Topic: List of bitcoin hostile banks. [edit] New thread see first line. (Read 30723 times)

u cant give that reason, I tried, u have to choose from predefined list... so crappy. not really a feedback but predefined conformised feedback.

Agreed, an advisement does not mean it is law. There have been many "advisements" made by the IRS which
did not hold up in court. A positive advisement is good protection if the IRS tries to go after you, but a negative
advisement does not mean they will win when they do. I assume the same is true in Thailand for these types of things.

This thread is no longer in use, please use the new thread at

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=264679.new#new

And we are awaiting some documentation/proof before I can add this to the list.

You can add Popmoney to the list they shut down payments to LiteTree Litecoin Exchange.

[edit]I am nolonger maintaining this thread, but joesmoe2012 has kindly promised to do so, the new thread can be found at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=264679.new#new

I believe the site is a few days old.
Oh, there used to be a tool for submitting info

UNICREDIT works with BITSTAMP, i sent a sepa (dollars) to an account in europe (unicredit too) and all goes well

please add this info:

1. Commerzbank is a german bank, so u are right

2. another bitcoin friendly bank is Fidor Bank  (https://www.fidor.de/)
that company works together with bitcoin.de , a germany bitcoin exchange.

http://www.coindesk.com/germanys-bitcoin-de-and-fidor-bank-ag-form-partnership/

they are even promote this on their website, so i guess its one of the bitcoin friendly bank that exists at the moment ;-)


thanks for making the list.

... there weren't any banks listed on bankblacklist.com. Just comics. It's a shame, because the community needs this. The problem is bad here in Canada, where the government is relatively fine with Bitcoin, and we are locked in a battle in the private sector with Canada's banks. Ever since the financial crisis in the States, these Canadian banks that never defaulted are too powerful, and do as they please. So far, we don't think any of the Bitcoin business or Bitcoin-accepting businesses in Vancouver have had problems, although we're concerned about the status of one restaurant who uses TD. The current operator of Bitcoin Co-op's account is ashamed to say he still uses RBC, but would like to cancel soon and explain to them why he did so in great detail.

I am nolonger maintaining the op, I reccomend any new and or old submissions to go to:
http://bankblacklist.com/

If someone wants to take over maintaining the thread:
1. Should the mods allow it & transfer the thread under another op.
2. Or just make a new thread and start with the little info that was accumulated here.

I'd be fine with it, actually encourage it.

Adding Comerica
The bank, Comerica, gave “no reason” for the closure
http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/07/iafcu

Isokivi

According to James Canadian Banks do not ask for AYL/KYC and assume they don't have it
Direct Source Canadianbitcoins
No update from the post in June on status assume status quo is the same

For the record I remember cash deposit at TD BMO and CIBC heck Western Union was on there at one time but they were asshats
July 31th 2012   Removed Western Union. They are a bunch of asshats and have been 'returning' a lot of transactions for 'security reasons' and wont give any more details.
https://www.canadianbitcoins.com/messages.php
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.2545770

Thank you for your valuable input. You must feel useful.

My friends use TD Bank in the US for all bitcoin purchases and they've never had problems. Also, I use Citizen's Bank (the subsidiary of Royal Bank of Scotland) and I haven't had many problems. I don't really have proof that either is "bitcoin friendly", but could they go under unconfirmed?

This thread is even more inaccurate than the "List of ongoing scams" thread.

Nope.
Bitcoin.de is currently negotiating with Fidor Bank AG for some sort of partnership far beyond than just operating heir account.

Fidor will handle the customers accounts and they will be protected by the 100k deposit insurance of german gov. At the moment bitcoin.de has problems with people refusing to pay settled trades,but this partnership allows no chargebacks then.


http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1197313/bitcoin-de-and-fidor-bank-ag-agree-on-large-scale-partnership

Amagi Metals said Bank of the West shut down their account so I guess you can add them to the list.

Op updated with This seems like a more robust tool for the same purpose: http://bankblacklist.com/

What are banks anyway? Does banking system really exist which is at par with bitcoin standard? Fiat money is overrated. I say instead of exchanging. Wait.

Updated BMO status.

CANADA (5 banks by law)

Royal Bank of Canada - Closed CaVirtex and "Canadian Bitcoins" trading accounts.

