Topic: Libra has competitive advantages over Bitcoin. We let this happen. (Read 544 times)

Well if libra will be a stable coins as i know 1 Libra will value 1$ approximately, but you say that over years the cap market of Libra will be over bitcoin? Maybe is possible but i think will not happen and Libra will be used mostly for users who want to pay for a Facebook premium service.

Saying bitcoin community is stagnant is ignorant. Bitcoin remains the number one legal tender in the cryptocurrency space. Libra will make some noise but cannot displace the spot of bitcoin

Bitcoin was never created with intent of investment plan, but here we are, I guess what draws more attention and adoption to bitcoin is its value appreciation and almost everyone are only after what they gain financially from it and not the ways they can make use of it.

Absolutely, the biggest advantage that i see will be the adoption, userbase and money that libra will bring to crypto markets, payments and remittance niche, overall the impact of libra will be explosive but technically i think btc will remain the premiere decentralized coin and it will remain the king of crypto market.

I think Bitcoin is no cause for concern.  In addition, all users of cryptocurrencies and Bitcoin owners have so far understood that Libra will comply with the standards of payment systems that will not overlap with Bitcoin.  Today, Bitcoin is still used as a profitable investment, but no more.

Would have been a worthy rival if Libra was a minable coin and not a stable coin which in my own view is not up to the standard of bitcoin

Facebook really step up their game on every kind of platform. I already seen many streamer opt to stream on Facebook instead Twitch or Youtube. They have the stars donate that very convenient and with Libra back up behind, no doubt from video contents makers to streamers of Twitch and Youtube will have to make a choice to stay or jump.

Libra is very popular, moreover before this is created. The coin from Facebook really can enter the market with high hype. FB really know how to attract many investors for their coins. And that's true, Libra may give competitive advantages over the Bitcoin. But of course, both will have their negative and positive sides. LIbra will be a stable coin, different from BTC. BTC may reach its highest price someday that will give you big profits, but Libra will not reach at that simple and short time.

Well, the blame is not to be out on anyone, we are in a world where everyone is looking for business to do to give them income and that is what they care about right now irrespective of where such income will come from, we already failed cryptocurrency from the onset too, every one of us, when the only reason why we want to hold bitcoin is for it to grow and yield an increase.

Let me ask some of us, ever since we bought bitcoin, how many time have we even used it to make payment, and this is supposed to be what will make bitcoin really valuable when it is being exchanged from time to time, and it is decreasing the supply and creating demand. So, let every one of them just play their games accordingly, all will still be useful in their own space.

It seems to me that here two different things are compared. Facebook popularity cannot be connected with the future fate of its cryptocurrency. Libra is not a rival of Bitcoin as soon as it is going to be a stable coin. The price for Libra will be fixed, and it will be not released for different speculations. BTC is for making profits and getting returns now.

BCH (Bitcoin Cash) is one of the top coins on coin market cap, exactly, it is on the top 5. With the trading volume $1,371,276,956 (per 24h) and 17,902,000 BCH for the circulating supply, I believe that this altcoin is one of the worthy coins to invest. Moreover, this coin also has good increase so far.

you are wrong on so many levels
we do want bitcoin to be stable , it is better to have a small growth than random ups and down up to 35% of the price
there are hundreds of reasons to invest into a stablecoin , one of them is when the market volatile or going down
USDT was a relatively safe haven to keep coins for traders , when every other coin was falling tether was -0.02% or so
you confuse speculate and invest here ,probably - investing is a longterm process ,usually
and you do want to have a stable income rather than watch your asset lose half of its value one day

Bitcoin wasn't solely made as an investment. Bitcoin was made to be used as a store-of-value and or a currency. Bitcoin is just an investment right now due to it's volatility and it's potential to go a lot higher in the future, but the end goal is still for bitcoin to have a stable price. I mean, I don't know about you, but I'd definitely prefer my fiat hedge and day-to-day currency to be stable in price.

We should not deny the fact that the personality behind libra will easily influence it in the market and it is because of that, that we are hearing different personalities talking about it when it has not been launch but becoming more popular in cryptocurrency cycle more than almost all the stablecoins and altcoins. That do not mean that it is going to replace bitcoin because bitcoin has a strong foundation and it is decentralized.

Libra to many seems going to be big but are the crypto space going to be free as it was initially integrated as a privacy stuff with Libra? Is what we should be concern about as I see it to be a tools for regulators to get their way in to crypto .

But I can see more adoption coming thru Libra and main usage of blockchain might be jeopardize with at the end but all in all let watch and see where this will end.

I think they were hating on Facebook a little bit too much LOL. But I really couldn't blame them, as Facebook has done some crap concerning privacy multiple times in the past already. Such a shame for a decent platform that went to crap.

