Author

Topic: Modifying a USB hub for extra power and "I did it!" showoff thread (Read 6363 times)

jr. member
Activity: 42
Merit: 1
Finally got my overclocking issues figured out!
My creation is about to go from the "lab" (garage) to the "data center" (basement)  Grin
I just needed a cluster of pi (pies?) to go with my cluster of 2pacs. Found out what I thought was a hardware error with the 2pac was actually the pi usb port getting overloaded. I ran stable doing 200mhz @1.41v over the weekend and have been upping it every day. Doing 250mhz @ 1.41v for an average of 550Gh/s  Shocked






That's a sweet looking rig and something I aspire to mimic. Do you have the STL files for the 3D printed stuff? I'd love to print some for myself.

Thanks,
TheNerdyType
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500

HEY!! I have these hubs I find they don't like to support the Compac 2 chip, any tips?

I am thinking of just getting a usb extentsion cord, ripping it open and cutting into the power wires though.

you can use the extension splice technique, or you can pop em open them up and add heavier gauge wire across the positive and negative tracks to support the extra load.

what I did with mine is have the wires come out and attach the 5V wires off a HDD Molex connector to them. it wasn't a clean setup, but doable.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1000
I had good luck modding cheapest hubs I could find at the time. Shelf board with all the hubs attached is available if someone is interested, make an offer, its heavy.



HEY!! I have these hubs I find they don't like to support the Compac 2 chip, any tips?

I am thinking of just getting a usb extentsion cord, ripping it open and cutting into the power wires though.
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
Nice bit of work there!
You're making me want to fire up the old avalon and compacs again.. I attempted to use 30cm cabling to reorganise the compacs onto a singe large heatsink, and I gave up when they all stopped talking to the system (I blame the cheap cables, they are cheap)
newbie
Activity: 33
Merit: 0
Finally got my overclocking issues figured out!
My creation is about to go from the "lab" (garage) to the "data center" (basement)  Grin
I just needed a cluster of pi (pies?) to go with my cluster of 2pacs. Found out what I thought was a hardware error with the 2pac was actually the pi usb port getting overloaded. I ran stable doing 200mhz @1.41v over the weekend and have been upping it every day. Doing 250mhz @ 1.41v for an average of 550Gh/s  Shocked

https://i.imgur.com/S1gJNJ4.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/nZKGFJY.png
hero member
Activity: 561
Merit: 500
Very impressive! I'll be interested to hear if those hubs can handle that much power once you've cranked the frequency on the 2pacs up to 250 and beyond.

Still a work in progress but this is what i have so far

My monster 2pac consists of ..

1x raspberry pi 2

4x 2.0 usb hub, With 5v brick cutoff and the plug wired into the power supply
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-10-Ports-USB-HUB-2-0-High-Speed-with-Power-Adapter-Black-/190574386344

1x mean well lrs-350-5 with a 3d printed coverplate
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mean-Well-LRS-350-5-300W-5V-60A-Single-Output-Switchable-Power-Supply-/122214364987?hash=item1c748b373b:g:~28AAOSwo4pYH3aB

4x custom 3d printed holder attached to 1 1/2" wood dowel holding 5x usb cables (white)
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=5431

using the method here to connect power ( i found soldering to the jack just wasn't worth the effort)
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.17838616


Still working out overclocking, will update when i get it figured out. But I know it runs stable at 100mhz Smiley

newbie
Activity: 33
Merit: 0
Still a work in progress but this is what i have so far

My monster 2pac consists of ..

1x raspberry pi 2

4x 2.0 usb hub, With 5v brick cutoff and the plug wired into the power supply
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-10-Ports-USB-HUB-2-0-High-Speed-with-Power-Adapter-Black-/190574386344

1x mean well lrs-350-5 with a 3d printed coverplate
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mean-Well-LRS-350-5-300W-5V-60A-Single-Output-Switchable-Power-Supply-/122214364987?hash=item1c748b373b:g:~28AAOSwo4pYH3aB

4x custom 3d printed holder attached to 1 1/2" wood dowel holding 5x usb cables (white)
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=5431

using the method here to connect power ( i found soldering to the jack just wasn't worth the effort)
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.17838616


Still working out overclocking, will update when i get it figured out. But I know it runs stable at 100mhz Smiley

https://i.imgur.com/2MCQ7VM.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/32tVwBP.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Nq2YXNg.jpg


legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1000
Oooh I am going to be using this to try to make my little USB hub Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000

just to let you know, these are nasty to modify, has to get the heat-gun and iron to get the plastic potting off.

After some looking, found an image of these with the plastic cover removed:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291548978082?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&var=590604172289&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

http://cdn2.goughlui.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/DSC_9492.jpg

Which looks like they would work without the mess.

Cut the digital left side off (in the pic), re-connect the trace on the right, and add the second power/ground wire's. Can even reuse the plastic cover to glue the second plug wires in place.



Hmm.. I might just grab a few to play with it doesn’t look to hard, even to splice in a secondary plug on a cable just for power.

Are you trying to just get power from 2 usb's for this or are you hooking the little dongle or to something else for more power?

You can get Y splitters very cheap on ebay.  I think it was Phil that pointed these out in another thread - http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

They are 1.45 each.  Only thing is it took a LONG time to get.  So do not order them if you need them quick.  But order and have 2 weeks or so they are quite a bargain.  The 5 I got all seem to work good aswell.  So work as advertised.

But but but! that's not how you DIY! yeah, OK, if you want a simple plug'n'play, go for it, but ima feed 20A to 'tem stiiks!

I know Smiley was just pointing out a easy option.    And it's cheaper then a lot of DIY ones as they ship so slowly.