Toronto-Dominion Bank - Closed "CADBitcoin" trading account

Bank of Nova Scotia - Closed "CaVirtex" cash account

Bank of Montreal - Closed "CaVirtex" cash deposit account

Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce - No information

I'm not saying they should, simply (at this point) they do.  Of course banks could control Bitcoin in their accounts, and could create an economic model under which lending etc. would be feasible & profitable.  As of now, no (government sanctioned) Bitcoin banks exist, and until a bank starts dealing in Bitcoin, it's safe to say all banks are hostile to Bitcoin.  Bitcoin encroaches upon the fiat economy, and thus on the banks (unless Bitcoin's widespread acceptance becomes inevitable & the banks are forced to accept/incorporate it).  Satoshi was not being overly cautious when he wanted to shield Bitcoin from premature public attention. 

Why should they?


Banks can easily control BItcoin that are stored at their accounts.
They could even offer interest rate in Bitcoin accounts.


As long as governments will have a Fiat currency in place, Bitcoin might be an interesting solution, but banks have no need for controlling them. They don't need the control at all.

The answer to which banks are hostile to Bitcoin?  Same as the answer to how many people are dead in that cemetery:  All of them.  

banks arent hostile to bitcoin, theyre hostile to multilevel marketing scams.

Royal Bank of Canada = Bankster-Complex scum

"Sofort Bank                                      Germany                  Proof was given to me in a private message I will not publish, unless it's sender gives me the go ahead, my source tells me anyone can verify                                                                                                                       this by contacting the bank about opening an account for a bitcoin related buisness, perhaps someone fluent in german could do this ?"

I'd appreciate a verification on that.

Which bank? We could possibly do this too.

I will translate anything you want to German if anyone wants to do this.

I see Capital One listed here and I'm dismayed by that although not at all surprised given what I know about them as a company.  The reason for that is that I use them as an online savings account - not by choice, I have what was an ING Direct Savings account, but Capital One bought them out.  I was really hoping that GE would buy them out instead of Capital One because I like them better as a company and they were bidding on it when it was up for sale, but no such luck.

However, I am reluctant to change savings accounts because they have a feature that is extremely useful to me.  I bank Online only now and this Savings accounts lets me deposit checks simply by signing them and taking pictures and uploading the pictures.  It's extremely convenient.  That's really my only reason for wanting to stick with them as a Savings account; if anyone knows of another online Savings Account that has this feature, please let me know and I would love to switch.  I tried Barclays but their UI is terrible, and even before discovering that they were hostile to Bitcoin, I didn't like them because of they played a part in the LIBOR scandal.

One thing I would REALLY like to know is which bank the company Coinbase uses.  Even if they're somehow handling the bitcoin -> USD currency conversion all on their own, surely they have a business bank account somewhere and just because of the nature of their business, I'd say that bank is likely supportive of Bitcoin.

Edited to add: Capital One is a McLean, VA based company, so you could put United States down as far as where they're based.

Copypaste from reddit:

"Just received this e-mail:

DWOLLA

As of 12:13 PM on 5/14/2013:

You’re receiving this notice because our systems have indicated that you’ve processed and completed a real-time Dwolla-to-Dwolla payment to Mutum Sigillum LLC (“Mt. Gox”) within the last 24 hours.

Due to recent court orders received from the Department of Homeland Security and U.S. District Court for the District of Maryland, Dwolla is no longer legally able to service Mutum Sigillum LLC’s account.

This is a courtesy email encouraging you to follow up on any uncompleted orders with Mutum Sigillum LLC as Dwolla is now unable to move money to and from Mutum Sigillum LLC’s Dwolla account.

Dwolla is not party to this matter nor does it have any information or further insight into the situation. We strongly encourages those with questions to contact Mutum Sigillum LLC

Note: Dwolla requires a court order before honoring requests such as seizing funds or revoking access to an account.

On behalf of Dwolla, we apologize for this inconvenience."

https://www.moneybookers.com/app/help.pl?s=terms

Both belong on the list, could someone please link me some info on moneybookers to post as proof.

Thank you, Paypal has been added to the list.

Why not list e-wallet companies like moneybookers and paypal, and what about other payment processors. These companies also interface between fiat to btc.

Does PayPal get honorary mention in the hostile "bank*" list for effectively declaring war on Bitcoin?

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.2114217

* Assuming Paypal is bank-like enough with its user currency accounts and payment processing service.

Point taken. Green would be friendly, Blue is "Tolerant", Black for no data, and Red for Hostile.


It's also questionable if staying in a country where industry is hostile towards systems that are a net good for society is the best option.

Just a note--I did this with a TD account a couple of years back (obnoxious service) and they helpfully overdrafted the account with account fees, then charged me an overdraft fee, then shut down the account and started sending me collections notices on the "money owed"...

I'll pay off my BarclayCard balance, close the account and tell them why.

They of course won't give a shit about one customer but I'll do my bit.

