MH17 crash: Rebels hand over black boxes

tee-rex

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Quote from: Nemo1024 on July 22, 2014, 02:05:54 AM

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on July 21, 2014, 11:53:08 PM

Quote from: tooil on July 21, 2014, 08:31:14 PM

The black boxes will clearly not reveal any incriminating evident against the rebel, otherwise they won't have hand it back so easily.

On the other hand it could mean that the rebels have nothing to hide and the evidence is already in the hands of the Russians Wink

Who will be able to prove someone manipulated it if the report says something different (although I don't think its easy to manipulate a black box)

Those boxes are sealed. They were reported by the freedom fighters to be in good condition, which probably means that they are not broken, which in turn means that they have no idea what's stored inside. Besides, it's not like you can just open the box and read the data off a harddisk... Expertise at interpreting that data is needed.

As I got it, the information on the memory cards in these boxes is encrypted, so even Boeing itself couldn't fiddle with it.

Sithara007

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Quote from: bryant.coleman on July 22, 2014, 09:27:52 AM

I thought the black boxes contain data from Traffic alert and Collision Avoidance System (TACS). From reading that data, we can ascertain the direction (3D) and velocity of the approaching missile. (Not sure).

TACS works only against other aircraft. The Surface-to-air missiles are designed in such a way that TACS can't detect them. Also, the missile travels at a speed of 1,000 m/s and none of the pilots would have even noticed it before it hit the aircraft.

bryant.coleman

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Quote from: Sithara007 on July 22, 2014, 09:21:14 AM

Quote from: bryant.coleman on July 22, 2014, 09:17:36 AM

If I am not wrong, the flight data recorder will also contain the aircraft's local radar data. It will show from where the missile was fired, and velocity and other aspects of that missile.

You are wrong. The black boxes are useless to findout the missile details. Check this:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2701145/Is-data-MH17s-black-box-USELESS-Readings-flight-recorders-wont-reveal-attack-experts-claim.html

I thought the black boxes contain data from Traffic alert and Collision Avoidance System (TACS). From reading that data, we can ascertain the direction (3D) and velocity of the approaching missile. (Not sure).

Sithara007

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Quote from: bryant.coleman on July 22, 2014, 09:17:36 AM

If I am not wrong, the flight data recorder will also contain the aircraft's local radar data. It will show from where the missile was fired, and velocity and other aspects of that missile.

You are wrong. The black boxes are useless to findout the missile details. Check this:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2701145/Is-data-MH17s-black-box-USELESS-Readings-flight-recorders-wont-reveal-attack-experts-claim.html

bryant.coleman

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Quote from: Tusk on July 21, 2014, 09:57:33 PM

Well time will tell, I think it will for once establish some missing parts of the puzzle possible some new pieces

1) the position of the plane when the missile struck
2) the communication with Air traffic control
3) possibly some other communication

I agree it would be unlikely for the rebels to have complied if they had shot down the plane

If I am not wrong, the flight data recorder will also contain the aircraft's local radar data. It will show from where the missile was fired, and velocity and other aspects of that missile.

247crypto

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Quote from: Nemo1024 on July 22, 2014, 02:05:54 AM

Those boxes are sealed.

Donetsk is in grade to have the copy of data stored there.

Balthazar

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Quote from: rocking1805 on July 22, 2014, 05:18:22 AM

BTW why don't the US publish their evidence as well as Russia did? They presented to the world community satellite shots with suspicious movement of Ukrainian air defense systems and a warplane, and America keeps on telling that it's Russia propaganda. However, Russian Ministry of Defense told they are ready to submit these materials to any international body for an expertise. Seems that Obama is losing.

Because they understand that now they're responsible for everything what happened since installation of coup government in Kiev. It even doesn't matter who have shot down this plane, that wouldn't happen without their "investment into ukrainian democracy". All that remains is fill the media by the meaningless statements, pretending that they have some kind of value. Roll Eyes

rocking1805

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BTW why don't the US publish their evidence as well as Russia did? They presented to the world community satellite shots with suspicious movement of Ukrainian air defense systems and a warplane, and America keeps on telling that it's Russia propaganda. However, Russian Ministry of Defense told they are ready to submit these materials to any international body for an expertise. Seems that Obama is losing.

Kimowa

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Hopefully they didn't erase the data or something.. Will wait for the news..