And you still can DIY.  If you wanted to power it from something beside other USB you could cut off the power plug in  and could hook it up to external source.
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500

just to let you know, these are nasty to modify, has to get the heat-gun and iron to get the plastic potting off.

After some looking, found an image of these with the plastic cover removed:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291548978082?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&var=590604172289&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

http://cdn2.goughlui.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/DSC_9492.jpg

Which looks like they would work without the mess.

Cut the digital left side off (in the pic), re-connect the trace on the right, and add the second power/ground wire's. Can even reuse the plastic cover to glue the second plug wires in place.



Hmm.. I might just grab a few to play with it doesn’t look to hard, even to splice in a secondary plug on a cable just for power.

Are you trying to just get power from 2 usb's for this or are you hooking the little dongle or to something else for more power?

You can get Y splitters very cheap on ebay.  I think it was Phil that pointed these out in another thread - http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

They are 1.45 each.  Only thing is it took a LONG time to get.  So do not order them if you need them quick.  But order and have 2 weeks or so they are quite a bargain.  The 5 I got all seem to work good aswell.  So work as advertised.

But but but! that's not how you DIY! yeah, OK, if you want a simple plug'n'play, go for it, but ima feed 20A to 'tem stiiks!
sr. member
Activity: 331
Merit: 250

just to let you know, these are nasty to modify, has to get the heat-gun and iron to get the plastic potting off.

After some looking, found an image of these with the plastic cover removed:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291548978082?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&var=590604172289&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

http://cdn2.goughlui.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/DSC_9492.jpg

Which looks like they would work without the mess.

Cut the digital left side off (in the pic), re-connect the trace on the right, and add the second power/ground wire's. Can even reuse the plastic cover to glue the second plug wires in place.



Hmm.. I might just grab a few to play with it doesn’t look to hard, even to splice in a secondary plug on a cable just for power.

Are you trying to just get power from 2 usb's for this or are you hooking the little dongle or to something else for more power?

You can get Y splitters very cheap on ebay.  I think it was Phil that pointed these out in another thread - http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

They are 1.45 each.  Only thing is it took a LONG time to get.  So do not order them if you need them quick.  But order and have 2 weeks or so they are quite a bargain.  The 5 I got all seem to work good aswell.  So work as advertised.

Yes, modify them for power from 2 ports.

I got the y-cables coming on the slow row boat from China, but if modifying these work like I think they will, then the whole setup should fit nicely inside an old PC case and won't have to figure out a way to hold the compac's  in place for a fan while keeping the y-cables out of the way.

If these cheap usb meters work, the cable running to the second port would only need to be about 3-4" long, which keeping wires short should be a plus and another plus is I can use a little heavier gauge wire instead of the smaller usb wire.
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000

just to let you know, these are nasty to modify, has to get the heat-gun and iron to get the plastic potting off.

After some looking, found an image of these with the plastic cover removed:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291548978082?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&var=590604172289&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

http://cdn2.goughlui.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/DSC_9492.jpg

Which looks like they would work without the mess.

Cut the digital left side off (in the pic), re-connect the trace on the right, and add the second power/ground wire's. Can even reuse the plastic cover to glue the second plug wires in place.



Hmm.. I might just grab a few to play with it doesn’t look to hard, even to splice in a secondary plug on a cable just for power.

Are you trying to just get power from 2 usb's for this or are you hooking the little dongle or to something else for more power?

You can get Y splitters very cheap on ebay.  I think it was Phil that pointed these out in another thread - http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

They are 1.45 each.  Only thing is it took a LONG time to get.  So do not order them if you need them quick.  But order and have 2 weeks or so they are quite a bargain.  The 5 I got all seem to work good aswell.  So work as advertised.
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500

just to let you know, these are nasty to modify, has to get the heat-gun and iron to get the plastic potting off.

After some looking, found an image of these with the plastic cover removed:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291548978082?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&var=590604172289&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

http://cdn2.goughlui.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/DSC_9492.jpg

Which looks like they would work without the mess.

Cut the digital left side off (in the pic), re-connect the trace on the right, and add the second power/ground wire's. Can even reuse the plastic cover to glue the second plug wires in place.



Hmm.. I might just grab a few to play with it doesn’t look to hard, even to splice in a secondary plug on a cable just for power.
sr. member
Activity: 331
Merit: 250

just to let you know, these are nasty to modify, has to get the heat-gun and iron to get the plastic potting off.

After some looking, found an image of these with the plastic cover removed:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291548978082?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&var=590604172289&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

http://cdn2.goughlui.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/DSC_9492.jpg

Which looks like they would work without the mess.

Cut the digital left side off (in the pic), re-connect the trace on the right, and add the second power/ground wire's. Can even reuse the plastic cover to glue the second plug wires in place.

sr. member
Activity: 331
Merit: 250


just to let you know, these are nasty to modify, has to get the heat-gun and iron to get the plastic potting off.

Thanks.

That looks like a mess I'll pass on, I'll make up one that I was thinking of and test it out (when all the parts arrive).
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500


just to let you know, these are nasty to modify, has to get the heat-gun and iron to get the plastic potting off.
sr. member
Activity: 331
Merit: 250

This is the one I ordered yesterday, figured it should run one modified 10 port hub with 5 sticks (with a frankenstein setup) and just a plain hub for the Pi and 2 maybe 3 fans (and should leave headroom on the power).

A rough drawing of the frankenstein cross of Y cables, your bridge in the review, TheRealSteve's stick test setup (take a little from each and combine). This way the sticks are in place for an easier cooling setup.

https://i.imgur.com/51KOYXi.png frankenstein

I bought a bag full of these USB male plug to Female jack to do this hack too, i will photogragh my adventure with this if you wish. (please, don't hesitate to show us your hacks!)

