The transaction eventually went through.
Thank you all a lot for your help. I learnt a lot. Thank you.
Topic: 'Local' transaction, yet can be found on a block explorer (Read 152 times)
I am now waiting for a response on the forum of the exchange. Earlier, I had resynced the SPV file of the decentralized exchange to try re-sending (in vain). But now, the interface of the exchange still has that re-send transaction pending. I imagine I have to restore the backup folder of the decentralized exchange I made before resyncing the SPV file, but I am not sure.
I am thinking I want to clarify the exchange part before I return to Electrum to broadcast and CPFP the 'Local' transaction.
Okay, so it's from a DEX, not a centralized Exchange.I am thinking I want to clarify the exchange part before I return to Electrum to broadcast and CPFP the 'Local' transaction.
Then you still have control over the transaction, the problem is it depends on the Decentralized Exchange's features.
If there's an option to export the address' private key, you can import it to a new imported Electrum wallet in "New->Import Bitcoin Address or Private keys"
and bump the transaction by utilizing "full-rbf" (not opt-in rbf) by following this: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.63198878
But I'm not familiar with most decentralized Exchange so I can't help you with that.
I want to clarify the exchange part before I return to Electrum to broadcast and CPFP the 'Local' transaction.
You can rebroadcast the transaction but, theoretically, you can not perform CPFP on a "local" transaction because the UTXOs you are trying to spend do not exist, according to the servers you wallet is connected to. First, you need to connect your wallet to servers that still have the transaction in their mempool and you should see its status as "unconfirmed" before you can perform CPFP.Keep in mind that this means you will have to pay more in fees in order to pay enough for the original transaction and its child.
Since the re-send can't be found on block explorers it could mean that your original transaction didn't have RBF enabled and nodes still have it in their mempool. This will result in the new transaction getting rejected because it conflicts with the original.
I think that is the case. I read on the forum on the exchange that it does not support RBF.
Your best option is to connect to an Electrum server that is able to see the original and use CPFP to bump the fee.
That's what I will do.
That local transaction is saved in your wallet file but not in all bitcoin nodes, if you want to keep a backup of it;
you either create a backup of wallet or create a backup the transaction by opening it (RClick->Details) and use the "Share" options (via "save to file" recommended).
you either create a backup of wallet or create a backup the transaction by opening it (RClick->Details) and use the "Share" options (via "save to file" recommended).
Thank you. I did not know. I backed up the local transaction file.
I am now waiting for a response on the forum of the exchange. Earlier, I had resynced the SPV file of the decentralized exchange to try re-sending (in vain). But now, the interface of the exchange still has that re-send transaction pending. I imagine I have to restore the backup folder of the decentralized exchange I made before resyncing the SPV file, but I am not sure. I am thinking I want to clarify the exchange part before I return to Electrum to broadcast and CPFP the 'Local' transaction.
Although, it will get dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction.
I'm curious to understand what I am missing here.So, since your transaction isn't actually sent yet but "in the process", if that $20 bill is used to successfully send to another person, your transaction cannot be completed.
Bitcoin works different, it's not like a back account where transactions deduct balance from the sender.
Wallets show a total balance for simplicity that but it uses "UTXO model" under the hood (more info).
I am the sender and I can't increase the fee from the wallet of the exchange.
Unfortunately, unlike Electrum, Exchanges are custodial.It's up to them if they are willing to bump a transaction, but I'm most certain that most custodial services do not do that.
Or wait for it to be able to broadcast again then use CPFP to the transaction to bump its fee (right-click->"Child pays for parent"),
That's what I am most comfortable doing. I will try changing server now and then until the inbound transaction get "picked up" again, and CPFP. I have a couple of precautionary questions: is it safe to:
- update Electrum
- receive and send other transactions
while I have this 'Local' transaction hanging?
The only issue I find is when sending while "spend only confirmed coins" is disabled
because the output of your local transaction may get selected that'll cause the new transaction to be invalid for spending non-existing coin.
If that setting is disabled in "pay" new transaction dialogue's settings icon, you can temporarily disable the setting or freeze its output in the 'Coins' tab.
The former will prevent you from spending the change from your other unconfirmed transactions.
That local transaction is saved in your wallet file but not in all bitcoin nodes, if you want to keep a backup of it;
you either create a backup of wallet or create a backup the transaction by opening it (RClick->Details) and use the "Share" options (via "save to file" recommended).
You can import that back via "Tools->Load transaction->From File' and broadcast in case it got totally dropped and deleted as long as its input is still unspent.
I can't get my head around why the transaction would get "dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction."
