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Topic: My more than 2 bitcoins got stolen just 2 days ago. (Read 585 times)

legendary
Activity: 2394
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I don't know if you've posted it before or if i missed it, but why is the police reluctant to take any action? I feel the money lost here is huge enough for them to assist you in any little way possible.
His reply about that matter is back in page 2, link: /index.php?topic=5469637.msg62969699#msg62969699
He replied to my post regarding the note that KuCoin or any other centralized exchange will require it before taking action.
hero member
Activity: 826
Merit: 1010
Only BTC
Does anyone has personal contact in KuCoin who might help to get this information?
I don't think this will help, because maybe not everyone working in KuCoin will have access to the information that you are looking for, and even if you get a hold of one who does, they would probably not share the information with you. Be careful if anyone sends you a pm that they work with KuCoin after this, they are probably scammers and do not send money or private information to them.
Dubai police is taking no actions.
I don't know if you've posted it before or if i missed it, but why is the police reluctant to take any action? I feel the money lost here is huge enough for them to assist you in any little way possible.
hero member
Activity: 714
Merit: 1010
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Does this mean that the hacker did needed my password as well? Which I kept only in my head. Or the seed phrase itself is enough? I kept both seed phrasse and the wallet file on my laptop.

No, the hacker doesn't necessarily need your wallet encryption password. Unless you use a strong and complex enough optional mnemonic passphrase in addition to the mnemonic recovery words to define your wallet, it is enough to steal your mnemonic recovery words for a thief to restore your complete wallet and steal your funds.

If you protect your wallet with an additional mnemonic passphrase it is of course mandatory not to save this mnemonic passphrase on the same device where the wallet is (offline only physical storage not together with your mnemonic recovery words is good practice here).

As you now learned the hard way it is no real obstacle for a thief to unmix 12 mnemonic recovery words when you have saved them on an online device. Mixing up the proper sequence of the words doesn't protect you when there are only 12 mnemonic words. With 24 randomly mixed up mnemonic recovery words the situation would be different for the thief. Such a random mixup of 24 words is not feasible to unscramble with current technology, time and energy.
legendary
Activity: 1568
Merit: 2581
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KuCoin accounts are frozen - but the won't ive any info whether there is something there or not, until I get the official law enforcement report. Dubai police is taking no actions.

Does anyone has personal contact in KuCoin who might help to get this information?

Or maybe there is some possibility to get the report from any countries' law enformecents?

I don't believe that personal contact with someone from KuCoin will help you in this case, as sharing such information would be against their policies. The only way, in my opinion, is to pursue legal means.

That's why I recommended you consider consulting someone who's experienced in dealing with  internet-related crimes and cryptocurrencies, like a specialized law firm. I can't speak for Dubai, but over here, I have a local contact I can turn to for legal advice, and the costs are minimal, if any. If it's not their area of expertise, they'll refer me to the right legal experts. From there, they handle all the communication with law enforcement and the courts on my behalf.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
KuCoin accounts are frozen - but the won't ive any info whether there is something there or not, until I get the official law enforcement report. Dubai police is taking no actions.

Does anyone has personal contact in KuCoin who might help to get this information?

Or maybe there is some possibility to get the report from any countries' law enformecents?
hero member
Activity: 2310
Merit: 757
Bitcoin = Financial freedom

Does this mean that the hacker did needed my password as well? Which I kept only in my head. Or the seed phrase itself is enough? I kept both seed phrasse and the wallet file on my laptop.

If someone gets the recovery seeds of a wallet then it can be imported on any Bitcoin wallet where it is supported, for example, electrum supports BIP-39 seeds too even though it doesn't generate that type seeds so once someone got the seeds they can simply import the wallet into their electrum by following this.

Create new wallet => standard wallet => I already have a seed => 'by entering the 12,18,24 seed words'

or whatever type the wallet is ready to be accessed.
legendary
Activity: 2394
Merit: 5531
Self-proclaimed Genius
In Electrum, the wallet file contains the seed (for electrum generated seed) and master keys but not the individual private keys.
Those private data are in plain text only if the wallet or the secrets aren't encrypted with a password, otherwise it'll be encrypted.
The "wallet.dat" file in the example is a Bitcoin Core wallet file (non-descriptor).
Does this mean that the hacker did needed my password as well? Which I kept only in my head. Or the seed phrase itself is enough? I kept both seed phrasse and the wallet file on my laptop.
The latter, the seed phrase alone is enough to restore your wallet.

My reply is about the wallet file in your drive and seed & master keys that are written on it:
If you set a password to encrypt the wallet, the wallet file and secrets will be encrypted.
If you set a password to encrypt only the secrets, secrets will be encrypted but not the wallet file.

But that password wont affect the seed phase that you've written in a text file or paper.
sr. member
Activity: 504
Merit: 421
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Thanks for the information guys. Still trying to make some steps.
I'm so sorry that you had to learn the hard way. 2 BTC is a whole lot of money and would certainly make a difference in many persons lives here. I don't think money is your problem because if you could stached up to 2 BTC in your wallet, then spending a few more dollars to get a good hardware wallet wouldn't have been an issue. You definitely didn't know that storing your seed phrase electronically was a bad practice. I hope the thief is caught and he pays for his crimes and I would also advise you to be spending more time here so that you can learn more about cyber security, wallet security, and many more.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5

If it is not too private, can you explain what was that file or where did you downloaded it from?
Because that seems to be the most crucial part of your story.


This was VST plugin for music software. I made a mistake and simply googled it as I thought this one was very specific for hackers to use - there are too little people in the wrold who might need it. I just googled the name and "download" in the end. And used few forst links. I might even give you the links.

In Electrum, the wallet file contains the seed (for electrum generated seed) and master keys but not the individual private keys.
Those private data are in plain text only if the wallet or the secrets aren't encrypted with a password, otherwise it'll be encrypted.
The "wallet.dat" file in the example is a Bitcoin Core wallet file (non-descriptor).

