff?

Anyway the "What, so soon?" made me to lol 

What, so soon? This thread was promising to rival Uppity Tortilla's stuff. Stay on it!

Thank you for the comment.

I might as well start by offering escrow for smaller amounts as well, all online. Those interested can contact me. No extra services added. Really small amounts will be free (just tip me.) Anything above 10 BTC will require an appropriate fee, perhaps the same as the others of 1.5% to 2%.

I don't trade in the bitcoins necessary for this service, but would just like to say very well written. I would also like to point out the market for 100k BTC transactions is probably not to large since that's 1% of all btc.

I'm not going to be cashing out 500,000 pesos. The transaction will be in bitcoin. What I personally pay to fix the whole deal will be a lot less than that amount.

Also, I must make it clear that I'm not going to be involved in any transaction that deals with drugs (legal or illegal) or arms (legal or illegal). There are enough of that all over the place, usually by the small time corner pushers or something. The legitimate gun stores have their clients too.

Anyone can hire their own security. I think it's just:
1. Cheaper where I am.
2. I'm the escrow dude, the third party, the security answers to me, not to any party.

You'll have a problem when either or both parties have their own security.

Your other points are noted. That's why I started this discussion, I need to find out if this can work or not. In theory, it can. But in reality, maybe no one is going to do it. Or the banks or governments of the world will pay attention and attempt to regulate bitcoin.

It also depends on what they think is bitcoin, or if they understand it. I'm just pushing buttons on my computer.

As for me, I have a traditional or regular business, I do all the necessary paperwork, I pay my taxes, I obey all the laws, everything legal. This escrow thing is just something I thought of that I could provide, if there is a market for it.

Mind you, if there are no physical goods involved, or if there are only documents to be signed, this can be conducted completely online as well. We just do encrypted video conference or something. I just think no one is going to do that with the bitcoins involved.

As a separate service, I might offer lessons on stick fighting and unarmed combat, for example. You really have to come here then.

I'm trying to work out why anyone other than drug cartels or arms dealers (who almost certainly have their own "fixers" already) would even consider going through such dramatic arrangements and involving many additional people in the deal.  The more people know about it, the greater the overall risk.  You'd have to be a complete idiot to conduct drug related business in the Philippines.

People willing to go offshore to conduct these transactions likely don't want them to be traced.  Their biggest problem is going to be repatriating the funds in a way which doesn't attract attention.  Perhaps that's the problem you should look at trying to solve because people can hire their own security anywhere in the world.

Right now the Philippines is a hair's breadth away from being blacklisted by the international financial community.  It's simply not true that no-one gives a shit about foreign currency transactions.


http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/02/07/uk-philippines-moneylaundering-idUKBRE91605420130207

I personally don't have a problem. To me, bitcoin is just another technology vehicle. That it now has a very high perceived value is mostly irrelevant. I mean, it was "nothing" when someone bought a pizza a couple years ago for the amount in bitcoins that I'm talking about now.

The transaction will essentially be the same. The difference is the security involved. I will probably purchase brand new netbooks for this purpose. (in my opinion not necessary.)

In the end, I personally believe that personal and physical security is the more important thing. If you've seen the xkcd comics, I think it tells us an important story.

http://xkcd.com/538/


My service provides that while you are in my territory, no one is going to use a $5 wrench on you.

These "silly" forums are going to be seen by everyone who has anything to do or want to do with bitcoins. If my market is out there, someone will contact me.

That, or someone else is already doing this and we all don't know anything about it. Dark web and such.

This will start as a "modest" personal venture. When I get enough clients, I can start thinking of setting up a formal company. In the mean time, I know several security agencies. They are the ones that provide armed guards to some of the bigger malls. My high school classmate owns one. Another high school classmate owns a 4 star hotel, so I can use that as the venue.

I will of course pay them in fiat. They just know me as the computer geek with a gun that got sent to military school.

What's in it for me? Aside from the 1%, I want to be the guy that did the escrow of the world's biggest bitcoin transaction.

Who am I? (To paraphrase Tony Stark.)
I am Dabs of bitcointalk.org.