I am the sender, and I've tried re-sending that UTXO(?), after resyncing the SPV of the decentralized exchange I am withdrawing from. This attempt to re-send is pending (on the interface of the exchange), and can't be found on mempool.space. I imagine that the attempt to re-send is pending because the previous transaction (the one in question, that is inbound to the Electrum wallet) is still "in the network". That is why I struggle to understand how the transaction would get "dropped for good once its input is spent by another transaction".
I'm curious to understand what I am missing here.
I am the sender, and I've tried re-sending that UTXO(?), after resyncing the SPV of the decentralized exchange I am withdrawing from. This attempt to re-send is pending (on the interface of the exchange), and can't be found on mempool.space. I imagine that the attempt to re-send is pending because the previous transaction (the one in question, that is inbound to the Electrum wallet) is still "in the network". That is why I struggle to understand how the transaction would get "dropped for good once its input is spent by another transaction".
I'm curious to understand what I am missing here.
If your re-send successfully propagates then the original transaction will disappear forever from every mempool. Since the re-send can't be found on block explorers it could mean that your original transaction didn't have RBF enabled and nodes still have it in their mempool. This will result in the new transaction getting rejected because it conflicts with the original.
Your best option is to connect to an Electrum server that is able to see the original and use CPFP to bump the fee.
Thank you all.
I can't get my head around why the transaction would get "dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction."
The transaction fee is low and that was why the server that your wallet is connected to dropped it, but it is still in other mempool. If you increase the fee or bump the fee to a higher one, the transaction will be added back to the mempool, and because miners are selecting transactions with high fee, if they add your transaction to the next block and it gets confirmed, your old transaction will be dropped because the first transaction that will be successfully added to the blockchain is what will be valid, and the other one will be invalid because they both have the same input.Although, it will get dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction.
I can't get my head around why the transaction would get "dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction."
What you can do is remove the transaction from the sending wallet, which will allow you to spend those coins in a new transaction. If the transaction is showing as local, simply right click on it and delete it. This will indeed reset your balances, and you can then make a new transaction sending the same coins (plus any other coins you want to send) with a higher fee.
I have a couple of precautionary questions: is it safe to:
- update Electrum
- receive and send other transactions
while I have this 'Local' transaction hanging?
- update Electrum
- receive and send other transactions
while I have this 'Local' transaction hanging?
You can update your Electrum wallet. Updating the wallet will not affect the local transaction. And you can send and receive other transactions. When sending, I recommend not to use unconfirmed assets to avoid any misunderstandings. If you try to send unconfirmed coins, Electrum will warn you "This transaction will spend unconfirmed coins.".
Thank you all.
I can't get my head around why the transaction would get "dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction."
I am the sender, and I've tried re-sending that UTXO(?), after resyncing the SPV of the decentralized exchange I am withdrawing from. This attempt to re-send is pending (on the interface of the exchange), and can't be found on mempool.space. I imagine that the attempt to re-send is pending because the previous transaction (the one in question, that is inbound to the Electrum wallet) is still "in the network". That is why I struggle to understand how the transaction would get "dropped for good once its input is spent by another transaction".
I'm curious to understand what I am missing here.
I am the sender and I can't increase the fee from the wallet of the exchange.
That's what I am most comfortable doing. I will try changing server now and then until the inbound transaction get "picked up" again, and CPFP.
I have a couple of precautionary questions: is it safe to:
- update Electrum
- receive and send other transactions
while I have this 'Local' transaction hanging?
Although, it will get dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction.
I can't get my head around why the transaction would get "dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction."
I am the sender, and I've tried re-sending that UTXO(?), after resyncing the SPV of the decentralized exchange I am withdrawing from. This attempt to re-send is pending (on the interface of the exchange), and can't be found on mempool.space. I imagine that the attempt to re-send is pending because the previous transaction (the one in question, that is inbound to the Electrum wallet) is still "in the network". That is why I struggle to understand how the transaction would get "dropped for good once its input is spent by another transaction".
I'm curious to understand what I am missing here.
Unfortunately, since it's inbound, you can't do anything to it but to contact the sender to increase the fee if it's possible in his wallet;
I am the sender and I can't increase the fee from the wallet of the exchange.
Or wait for it to be able to broadcast again then use CPFP to the transaction to bump its fee (right-click->"Child pays for parent"),
That's what I am most comfortable doing. I will try changing server now and then until the inbound transaction get "picked up" again, and CPFP.
I have a couple of precautionary questions: is it safe to:
- update Electrum
- receive and send other transactions
while I have this 'Local' transaction hanging?
Is 2 enough to assume that the transaction was dropped by the network? I am asking, however I must say, I actually tried to re-send the UTXO (not sure I am using the term correctly) 9 days ago.
With how the nodes relay and drop transactions nowadays, it's hard to assume that a txn is totally dropped by the network since it might propagate again in the right condition.Reason is, not all nodes have the same relay and mempool settings, some of them may keep a transaction for months and some wallets are re-broadcasting transactions.
