Ledger sent to 2 adresses at the same time?

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18748

Quote from: Pmalek on May 16, 2021, 07:42:06 AM

Something tells me the user I replied to wasn't talking about air gapped solutions.

Sure, but that doesn't mean we should use incorrect terminology. Web wallets such as blockchain.com, for example, are hot wallets because obviously they can only be used while online. So are some software wallets such as Coinomi, which do not support importing or exporting unsigned transactions and so must be used online. Electrum, however, is not necessarily a hot wallet because it can be used online or airgapped, however the individual desires.

To say all software wallets are hot wallets is incorrect. Better to be accurate with our terminology, regardless of who we are discussing with, so as not to confuse them in the future or anybody else who is reading this thread and isn't sure about these terms.

Pmalek

legendary

Activity: 2730

Merit: 7065

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on May 16, 2021, 05:35:29 AM

Electrum is not necessarily a hot wallet. It is a software wallet, which can be used as either a hot wallet or a cold wallet - a hot wallet on an online device, or a cold wallet on a permanently air-gapped device.

Yes, of course. I am aware of the different ways one can use Electrum depending on if it's installed in an offline environment or it's being used on a computer that is permanently connected to the internet. Something tells me the user I replied to wasn't talking about air gapped solutions.

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18748

Quote from: swogerino on May 15, 2021, 01:19:13 PM

As long as you have bought it from the official website and not ebay or amazon there is no risk of it being hacked unless the hacker has physical access to your hardware wallet which I think is highly unlikely...

This is assuming you place complete trust in the manufacturer of the hardware wallet. There is nothing stopping someone in their production facilities of carrying out an attack on your device, or anyone in the delivery chain between them and you. Pre-initialized devices were a common way to steal funds from buyers of hardware wallets for a while.

Quote from: Pmalek on May 16, 2021, 02:50:18 AM

Electrum is a software wallet (hot wallet) that can become vulnerable to other attack vectors a hardware wallet (cold wallet) isn't.

Electrum is not necessarily a hot wallet. It is a software wallet, which can be used as either a hot wallet or a cold wallet - a hot wallet on an online device, or a cold wallet on a permanently air-gapped device. I occasionally use Electrum which comes bundled with Tails, using Tails as a live OS on an air-gapped device without any connectivity hardware.

Pmalek

legendary

Activity: 2730

Merit: 7065

Quote from: swogerino on May 15, 2021, 01:19:13 PM

As long as you have bought it from the official website and not ebay or amazon there is no risk of it being hacked unless the hacker has physical access to your hardware wallet which I think is highly unlikely...

Buying a hardware wallet from unofficial sources isn't recommended, but doesn't necessarily mean that doing so will cause you to lose your funds. Don't forget that official Ledger resellers sell their gadgets over Amazon. Buying from Amazon is one way of acquiring a hardware wallet but always check who the seller is.

Quote from: swogerino on May 15, 2021, 01:19:13 PM

so don't worry and as explained above that is how it works in Ledger and the same in other wallets too like Electrum for example.

Electrum is a software wallet (hot wallet) that can become vulnerable to other attack vectors a hardware wallet (cold wallet) isn't. With hardware wallets, the private keys are generated in an secure offline environment. With software wallets, that's not the case. They can also be remotely attacked or you get yourself keylogged.

bL4nkcode

copper member

Activity: 2142

Merit: 1305

Limited in number. Limitless in potential.

In simple words of those explanation above of change address. It's when you received a 1000$ bill, and you purchase with an amount of 100, so the remaining is 900, this 900 remains to your wallet, that's what you've seen on other wallet address on the same transaction, its called change address, literally, the change of the amount you've sent on a transaction.