Does this mean that the hacker did needed my password as well? Which I kept only in my head. Or the seed phrase itself is enough? I kept both seed phrasse and the wallet file on my laptop.
newbie
Activity: 17
Merit: 12
-snip-
Am I geting it correct, are the wallet files created by electrum includes the private keys or seed phrases when opened in plain text?
In Electrum, the wallet file contains the seed (for electrum generated seed) and master keys but not the individual private keys.
Those private data are in plain text only if the wallet or the secrets aren't encrypted with a password, otherwise it'll be encrypted.
The "wallet.dat" file in the example is a Bitcoin Core wallet file (non-descriptor).

Let me ask in a simpler way:
Let's say you have an electrum wallet file that belongs to someone else and it is protected by a very strong password which you do not know.
Is it possible for you to take the funds in it?
legendary
Activity: 2394
Merit: 5531
Self-proclaimed Genius
-snip-
Am I geting it correct, are the wallet files created by electrum includes the private keys or seed phrases when opened in plain text?
In Electrum, the wallet file contains the seed (for electrum generated seed) and master keys but not the individual private keys.
Those private data are in plain text only if the wallet or the secrets aren't encrypted with a password, otherwise it'll be encrypted.
The "wallet.dat" file in the example is a Bitcoin Core wallet file (non-descriptor).
newbie
Activity: 17
Merit: 12
I think I know the answer where it came from. I downloaded one software that night, and it wasn't working properly, so I deleted it straight away. I think the software contained malware. But the job was already done. Seems like it scanned my PC and got everything it needed in few minutes. The transacation was done exactly that night within few hours.

If it is not too private, can you explain what was that file or where did you downloaded it from?
Because that seems to be the most crucial part of your story.

I think I have the installation files of the software that caused the leakage of the information. Do you think it may help the police to find our where the data was sent to? Or it is not possible to track this from the software files?

Have you tried scanning that file with an antivirus program or at least with windows defender?

All the attacker needs is to write a script that searches for specific patters for seed phrases or private keys or wallet files.
Be it in binary or plain text (eg.: "04ckey" or "03key" for keys in wallet.dat files), depending on how and what he prefers to search.

Am I geting it correct, are the wallet files created by electrum includes the private keys or seed phrases when opened in plain text?
legendary
Activity: 3220
Merit: 5634
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Yeah, that's my only hope there. But it will help only if the police will work on this. And at the moment they do not.
~snip~

I hope that your police will do something, even though it seems that they are not interested in the case or maybe they don't even understand what it is exactly about. In that case, it might be wise to seek the help of a lawyer, who again should be a person who at least somewhat understands what it is about and could convince the police to take some steps.

Another piece of advice in case someone offers you "professional help" in returning funds, be very careful with that and don't pay anyone anything in advance - they are mostly scammers who take advantage of victims like you.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
Thanks for the information guys. Still trying to make some steps.
hero member
Activity: 3024
Merit: 647
Sorry to hear about your loss. There's no to recover the amount you lose already, so just chalk it up to experience and use it as a learning opportunity.

From the get-go, it's not a wise move to keep a large sum of money in a single wallet. Two bitcoins already constitute a substantial amount, and personally, I wouldn't even store one bitcoin in a single wallet. Electrum, while a reliable application, has had reported incidents of users losing their funds. However, it's important to note that this isn't the fault of the application itself, but rather the users' responsibility. Being cautious with your holdings is crucial.

My suggestion for the future would be to use multiple wallets. You don't have to memorize them all since that could be challenging, but it's a good strategy to minimize risk and prevent such incidents from happening again. Losing money is never a pleasant experience, especially in the current bullish market sentiment. You might end up regretting losing those 2 bitcoins, which could potentially be valued at $200k when Bitcoin reaches $100k, considering its all-time high (ATH).
legendary
Activity: 2394
Merit: 5531
Self-proclaimed Genius
Also, couldn't realise that this can be done within few minutes - to scan the whole PC for the text files, which contains something looking like SEED phrase - I still can't understand - how techincally it can happen. I have 1 Tb of files here.
All the attacker needs is to write a script that searches for specific patters for seed phrases or private keys or wallet files.
Be it in binary or plain text (eg.: "04ckey" or "03key" for keys in wallet.dat files), depending on how and what he prefers to search.
Reading a 1TB drive wont be as slow as writing something on it, specially the newer models.
One example of such script is pywallet's --recover tool that'll search the entire drive or parts of it for wallet files or private keys.
searching a 1TB drive wont take hours with that tool and it even search for deleted files, it'll be much faster if a script is designed to search only existing files.
Now, all he need is deploy a script like that with a malware or something, then remove the traces is necessary.

For the jumbled seed phrase, its falls under the limitation of the jumbled 12-words which only has possible 12! combinations.
With scripts like btcrecover's "seedrecover.py" tool and an address from your wallet which is easy to get, it can be arranged even with a home PC.

Example, I just rearranged a jumbled 12-word electrum seed phrase in just 22 minutes with a 9-year old processor (with luck):
Code:
seedrecover.py --tokenlist testseed_scramble12_electrum.txt --mnemonic-length 12 --language en --addrs bc1qsaly.....4t7p --addr-limit 2 --dsw --no-eta