Yeah ..Scotiabank closed my account too..I was using it to trade BTC ...they are going bananas here in Canada..lol..the Scotiabank manager referred to bitcoin as  "trading bit money " lol ..anyway ...I believe they are concerned that the new kid on the block might steal their cake.

Any recommended banks in the UK, or just the odd one to avoid?

If you are going to make a list of friendly banks I would like some evidence that they are actually supporting btc in some way to be on that list or else they should be labelled "Neutral"

I am particularly interested in the Bank of Montreal because I am Canadian and also have an account with CaVirtex.

Simply "working with CaVirtex" isn't a reason to consider them "friendly" to btc. 

I think all banks should be considered "Neutral" to btc until you can provide evidence that they have actually taken some action or made some form of announcement that they are not against btc.

Did the BMO actually state they are working with CaVirtex?  If not, they may be planning to shut down their bank account any day now.

Anyone have any evidence they aren't planning on shutting down CaVirtex's accounts?

Thank you, added to the Op.

Updated Scotiabank status.

CANADA (5 banks by law)

Royal Bank of Canada - Closed CaVirtex and "Canadian Bitcoins" trading accounts.

Toronto-Dominion Bank - Closed "CADBitcoin" trading account

Bank of Nova Scotia - Closed "CaVirtex" cash account

Bank of Montreal - Working with CaVirtex

Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce - No information

Bitfloor has done a piss poor job in handling this, but I still sympathize, shame on you Capitol One.

This is a good list, it will let us keep a record of who our friends and enemies are in the financial sector, maybe you could also point out the ones that have been friendly to Bitcoin as well.

Edit: Oops didn't read the thread carefully since I'm tired, I see you've already done that

It's a great list to have - I will certainly refer to this list as well.

Cheers, that's a good idea.

Unconfirmed reports dissected to a separate list within the same post, I hope this satisfies everyone to atleast some extent.

Any Tory-Bilderberg Trotskyite Bankster who is not hostile to BTCitcoin needs to be locked up in a room and forced to listen to Milton Friedman lectures at one of their neo-Mercantilist "global Bilderberg Reich" neo National-Socialist (neoNazi) Economic "FEMA Re-education Camps".

The Universal BTCitcoin Free Market Money is the fabled New Economic World that is to replace their old, bankrupted through fraud and vile permanent-war-communist corruption debt-enslaved ones.

Never forget William Wilberforce!

These terrorist Tory-Bilderberg Trotskyite Menshevik permanent-war-communists don't need our great, great, great grandchildren's debt payments, they just want to keep debt enslaving us all, to them, forever...

We are all Debt Slavery Abolitionists, get with the program!

Suomen Verkkomaksut is really siding with the devil...? 

I will have to call them tomorrow...

If the information is correct, it would be a disservice to remove it altogether. Perhaps you might just keep a different section for information that at the moment can't be publicly substantiated?

I think then that they should be removed - If we are not going to do this based on evidence then what point is there?? 

("he said she said"...)

I will not publish private messages without permission from the sender. If the community here feels such entries do not belong on this list then I will remove them, please voice your opinnion.

Unfortunately I'm a bitcoin24 customer, hence somehow I've followed
the evolution since the blockade (Luckily enough I hadn't had a lot of money into
it though).

It seems everything started cause Deutsche Bank had some problem with
phishing that is somehow linked with a bitcoin24 owner bank account, anyway is
it a quite long story, read more in those links: 

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1c7utl/bitcoin24com_the_polish_authority_closed_your_our/c9f6s6w
https://bitcoin-24.com/ (there are a few official documents linked there)

of course a lot of other factors played a role, e.g. the naivety of bitcoin24 owner

ps since yesterday it is possible to withdraw BTC from bitcon24, unfortunately
    the same is not possible for fiat, be it EUR or USD, and more to the point
    it will take at best few months to get it back :/

I used to use ING Direct, wonderful service.  Now owned by Capital One.  I'd like to dump them, but don't know anything better.  Anyone suggest a good alternative?  I need a bank I can use completely online, I don't want to ever go to a branch.  And ING's bill-pay where they will mail a physical check out for me is key.

Chase, BoA, Capital One.... I say avoid them all.  I've had accounts with all three, and bad experience with each.  Now I only use local credit unions.  And an Amex card.

Added "Also I would like to know if AML and KYG requirements have been met by the services in question, if not then the entry does not belong on the list imo, discuss."
I think this criteria should be met to make the list, please help me prune invalid entries.

Also added a friendly bank list, but I will only be listing banks that allow bitcoin services to use their service. Not every single bank someone has managed to make a wire or sepa transfer from.

so who fucked us, BOF or Bankone ?