Either legit or scam. 50/50. Well written anyway, will see feedback. I don't know how IRL meeting will benefit but there might be some need for such arrangements. The possibilities are endless and this forums is largest place where all kinds of bitcoiners lurk.

That's certainly interesting. Although is such a massively important service appropriate for posting on these silly bitcoin forums? This seems like something that deserves it's own website and physical offices and maybe, company. xD

Thank you for the comment, and a sort of indirect endorsement. I figured I don't want to take your market, so I'm starting a little bit higher than I've seen anyone else.

I mean, I will accept escrow transactions that do not require physical meet-up, but with the suggested amounts involved, they might want to anyway. Besides, after the transaction, I can accompany one or both parties to our world famous Boracay beach. Unless they want to go home already. I can show you hundreds of "undiscovered" white sand beaches, where no one else goes to. I don't know why Boracay gets all the attention, plus everything there is priced for tourists, meaning expensive.

I will probably not accept arms deals. The PNP (Philippine National Police) will want it done in fiat, naturally, so they will take a cut. Customs too. And bombs, uh... will never get past airport screening. And all that paper work. I have a few friends in the firearms business (gun stores, shooting ranges.) What I have seen are, for example, Japanese tourists who "own" guns here, lock it up here, shoot here. But they obviously can't bring it back to Japan. They entrust it to a store or a range, lock it up, and hold a key.

Cash... or stuff good as cash, like Manager's Checks or Traveler's Checks or Bank Drafts, or Bearer Bonds (if there are still such things) or high value money orders / postal orders, maybe. Stuff that are irreversible too. But probably people will prefer just bank wires. I don't know.

Real estate is easy. Both parties bring lawyers. If both lawyers are satisfied, we have a deal, I can release the bitcoins. Both parties take care of their lawyers (who will probably accept fiat). I just escrow the bitcoins. I don't even have to know what or where the land is, or how big, or if you really own it or other details. The lawyers do, that's their job.

My father has an investment banker friend who has since migrated to Canada. He used to help set up deals in the billions of dollars (USD). His fee was a fraction of a percent, but because of the high amount, the absolute value of his fee was substantial.

So ... serious inquiries can PM me. I don't have to know you. I don't care who you are. I'm not going to steal your bitcoins or your hardware or your mission impossible launch codes or whatever it is that you are trading. Remember, I already have the guns and the goons. You just provide the gold and I'll escrow it for you.

The meet-up also ensures that you know me. I don't care if you don't know the other guy, but it's my duty, as part of the service, to ensure you don't try to kill each other and the transaction goes smoothly.

Your only risk is initially sending me the fee. You want to make sure that when you arrive, I already have the security team. As for the seller, he still has to fly here.

But if you just want to set a world record, you can always order a million dollar pizza. I'll escrow it. You come here. You eat it here before it gets cold. No need to even leave the airport. Airports have the best security (or they are supposed to anyway.)

I'll let you know if someone bites. (They will probably want anonymity, so I don't know what proof I will be able to offer without revealing them.)

P.S. I can do cash, as long as it's less than $10,000 USD. Or whatever is the legal limit for physical possession. I will convert that to local fiat so you have pocket money while you are here. The rest of the trade must be in some form of paper financial instrument, and the buyer and seller must either be able to verify authenticity, or bring someone who can (like your banker or accountant or lawyer). I then suggest you both leave soon, as I can only guarantee your physical security while you are here. Once you're in the airport, you are no longer my responsibility. Have a safe flight.

  an escrow transaction where you have to fly to The Philippines ... kind of like the movies where the protagonist visits a distant place with suitcases of $ for some secret deal with another arms dealer. For that amount in Bitcoin though, about the only feasible good exchanged would have to be real estates - which is not really feasible to 'bring along' so to say. Unless you mean a small H-bomb or something.  Cash in exchange for the bitcoins could be another possibility, but it would be hard to bring that amount of $ through the customs.