Never thought about using those adapters, looks like they should work (as long as the covering comes off easy and you got room to attach wires).

I think I'll hold off on doing mine and see how these turn out, it probably will be easier to do and save some time.
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'

This is the one I ordered yesterday, figured it should run one modified 10 port hub with 5 sticks (with a frankenstein setup) and just a plain hub for the Pi and 2 maybe 3 fans (and should leave headroom on the power).

A rough drawing of the frankenstein cross of Y cables, your bridge in the review, TheRealSteve's stick test setup (take a little from each and combine). This way the sticks are in place for an easier cooling setup.

https://i.imgur.com/51KOYXi.png frankenstein

I bought a bag full of these USB male plug to Female jack to do this hack too, i will photogragh my adventure with this if you wish. (please, don't hesitate to show us your hacks!)

when my new psu's come for these 2 hubs I will post

http://www.eyeboot.com/19-port-dipo-electronic-USB-Hub

they will up grade from this psu

http://www.trcelectronics.com/View/Mean-Well/NES-100-5.shtml


to this one

https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/lrs150f.pdf


should be an exact fit.

 I go from 80% to 85%

and 100 watts to 110

I also discovered the turning the pot from 5.0 volts to 5.2 volts make these psu's work better.

They get more  Efficient by just a little.

And when the voltage drops just a bit from the sticks you end up at 5 or 5.02 volts
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500

This is the one I ordered yesterday, figured it should run one modified 10 port hub with 5 sticks (with a frankenstein setup) and just a plain hub for the Pi and 2 maybe 3 fans (and should leave headroom on the power).

A rough drawing of the frankenstein cross of Y cables, your bridge in the review, TheRealSteve's stick test setup (take a little from each and combine). This way the sticks are in place for an easier cooling setup.

https://i.imgur.com/51KOYXi.png frankenstein

I bought a bag full of these USB male plug to Female jack to do this hack too, i will photogragh my adventure with this if you wish. (please, don't hesitate to show us your hacks!)
sr. member
Activity: 331
Merit: 250
I found this 5 volt meanwell


https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/lrs75.pdf  so this one = yes


should power a 10 port hub 24/7/365 all 10 sticks at about 1.1 amps

86.5% eff  very good for a 5 volt psu.




I have 2 of these

https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/lrs150.pdf this one = yes

on order  they are a direct replacement for the psu in my 2 studhubs from klintay

https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/nes100.pdf   = no

The eff will jump from 80 to 86.5  the watts will jump from 100 to 150





this below one will do  32 sticks and is 87.5% eff

https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/lrs200.pdf  and this one = yes

This is the one I ordered yesterday, figured it should run one modified 10 port hub with 5 sticks (with a frankenstein setup) and just a plain hub for the Pi and 2 maybe 3 fans (and should leave headroom on the power).

A rough drawing of the frankenstein cross of Y cables, your bridge in the review, TheRealSteve's stick test setup (take a little from each and combine). This way the sticks are in place for an easier cooling setup.

https://i.imgur.com/51KOYXi.png frankenstein
member
Activity: 60
Merit: 10
I had good luck modding cheapest hubs I could find at the time. Shelf board with all the hubs attached is available if someone is interested, make an offer, its heavy.

legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
 I found this 5 volt meanwell


https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/lrs75.pdf  so this one = yes


should power a 10 port hub 24/7/365 all 10 sticks at about 1.1 amps

86.5% eff  very good for a 5 volt psu.




I have 2 of these

https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/lrs150.pdf this one = yes

on order  they are a direct replacement for the psu in my 2 studhubs from klintay

https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/nes100.pdf   = no

The eff will jump from 80 to 86.5  the watts will jump from 100 to 150





this below one will do  32 sticks and is 87.5% eff

https://www.trcelectronics.com/ecomm/pdf/lrs200.pdf  and this one = yes
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
FUN > ROI
That eliminates some components - specifically whatever technology used to step the voltage down from 12V to 5V.  On the other hand, it introduces the need for a 5V power supply which are not as commonly available (computer PSUs and PSUs meant for building into devices - like a good chunk of MeanWell's range - aside).  There's also no guarantee there aren't other components in there that would still limit the per-port or overall device current capability.  Example: say the hub can use either the power supplied over the USB cable, or the power supplied via external power, and uses a bit of logic and some solid state component that acts as a 'switch' between the two.  That 'switch' may well impose a limit.
Again, check specs or stick to hubs people have already successfully used Smiley
sr. member
Activity: 331
Merit: 250
I'm with Mikestang, kind of got the jest of it, that for a 12V it boils down to the 12V---->5V as how good it is.

So I guess it's better to do a hub that takes 5V straight, like the one AJRGale did and take the conversion from 12V to 5V out?
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1000
If things are still a bit confusing, I would highly recommend sticking to some of the suggested hubs that people have already tested and are known to work well Smiley

Thanks for the explanation, most of it got through my thick skull.  You started to lose me with the components, but I think I get it.

So upon further inquiries it appears that my hub is not going to be good for overclocking stick miners (post).  I'm going to pick up one of those usb testers and play around with this hub (afterall, playing around is most of the fun), but if I'm going to be running multiple sticks overclocked I'm going to have to look for new hardware.
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
After playing with a RPI and trying to get a powered hub I can say all hubs are not equal.  Very safe thing to say.   