One thing I found frustrating to hear though, is that even though Marcus said multiple times that multiple companies(not solely Facebook) will have control over Libra, some of the people(?)/officials in the hearing is still pushing as if Facebook has 100% control over Libra.

User data leakage to the public is proof that Facebook has a vulnerability to security, this is a consideration and has become my memory that is always questionable. I personally have lost interest and worry about that, if they launch libra later, maybe I am more comfortable using and storing libra to another wallet.

My post was an answer to the comment bellow

So what is you point in saying all this stuff? Discrediting Bitcoin for what it has achieved over the years cannot make you Libra come closer to it. Also, Bitcoin community does not seem stagnant coz it's always evolving as what we have experienced since it started.

Bitcoin network has tens of thousands of nodes, which gives it all the cool properties that it has. Will Libra have the same amount of nodes? No, their nodes will just be rented datacenters, and subject to all the problems that you've mentioned like being prone to errors, not being able to handle the traffic at certain times. Libra is not stealing Bitcoin technology, it more closely resembles alts like Tron and EOS, and it will be just a centralized payment company, and centralized payment companies aren't direct competitors of Bitcoin.

Nano is not secure, nor is it decentralized. It uses a variant of delegated proof-of-stake where a limited number of centralized delegated representatives vote to prevent forking or double spending.

That's the trade-off. If you want reliably irreversible and censorship-resistant transactions, Bitcoin is the obvious choice. There are thousands of cheaper alternatives -- including Libra or Nano -- if decentralization and strong security are not required.

Libra started a pr compaign as I see..

first thing - bitcoin is not stagnant by any means
stability is the sign of a class and bitcoin has been doing very well over the past years - it didn't have any critical failures or scandals that could threaten its existence, it hasn't been compromised or hacked or anything
Lightning network introduction makes bitcoin a perspective alternative method of payment and its price is breaking the profit records , name one asset that could bring you thousands of % profit in just 5 years?
as for Libra having advantages over bitcoin , Libra is waporware at the moment
we do not know how it performs when it is released , neither we know if the central banks and the governments allow this direct competitor to fiat
I bet they will fight tooth and nail to put obstacles and maybe even ban it in certain countries
all in all Libra should pave the way to the decentralized coins to enter the mainstream and in this regard it is doing bitcoin and crypto in general a service

Crypto is about privacy and decentralization. As for this point of view, Libra is not a competitor for BTC.

Crypto currency and gold well" definitely is both g important and good investment, gold is good keep it as investment, digital currency is gpguve better job and give easy and convenient for all fast transaction transfering the fund and use it for pay bill using the modern technology. I think no need to worries about the threat of crypto to economic effect of the country it bring better source of income for the every country community to growth their economies. Lira coun can to get easy to all, hope libra coin can convince people all over the world to learn what is crypto or what is bitcoin connected into crypto as general.

I watched all the recent hearings about Libra. It's impossible to put into words how much the US government despises Facebook and detests the concept of Libra.

I would put the odds of Libra being permitted to exist in the form they're proposing at - 0%

It absolutely will not happen unless it's watered down into something even more pisspoor than Paypal.

In my opinion, now the Libra coin has very little chances of being released at all. The US and Europe are quickly taking measures so that Facebook does not release its Libra. A bill has been submitted to the US Congress that specifically aimed against the emergence of this coin and prohibiting IT-campaigns with an annual turnover of, in my opinion, more than 12 billion dollars to participate in such financial projects. In addition, at a recent meeting of G7 countries finance ministers, it was also decided to oppose the appearance of this coin. So that states understand the threat to their national currencies with the advent of Libra and the possibility of gathering almost complete confidential information about at least a third of the world's population.

Facebook was created in 2004 and Bitcoin in 2009. We'll see what market cap it will have when it's as old as facebook is now. We still have 5 years to go.

Facebook received big founding and was advertised. Bitcoin was not and started from scratch as a decentralized project. You're comparing apples and oranges. Facebook is advertising as we speak bitcoin still after 10 years is not.

and yes his startup is shit ask any experts in tech space.

and to compete with usd,euro and financial system like banks and bunch others which is industry more then 30 trillion usd market,

this industry is like small child wait soon this child will grow , you just far away from knowing the big picture and focus on numbers, educate yourself because crypto space is compete the all financial system , do you fucking get this idea....mark is nothing.

19 July 2018
FACEBOOK
Mkt cap   $566.22B
CRYPTO SPACE
Mkt cap   $282,25B

some of your statement is not true look on nano coin about  transactions.

shitcoin by shit man mr fuckerberg which know only to steal and copy cat others, and his startup facebook is shit compare to crypto space.

crypto is peer to peer tech and ask every e xpert in tech space he will tell you who try to fight with peer to peer tech will lose.

peer to peer file sharing was ban from e very country and the oldest tech in the space and still growing like a monster and bitcoin burn from peer to peer file sharing mixed with cryptography.

its speculative investment for uneducated people, the smart and experts know peer to peer will eat the entire system and facebook include, they know from where come peer to peer and what the power of it.

and dude facebook is stable coin the price will not grow, at last this you must know or you fucking in deep shit

Why do you think Libra is "secure?" You think your payments on Libra are irreversible?