On a side note, I've seen the security first handedly on a trip to Philippines last time. I remember seeing a light tank escort someone (probably who brings the bank's reserve funds) with a handcuffed suitcase to a mall at Manila. I was regularly patted down when entering public places, and my coach was scanned for bombs on the undercarriage when entering Manila Hotel. (and yes, my suitcases and stuff were passed through a airport-esque scanner)

PS: I've transacted over 10k BTC worth in escrow transactions in the past (and this) month already, so I daresay there could be a market for this too as people regularly do high value transactions in bitcoin for the anonymity and security. Good luck!

I'm serious. Because if no one bites, then there is nothing to transact anyways. Or at least my market is not in this forum.

I don't think anyone would take me as an escrow if I do lower amounts when there are so many others already. And if you're just buying coins, there are private direct traders, and the localbitcoins one that all do escrow, so I'm out of that range.

I can't get into Tradehill Prime since they have a minimum that I can't personally yet meet. I don't know if they handle this kind of volume. They do advertise dark pool trading or something to that effect.

Maybe I'm just dreaming and waiting for an excuse to go play with my toys. Security is big business here. Every bank, pawnshop, and money changer (transmitter) has an armed guard. Every businessman worth more than a few million either has an armed guard, or is armed himself.

They don't have to understand bitcoin. They just need to be paid.

I... honestly can't tell if you're joking. 
Well played.

Is there a market for large escrow transactions? 10k or 100k BTC?

Is there a market for large escrow transactions?

I'm thinking of those valued at 10,000 bitcoins or higher. Maybe even 100,000 bitcoins?

I could offer escrow for those.

Some questions or concerns you may have:

Why not start smaller?
Because many other services and some other people already have done escrows for 2000 bitcoins and below, and they are good for that.

What will be the difference using me as escrow and using someone else then?
Well, for the amount involved, this kind of escrow would require physical meet-up in a territory neutral to both parties (to the buyer, and to the seller). I can offer that, however both the buyer and the seller must come to my location.

I will request a 1% fee for this transaction. From this fee, I will provide the following additional services:

1. Airport pick up. I will pick you up from the airport when you arrive in my country. You pay for your own flight.
2. I will provide you with a chauffeur (driver), sport utility vehicle, and 1 or 2 armed security escorts (bodyguards) for the duration of your stay in my country. Please don't stay longer than you need to, 1 to 2 weeks would be ideal.
3. I will book you in a hotel of your choice, or depending on the contract, I will book BOTH of you in the same hotel.
4. Your security detail, vehicle, and driver report to me. I merely assign them to you while you are here.
5. Of course, after the transaction, you will be safely escorted back to the airport for your flight home.

Security is provide only within the city. If you want to go to a beach after your business, that can be arranged separately. SUV is not armored, if you want armored or bombproof SUV, there will be additional charge for that. Your protective agents are armed only with concealable weapons (handguns). If you want rifles or higher calibers, additional charge. They will also only be wearing plain clothes. If you want uniformed security, additional charge for that as I will have to request from local police and military for that.

All weapons permits, licenses, agents, etc will be handled by me. For all legal purposes, you are merely a client.

For the actual bitcoin transaction itself, I will provide one or more escrow addresses, bitcoin signed, and GPG signed. Several, so the buyer (the one paying in bitcoins) can break down his 10,000 (ten thousand) to 100,000 (one hundred thousand) bitcoin transaction into small pieces that will attract less attention to everyone who likes to view the block chain.

Who are you? How can you offer security like that?
I am an officer in the armed forces of my country handling the civil military affairs group for the national capital region. As such, I have personally made calls with most of the local mayors and governors within this region. As a matter of course, I have also personally met and dealt with the local chief of police in each city. There are approximately 19 cities within this region. I am apolitical, meaning, every 3 years, after the next local election, I merely do a courtesy call to the mayoral candidate that won, whoever he or she is.

I am in the reserve force, however I am on active duty status. I can get into the Presidential palace just by merely showing my identification and credentials. (They will verify this.)

I lead a unit that does free medical, dental, and engineering missions. We also have the regular military training in small arms, tactics, VIP security, martial arts, and other "usual" stuff. I am familiar and known by my group commander (who has a rank of Colonel) and our brigade commander (who has a rank of Brigadier General equivalent).