In a perfect world any usb 2 hub would work with RPI perfectly.  But it so very very different not all are the same.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
FUN > ROI
The 12V, 5A is typically the electrical rating for a hub taking external power as the type of power supply that you should connect: i.e. 12V, and capable of handling at least 5A.  That doesn't mean the hub will always draw 5A, but the hub itself is designed such that it at least theoretically can - though this is often based on datasheets, rather than actual measurements (i.e. using test equipment to force a particular current draw and then see if the components get too hot / trigger an internal shutoff, etc.).

The differences between hubs is in what components they use to regulate the voltage down to 5V and how it is laid out electrically.  If you're familiar with typical small indicator LEDs, then you might consider a small 1/8th Watt resistor to 'regulate' current for an LED.  But replace that small LED with one used for lighting purposes, and that 1/8th Watt resistor will get way too hot which may change characteristics or even cause the resistor to just burn up.  So you'd have to replace it with, say, an 0.5 Watt resistor.  Or, better yet, you'll use a linear voltage regulator that can handle maybe 2A.  Better yet, a switching regulator with components that can handle 5A, etc.  It's that choice of components that determines how much current the hub itself can handle.
( The electrical layout also matters - specifically trace widths.  A very narrow trace can't handle nearly as much current as a nice wide trace or a trace that has been tinned over.  Take for example a typical bit of wire, a small bicycle bulb, and a 9V battery and you can light up that bulb no problem.  Use steel wool, on the other hand, and the steel wool will ignite, as each steel wool fiber has a very low current carrying capacity. )

So what makes a hub beefy is how much current it can handle.  Hubs slightly complicate things because the current on its input (e.g. that 5A) does not necessarily translate in how much it can handle per port.  Let's say it has 4 ports and each can handle 2A; 4*2A = 8A = exceeds what it can handle on its input.  Alternatively, say each port can only actually handle 1A, then it's all good and well that the engineers specced its design to 5A and the people slapping stickers onto the thing and putting print on the packages copy that, but as each port tops out at 1A that's a bit moot - and there's definitely no drawing 5A from a single port.
But say you need 2A and each port can only deliver 1A: that's when you can use a Y cable (or other such constructions) to basically divide the load (2A) across two ports (2A / 2 = 1A).  On a cheapo hub, that's not much of a problem - on things like a laptop, I'd be more cautious; no point in potentially 'ruining' a $500 device if you can instead mess around with a $15 one.

That's all somewhat unrelated to USB 3.0 vs 2.0.  USB 3.0 is supposed to be able to deliver up to 900mA, USB 2.0 up to 500mA .  However, a USB 2.0 hub may well be able to deliver 3A on a single port.  As long as it's a minimum of 500mA, they're okay to slap a USB 2.0 label on it.  In short, I wouldn't rely on USB 2 vs USB 3 in terms of assuming current capability, and instead look up the exact specs - specifically: How much current can it deliver on a single port, and how much current can it handle total.  The input voltage is something you can ignore in terms of the hub itself - it's only something you need to know in order to figure out what voltage rating power supply to look for / hook up.

If things are still a bit confusing, I would highly recommend sticking to some of the suggested hubs that people have already tested and are known to work well Smiley
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1000
The power going into the hub is 12V at up to 5A.
But that gets regulated internally to 5V, right?  I think that's what you wrote in response to me in your stick thread.  I guess that's one disconnect I'm struggling with.  Internal ratings, external rating, usb port ratings...  Were those numbers (12V @ 5A) determined from manufacturer literature or experimentally?  If every hub regulated voltage down internally to 5V where do the differences between hubs come into play?

Most folks will be running beefy hubs, or using Y cables to pull power from two ports at the same time for one stick.

Here's where I get lost.  What makes a hub "beefy"?  This is directly related my questioning above.

Would a single usb 3.0 port be essentially equivalent to a y cable on two 2.0 ports?
legendary
Activity: 3374
Merit: 1859
Curmudgeonly hardware guy
The power going into the hub is 12V at up to 5A. This means a maximum of 60W. Derate that a bit for internal conversions, you're looking at about 50W total usable power from your ports. If your ports can safely push 1A each (fairly beefy), you can draw 5W from each port (5V times 1A) which means you could run ten sticks safely (10 x 5W = 50W) from the available power supply.

Most folks will be running beefy hubs, or using Y cables to pull power from two ports at the same time for one stick.
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1000
So can I assume that any one I see running a compac stick at more than ~8GH (source) is using a hub they modified?  Or could they be using a "beefy" usb 2.0 hub that just happens to be able to handle more current?

Since usb 3.0 can provide 0.9A at each port can I assume a usb 3.0 hub would be able to run the compac sticks at a higher frequency than a 2.0 hub?



Just not all hubs are equal.  Best example is from old day's: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/which-usb-hub-to-use-with-block-erupters-nanofury-nf1-bpmc-red-fury-ant-u1-253749

Look at that thread it shows some hubs and power that they have from ac.  They very GREATLY.
I'm not understanding the "Power from AC" column - 12V @ 5A for example, does that mean the entire hub is rated for that draw?  Each port?  What am I reading?  Cry
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
In terms of easy over clock :

freq 250   uses 1.1 amps  does 13.7gh   uses about .33-34 watts a gh likes a fan but can be run without the fan.  you can use this link



freq 425  uses 2.6 amps does 23.3 gh   uses about .58 watts a gh  and must have a fan



should let you go to 1 amp maybe 1.2 amps,  still waiting for these  to test them.



I would think that with the y adapter this  hub can do 4 sticks at freq 250   giving you  4.4amps at 5 volts    about 22 watts for about 66gh .  comes with a 3 amp 12 volt brick which has 36 watt max  and you are pulling 22 watts.   may not be able to do this once again I have these on hand and will test once the y-adapters come.