Starting seedrecover 1.9.0-CryptoGuide, btcrecover 1.9.0-Cryptoguide on Python 3.11.4 64-bit, 21-bit unicodes, 64-bit ints
Using the 'en' wordlist.
2023-10-13 12:42:42 : Phase 1/1: up to 12 mistakes, 12 of which can be an entirely different seed word.
Warning: --no-eta without --no-dupchecks can cause out-of-memory failures while searching
2023-10-13 12:42:43 : Using 8 worker threads
2023-10-13 13:04:37 : ***MATCHING SEED FOUND***, Matched on Address at derivation path: m/0'/0/0
| 209083649  elapsed: 0:21:50  rate: 162.08 kP/s
2023-10-13 13:04:37 : Search Complete
It'll be significantly faster with the latest models and/or with GPU.
hero member
Activity: 826
Merit: 1010
Only BTC
As for the seed - yeah, now I know. I thought, that the wrong words sequnce will help. Also, couldn't realise that this can be done within few minutes - to scan the whole PC for the text files, which contains something looking like SEED phrase - I still can't understand - how techincally it can happen. I have 1 Tb of files here.
I'm sorry that you had to lose your funds to learn the lesson that: anything that is stored online is prone to hacking, even if it is a 12 word seed phrase stored in the wrong order. Write your seed phrase down on paper and your wallet should be stored locally in an airgapped device or you use a hardware wallet. You don't have to understand exactly how the attack happened or the malware that the attacker used, just follow all the advice in this topic and use it to protect other funds you have or may have in the future. I hope your local police agrees to help you out in the process of recovering your funds.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
@mbLI, most of the victims come to terms with the fact that they were hacked and that their coins disappeared without a trace, but I think that you should still try to find out something and if you're lucky, maybe you can return some or all of the funds that were stolen from you.

When I mention luck, I mostly mean that your hacker made a mistake somewhere in the steps and maybe even used his real data on that CEX. That would be really stupid, but not all hackers are intelligent enough to know how to hide their tracks. What is "good" in the whole matter is that you are obviously not the only victim, and if investigations are opened in several countries, the chances increase that the hacker will still be discovered.

As for the reason you were hacked, now you know that the seed (backup) should never be stored on devices that have access to the internet.

Yeah, that's my only hope there. But it will help only if the police will work on this. And at the moment they do not.

As for the seed - yeah, now I know. I thought, that the wrong words sequnce will help. Also, couldn't realise that this can be done within few minutes - to scan the whole PC for the text files, which contains something looking like SEED phrase - I still can't understand - how techincally it can happen. I have 1 Tb of files here.
legendary
Activity: 3220
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@mbLI, most of the victims come to terms with the fact that they were hacked and that their coins disappeared without a trace, but I think that you should still try to find out something and if you're lucky, maybe you can return some or all of the funds that were stolen from you.

When I mention luck, I mostly mean that your hacker made a mistake somewhere in the steps and maybe even used his real data on that CEX. That would be really stupid, but not all hackers are intelligent enough to know how to hide their tracks. What is "good" in the whole matter is that you are obviously not the only victim, and if investigations are opened in several countries, the chances increase that the hacker will still be discovered.

As for the reason you were hacked, now you know that the seed (backup) should never be stored on devices that have access to the internet.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
OP what kind of information are you looking for, if you want i can help with some analysis of the transactions but TBH i doubt that there is something useful there.

To be honest - I don't know. Any kind of information that might help me to get my bitcoins back.
At the moment I'm working on getting this official report from the police and provide it to KuCoin. I don't see anything else. But a crypto specialist might be able to find something elese in these transactions.
hero member
Activity: 828
Merit: 657
OP what kind of information are you looking for, if you want i can help with some analysis of the transactions but TBH i doubt that there is something useful there.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
Can you tell me please how you got all the chains from this starting point to the final one?
Click on the address and a new window will pop up at right side of the page.

https://www.talkimg.com/images/2023/10/10/RmFBo.jpeg
https://lite.crystalblockchain.com/

You should check the transactions you want to be displayed in the visual one by one. Take note that you will need to play around with the "Date " and/or "Debit/Credit, BTC" to find all transactions you are looking for.

https://www.talkimg.com/images/2023/10/10/RmEdT.jpeg

Thanks. It only shows 5, that's why I didn't see all. The date range helps to filter.
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 5213
Can you tell me please how you got all the chains from this starting point to the final one?
Click on the address. After that, a new window will pop up at right side of the page.


https://lite.crystalblockchain.com/

You should check the transactions you want to be displayed in the visual one by one. Take note that you will need to play around with the "Date " and/or "Debit/Credit, BTC" to find all transactions you are looking for.

legendary
Activity: 3332
Merit: 6809
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Any online device is always prone to hacking. OP's device was probably infected with a malware and how exactly the malware could gain access to OP's keys is known only by the hacker.
If you want to be completely secure, you should create your wallet using a safe tool on an air-gapped device and your keys should never connect to the internet. Otherwise, there's always the chance of getting hacked.
I did know all of what you wrote before I posted my question--I guess I'm just wondering how big a risk it is to use Electrum as a storage wallet if you don't visit weird sites and don't download fishy things.  It baffles me how computers get infected with malware so bad that they can steal coins from your wallet, particularly because pretty much everyone has anti-malware software of some kind.  And I know this isn't the thread to start a conversation about that.

Ok, spoke to KuCoin support. The address which you pointed out is general KuCoin wallet. The one before it - is personal KuCoin wallet and it is verified - meaning it went through KYC. They won't give any further info without official document from the police. The account is frozen already, meaning someone reported before me.

They said that the case success will depend on the police investigation. Which means, most likely, that crypto is not there anymore. And I can't imagine how local Dubai Police will be able to get someone from Ukraine/Russia/Nigeria, even if KYC documents are real.
OP, best of luck to you.  From what I've seen on this forum with hacks like what you're describing, there's rarely a good outcome (or the person doesn't bother to update the community).  You've got a lot of money on the line here, so I hope you get the fuckers who stole from you.  I'm sending positive vibes in your direction.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
The password fpr the wallet was only in my memory.

If your password for the Electrum wallet was strong enough, it's highly unlikely that the Electrum wallet was hacked, even if you installed malware on your system. There is a possibility that you updated Electrum with a malicious version, but you would have had to initiate the upgrade process yourself.


I didn't update my Electrum at all, since I first deposited all the bitocins there a year ago. It was standing still, I didn't even open it for more tahn half a year. So, no, no updated on Electrum.