Specially yours that's only unavailable in two blockexplorers,
I bet that it'll be relayed back to your server's mempool once its fee rate made it in the default relay fee policy.
Although, it will get dropped for good once any of its input is spent by another transaction.
I have a receiving transaction showing as "Local" in Electrum, so, I understand no longer on the network.
Unfortunately, since it's inbound, you can't do anything to it but to contact the sender to increase the fee if it's possible in his wallet;Or wait for it to be able to broadcast again then use CPFP to the transaction to bump its fee (right-click->"Child pays for parent"),
Alternatively, instead of CPFP, use "coin control" (instructions) to use its output to your next transaction but set a higher fee rate to bump those two txn's overall fee rate.
I am thinking then I should try to change server, and see if a server can pick up the transaction again, but I am not sure.
What do you think?
What do you think?
It depends on whether you want the transaction to be "picked up" (broadcast) again or if you want it to be dropped by the network. If it's already marked as "local" in your Electrum wallet, I wouldd suggest simply deleting old tx and creating a new one (using the same inputs) with a higher fee. This way, you can be sure that your transaction gets picked up by the network and processed. The current recommended transaction fee (medium priority) is around 42 sats/vbyte.
You can double click on the transaction on the history tab of electrum and then click on broadcast in the window that appears. That should make the electrum server you are connected to aware of the transaction. It may still reject it though if the fee is too low compared to other transactions in its mempool.
OTOH if you're trying to make all nodes drop this transaction then the only way is to spend the same utxos in another transaction. To do that double click on the transaction on the history tab and then note down the transaction's inputs. Then right click on the transaction on the history tab and click on 'delete' or 'remove' from the menu that appears. Then go to view menu > check 'coins' and switch to coins tab. There select the inputs of that transaction by ctrl clicking to select multiple entries. Then right click and choose 'add to coin control'. Then craft a spending transaction using the send tab.
OTOH if you're trying to make all nodes drop this transaction then the only way is to spend the same utxos in another transaction. To do that double click on the transaction on the history tab and then note down the transaction's inputs. Then right click on the transaction on the history tab and click on 'delete' or 'remove' from the menu that appears. Then go to view menu > check 'coins' and switch to coins tab. There select the inputs of that transaction by ctrl clicking to select multiple entries. Then right click and choose 'add to coin control'. Then craft a spending transaction using the send tab.
That means your transaction has not yet been rejected by some nodes and the explorer where you check this transaction is still on their nodes.
I suggest try to copy the TXID of this transaction and paste it to another explorer check the list below
- https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_chain_browser
If you can't find this TXID on some blockchain explorer it means it's already rejected by some nodes you should now be able to re-send it.
I suggest try to copy the TXID of this transaction and paste it to another explorer check the list below
- https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_chain_browser
If you can't find this TXID on some blockchain explorer it means it's already rejected by some nodes you should now be able to re-send it.
Thank you. I tried all the explorers.
The transaction was not found apparently on:
https://btc.cryptoid.info "no matching results"
https://www.blockonomics.co "transaction not found"
However, I could find it on:
https://mempool.space
https://bitaps.com
https://blockstream.info/
https://www.blockchain.com
https://blockchair.com
https://btc.com
https://chain.so
https://bitpay.com
https://live.blockcypher.com
Is 2 enough to assume that the transaction was dropped by the network? I am asking, however I must say, I actually tried to re-send the UTXO (not sure I am using the term correctly) 9 days ago. To do so, I resynced the SPV of the wallet of the exchange following a conversation there: https://bisq.community/t/2-month-old-btc-withdraw-shows-as-local-in-electrum/12517/2?u=cks. The re-send though is still pending (as of now) for confirmation in the wallet of the exchange. The interpretation of a user of that exchange is that the previous transaction is still "traveling through the network" https://bisq.community/t/2-month-old-btc-withdraw-shows-as-local-in-electrum/12517/10?u=cks.
I noted the comment of BitMaxz, who wrote "if you can't find this TXID on some blockchain explorer it means it's already rejected by some nodes you should now be able to re-send it." - but the transaction was not found on 2 explorers, however the re-send is still "not found" by mempool.space.
I am thinking then I should try to change server, and see if a server can pick up the transaction again, but I am not sure.
What do you think?
That means your transaction has not yet been rejected by some nodes and the explorer where you check this transaction is still on their nodes.
I suggest try to copy the TXID of this transaction and paste it to another explorer check the list below
- https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_chain_browser
If you can't find this TXID on some blockchain explorer it means it's already rejected by some nodes you should now be able to re-send it.
Yes uncheck the "select server automatically" and then under server just right-click any server of your choice and then "use as server".
Yes some server would pick up this transaction but some of them already rejected it.