If a usb 2.0 port only provides 0.5A how are you guys seeing 1.1 amps or 2.6 amps supplied to a single stick?  Are these all done on modified hubs?
snip

Just not all hubs are equal.  Best example is from old day's: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/which-usb-hub-to-use-with-block-erupters-nanofury-nf1-bpmc-red-fury-ant-u1-253749

Look at that thread it shows some hubs and power that they have from ac.  They very GREATLY.
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1000
In terms of easy over clock :

freq 250   uses 1.1 amps  does 13.7gh   uses about .33-34 watts a gh likes a fan but can be run without the fan.  you can use this link



freq 425  uses 2.6 amps does 23.3 gh   uses about .58 watts a gh  and must have a fan



should let you go to 1 amp maybe 1.2 amps,  still waiting for these  to test them.



I would think that with the y adapter this  hub can do 4 sticks at freq 250   giving you  4.4amps at 5 volts    about 22 watts for about 66gh .  comes with a 3 amp 12 volt brick which has 36 watt max  and you are pulling 22 watts.   may not be able to do this once again I have these on hand and will test once the y-adapters come.

If a usb 2.0 port only provides 0.5A how are you guys seeing 1.1 amps or 2.6 amps supplied to a single stick?  Are these all done on modified hubs?

I'm trying to wrap my limited electrical engineering neurons around what I'm going to be able to do with my 4 compacs when they show up, e.g., how far can I push them safely on an unmodified usb 2.0 hub?  So far I've gotten as far as 0.5A @ 5V = 2.5watts (theoretical) max power available to a normal usb port.  I want to run 4 sticks on one hub and know what frequency I can push them to without smoking my hub.

I'm having as much difficulty formulating my question(s) as I am in trying to understand what it is I'm questioning, ha!
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
Thanks AJRGale, not sure if I'm going this route or going with the Y cables, yet.

Did you disconnect the 5V+ (or are you going to cut the wire) in the cable from the hub to computer/Pi/?, so you don't get back current?

Just noticed in the pics you posted and the pics from ebay listing, your's is missing 2 of the 3 filter capacitors, so who knows what else is missing in that hub.

Hate for you to see smoke from the computer or whatever it's hooked up to!

if I was going to use it to power a Rpi, almost unnecessary, same if I used the same system for data and power, but if I have a PSU seperate from the system, like a laptop, I may need to chop something, i don't know. But I don't think 5V won't harm it may keep a led lit up on the system. just as long as you plug the data in 1st, then plug the PSU in, whilst its off. When every connection is secure, power on the PSU then the laptop. then when everything is evened out, plug the miners in.

If I was going to chop anything, it would be the 5V from the host, since the psu power is what is feeding the miners and the Hub chipsets.

As for the filter caps, I'd have to find some thats 5+v and about 1000nF and mount them the wrong way Wink
sr. member
Activity: 331
Merit: 250
Thanks AJRGale, not sure if I'm going this route or going with the Y cables, yet.

Did you disconnect the 5V+ (or are you going to cut the wire) in the cable from the hub to computer/Pi/?, so you don't get back current?

Just noticed in the pics you posted and the pics from ebay listing, your's is missing 2 of the 3 filter capacitors, so who knows what else is missing in that hub.

Hate for you to see smoke from the computer or whatever it's hooked up to!
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
Here's another thought. Use the Y-cable, but connect the "Power Only" cable directly to the supply for the hub. That would take the hub traces out of the power distribution for the most part, thought it would be fairly messy cabling wise.

yeah but the black data  cable carries power need to be careful.

this y cable is a simple play n plug that is letting me do freq 250 at 1.1 amps brainlessly. (good for those that are  plug n play tech level )


they are mining here but I seem to be getting some roll over from an s-3 in my friends office. so it reads well over 28-30gb

http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1JdC6Xg3ajT3rge3FgPNSYYFpmf53Vbtje
alh
legendary
Activity: 1846
Merit: 1052
Here's another thought. Use the Y-cable, but connect the "Power Only" cable directly to the supply for the hub. That would take the hub traces out of the power distribution for the most part, thought it would be fairly messy cabling wise.
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
okay the y-cables are in.

so far so good they do allow me to run about 1.1 amps and freq 250 hash rate = 13.5 very few errors will post more since this has been running under 2 hours.

So the Y cable is a "Only power" and "data" plugs?

I can test that tomorrow.

 I will lower freq to 150

 On first usb y- cable I will pull the plug that has a red tag(guessing a power only)


On the second usd  y-cable I will pull the unmarked black plug (guessing data/power cable)


The first one should not drop the usb since I am only pulling the power booster.

In theory the second one should drop the  usb.

I will photo everything tomorrow.

Nice, I'll be waiting! could just do a normal thumb drive test, same results.

all photos and results are here

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.12194638


looks like the red plug is power booster the black plug is power and data.

nice cable for around 2 dollars
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
okay the y-cables are in.

so far so good they do allow me to run about 1.1 amps and freq 250 hash rate = 13.5 very few errors will post more since this has been running under 2 hours.

So the Y cable is a "Only power" and "data" plugs?

I can test that tomorrow.

 I will lower freq to 150

 On first usb y- cable I will pull the plug that has a red tag(guessing a power only)


On the second usd  y-cable I will pull the unmarked black plug (guessing data/power cable)


The first one should not drop the usb since I am only pulling the power booster.

In theory the second one should drop the  usb.

I will photo everything tomorrow.

Nice, I'll be waiting! could just do a normal thumb drive test, same results.
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
okay the y-cables are in.

so far so good they do allow me to run about 1.1 amps and freq 250 hash rate = 13.5 very few errors will post more since this has been running under 2 hours.

So the Y cable is a "Only power" and "data" plugs?

I can test that tomorrow.