It's pretty hard to compete with free transactions. No decentralized system can offer that -- users either pay via transaction fees, inflation or demurrage. Otherwise there is no incentive for honest consensus.

So, Libra can offer you free transactions. That's great. But it comes at a cost:

• Your transactions can be reversed and your money can be frozen/confiscated.
• You need to complete KYC to transact on the network at all.
• Your transaction data will be sold to 3rd parties.

Even if we ignore the "digital gold" aspects, these seem like strong reasons to use Bitcoin for P2P payments rather than Libra.

Please read my other comments also on this post. We are not far. Why would you think I'm in bitcointalk? I see that this community doesn't take Libra seriously, that's the reason I'm posting this.

When would you understand that it is not just about bitcoin but crypto-enthusiast as a whole? I like to be anonymous, I like to have freedom over my transactions, I like to have the code-open-sourced. I don't care what market value is of the coin as long as I don't want to use banks. I don't like someone watching over my transactions. Read all that and think about Libra again, "Libra created by FACEBOOK".

It can become a store of value but right now it is just a speculative investment. Thank you for the cointelegraph link, I haven't read that one.

people need to have freedom, to have something decentralized like bitcoin.


as I said, people need decentralized things, bitcoin can be "digital gold" and can also be used as a means of payments, I do not see why people would use Libra if they can use Fiat to make purchases

I agree with this:

Libra Is Like Sending a Friend Request to Terrorists, Politician Says


This is a big joke, you know this is not true.


just google it

Shill for what Libra? Yes dude I bought Libra and shilling the coin. I will sell when double.... Obviously you don't know what you are talking about. I am not qualified enough to discuss technical issues although I understand them. Also all your guesses are wrong. Plus I didn't get scammed by any exchange. This was obviously a try to attack the person by looking into his history.
The argument is what it is. If you don't have any concerns about Bitcoin you can always go allin and bash anyone that has a different opinion.

Do we have a shill here? Move this damn thread to Shit-Coin discussion already.

@op : I would have taken your argument into account if you could compare them based on the technical specifications. But for peanut brains like you who judges a coin by it's market value, I don't have much to discuss. Let me guess, you created your first ever bitcoin wallet on Coinbase? And got fucked over by one of these scammy exchanges.

If I believe in a digital currency that is Bitcoin only. This means I don't have to speak my concerns with the community especially when there is a clear threat for all cryptocurrencies?
This is a list of facebook acquisitions, most were seen as possible disruptors for the market. So perhaps you will actually realize the threat too and stop your winning bullshit about reddit.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mergers_and_acquisitions_by_Facebook

The ordinary people who doesn't have bank access will now have! Definitely support it.

What I can see is that Libra is going to takeover in terms of marketcap probably beat BTC on top but its still is still what is it. Its going to be a success of facebook of course but we also get what we want the adoption. Those who are concern more of privacy may not really be happy about it but I guess it solves one problem we have.

You are making sense. Most of the comments do also. I'm trying not to be adamantant on most of my positions thats why I asked and I read each and every answer carefully. This is my current position but perhaps I will be more flexible if this is discussed in a convincing manner. I have to thank the bitcointalk community for their insight as usual. There are a lot of really intelligent people on this forum.

My job for around 5 years was to observe rejected transactions through a lot of banking systems, POS and E-commerce made with Visa, Mastercard, AMEX and a few more ways of payments. You can't imagine how many problems exist, especially for overseas transactions (US to EU mostly and the opposite). There is not just one centralized system that has to process a transaction, but usually three or four. On any of these systems there are variables that might cause a transaction to fail. Most of these variables are unknown to the card holder and to the merchant. Quite a few doesn't even have to do with them but with the card options. So in order for a transaction to proceed you have to put trust to your Bank, your card (Visa/Master), the outside companies that processed the details in their database, the merchants bank and it goes on. All these are based in centralized servers. One server goes down (and they go down very often) and you get rejections. One data would be entered wrong and you might not be able to buy tickets at the airdrop you were making vacations. These are real problems that are not rare.
So the first thing the world needed and Bitcoin provided was this. Cancel the middle man. Noone needs to trust a bank or outside processing companies. You just trust yourself, the tech and cut the middle man.
What was actually needed was this model. It was close to flawless and at least a few thousand of people realized it immediately.
Paypal was a revolution as well. Still it has many problems, like limits and refunds, that are probably unsolvable.