I suggest try to copy the TXID of this transaction and paste it to another explorer check the list below
- https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_chain_browser
If you can't find this TXID on some blockchain explorer it means it's already rejected by some nodes you should now be able to re-send it.
Thank you both for the clarification.
I looked at https://electrum.readthedocs.io but could not see any information on how to change server. In the wallet I see Tools > Network > Overview. Shall I un-tick "Select server automatically" and select a server from below "Other known servers"? Is that the right way to change server?
I looked at https://electrum.readthedocs.io but could not see any information on how to change server. In the wallet I see Tools > Network > Overview. Shall I un-tick "Select server automatically" and select a server from below "Other known servers"? Is that the right way to change server?
Yes uncheck the "select server automatically" and then under server just right-click any server of your choice and then "use as server".
Also, I am wondering, since the fee of the transaction is so low, 14.0/vB: is there any chance at all that a server would "pick up" this transaction?
PS the explorer I was looking at was mempool.space.
PS the explorer I was looking at was mempool.space.
Yes some server would pick up this transaction but some of them already rejected it.
Thank you both for the clarification.
I looked at https://electrum.readthedocs.io but could not see any information on how to change server. In the wallet I see Tools > Network > Overview. Shall I un-tick "Select server automatically" and select a server from below "Other known servers"? Is that the right way to change server?
Also, I am wondering, since the fee of the transaction is so low, 14.0/vB: is there any chance at all that a server would "pick up" this transaction?
PS the explorer I was looking at was mempool.space.
I looked at https://electrum.readthedocs.io but could not see any information on how to change server. In the wallet I see Tools > Network > Overview. Shall I un-tick "Select server automatically" and select a server from below "Other known servers"? Is that the right way to change server?
Also, I am wondering, since the fee of the transaction is so low, 14.0/vB: is there any chance at all that a server would "pick up" this transaction?
PS the explorer I was looking at was mempool.space.
Each node has its own mempool. Some nodes have your transaction in their mempool and some node don't have your transaction in their mempool.
"Local" means that the transaction exists in your wallet file, but the server you are connected to doesn't have it in its mempool.
If you change the server and connect to one of the servers that has your transaction in its mempool, the status will be changed to "unconfirmed".
"Local" means that the transaction exists in your wallet file, but the server you are connected to doesn't have it in its mempool.
If you change the server and connect to one of the servers that has your transaction in its mempool, the status will be changed to "unconfirmed".
Which explorer? The transaction is probably still on the explorer's mempool (or cached on their database) while it was dropped by the electrum server you're connected to.
Mempool.space says the "minimum fee" is 23,5 sat/vB, so that makes sense.
Mempool.space says the "minimum fee" is 23,5 sat/vB, so that makes sense.
I have a receiving transaction showing as "Local" in Electrum, so, I understand no longer on the network. Yet, when I right-click on the transaction > View on block explorer, the tx page loads. It says the transaction is "Unconfirmed".
Could you possibly enlighten me on the confusion over Electrum telling me the transaction is 'Local', yet, showing up on a block explorer as 'Unconfirmed'?
I initiated the transaction myself 2 months ago (I read that transactions are dropped after 1-2 weeks - that's another point of confusion for me), from an exchange to this wallet in question.
I imagine the issue stem from the fee rate that is/was too low: 14.0/vB.
FYI:
When I right-click on the transaction > Details then click on the button 'Broadcast', I get the following message:
I hesitate taking further step e.g. trying to connect to a different server, since I am confused about the Local-tx-yet-can-be-found-on-a-block-explorer question.
Could you possibly enlighten me on the confusion over Electrum telling me the transaction is 'Local', yet, showing up on a block explorer as 'Unconfirmed'?
I initiated the transaction myself 2 months ago (I read that transactions are dropped after 1-2 weeks - that's another point of confusion for me), from an exchange to this wallet in question.
I imagine the issue stem from the fee rate that is/was too low: 14.0/vB.
FYI:
When I right-click on the transaction > Details then click on the button 'Broadcast', I get the following message:
Quote
"The server returned an error when broadcasting the transaction.
Consider trying to connect to a different server, or updating Electrum.
mempool min fee not met
Your transaction is paying a fee that is so low that the bitcoin node cannot fit it into its mempool. The mempool is already full of hundreds of megabytes of transactions that all pay higher fees. Try to increase the fee."
Consider trying to connect to a different server, or updating Electrum.
mempool min fee not met
Your transaction is paying a fee that is so low that the bitcoin node cannot fit it into its mempool. The mempool is already full of hundreds of megabytes of transactions that all pay higher fees. Try to increase the fee."
I hesitate taking further step e.g. trying to connect to a different server, since I am confused about the Local-tx-yet-can-be-found-on-a-block-explorer question.
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