 I will lower freq to 150

 On first usb y- cable I will pull the plug that has a red tag(guessing a power only)


On the second usd  y-cable I will pull the unmarked black plug (guessing data/power cable)


The first one should not drop the usb since I am only pulling the power booster.

In theory the second one should drop the  usb.

I will photo everything tomorrow.
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
okay the y-cables are in.

so far so good they do allow me to run about 1.1 amps and freq 250 hash rate = 13.5 very few errors will post more since this has been running under 2 hours.

So the Y cable is a "Only power" and "data" plugs?
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
okay the y-cables are in.

so far so good they do allow me to run about 1.1 amps and freq 250 hash rate = 13.5 very few errors will post more since this has been running under 2 hours.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
FUN > ROI
Just because I was asked - shouldn't take this as a guide; modifying nice hubs is structurally better, buying a hub that already does the job is more sane, and if wanting to do this right, fire up kicad/eagle/something and at least design a nice board Smiley

( click for big )

Regular USB A male connector with cable (from a cable I wasn't using - I'm drowning in the things), chopped off and stripped at one end, coming in from the left.
USB A female connector from an old, dead, power bank on the right.  If just connecting these two together, you'd just solder these from
left to right straight through.

For injecting power, solder the black (gnd), green (D+) and white (D-) wires through, and leave the red unconnected.  You can pretty much just chop it off entirely but that's a bit of a waste.  Now take your PSU, connect the PSU's 0V / 'ground' (not the chassis ground) to the black wire, and the PSU's +5V to where the red wire would have gone.  Done.  Ideally you'd check for potential differences between the two grounds instead of just blindly wiring them together, but you'd need some screwy PSU/computer for that to be terrible.

There's a few extra things on that board - quick overview of that:
Instead of dropping the USB cable's red wire entirely, I soldered it to a male header that connects to the PSU +5V at the other end.  That way I can always use it without the PSU for lower power solutions.  If you'd be inclined to do this as well, don't bridge that jumper while also feeding with the PSU.  If you do, you may have a bad time.
The PSU's +5V supply is not connected straight through - there's two test points I can stick a multimeter between to get current readings, and if for any reason I don't want to measure current, the track can again be bridged with a jumper for lower power solutions.
At the top left is a resistor that goes to a small LED to indicate power, and on the flip side of the board is an array of capacitors to help deal with initial current draw on the board's end.  Ideally these would all be close around the USB socket, but it'll do for something cobbled together.  Their leads (bent over the pads) and all the pads underneath got a good globbing of solder on there to carry the current.
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
I need bigger pictures or a new set of glasses Smiley hard to say where the wires are soldered with my poor eyes Smiley
i shrunk them with bbcode, right click and "view image" should show the full size
hero member
Activity: 572
Merit: 500
I need bigger pictures or a new set of glasses Smiley hard to say where the wires are soldered with my poor eyes Smiley
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
looks encouraging.

I would think it will be able to run 5 sticks at freq 250 easy.

 since that is about 5.5 amps for 5 sticks

if you push past freq 250 and go up to freq 300  it is about 1.5 or 1.6 amps  say 7.5 to 8 amps

Sidehack  or theRealSteve have the numbers over freq 250
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
I'd recommend soldering individual lanes from each plug back to the molex connection. Otherwise as you add high-current devices the voltage drop gets successively worse for each plug.

good point.


So going by this:

I've restated this idea, stripping all the old wires off, going to resolder these wires to each port (yes yes, its a 7 porter, I'm only using the 5 on this side)


I start off with stripping out the wires in the molex needed to connect to the 5 wires.


Starting the solder onto the Positive side to the USB jacks.


Finalising the soldering to each point. and as you can see, the 5 wires are now joined to the pin at the Molex plug.


Moving on to solder on the Negative to the Earth pins and casing


The final product:


Shall we see if it smokes?


Well, Power light is on, so that must mean something Right? RIGHT?!
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
Therealsteve has pushed the sticks up to 23gh!  but they then use over .4 watts a gh  they need a fan and are still pretty hot. I think he was at freq 350 or 375 IIRC.


cgminer version 4.9.2-compac - Started: [2015-08-17 17:57:31]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(5s):27.02G (1m):23.40G (5m):23.25G (15m):23.19G (avg):23.31Gh/s
A:396784  R:108  HW:57  X:237  T:126  GN:398784  WU:325.67/m  WE:100.00% HE:99.73% cf:425.00 ch:23375.00 t:73471
Connected to pool0.btcdig.com diff 19 with stratum as user BEUSB@gscompac
Block: 545278ff...  Diff:52.7G  Started: [14:20:54]  Best share: 178K
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


425MHz, giving 23.31Gh/s on average so far; hover over the statistics to get an explanation of what all those extra bits are.

Temperature-wise, it's currently at 38.1°C vs 23.5°C ambient, but that's with an Arctic 'Breeze' USB fan just about on top of it now.  At 400MHz it was at a 50.2°C vs 27.7°C with the fan 9cm above it.

Power-wise, I haven't tweaked this for efficiency; Vusb is at 5.23V, Iusb is at 2.6A - yielding an apalling ~0.58W/Gh.  Still beats the 0.6W/Gh scamware people tried to get for free, but I'd definitely stick to lower hash rates and with it much more agreeable current draw Smiley

Well, the maximum rating by the documents with the BM1384 is 400MHz, so anywhere outside the factory tests ate unknown territory (probably people have pushed them well beyond this)

But hey, I know nothing about these chips..