Please disclose all sources, if they want to remain anonymous can they submit the reason to wikileaks or something?

How about a list with banks that are friendly to BTC? SEB in Sweden just said that they might work with BTC if it found a larger crowd and any legal issues where examined and cleared.
The article is from their chief strategist and is actually quite good, he explains the problems with BTC and also the possibilities (from a bank perspective).
Source:
http://www.seb.se/pow/wcp/index.asp?ss=/pow/wcp/templates/sebarticle.cfmc.asp%3FDUID%3DDUID_7229FBC192B9765BC1257B55005559B3%26sitekey%3Dseb.se%26lang%3Dse

It's in Swedish so you have to use google translate

I think it would be more convenient to sort banks by country and their dealings regarding bitcoins:

We need to open the bank where would a Bitcoin vendors. It only takes three million dollars to open a bank in Panama.

A number of banks in the Uk have not been kind to bitcoin related businesses.

• Barclays Bank prevented MtGox, Intersango and Blockchain.info from accepting GBP.
• Metro Bank - Intersango used them for a while

Thank you, but the fisrst thing I checked about the list does not seem up to speed, according to bitcoin24 "The prosecutor office of Berlin has confiscated the account of BTC24 at the Commerzbank." Imho this does not justyfy outting Commerzbank on the list.

I will work my way trough the rests when I get back from work.

Well, shit.  I have TD in the USA.  They're technically different companies though, so does that count as bad?

Not true. Bitfloor's funds were kept in a Chase bank account.

Bank of America was just a venue for deposits made through a third party. (LocalTill)

If OP decides to add "friendly" list:

I used Lloyds TSB in UK to do multiple transfers to mtgox.
Usually takes 3-4 working days.

As a side note - there is something very dodgy with Lloyds TSB fee calculation.

Transfer itself costs £20. On top of that you get charged <£10 at the other end.
The dodgy part is that sometimes they add ~£100 charge(this depends on the size of tx) - happened on 2 out of 5 transfers.

Great idea, will be nice to also add to wiki's once a more complete list is formalised.

I do have a bitcoin project or two in the works (Slowly) which would require cooperation from banks, so knowing which ones could dislike bitcoin in general would help in choosing which one to go for.

May I suggest compiling a list of "friendly" banks along side?

Bitfloor was closed down by bank of america.

Is there concern over just the Canadian side of TD? or TD Bank, N.A. (USA subsidary) as well?

edit: The article is linking to the TD Bank (american) website, which will probably just cause confusion.

just empty the account and leave it. Assholes at TD try to charge you 60$ to close account.

Damnit TD, you've been so good to me until now. I may have to end up doing the same.

Royal Bank Canada and TD bank in Canada are two banks I used to do business, years ago. Both offered such miserable service (high fees, surley staff, at the very least 20 min. lineups) that i quit both and found infinitely better service at BMO (bank of montreal) I rarely wait more than 5 min. in line, the staff is friendly and eager to please, their fees are minimal. After moving to BMO I cannot believe ANYONE would do business with the other losers. TD even told me, when I removed all my money from them and asked them to close my account, that there is a SIXTY DOLLAR FEE TO CLOSE ACCOUNT! WTF?? I simply left 3 cents in the account and abandoned it. I guess TD sees this as a 3 cent win, but they will NEVER get the slightest endorsement from me, to the extent that when doing business with clients that use TD I recommend they switch. Absolutely one of the worst financial institutions ever. The only reason I can think that anyone still goes there is; some people WANT their bank to lord it over them and treat them like dirt because it makes them feel secure, or something.

copying the list over there to safe you people one click:


Ente

There was a similar cataloguing effort on Reddit a week ago, whence you might source some more institutions:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1cm9le/list_of_banks_that_dont_want_bitcoin_to_succeed/

I will close my TD account this week citing their unwarranted hostility towards Bitcoin as the reason.

I dare you to start operating a live online bitcoin/fiat exchange. Seriously, you propably have most if not all the required resources at your disposal and it'd eventually free up more of your precious time, not having to talk to two or three customers a day ; ) You'd prolly end up making more pocket change in the process.

I make my cut from the delays of the banks (and Technomage's service). People don't object paying 10-15% over gox if they can get it now.

None of the banks I use has given a fook, whether the business is related to bitcoin or not. I am entertaining the thought that banks, accountants, taxmen etc. just all get infused with bitcoin in such an early stage of the rise (such as now), that they will quit their jobs en masse and there will be no one left to tax us after a few months 

Trying to set an example, hoping others will follow. My main point here is to show that this is and will be a major concern when selecting banks.
[edit] Consider it something similiar to what the gay movement did way back by stamping cash with the pink tringle that nazi Germany assigned them dcades earlyer during the second world war.

