Topic: MMOcoin (idea for an all in one coin based on litecoin) (Read 1655 times)

Well myself I am doing it partly by being a game developer, partly by using free open source code aka by co-opting existing free open source games to serve as "clients" or "views into" my "metagame" in which they all play a part, and partly from trying to start as much as possible from economics/finance games.

For example in Freeciv, some of the "city improvements" that cities can build are the Market, the Bank, and the Stock Exchange. So I thought well lets start with that: lets get Markets, Banks, and Stock Exchanges working as free open source code, so that cryptocoin enthusiasts and asset-trading enthusiasts can "play" as soon as possible with the bonus that the enthusiasts of such games seldom care about actually having a character on a map who has to walk through a city to reach the market or bank or stock-market and who thus might be vulnerable in-transit to robbers and greedy corrupt city-guards and irate housewives emptying their nightsoil into the street on top of the heads of passers-by and other such glorious details Role Playing Game enthusiasts might enjoy but, rather, tend instead to just buy high and sell low anything they can turn a profit on, even if whatever it is cannot be used to slay dragons or robbers or irate housewives or even as a conveyance to convey them safely back and forth between their lodgings and the Market, Bank or Stock Exchange.

In other words, I hope we can start quite abstract, with traders trading the coins/currencies of various nations on exchanges without maybe much caring even which nation controls how many square miles of which planet, how many characters of what character-types live in which cities that nation has built or is building on that planet, or other such details that Role Playing Game players and/or Civilisation Game players or even Rogue-like MMO players might find more interesting than just plain raw currency-exchanges, asset-exchanges or even, maybe - though this might be where the various types of players could interact - actual in-game-object markets where players could use various currencies and assets to barter, buy or sell various in-game objects such as armour, swords, guns, spaceships, military units, units of settlers capable of founding cities. or whatever.

SInce money seems so often the stumbling-block, a game being basically a hole in the internet into which you throw money, hoping maybe someday some players might also chose to throw money, it seemed prudent to start off with the making of money first, then elaborate around that once there is enough money to elaborate around.

So hey, maybe we can start by having good reliable free open source code for Markets, Banks and Stock Exchanges making money first, then use that money to paint in the planets on which the cities in which those get built exist.

The top level wiki page for this metagame concept is at http://devtome.com/doku.php?id=galactic_milieu

Some stats on some of the currencies and assets are at http://galaxies.mygamesonline.org/digitalisassets.html and if anyone knows how to fix the fact that the nice GNUplot plots that worked fine running GNUplot in Fedodra 17 don't work when created using the same scripts against the GNUplot that Ubuntu 14.04 provides, that would be awesome so we can get the pretty plots working again.

Afficonados of scamcoins and shitcoins might notice that although in the game currencies such as UKB, UNS, CDN and such are blockchain coins whose blockchains run over faster than light communications channels, here on Earth they are not operated as blockchains for the simple reason that securing a blockchain is insanely expensive. Thus those asset pages refer to the Digitalis Open Transactions Server, which was where we were running them until such time as an affordable means of securely running them as distributed systems became feasible here on the planet known as Earth.

-MarkM-

the problem is, what's the benefit for bringing crypto to the games?

The benefit for the game owner?

For the players?

I too, want, hope, and think that the future of gaming will be almost like a literal "second life", where there is a whole virtual economy that can be interexchangable with 'reality'. And blockchains could have a part in that.

But currently, how can you convince a game developer to use such a coin?

Re-visiting the idea of hiding a miner in a game that people run at home and play at home, maybe making it an MMO adds needless complications.

Maybe all you need to get normal gamers to mine coins is to embed a miner into a play at home game that keeps them playing partly by releasing the coins it mines to them.

But why would they bother playing the game to mine the coins instead of simply isolating the part of the code that does the actual mining and running just that, so that it can earn them coins without them needing to be there all the time holdings its hand aka playing the game?

That concern does seem to hint that hooking gthem into a network could be needed just to force them not to run the miner part isolated from the actual game part.

So maybe you get back to MMO by trying to find a way to enforce that the miners are actually playing the game aka spending/wasting/investin human time/attention in the mining process.

Maybe huntercoin has the right solution: don't embed the miner into games, instead embed a game or multiple games into a blackchain.

Consider roguelike MMO type games such as the free open source Crossfire RPG. It keeps things down to simple keystrokes, so maybe could be amenable to some kind of "you get one keystroke per block" system.