But more photos coming up!
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
In terms of easy over clock :

   freq 250   uses 1.1 amps  does 13.7gh   uses about .33-34 watts a gh likes a fan but can be run without the fan.  you can use this link


http://ck.kolivas.org/apps/cgminer/

and get the 4.9.2 build and zadig

I still don't know if ck has add support for above freq 250  but sidehack and steve do have how to go above 250


In terms of insane over clock

freq 425  uses 2.6 amps does 23.3 gh   uses about .58 watts a gh  and must have a fan


sidehack and theRealSteve   can fill inbetween



a usb2 hub with the y-adpater from here

http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513? 

should let you go to 1 amp maybe 1.2 amps,  still waiting for these  to test them.

Op's solder trick  should be good for a better diy hub.  sidehack's  star power idea vs chained power should improve on op's idea.

A cheap hub


http://www.amazon.com/Etekcity-Adapter-Charging-Protector-Indicators/dp/B00ELPSEVW/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1439906982&sr=8-2&keywords=10+port+usb+2+hub


I would think that with the y adapter this  hub can do 4 sticks at freq 250   giving you  4.4amps at 5 volts    about 22 watts for about 66gh .  comes with a 3 amp 12 volt brick 

which has 36 watt max  and you are pulling 22 watts.   may not be able to do this once again I have these on hand and will test once the y-adapters come.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
FUN > ROI
2.6A is pretty good current for USB. To be honest, the jack on that is only rated 1.5A from the manufacturer. What's the hub setup you're pushing that with (since this is a hub thread)?

I ended up just cobbling something together so I wouldn't have to mess about with the hubs I have in terms of adding test points. I'll have to take a pic when I get home, but it's essentially just the data signals going straight through and power coming off of a small PSU.
legendary
Activity: 3374
Merit: 1859
Curmudgeonly hardware guy
Since it's got a buck, it should be about 10% less efficient than an S5 at the same setpoint.

2.6A is pretty good current for USB. To be honest, the jack on that is only rated 1.5A from the manufacturer. What's the hub setup you're pushing that with (since this is a hub thread)?
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
FUN > ROI
Therealsteve has pushed the sticks up to 23gh!  but they then use over .4 watts a gh  they need a fan and are still pretty hot. I think he was at freq 350 or 375 IIRC.


cgminer version 4.9.2-compac - Started: [2015-08-17 17:57:31]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(5s):27.02G (1m):23.40G (5m):23.25G (15m):23.19G (avg):23.31Gh/s
A:396784  R:108  HW:57  X:237  T:126  GN:398784  WU:325.67/m  WE:100.00% HE:99.73% cf:425.00 ch:23375.00 t:73471
Connected to pool0.btcdig.com diff 19 with stratum as user BEUSB@gscompac
Block: 545278ff...  Diff:52.7G  Started: [14:20:54]  Best share: 178K
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


425MHz, giving 23.31Gh/s on average so far; hover over the statistics to get an explanation of what all those extra bits are.

Temperature-wise, it's currently at 38.1°C vs 23.5°C ambient, but that's with an Arctic 'Breeze' USB fan just about on top of it now.  At 400MHz it was at a 50.2°C vs 27.7°C with the fan 9cm above it.

Power-wise, I haven't tweaked this for efficiency; Vusb is at 5.23V, Iusb is at 2.6A - yielding an apalling ~0.58W/Gh.  Still beats the 0.6W/Gh scamware people tried to get for free, but I'd definitely stick to lower hash rates and with it much more agreeable current draw Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3374
Merit: 1859
Curmudgeonly hardware guy
23GH is 425MHz and I'd be surprised if they weren't hitting 0.5 at that point.
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
AJ thanks for posting this.
You saved several of us some time even thinking about it, and can come straight here to copy yours in readiness for our Compac's.

or just buy this


http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513?

not saying it is better  I am waiting  on my 5 cables to arrive.


for all I know they will work poorly

I will look for your notes on it working or not.
I've been looking at USB3 externally powered hubs, but none seem to offer the amperages you guys talk about for being able to go to the high end of frequencies on sidehack's sticks.

also remember that when you push the sticks they become less efficient.

 I got lazy and stopped at 1.1amps  per port and freq 250  giving me 13.7gh and about .33-.34 watts a gh.

Therealsteve has pushed the sticks up to 23gh!  but they then use over .4 watts a gh  they need a fan and are still pretty hot. I think he was at freq 350 or 375  IIRC.

425 freq corrected
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
There is an option of getting these Male to Female adaptors, splitting the plastic off, and with the 5V lines, solder in 1 Molex adaptor.
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
AJ thanks for posting this.
You saved several of us some time even thinking about it, and can come straight here to copy yours in readiness for our Compac's.

or just buy this


http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513?

not saying it is better  I am waiting  on my 5 cables to arrive.


for all I know they will work poorly

Yeah, that too. i was looking into Molex to USB power + data on ebay, but you think i could find something? there is this though:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/5pcs-lot-5V-2Pin-IDE-Molex-to-USB-A-Female-Power-Charge-Cable-Cord-35cm/32297387976.html but it would be nice if it was UAB-A-M to USB-A-F with IDE Molex 5V rail spliced in..