Payment processors in Finland are very hostile to Bitcoin but that is only because the banks have declined to allow the instant payments related to Bitcoin purchases. Thus far at least.

For regular SEPA transfers and basic banking activities, no Finnish bank has shown any hostility. We run the biggest Finnish exchange and use 3 Finnish banks, no problems so far.

We've recently made new attempts to get the instant payment buttons to our exchange because that would increase convenience quite a bit, let's see how it goes.

To my understanding "Sofort bank" isn't a bank but a payment processor. It handles payment processing with webshops and works with multiple banks.

(Since OP is from Finland, equivalent companies from Finland would be "Suomen verkkomaksut" or "checkout.fi" - they are allowed to select their customers and also aren't dealing with bitcoins)

Huh 

I hereby promise I will never do business with a single bank that makes this list. I will do my best to avoid doing business with any of there customers.

[edit]I am nolonger maintaining this thread, but joesmoe2012 has kindly promised to do so, the new thread can be found at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=264679.new#new

To qualify on the list a bank or payment processor must without explanation terminate or refuse business of legitimate bitcoin busineses. The point of this threas is to name and shame said institutions and to encourage people who are there customers, regardless of bitcoin, to take there business elsewhere.

ATM This is by a long shot not a comprehensive list, your contributions are required. For starters it would be beneficial if someone could sum up the UK bank situation I am not up to date. Also I would like to know if AML and KYC requirements have been met by the services in question, if not then the entry does not belong on the list imo, discuss.

Bank / payment processor name      Country                            Proof                                                                         AML/KYC status

The Royal Bank of Canada                   Canada                    http://www.salon.com/2013/04/26/canada_tightens_restrictions_on_bitcoin_trading_partner/. https://www.libertybit.com/news
TDBank                                            Canada                    http://www.salon.com/2013/04/26/canada_tightens_restrictions_on_bitcoin_trading_partner/
Suomen verkkomaksut / checkout.fi      Finland                     Multiple reports of declining buisness with bitcoin related services, including bittiraha.fi.
Commerzbank                                   Germany                   Shut down bitcoin24 account
Capital One                                          ?                         Shut down bitfloor account
Metro Bank                                          ?                         Shut down intersango account
Barclays                                          UK                           Prevented MtGox, Intersango and Blockchain.info from accepting GBP.
Banco do Brasil                                 Brasil                       Shut down mercado bitcoin account
Ukash                                                                           http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1dbyo0/ukash_declines_merchant_application_for_bitcoin/
Royal Bank of Canada                        Canada                    https://www.coinforum.ca/discussion/57/canadian-bitcoins-and-cadbitcoin-have-accounts-frozen
Toronto-Dominion Bank                       Canada                   https://www.coinforum.ca/discussion/57/canadian-bitcoins-and-cadbitcoin-have-accounts-frozen
Bank of Nova Scotia                           Canada                   https://www.cavirtex.com/news , another user confirms he's account being closed too (in this thread, page 3).
Comercia                                             ?                        http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/07/iafcu
Unconfirmed reports:
Paypal                                            Global                      https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=202431.msg2114217#msg2114217

Bank name                                     Country    
Sofort Bank                                      Germany                  Proof was given to me in a private message I will not publish, unless it's sender gives me the go ahead, my source tells me anyone can verify this                                                                                                                by contacting the bank about opening an account for a bitcoin related buisness, perhaps someone fluent in german could do this ?
Uncategorized
Dwolla                                              US                       http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/05/feds-seize-money-from-top-bitcoin-exchange-mt-gox/ http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/10924/why-cant-dwolla-send-to-mt-gox                                                    It would appear that Dwolla is in no way hostile, but I felt it should be included on this list while the situation persists.
                      


Bitcoin friendly banks:
Bank name                                       Country               Relevant information
SEB                                                  Sweden                Swedish article, use google translate.
Nordea                                              Finland                 Conducts business with bittiraha.fi
Osuuspankki                                       Finland                 Conducts business with bittiraha.fi
Tapiola                                              Finland                 Conducts business with bittiraha.fi
Bank of Montreal                                 Canada                 Working with CaVirtex
Internet Credit Union                            ?                         "taking a proactive pro-Bitcoin stance" http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1g2r6q/audenx_is_a_badass/cagg431
TD Bank                                              US                     https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.2794888
Fidor Bank AG                                     Germany               http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1197313/bitcoin-de-and-fidor-bank-ag-agree-on-large-scale-partnership