Guys, do you think it is possible to trace someone from all these blockhains transactions left? Or there are plenty of options for him to use these bitcoins wuthout processing them through any KYC?

Absolutely! It's indeed possible to trace blockchain transactions and follow the trail of money. While I'm no blockchain expert, I gave it a shot and attempted to trace the blockchain records of your transaction. If I'm not mistaken, it appears that all the coins eventually end up at the address: bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz. You can see the visualization below:

https://talkimg.com/images/2023/10/08/RAfpI.jpeg

The address bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz is associated with the hot wallet of the KuCoin exchange, as documented on their website:
https://www.kucoin.com/blog/transparency-and-trust-a-detailed-list-of-kucoin-s-wallets

If I were in your shoes, I'd take this information, get a lawyer who knows about crypto and online scams. Then, I'd proceed to file a criminal complaint with the local authorities for online crimes. If you act quickly, you can request KuCoin to freeze both the suspected account and the funds linked to the criminal activity.


Can you please help me to get the same chain of transactions that you show here?

When I open this theft transaction ID and open the next transactions, I get to the KuCoin hot wallet - the same as you did, right.
https://talkimg.com/images/2023/10/10/RmZBG.png

But I can't get all tre previous incoming transcations which lead eventually back to the hacker's first wallet:
https://talkimg.com/images/2023/10/10/RmCXD.png

If I open incoming transactions for the final KuCoin hot wallet - they show 72 incoming.
https://talkimg.com/images/2023/10/10/RmQzf.png

Can you tell me please how you got all the chains from this starting point to the final one?
https://talkimg.com/images/2023/10/10/RmGhZ.png

legendary
Activity: 2394
Merit: 5531
Self-proclaimed Genius
-snip-
If they withdraw in altcoins like you say - there is completely on chance to trace it further, right?
Most likely he did it. And most likely KuCoin account is empty - KuCoin didn't tell me this directly, but I understood this from our conversation.
If it's something like Monero (or any "privacy coin"), I'd say yes.
That coin is designed to be anonymous so tracing it would be difficult compared to Bitcoin transactions.
It's not totally untraceable though as there are techniques that can be applied, but generally, that specific coin is untraceable if the user is wary of the privacy practices himself.

There are companies that's good at it and even won the bounty for tracing Monero/lightning transactions (didn't specified which one they're paid for)
More information here: https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/z9j62d/the_irs_bounty_the_full_story/

I'm trying to get the form from Dubai police. The first offcier from the cybercrime departent I met refused to open the case since it is on the Internet and out of UAE jurisdiction. Which is kinda nonsense. I'm tryong to push this another way.
That would be a problem since those exchanges typically wouldn't cooperate and wont even provide minimal information without it.
hero member
Activity: 1246
Merit: 560
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If they withdraw in altcoins like you say - there is completely on chance to trace it further, right?
Most likely he did it. And most likely KuCoin account is empty - KuCoin didn't tell me this directly, but I understood this from our conversation.

Yes you can track it further when the hacker withdraws it on a non privacy token but you will still need Kucoin helps to track it since Kucoin use multiple hot wallets which means internal transactions within exchange can’t be determined if you re just using blockchain records. So his Bitcoin will still remain on his exchange wallet address while he can get altcoins on different address without blockchain record of exchange.

Your best chance to caught this hacker is by freezing his asset on a centralized service such as exchange instead of tracking him more on altcoins.


You will be lucky if the hacker sent your Bitcoin directly on exchange address because you can prove ownership by signing message on your Bitcoin address.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
-snip-
But is the last blochain transaction is made in KuCoin this means he withdrwn in fiat? In this case it might be possible to trace him - depends on the jurisdiction he is in?
That's only possible if the hacker isn't good at his trade.

Most notorious ones use any leaked credentials to pass KYC on centralized exchanges.
For withdrawal, they don't usually go for fiat, but rather withdraw anonymous altcoins like Monero which they can then transact without being traced.

Your chance is to flag it to KuCoin as soon as possible before the hacker withdraw your funds.
(they only do that if you have substantial evidence and backing from authorities though)

If they withdraw in altcoins like you say - there is completely on chance to trace it further, right?
Most likely he did it. And most likely KuCoin account is empty - KuCoin didn't tell me this directly, but I understood this from our conversation.

I'm trying to get the form from Dubai police. The first offcier from the cybercrime departent I met refused to open the case since it is on the Internet and out of UAE jurisdiction. Which is kinda nonsense. I'm tryong to push this another way.
legendary
Activity: 2394
Merit: 5531
Self-proclaimed Genius
-snip-
But is the last blochain transaction is made in KuCoin this means he withdrwn in fiat? In this case it might be possible to trace him - depends on the jurisdiction he is in?
That's only possible if the hacker isn't good at his trade.

Most notorious ones use any leaked credentials to pass KYC on centralized exchanges.
For withdrawal, they don't usually go for fiat, but rather withdraw anonymous altcoins like Monero which they can then transact without being traced.

Your chance is to flag it to KuCoin as soon as possible before the hacker withdraw your funds.
(they only do that if you have substantial evidence and backing from authorities though)
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
If I'm not mistaken, it appears that all the coins eventually end up at the address: bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz. You can see the visualization below:
As displayed in the image, the hacker split the stolen funds between five addresses and then sent them separately to four different deposit addresses.

I used to use Kucoin. I used their service until they made KYC compulsory. If nothing has changed, they don't generate new deposit addresses and users have to reuse the same deposit address.
Maybe, the hacker had mutliple accounts on Kucoin and if that's the case, the hacker must have used four different documents.

Good point - KuCoin doesn't let you make new deposit addresses.  So the hacker must've used a bunch of accounts to "launder" the stolen coins. They probably faked the KYC info for those accounts too and I really doubt they'd be stupid enough to send hacked coins to a KYC exchange tied to their real name and info!