I was thinking of getting one of these and taking the power plug side, and splicing a molex plug on.. Next idea: multiple USB jacks to only power these types of cords..  only need several USB jacks, a proto-board and a Molex plug
hero member
Activity: 700
Merit: 501
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=905210.msg
AJ thanks for posting this.
You saved several of us some time even thinking about it, and can come straight here to copy yours in readiness for our Compac's.

or just buy this


http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513?

not saying it is better  I am waiting  on my 5 cables to arrive.


for all I know they will work poorly

I will look for your notes on it working or not.
I've been looking at USB3 externally powered hubs, but none seem to offer the amperages you guys talk about for being able to go to the high end of frequencies on sidehack's sticks.
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
AJ thanks for posting this.
You saved several of us some time even thinking about it, and can come straight here to copy yours in readiness for our Compac's.

or just buy this


http://www.ebay.com/itm/221661361513?

not saying it is better  I am waiting  on my 5 cables to arrive.


for all I know they will work poorly
hero member
Activity: 700
Merit: 501
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=905210.msg
AJ thanks for posting this.
You saved several of us some time even thinking about it, and can come straight here to copy yours in readiness for our Compac's.
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
I'm going to redo the wiring, have 4 wires to the plug itself, then I'm going to show how to just do a power wire to plug modification..
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
I'd recommend soldering individual lanes from each plug back to the molex connection. Otherwise as you add high-current devices the voltage drop gets successively worse for each plug.

good point.

One slight correction to the first post - on DC wiring, the wire with the line / dashes is usually actually the positive.  There is, unfortunately, no unified marking across all devices (e.g. band on diode = cathode, band on SMD polarized cap = positive) but at least within classes it tends to be.  Good thing to measure, regardless, as there's always exceptions.

Would also be good to see a mod done to a hub that doesn't already have an external power option - though the procedure is very similar Smiley

wiring is all up to the fab labs, speaker wire has markings similar to this, but the amount of colours and markings can change depending on application at the time.

as for the "self powered" hubs, i do have a hub with plugs that go both ways if you want to see that go up in smoke too?
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
FUN > ROI
One slight correction to the first post - on DC wiring, the wire with the line / dashes is usually actually the positive.  There is, unfortunately, no unified marking across all devices (e.g. band on diode = cathode, band on SMD polarized cap = positive) but at least within classes it tends to be.  Good thing to measure, regardless, as there's always exceptions.

Would also be good to see a mod done to a hub that doesn't already have an external power option - though the procedure is very similar Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3374
Merit: 1859
Curmudgeonly hardware guy
I'd recommend soldering individual lanes from each plug back to the molex connection. Otherwise as you add high-current devices the voltage drop gets successively worse for each plug.
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
[WORK]

This is where the road to many mistakes start:

First thing, pop open the case:


As you can see, there is rather large tracks on the PCB already from the Barrel plug:


Which I Removed, I'm going to solder the Molex plug to this point:


Oh, I almost forgot the most nessecary tool for this type of project, The Multimeter!!

As you can see, I have another Molex plug ready to solder in

Now this is where you start stripping wires:


Solder them wires into the empty points on the PCB:


F%#@ S*%! BALLS! its 5V not 12V!!


Yellow is 12V


Red is 5V


So lets try that again!

Following the track from the rail off the barrel plug, the pin for the middle is positive, that is the spade that is on the back of the barrel plug, and soldered onto the board where the single track tracing around to each connection. Easy way to test this is plugging in the hub to a USB port, finding an earth, and testing the solder points on the track.

From here we solder the Red wire to the solder point on the board related to the 5V


Cleaning a bit of the green solder mask off the tracks, I tin the exposed tracks (yes, i did change the layout a little with the wiring, its going to be a little choppy now)


then from here, I soldered on a thicker bodge wire across from the main wire to the plug:

(as you can see, no extra exposed tinned tracks, told'ya its gonna get choppy)

And continue with the bodge bridging:


or you could go from the main solder point, and across to the power pin on the plug..

[TO BE CONTINUED]
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
[PREREQUISITES]

What we need:

The Hub, duuur
pliers, to remove and hold components
Solder
flux
A screwdriver, to open the case (mine was clip shut, used hands to pop it open)



the wire that we are going to use, as you can see, the male Molex plug is what we need



As you can see, this hub has a barrel connection, if you don't want to go any further, use the wire off the power pack, check to see which wire is the middle barrel, that's the positive, push the wire into the Red wire on the female Molex plug. the other is negative, that goes into one of the 2 black wire connectors.

From here on, we get into soldering up heavier wiring onto the hub..
hero member
Activity: 767
Merit: 500
[INTRO]

Well, let me start with what the searches say.
I bet there is plenty of people who have done this type of mod in some way, fashion or form..

Well, for starters, here is an old post with a list of hubs that could be used with the old Block Eruptors, and then some:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/which-usb-hub-to-use-with-block-erupters-nanofury-nf1-bpmc-red-fury-ant-u1-253749

Here is a newbie making their own modified powered USB hub:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/powering-10-port-usb-newb-style-801230

as TheRealSteve said you could just force feed power into the usb power wires:

...

That can be as simple as severing Vbus (V+ / the red wire), connecting the positive of your power supply where Vbus used to connect (or connecting it closer to the actual ports on the hub (in case the traces are pretty narrow and you're not too sure the traces will handle the current), connecting your power supply's negative where USB GND (V- / the black wire) connects, and off you go.  

You can add some capacitors for stability or make the circuit a bit more intelligent (google 'USB power injector'), but it pretty much comes down to that first sentence.

I picked a USB hub that basically has that intelligent bit and whatnot already built-in so I can just plug external power in with a barrel jack, but it is a bit power limited, so I also have a small board where I've only done the 'sever the red wire' approach that's been running my engineering sample Compac for some higher speed tests, but efficiency goes down the gutter at those higher rates Smiley

I have a cheap and nasty USB 7 port thing off Ebay: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/320785264621 what ever you do, don't pull 1A off them 2A bricks, they make nice fireworks...

So, I have a barrel connection in this thing, could just cut the wire off the brick and splice it into a PSU, but that's easy! On this one I got, they have the wiring the wrong way around, the negative painted wire(the one with the white stripe) is not negative! luckily I found this out with a multimeter!


So, lets move on and get the tools, items, wires and workspace needed
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