Paya

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I'm afraid that they won't read anything that could solve the mistery who shot down the plane. Since (according to Malasyians) there were no comms from pilots indicating some sort of problem, aircraft was most likely broken up to pieces immediately after the missile hit: it had to fell in same general area where interception occured. But this doesn't necessarily mean that the rebels launched missile, considering blurred frontlines, horizontal ranges of SAM types which might have been used, and relative proximity of Ukrainian controlled territory.

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Quote from: Nemo1024 on July 22, 2014, 02:05:54 AM

Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on July 21, 2014, 11:53:08 PM

Quote from: tooil on July 21, 2014, 08:31:14 PM

The black boxes will clearly not reveal any incriminating evident against the rebel, otherwise they won't have hand it back so easily.

On the other hand it could mean that the rebels have nothing to hide and the evidence is already in the hands of the Russians Wink

Who will be able to prove someone manipulated it if the report says something different (although I don't think its easy to manipulate a black box)

Those boxes are sealed. They were reported by the freedom fighters to be in good condition, which probably means that they are not broken, which in turn means that they have no idea what's stored inside. Besides, it's not like you can just open the box and read the data off a harddisk... Expertise at interpreting that data is needed.

That's probably correct just the if a large government controls it they probably have their methods theory.
But I do hope the boxes remain untampered and go to a third party country for inspection that both sides USA and Russian can agree on.
Believe the NTSB has the French and the US bases so think they will be sent to france but are held by Malaysian investigators in the meanwhile.

http://www.thestar.com.my/News/Nation/2014/07/22/MH17-crash-Black-box-receive/

Nemo1024

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Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on July 21, 2014, 11:53:08 PM

Quote from: tooil on July 21, 2014, 08:31:14 PM

The black boxes will clearly not reveal any incriminating evident against the rebel, otherwise they won't have hand it back so easily.

On the other hand it could mean that the rebels have nothing to hide and the evidence is already in the hands of the Russians Wink

Who will be able to prove someone manipulated it if the report says something different (although I don't think its easy to manipulate a black box)

Those boxes are sealed. They were reported by the freedom fighters to be in good condition, which probably means that they are not broken, which in turn means that they have no idea what's stored inside. Besides, it's not like you can just open the box and read the data off a harddisk... Expertise at interpreting that data is needed.

Swordsoffreedom

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Quote from: tooil on July 21, 2014, 08:31:14 PM

The black boxes will clearly not reveal any incriminating evident against the rebel, otherwise they won't have hand it back so easily.

On the other hand it could mean that the rebels have nothing to hide and the evidence is already in the hands of the Russians Wink

Who will be able to prove someone manipulated it if the report says something different (although I don't think its easy to manipulate a black box)

Tusk

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Well time will tell, I think it will for once establish some missing parts of the puzzle possible some new pieces

1) the position of the plane when the missile struck
2) the communication with Air traffic control
3) possibly some other communication

I agree it would be unlikely for the rebels to have complied if they had shot down the plane

tooil

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The black boxes will clearly not reveal any incriminating evident against the rebel, otherwise they won't have hand it back so easily.

Tusk

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I'm not sure, But if the Russians and Rebels are certain that it was Kiev that is responsible then it would make sense to have delayed the hand over until enough attention from the world has been drawn to ensure no tampering can occur, I think this is now the case.

Also listening to the US representative grandstanding at the UN, going on a bout Putin, as if he controlled the crash site was so cheep its a war zone in Ukraine yet not one mention of the Ukrainian army to cease fire Huh

Putin called for an international investigation immediately after the plane was shot down, yet mainstream news makes out that Russia came on board, its all appears so staged Cameron and the UK have already found Russia guilty calling for sanctions.

bitsmichel

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Quote from: Virtue on July 21, 2014, 07:20:54 PM

Donetsk, Ukraine (CNN) -- Rebels in eastern Ukraine handed over the black box data recorders from downed Flight 17 to Malaysian officials, days after the passenger jet crashed.

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/07/21/world/europe/ukraine-malaysia-airlines-crash/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

I'm really curious about what is on that blackbox, but I think once in the hands of the authorities it will be manipulated.
Also, fixed the link

Virtue

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Donetsk, Ukraine (CNN) -- Rebels in eastern Ukraine handed over the black box data recorders from downed Flight 17 to Malaysian officials, days after the passenger jet crashed.

http://edition. cnn. com/2014/07/21/world/europe/ukraine-malaysia-airlines-crash/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Topic: MH17 crash: Rebels hand over black boxes (Read 876 times)