My point is that Facebook with Libra, is actually stealing the hard work that was invested for Bitcoin to become the absolute means of transactions. What was needed so the whole world would adopt it was low fees (as it used to have for a while) and instant transactions. I say it looks stagnant because the Lightning Network doesn't seem to be a priority. Also there are many doubts if LN can work the way it is supposed to. I believe there should be more effort made in this subject.

if op was post it on reddit mod will ban him for scamming and mislead people to say that bitcoin is only store of value and its far away from the truth because low supply cryptos is

store of value and cash in the same time and was designed in this way,


if he post this on reddit after the mods kick his ass out the users over there will debunk the ass of mr fuckereberg with logic because libra is joke for experts in economics and blockchain.


whether its stable coin or usd which is only lose' value because supply is unlimited its the same shit ask any economist about this.

There has been a lot of discussions on Libra and its effects on the modern society, and I think that alone speaks up for itself to the extent of "caring" for what its worth.


I have been seeing this 'bitcoin's scaling problems' since 2015 but really, why are we being so problematic about a scenario that isn't closely being there, or rather a problem being artificially created at times? Even the proposed big blocks and other solutions for scalability proved to be a failure at this point, and I admit that SegWit also has its own flaws and we are seeing congested network activity from time to time, but that doesn't mean that bitcoin in its current form falls short on most points that a working cryptocurrency needs. Heck, Libra might one-up bitcoin in terms of advertisement and scalability, but even cybersec experts are not putting their trust on Libra even if it's not out in the open yet. That speaks much about a centralized coin issued by a company that found itself over hot waters countless of times.


Both, and I know that couldn't exist in one manifestation/coin only. but I'd definitely not choose Libra to be the digital currency we need, ever.



The recent targets actually isn't about development but profits on the pocket, sadly, and that's the harsh truth that I have observed as of late.

its also bullshit when he say that bitcoin is digital gold because bitcoin and other low supply cryptos like monero and zcash and cosmos and ethereum are

digital gold and cash in the same time, here op also scam ask experts in blockchain about this.

low supply crypto have much more less supply the gold and diamond and their is equation to see this in very nice way so its mean bitcoin is not digital gold its much more scarce.

bitcoin,monero,dash,zcash,cosmos, and other low supply coins are, *store of value and cash in the same time* while gold and diamonds are only store of value.

here

Of course it needs digital gold, we already have fast and secure digital currency - we have Visa and Mastercard, we have PayPal and Venmo. In most countries using payment cards for daily purchases is very comfortable - fees are low or even zero, confirmations are instant, buyers are protected from fraud and in many cases can get their money back. What the world didn't have before Bitcoin is a digital store of value that can't be seized by the government, can't be frozen by banks, can't be stopped by laws and regulations.

To my opinion Libra doesn't have such potential and it will not be so successful as some predict. No matter the all back up and support it might have. But at the end the market will decide and that is only fair. Still I don't believe that Libra could endanger Bitcoin, these are two totaly different concepts and therefore they have different types of supporters but Bitcoin will remain at the throne.

I would not say the community is stagnant, it has been constantly evolving over they years with new players getting involved as the currency matures. It's a collection of different people with different objectives. I'm my opinion, majority are in now for the volatility and potential to increase, hence we have long term hodlers.

My target for Bitcoin would be it becoming a stable store of value, and possibly used for national reserves.

The world needs both. In my opinion, before it makes sense to use bitcoin for a day to day currency by the masses, it needs to have a more stable price. And for that, we need more liquidity. A LOT more liquidity. And before bitcoin reaches that point, it first needs to be a collectible(which it already became in the past when bitcoin was pretty much worthless), and then a store of value(now).

For now, Bitcoin will be a store of value and a niche currency(for countries facing economic crisis, for government opposition companies like WikiLeaks, and for us computer nerds).

In the near future you will see libra on top-10 of every cryptocurrency index as it will be valued in Billions even as a stablecoin.
All indexes already have Libra's spot ready and waiting for the release.
https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/libra
https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/facebook-libra/
https://www.worldcoinindex.com/news/facebook-unveils-its-native-cryptocurrency-libra-in-a-bid-to-transform-global-finance

"Reaching the unbanked"
From the coindesk article it is clear that Libra will be a fierce competitor of Bitcoin:
https://www.coindesk.com/facebook-launches-subsidiary-to-support-new-libra-crypto
So our moto "Banking the unbanked" is now Libra's main verse and noone seems to actually care.

Our main devs decided Bitcoin should become digital "Store of Value", short of gold but in digits, instead of "A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System" as stated on the title of the Whitepaper.
Facebook probably discovered that Bitcoin has difficulties in scaling so they made in no-time an answer to what the world exactly needs.

What do you think the world needs?
Digital gold or a fast and secure digital currency?

From my point of view the Bitcoin community seem to be stagnant, without any real targets set. What are the targets you want Bitcoin to have?