But is the last blochain transaction is made in KuCoin this means he withdrwn in fiat? In this case it might be possible to trace him - depends on the jurisdiction he is in?
legendary
Activity: 1568
Merit: 2581
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If I'm not mistaken, it appears that all the coins eventually end up at the address: bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz. You can see the visualization below:
As displayed in the image, the hacker split the stolen funds between five addresses and then sent them separately to four different deposit addresses.

I used to use Kucoin. I used their service until they made KYC compulsory. If nothing has changed, they don't generate new deposit addresses and users have to reuse the same deposit address.
Maybe, the hacker had mutliple accounts on Kucoin and if that's the case, the hacker must have used four different documents.

Good point - KuCoin doesn't let you make new deposit addresses.  So the hacker must've used a bunch of accounts to "launder" the stolen coins. They probably faked the KYC info for those accounts too and I really doubt they'd be stupid enough to send hacked coins to a KYC exchange tied to their real name and info!
legendary
Activity: 2268
Merit: 18509
In what way(s) is it risky to store large amounts of BTC in an Electrum wallet?
It's not Electrum itself that is unsafe per se, but rather any device which is connected to the internet. Electrum can be used as a cold wallet on a permanently airgapped machine, in which case it is very safe indeed. But using Electrum as a hot wallet will always bring risks, as will using any software on an internet connected device.

Obviously one way is the malware seedcrawler you mentioned, but how in the hell does one get infected with such a thing?
You can never be 100% sure that every piece of software you install, every file you download, every website you visit, etc., are 100% clean and free from malware. And you can never be 100% sure that your computer is 100% impenetrable to attacks. Indeed, it seems OP downloaded some software which contained the malware:

I think I know the answer where it came from. I downloaded one software that night, and it wasn't working properly, so I deleted it straight away. I think the software contained malware. But the job was already done. Seems like it scanned my PC and got everything it needed in few minutes. The transacation was done exactly that night within few hours.

I downloaded it from Electrum web-site directly and it did work good for one year.
Note that downloading from (what you think is) the official Electrum website is insufficient - you must also verify your download prior to installation.
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 5213
If I'm not mistaken, it appears that all the coins eventually end up at the address: bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz. You can see the visualization below:
As displayed in the image, the hacker split the stolen funds between five addresses and then sent them separately to four different deposit addresses.

I used to use Kucoin. I used their service until they made KYC compulsory. If nothing has changed, they don't generate new deposit addresses and users have to reuse the same deposit address.
Maybe, the hacker had mutliple accounts on Kucoin and if that's the case, the hacker must have used four different documents.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
They said that the case success will depend on the police investigation. Which means, most likely, that crypto is not there anymore. And I can't imagine how local Dubai Police will be able to get someone from Ukraine/Russia/Nigeria, even if KYC documents are real.
You did the right thing by contacting kucoin's support and informing them about this incident. Now that the culprit's account has been frozen, all you have to do is to file a police report.
Dubai and the UAE is one of the most crypto friendly governments in the world. I'm sure it won't be hard to find a qualified lawyer who can help you with your case.

Will try to get the police report asap. But it seems that the account on KuCoin is already empty.

Do you think I will need a lawyer for this case? It is not possible just to report to the police to get things going?

Yes, I'm sure, I'm using the right wallet.

You're not very specific how you checked that your Electrum download was actually genuine and untampered. Let's assume the best and you did properly check the download file's signature by best practices and your wallet originated from https://www.electrum.org.


I think I know the answer where it came from. I downloaded one software that night, and it wasn't working properly, so I deleted it straight away. I think the software contained malware. But the job was already done. Seems like it scanned my PC and got everything it needed in few minutes. The transacation was done exactly that night within few hours.

As o_e_l_e_o already pointed out a few errors that the OP did himself, I want to highlight another one which I didn't read in this thread so far. You put your hodl wallet as a hot wallet on an online computer and even worse a laptop with which you do your daily stuff and internet and download shit. This is insane in my opinion with a software wallet that holds a decent amount of coins.

I would've used a decent hardware wallet already for far less than the amount of stolen coins here.

I downloaded it from Electrum web-site directly and it did work good for one year.

I agree, that was not very smart from my side, but I based on the information that was in my head at that moment, I thought it is impossbile to get this from my laptop. Now I know.
hero member
Activity: 714
Merit: 1010
Crypto Swap Exchange
Yes, I'm sure, I'm using the right wallet.

You're not very specific how you checked that your Electrum download was actually genuine and untampered. Let's assume the best and you did properly check the download file's signature by best practices and your wallet originated from https://www.electrum.org.


I think I know the answer where it came from. I downloaded one software that night, and it wasn't working properly, so I deleted it straight away. I think the software contained malware. But the job was already done. Seems like it scanned my PC and got everything it needed in few minutes. The transacation was done exactly that night within few hours.

As o_e_l_e_o already pointed out a few errors that the OP did himself, I want to highlight another one which I didn't read in this thread so far. You put your hodl wallet as a hot wallet on an online computer and even worse a laptop with which you do your daily stuff and internet and download shit. This is insane in my opinion with a software wallet that holds a decent amount of coins.

I would've used a decent hardware wallet already for far less than the amount of stolen coins here.
legendary
Activity: 2506
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They said that the case success will depend on the police investigation. Which means, most likely, that crypto is not there anymore. And I can't imagine how local Dubai Police will be able to get someone from Ukraine/Russia/Nigeria, even if KYC documents are real.
You did the right thing by contacting kucoin's support and informing them about this incident. Now that the culprit's account has been frozen, all you have to do is to file a police report.
Dubai and the UAE is one of the most crypto friendly governments in the world. I'm sure it won't be hard to find a qualified lawyer who can help you with your case.
hero member
Activity: 854
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Watch Bitcoin Documentary - https://t.ly/v0Nim
The password fpr the wallet was only in my memory.