The Cryptovator

legendary

Activity: 2394

Merit: 2223

Signature space for rent

I think OP has already gotten desired answers, but not sure I found learned how it works. So I will prefer to read What is the "Change" address on the bitcoin wallet? read to know. It was hard to find since it's a very old thread, but did it eventually for you. To be honest we aren't interested to learn about Bitcoin technology how everything has been working and that's the reason we make mistakes. Also sometimes would lead us to lose funds due to a lack of basic knowledge about Bitcoin and wallets. Hacking a hard wallet isn't too easy since the device with you. It's impossible to make a transaction without a device or seed. So you need to keep safe your wallet seed as well.

swogerino

legendary

Activity: 3318

Merit: 1247

Bitcoin Casino Est. 2013

Quote from: Mankov on May 15, 2021, 01:14:36 PM

Man, my heart and nerves...this really freaked me out, today.
I thought my Ledger was hacked.

Thank you!

Ledger and hardware wallets are well known for their hardening/security.As long as you have bought it from the official website and not ebay or amazon there is no risk of it being hacked unless the hacker has physical access to your hardware wallet which I think is highly unlikely,so don't worry and as explained above that is how it works in Ledger and the same in other wallets too like Electrum for example.

Mankov

jr. member

Activity: 428

Merit: 7

Man, my heart and nerves...this really freaked me out, today.
I thought my Ledger was hacked.

Thank you!

BlackHatCoiner

legendary

Activity: 1512

Merit: 7340

Farewell, Leo

Quote from: Mankov on May 15, 2021, 10:09:55 AM

Why does it say a total of 0.09 BTC was sent when I only sent out $ 100?

You can think of the block chain as being a storage for safe deposit boxes, which we call “outputs”. These outputs are just containers that hold amounts of bitcoins. If someone sends you 0.1 BTC, he'll fund your address with an output holding 0.1 BTC, that can only be unlocked by you. If you then want to spend 0.2 BTC, you'll have to unlock that output create a new one that spends 0.2 BTC to the receiving address and 0.8 BTC to you as change. (excluding the mining fee)

That other address your Ledger chose to sent the remaining bitcoins is called a “change address”.

— But, BlackHatCoiner, why didn't it choose to send the change to my sending address instead?

Because of your privacy. The block chain is publicly known and can be accessed by anyone, anytime, maybe 'til the next century. If someone sees that Address_A sends 0.02 BTC to Address_B and the remaining to itself, it'll mean that the owners of that address haven't spent their coins yet. But, if he sees that Address_A sends 0.02 BTC to Address_B and the remaining to Address_C there's no actual way to know if you still have money.

Charles-Tim

legendary

Activity: 1512

Merit: 4795

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

You have an input if 0.09645065 BTC on your wallet, you transferred 0.00202760 BTC to an address on binance, the remaining balance of the input which is 0.09433545 BTC will automatically be sent back to an address on your wallet called change address. If you check the change address, you will see it belongs to your Ledger Nano wallet.

BrewMaster

legendary

Activity: 2128

Merit: 1293

There is trouble abrewing

in bitcoin you have to spend transaction outputs that you have received (called coins). you had a coin worth 0.09645065 in your wallet that your wallet software chose to spend. when you spend a coin it is destroyed and you have to create a new output. since you only wanted to send 0.00202760 out of 0.09645065 you have to send the remaining amount (aka the change) to a new address which is where the 0.09433545 went.

that extra change address is automatically generated by your wallet using your seed so it is a part of your wallet. next time you have a new output with the value equal to 0.09433545 which you can spend.

Mankov

jr. member

Activity: 428

Merit: 7

Hello,

This is my ledger wallet address from which I sent $ 100 to Binance, today.
This was the only amount I was sending.

https://www.blockchain.com/btc/address/bc1qlsv8ez3x2kxrlveyfvfzrw7hw2p0gkgvdvxpuf

Why does it say a total of 0.09 BTC was sent when I only sent out $ 100?

I only confirmed the $ 100 in the Ledger, and that's what it also says in the Ledger software, not 0.09 BTC:

https://www.blockchain.com/btc/address/bc1qz90upj0g9mr8n0cu5ev3fjt6hvke4yvkryccw3

In the leger software my current balance seems to be still fine, only 100 $ is missing, which I sent out,
but why sent Ledger 0.09 BTC to another adress, at the same time in this transaction?

Topic: Ledger sent to 2 adresses at the same time? (Read 160 times)