My uniform has many colorful things attached to it. You can just imagine. There is a tank there too. (No, I can not and will not provide you with a tank during your stay here.)

My family owns and manages a manufacturing company and the retail company that markets our products in three major department store chains nationwide, totalling at least 30 (thirty) outlets. We make clothes. A traditional non-bitcoin business. We employ more than 200 (two hundred) tailors.

Security will be provided by my personal contacts who have security agencies or private contractors. Some are retired or former military or police.

I have also personally delivered certain consumable products to our incumbent Senate President. (I used to sell vitamins; I still do when asked.)

In other business dealings, I have brokered the sale and transfer of land titles, a portion of a building, entire fleets of vehicles, and even a small boat (or yatch). Not to mention firearms (rifles and pistols). All legal of course.

Won't you just take my bitcoins and the other guys stuff and disappear? Execute order 66!
Feel free to pay me a visit. At your expense. I can be your tour guide and I will show you around. Payable in bitcoin of course. It is in my best interest that I get good positive feedback from this service. I like star wars.

What if the other guy offers you 2% to get rid of me?
It is not in my interest to change the deal that both of you have agreed on. I am just the arbiter or the escrow. I want to get new contracts every now and then, perhaps every month. If I am escrowing 10,000 bitcoins, then my 1% fee is 100 bitcoins.

I don't like guns.
The security is for your protection. There are bad guys out there. Also, the security team answers to me. Not to you. Not to the other guy. If you are not a citizen of my country, you can't own or possess firearms. For us to get some, we go through all sorts of background checks, police clearances, court clearances, etc. I can cover you the moment you land here, to the moment you leave, within the city limits. Beyond that is a risk you have to take yourself.

I have a million bitcoins. Can you escrow that?
Why not? I'll upgrade your security team to be three vehicles and a platoon of agents. I might actually ask someone like John (the escrow guy) to help with this. He's only a border away and we're in the same time zone. Our respective countries have a territorial dispute, but that shouldn't affect this bitcoin transaction; and we'll both get reps too. If he's got connections to the GGK, you might want to escrow with him.

What can possibly be worth that much?
I don't know. Stuff that need to be signed? Technology? Trade secrets? I don't really care as long as it is not illegal. Bitcoins are not illegal. If you had a million coins, sending is just a click. Small rocks. Cash, in large quantities may be subject to all sorts of AMLA (anti money laundering acts). However, in my country, deposit accounts denominated in foreign currency are guaranteed to have privacy. No one else can look at them. I can send wire transfers in chunks.

What kind of bitcoin security do you have?
My personal laptop is whole disk encrypted. I have offline wallets. No online hacker can get to it. And as you can already tell, no offline hacker will attempt to get to it. I also have a bachelor's degree in information technology (or computer science) so I know what I'm doing, most of the time. To handle the actual bitcoin transaction itself, I will be using a personally paid for broadband internet connection. Pure peer to peer.

This is a scam!
If you have other options, go there. I don't like dealing with trolls. Like I said, feel free to take a vacation here, and I will be your personal tour guide. (I'll take care of hiring the "real" tour guides if you really like to explore.)

If you scam me, I will beat you up to death 20 times over and feed your body parts to my pigs!
I'm not leaving my country for awhile. I'd like to see you try. I take all threats seriously. I won't scam you. I am not a hired gun. I am offering a secured escrow service for large bitcoin transactions. It's just like other escrow services online, except this is ALSO offline. You get to meet the other guy in person. And neither of you are in a position to scam the other party. Either there is a deal, or no deal. In the best case scenario, both parties are satisfied and the transaction goes smoothly.


More concerns? This is the service discussion forum. I am asking if there is a market for this. I have not yet actually offered the service.

Also, my fee must be paid up front, before either of you buy a plane ticket. I will use this to pay for everything I said I will provide apart from the actual escrow itself. My grunts only accept payment in fiat, so I have to deal with that first.

Here is a picture of me in 2009 when I got married. I value my own privacy too so I have blurred certain portions of the photo. But that's me.