Seed phrase was written (in txt file sowhere in pc without clear indication where), but even in a wrong sequence.

It is clearly a hole in ELectrum itself.
Were you using 12 words seed phrase or 24 words seed phrase? If you were using 12 words and have saved them in unordered way, then it's still possible to brute force wallet in minutes, here is an article Bitcoin enthusiast cracks known 12-word seed phrase in minutes

It's very unlikely that there is a hole in Electrum.

If the hacker moved funds to an exchange or anywhere KYCed then it's possible to trace the identity of the individual, but I don't think who is smart enough to execute this will be dumb like that to leave the traces, so I don't think there is any hope.
There have been way smarter individuals who got caught.

I'm planning go straight to the police. Do you think getting a laywer before this is required? It will take me time to find one and I'm not sure how expensive this will be.

What service did you use to get the full visualisation?
If I were you, I would immediately contact KuCoin and would explain the situation to them to freeze the scammer's account as soon as possible, this will take you some minutes to figure out with their live support, so, I would do it ASAP, you lose nothing by doing this.
Can't help about the police and lawyers, I have no experience.

EDIT
It seems, you already spoke with them, the timing of my post was a little late.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
Man, if this will work out I will share the part of the returned funds with you! Many thanks.

I'm planning go straight to the police. Do you think getting a laywer before this is required? It will take me time to find one and I'm not sure how expensive this will be.

What service did you use to get the full visualisation?

You probably don't need legal representation; I just thought it might be helpful in following proper procedures and getting things done. But you can likely go directly to the police, specifically the internet crime unit.

I used Crystal Lite Explorer to create the visualization, but you can achieve the same with any blockchain explorer. Just follow a few transactions further, and they all lead to the same address from the KuCoin exchange. I hope this information proves useful to you.


Ok, spoke to KuCoin support. The address which you pointed out is general KuCoin wallet. The one before it - is personal KuCoin wallet and it is verified - meaning it went through KYC. They won't give any further info without official document from the police. The account is frozen already, meaning someone reported before me.

They said that the case success will depend on the police investigation. Which means, most likely, that crypto is not there anymore. And I can't imagine how local Dubai Police will be able to get someone from Ukraine/Russia/Nigeria, even if KYC documents are real.

I will keep you posted.
legendary
Activity: 1568
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Man, if this will work out I will share the part of the returned funds with you! Many thanks.

I'm planning go straight to the police. Do you think getting a laywer before this is required? It will take me time to find one and I'm not sure how expensive this will be.

What service did you use to get the full visualisation?

You probably don't need legal representation; I just thought it might be helpful in following proper procedures and getting things done. But you can likely go directly to the police, specifically the internet crime unit.

I used Crystal Lite Explorer to create the visualization, but you can achieve the same with any blockchain explorer. Just follow a few transactions further, and they all lead to the same address from the KuCoin exchange. I hope this information proves useful to you.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
The password fpr the wallet was only in my memory.

If your password for the Electrum wallet was strong enough, it's highly unlikely that the Electrum wallet was hacked, even if you installed malware on your system. There is a possibility that you updated Electrum with a malicious version, but you would have had to initiate the upgrade process yourself.


I didn't update my Electrum at all, since I first deposited all the bitocins there a year ago. It was standing still, I didn't even open it for more tahn half a year. So, no, no updated on Electrum.

Guys, do you think it is possible to trace someone from all these blockhains transactions left? Or there are plenty of options for him to use these bitcoins wuthout processing them through any KYC?

Absolutely! It's indeed possible to trace blockchain transactions and follow the trail of money. While I'm no blockchain expert, I gave it a shot and attempted to trace the blockchain records of your transaction. If I'm not mistaken, it appears that all the coins eventually end up at the address: bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz. You can see the visualization below:

https://talkimg.com/images/2023/10/08/RAfpI.jpeg

The address bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz is associated with the hot wallet of the KuCoin exchange, as documented on their website:
https://www.kucoin.com/blog/transparency-and-trust-a-detailed-list-of-kucoin-s-wallets

If I were in your shoes, I'd take this information, get a lawyer who knows about crypto and online scams. Then, I'd proceed to file a criminal complaint with the local authorities for online crimes. If you act quickly, you can request KuCoin to freeze both the suspected account and the funds linked to the criminal activity.


Man, if this will work out I will share the part of the returned funds with you! Many thanks.

I'm planning go straight to the police. Do you think getting a laywer before this is required? It will take me time to find one and I'm not sure how expensive this will be.

What service did you use to get the full visualisation?
legendary
Activity: 1568
Merit: 2581
Top Crypto Casino
The password fpr the wallet was only in my memory.

If your password for the Electrum wallet was strong enough, it's highly unlikely that the Electrum wallet was hacked, even if you installed malware on your system. There is a possibility that you updated Electrum with a malicious version, but you would have had to initiate the upgrade process yourself.


I didn't update my Electrum at all, since I first deposited all the bitocins there a year ago. It was standing still, I didn't even open it for more tahn half a year. So, no, no updated on Electrum.

Guys, do you think it is possible to trace someone from all these blockhains transactions left? Or there are plenty of options for him to use these bitcoins wuthout processing them through any KYC?

Absolutely! It's indeed possible to trace blockchain transactions and follow the trail of money. While I'm no blockchain expert, I gave it a shot and attempted to trace the blockchain records of your transaction. If I'm not mistaken, it appears that all the coins eventually end up at the address: bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz. You can see the visualization below:



The address bc1q8yja3gw33ngd8aunmfr4hj820adc9nlsv0syvz is associated with the hot wallet of the KuCoin exchange, as documented on their website:
https://www.kucoin.com/blog/transparency-and-trust-a-detailed-list-of-kucoin-s-wallets

If I were in your shoes, I'd take this information, get a lawyer who knows about crypto and online scams. Then, I'd proceed to file a criminal complaint with the local authorities for online crimes. If you act quickly, you can request KuCoin to freeze both the suspected account and the funds linked to the criminal activity.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
The password fpr the wallet was only in my memory.