Verifying maps could be as simple as taking their hash, so the blockchain specifies the hash of the map they a player applying a certain door gets sent to.

But verifying the "business rules" aka "game rules" aka actual execution of the exact same rules/moves/functionality by all nodes could be trickier. Though maybe re-casting such a game into something that has formal provers (Haskel has been said to have such things, maybe?) could allow some kind of formal proof that everyone is running the same rules.

Or maybe it'd just have to come down to whether more than half the nodes agree on the same blockchain-of-keystrokes-and-outcomes?

Maybe it is just a matter of the huntercoin game growing more and more powerful and complex over time until it does become more "roguelike" ?

-MarkM-

Me and a friend came up with this while talking about bitcoins being like game money. I have no affiliation with whoever you are talking about. If more than 1 group of people can come up with the same idea it must be a pretty good idea right?

Interesting. I wonder if these ideas could be patented into game technology

Look at http://galaxies.mygamesonline.org/deuterium.html

A typical fleet-load of deuterium sold to a GMC or GRF depot for those prices is nowadays five million units of deuterium (aka fuel) minus the fuel consumed by the fleet to perform the transport.

So maybe about $5000 or so per such shipment depending on the exchange / arbitrage routes you (or maybe Ripple if people ever get to throw up gateways for currencies of their choice on Ripple) choose to convert into some kind of fiat $.

There is no need to imagine people making money in games, plenty of people already make plenty of money in games.

-MarkM-

Hendo is not one of your sockies?

It is not one of mine as I do not have even one.

I assumed it was you broaching your idea here.

-MarkM-

The pools can be the servers. Multiple servers that anyone can put up and mine on. So a game that is the wallet and miner, and a server that is the pool and game server in one. I want it to be so anyone can download the server and start a pool/game server. No centralized game server.

Can you imagine how people would react to a game that they can make money playing.

It could be set up so that if you leave it running it builds up coins but you cant access them until you go farm monsters and the longer you were sitting idle the more you get while farming, its a predetermined amount according to how much you have mined with your gpu. The coins are actually created by the miner built into the game and then released when monsters are killed.

So Solidcoin type of setup, then?

Your special privieged servers that are the only ones allowed to mine are the centralised control and centralised minting?

Again, if you are centralising anyway, then a blockchain is just an insanely expensive extra expense.

Better to just use mysql databases, or Open Transactions, or clone RIpple when its source code is released.

Still insane but maybe do-able would be to use a Proof of Stake coin with the game server(s) owning the vast majority of the stake.

But the whole blockchain approach is just stupid/pointless when there is going to be centralised control, such as in your idea that only the game server(s) will be able to mine.

-MarkM-

Sounds exactly like the idea I proposed here  https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1993197

Let's collab and form a team of like minded individuals who would like to go in this direction. Vote in favor and make your voice heard.

What im trying to say is that you design it so it cant be mined outside of the game but it can be traded in and outside of the game. The only reason for the game is to mine coins and you could even build an exchange into the game.

If you can only use it in the game then a blockchain based coin is insane, insanely-expensive to secure overkill.

You only need a normal centralised database type system for in game currencies.

Blockchains come into play when you can mine it anywhere, anyone can mine it, it has nothing to do with any one particular game or other application or server or system or company and so on. In such cases of course there are already probably more chains to choose from than you are likely to bother using, that is, even if you tried to build in the ability to use all of them you might find new ones pop up faster than you can add support for them into the game.

So if you do want blockchain based currency, so that any games any players and any non-games and non-players can all mine it use it exchange it and so on, there is no need to create one, there are tons of them available off the shelf ready to run.

The big problem is securing chains, they are insanely expensive to secure. Even if you use a merged-mined coin you still might not get enough miners on it, even with it being vanishingly close to "free" for them to mine, to secure it.

So pick one with a high difficulty that has been high difficulty steadily a year or two already.

-MarkM-

My idea is a simple mmo game that doesn't have very intense graphics but has a built in mining program. The more you play the game the more coin you mine, but it doesn't stop there, go farm monsters and get coin drops along with gear that is sellable for coin. The coin would be like litecoin with similar difficulty but only minable through the game. This doesn't necessary have to be a new game, I think minecraft or wow could be modded to work this way. The key is to make the coin easy to get out of the game, we can just imbed a wallet in the game. A PK server could even implemented so that when you kill someone you get a portion of their coins.

what do you guys think?

If someone with more skill than I decides to make this please include me in the dev process.

I can just imagine playing minecraft all day on 4x 7970s. My room mate would think im insane.