If your password for the Electrum wallet was strong enough, it's highly unlikely that the Electrum wallet was hacked, even if you installed malware on your system. There is a possibility that you updated Electrum with a malicious version, but you would have had to initiate the upgrade process yourself.


I didn't update my Electrum at all, since I first deposited all the bitocins there a year ago. It was standing still, I didn't even open it for more tahn half a year. So, no, no updated on Electrum.

Guys, do you think it is possible to trace someone from all these blockhains transactions left? Or there are plenty of options for him to use these bitcoins wuthout processing them through any KYC?
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 5213
Out of curiosity why the address : bc1qg0ghptl62pgyjadv9hu9a9uhg4rxpgw62ajhqk shows 6.4BTC as total received
That's true.
In all outgoing transactions that have a change, the change has been sent back to the same address and you didn't consider them when calculating the total received amount. 
For example, in this transaction, 1.73632521 BTC has been sent and 1.23624061 BTC of that has been sent back to the same address.
legendary
Activity: 1568
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The password fpr the wallet was only in my memory.

If your password for the Electrum wallet was strong enough, it's highly unlikely that the Electrum wallet was hacked, even if you installed malware on your system. There is a possibility that you updated Electrum with a malicious version, but you would have had to initiate the upgrade process yourself.

Seed phrase was written (in txt file sowhere in pc without clear indication where), but even in a wrong sequence.

That's a glaring security oversight on your part. Keeping a seed phrase in plain text on an internet-connected computer is almost as bad as to posting it on a giant billboard for everyone to see. Okay, I might be exaggerating a bit, but you get the point. No amount of encryption and password protection on your wallet can save you if someone gets hold to your seed phrase. Even if you mixed the words up a bit.

It is clearly a hole in ELectrum itself.

No it's not. Especially considering your previous statement.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
Please post the TXid to know understand you are talking about.

574e046337f18b9debe4eb26cb3d303b42586d047211e04cde5a22114742f792

I explored the address bc1qg0ghptl62pgyjadv9hu9a9uhg4rxpgw62ajhqk, where the funds sent to and apart from that there were few other incoming TXs as well on the same day so its probably affected more than one wallet user. But you are the one who lost huge funds and I don't think it happened due to the Electrum, in the last two days your system infected by a malware, possible something called Bunny Loader and I read that it has capability to execute remote commands as well so that's how your funds were moved from your device so if that is true then you should probably came online in that device on that time period.

Will it help somehow? Do you think it worth going to the Police in Dubai?

I think I have the installation files of the software that caused the leakage of the information. Do you think it may help the police to find our where the data was sent to? Or it is not possible to track this from the software files?

If the hacker moved funds to an exchange or anywhere KYCed then it's possible to trace the identity of the individual, but I don't think who is smart enough to execute this will be dumb like that to leave the traces, so I don't think there is any hope.


Fair enough... Seems like the police won't be able to help.
sr. member
Activity: 868
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Please post the TXid to know understand you are talking about.

574e046337f18b9debe4eb26cb3d303b42586d047211e04cde5a22114742f792

I explored the address bc1qg0ghptl62pgyjadv9hu9a9uhg4rxpgw62ajhqk, where the funds sent to and apart from that there were few other incoming TXs as well on the same day so its probably affected more than one wallet user. But you are the one who lost huge funds and I don't think it happened due to the Electrum, in the last two days your system infected by a malware, possible something called Bunny Loader and I read that it has capability to execute remote commands as well so that's how your funds were moved from your device so if that is true then you should probably came online in that device on that time period.

Will it help somehow? Do you think it worth going to the Police in Dubai?

I think I have the installation files of the software that caused the leakage of the information. Do you think it may help the police to find our where the data was sent to? Or it is not possible to track this from the software files?

If the hacker moved funds to an exchange or anywhere KYCed then it's possible to trace the identity of the individual, but I don't think who is smart enough to execute this will be dumb like that to leave the traces, so I don't think there is any hope.



Out of curiosity why the address : bc1qg0ghptl62pgyjadv9hu9a9uhg4rxpgw62ajhqk shows 6.4BTC as total received



but I manually calculated the numbers are only around 2.6BTC only, tried multiple explorers too.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
Are you sure you are looking at the right wallet? Do you see the hashes of old transactions you received from the crypto exchange on the history tab?
If yes then most likely your laptop has been compromised and the attacker got access to your wallet's seed (he doesn't need the password to steal your coins as o-e-l-e-o mentioned above). It's unlikely that you are using a fake Electrum version since you've been using it for more than a year and your coins were stolen just recently.

Yes, I'm sure, I'm using the right wallet.

I think I know the answer where it came from. I downloaded one software that night, and it wasn't working properly, so I deleted it straight away. I think the software contained malware. But the job was already done. Seems like it scanned my PC and got everything it needed in few minutes. The transacation was done exactly that night within few hours.


Please post the TXid to know understand you are talking about.

574e046337f18b9debe4eb26cb3d303b42586d047211e04cde5a22114742f792

Will it help somehow? Do you think it worth going to the Police in Dubai?

I think I have the installation files of the software that caused the leakage of the information. Do you think it may help the police to find our where the data was sent to? Or it is not possible to track this from the software files?
legendary
Activity: 2380
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Ugh.  This has always puzzled me.  In what way(s) is it risky to store large amounts of BTC in an Electrum wallet?  Obviously one way is the malware seedcrawler you mentioned, but how in the hell does one get infected with such a thing?
Any online device is always prone to hacking. OP's device was probably infected with a malware and how exactly the malware could gain access to OP's keys is known only by the hacker.
If you want to be completely secure, you should create your wallet using a safe tool on an air-gapped device and your keys should never connect to the internet. Otherwise, there's always the chance of getting hacked.
legendary
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First, you stored more than you were willing to lose in a hot wallet.
Ugh.  This has always puzzled me.  In what way(s) is it risky to store large amounts of BTC in an Electrum wallet?  Obviously one way is the malware seedcrawler you mentioned, but how in the hell does one get infected with such a thing?

Are there other risks?  And I'm still wondering what really happened with OP's wallet and how it apparently got hacked.  I do agree that if there was such a big flaw in the code that there would be pandemonium throughout the entire bitcoin space, so it's got to be one of the reasons you mentioned....but I'm curious as to exactly how it got hacked, you know?
legendary
Activity: 3234
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Block halving is coming.
Yes, Electrum wallet used on my laptop only.

Are you sure if your Laptop is clean?
You might be using a cracked OS?
Or maybe you are using a fake Electrum wallet?

If this is for HODL you should make a wallet on an offline device or laptop and never save the password and seed phrase anywhere in your PC/Laptop.


How are you sure that your funds got stolen?
Did you check it from blockchain explorer?

You can maybe still able to reverse the transaction if it is still unconfirmed why not share your wallet address here?
sr. member
Activity: 868
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It is clearly a hole in ELectrum itself.

I don't think any such vulnerabilities found in the electrum wallet for year now. So something happened from your end.

Yes, Electrum wallet used on my laptop only.

I used the wallet just once - a year ago - just received a couple of transactions from my own account on trusted crypto exchange.
And this is it - never used this wallet somewehre else. It was created specifically for the security reasons. For HODL.

The password fpr the wallet was only in my memory.

Seed phrase was written (in txt file sowhere in pc without clear indication where), but even in a wrong sequence.

So, you never turned the device in the meanwhile?

There are only two possibilities, you downloaded electrum from an unofficial site or someone accessed your device and moved funds.

Please post the TXid to know understand you are talking about.
legendary
Activity: 2506
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Are you sure you are looking at the right wallet? Do you see the hashes of old transactions you received from the crypto exchange on the history tab?
If yes then most likely your laptop has been compromised and the attacker got access to your wallet's seed (he doesn't need the password to steal your coins as o-e-l-e-o mentioned above). It's unlikely that you are using a fake Electrum version since you've been using it for more than a year and your coins were stolen just recently.
legendary
Activity: 2268
Merit: 18509
It is clearly a hole in ELectrum itself.
Unlikely. Electrum is incredibly widely used, and so if it had a critical flaw in it we would expect to see hundreds if not thousands of reports from users losing their funds.

You made several mistakes I'm afraid OP. First, you stored more than you were willing to lose in a hot wallet. Then you ignored the warnings in Electrum which say "Please save these 12 words on paper" and "Do not store it electronically". By far the most likely way in which your coins were stolen is from malware or similar accessing the text file containing your seed phrase. It does not matter where on your hard drive it is (since malware can just scan your entire drive for words from the public word list), nor does it matter what order they are stored in since descrambling 12 words is incredibly easy and quick on even cheap hardware.

The password you remembered is irrelevant - your seed phrase is all that is needed to access your coins. The password only encrypts your local Electrum file.

What you need to do now is consider your computer compromised. At a minimum scan with antivirus and antimalware software, but ideally format it and reinstall your OS. Assume any other wallets or sensitive data on that computer are also compromised, including any saved website logins and passwords.
legendary
Activity: 2394
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Self-proclaimed Genius
Seed phrase was written (in txt file sowhere in pc without clear indication where), but even in a wrong sequence.
It's not recommended to save the seed phrase in your PC, it's always has to be on a piece of paper or any alternative.

Hiding it in some folder, no matter how "hidden" you think it is isn't something that can protect you from private key/seed crawlers that an attacker can perform to your drives.
Electrum's seed phrase is only 12words by default, rearranging it is just a futile effort to protect it either.
Attackers can arrange it in correct order within minutes or even seconds.

If you want to check the code for possible backdoors, check it here (it's "open-source", and the builds are reproducible): https://github.com/spesmilo/electrum
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
Yes, Electrum wallet used on my laptop only.

I used the wallet just once - a year ago - just received a couple of transactions from my own account on trusted crypto exchange.
And this is it - never used this wallet somewehre else. It was created specifically for the security reasons. For HODL.

The password fpr the wallet was only in my memory.

Seed phrase was written (in txt file sowhere in pc without clear indication where), but even in a wrong sequence.

It is clearly a hole in ELectrum itself.
hero member
Activity: 828
Merit: 657
Hi. Kept my password only in my head on noone had access to seed-phrases. It leaked purely internally because if the wallet itself. Guys, pleas,e advise what to do. 50k$ are gone

Sadly there is nothing that you can do, as you should know the transactions aren't reversibles, those are permanent.

But this history coming from a brand new account its unbelieve.
hero member
Activity: 672
Merit: 855
If your story is true then you might have visited a phishing site using the device that holds the wallet or probably your device caught a malware that Leaked the seed to the hackers.

Since you’re posting on electrum board I will assume it is electrum wallet and there is no breach of electrum wallet this is a personal breach. And sorry to put it out I don’t think anything can be done if the funds are no longer there, you just need to discard that seed and create a new one and probably have a proper scan of that device for malware.
sr. member
Activity: 1064
Merit: 437
#SWGT CERTIK Audited
What wallet were you using? And provide some hash or wallet address so that we can confirm and judge the tx, because without any help from you, we might not help you. And to be honest, if someone got into your wallet (intentionally) then the money is gone and there might be no way for it to be recovered.

PS: I assume, you are talking about Electrum wallet.

Well, if that's the case, then please share your whole story. because the type of electrum depends, whether you were using it on Phone or a Desktop, because both have some differences. And What did you do, that you think your wallet got hack.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 5
Hi. Kept my password only in my head on noone had access to seed-phrases. It leaked purely internally because if the wallet itself. Guys, pleas,e advise what to do. 50k$ are gone
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