Topic: My perspective on the hardfork from an investors point of view (Read 1078 times)

I don't think this is required

At least, not in the way or sense you assume it. Bitcoin is still new, so it is a bit premature to expect a lot of stability of it. In fact, it took literally a few centuries to find out and learn the rules which would allow to make fiat (which you yourself put between gold and diamonds, just in case) as stable as most stable fiat currencies are (e.g. the US dollar or Swiss franc). Technically, Bitcoin is still in an early development phase, and its use (even as a purely speculative asset) seems to be running ahead of its evolution

Most of the wallets that give you control over your private keys would let you keep you both BTC and BTU. But a hard fork would not be profitable for either of coin, so I think a hard fork is off the table even if btu gets its 55% approval.

Bitcoin is a relatively young currency.

Being young in comparison to gold, fiat and diamonds, btc needs to prove its stability over the long term & prove that its technology is reliable.

If a fork occurs, to some that will prove bitcoin is and always was a joke.

It could prove to some that bitcoin is an amateur currency, a gimmick, that wasn't good enough to exist on the big stage in world affairs.

A fork could be the end of bitcoin and alts as we know it.

If that happens a lot of people could lose a lot of money and be upset.

Then governments of the world could have an excuse to step in and ban crypto currencies to "protect" people from "unregulated" crypto.

Its not worth it for bitcoin unlimited, nor anyone else, to fork & increase block size by a paltry amount in terms of risk versus reward.

From what I read from coindesk website last night, fork is not really a bad idea as it deals with consensus on some issues like software for mining, transactions confirmation and networks. But my own views concerning the present one is about the people behind it. I don't think they come with good intentions, bitcoin unlimited is back up rich people who want to destroy bitcoin and create another coin to replace it.

Being unfamiliar with the technical details as well, I would be worried but not as much as those who invested heavily. I'm still watching the movement although it's a bit late now to take out my money. I might if the price reaches up a certain threshold though.


When you play the game of coins there is no middle ground... 

Wow this is starting to get kindve scary. I didn't think a hard fork would ever actually occur, but I guess we'll see what happens....

Call a date, bro!

We are tired of waiting already, these folks are playing us for fools. How long should we wait till they kick off for real? It's all been empty talk and bravado so far. Apart from that, why should BU overtake the Core while the latter should necessarily retake the blockchain? Once the split is done and over, everyone should walk their own path as I get it. There will be two different blockchains after the event, and you can call Bitcoin Core an altcoin and vice versa, but they will be independent of each other, anyway

Why the Bitcoin whales must have small blocks. This is very important.

The problem is they fail every time they test BTU and they do not have full support from Bitcoin Core miners so you are  speculating in support of BTU ....

The person that wrote that article is an idiot or a paid shill, take your pick.

Once BTU mines a block > 1 meg, all they have to do is release an updated BTU client with a hard coded checkpoint.
No reorganization back to Core would be possible, no matter how many asics core purchased.
Odds are high, that within 3 days of BTU taking over the other miners would fall in line soon after or split off forever to mine the weaker SegPal coin.
Either way after a hard coded checkpoint , core can never retake the blockchain.  


 

Thanks for the practical advice from the article. I will check out different wallets and not make any transactions after the fork. I didn't realize you could potentially keep both BTC and BTU.

wow i cant beloeve i read it all, and real appreciation and thanks for your perspective. Theres still a lot of things that we can learn in the community, i didnt know if btu make the fork we will have 2 types of coin which is the btc and btu in the wallet. And about the replay attack, guess for people who never read this article would just sent off any transaction after the fork

"Every battle is won or lost before it's ever fought." Sun Tzu

i've thought for the longest time that bitcoin is a dead man walking. because of the personality types that have or attempt to control it. only thing is nothing suitable has stood upto the task of replacing it.

basically the same types take over (or start) the leading alts as well 

money and power 

I'm still reading but


caught my attention. Two hostile fractions sum up in total onto "no one winning". Countless war battlefields telling the same story.
Maybe one Altcoin will take the lead as most valued coin on market.

My perspective on the hardfork from an investors point of view:

This fork thing had me concerned but after reading the article below and securing my coins off an exchange I have some assurance I wont be stuck with whatever the losing coin is.

From what I read there is a chance Bitcoin Core may overtake BTU and if it does, nobody knows how BTU price will be impacted(and vice versa).

In my current position if the Hardfork occurs it will result in my holding both coins. So by being in a position where you are holding both coins, this will ensure you are safe in the long term as far as holding the winning coin.

If you are a BTU holder and Bitcoin core succeeds BTU you will lose your investment. This could be a bate and switch, after all these guys are in it to make money.

The option of leaving your coins in an exchange will result in the fate of your investment in somebody else's hands (this is very bad).

I would think if the exchanges pull out there money the price of the coin in question would plummet very fast but the coin they choose as the winner would move up in price extremely fast so forget about chasing it if you have no time to dedicate to monitoring the exchange.

Pulling out all of your investment into USD would be the safest thing to do but in the end if you want to reinvest you will probable pay more because by the time the dust settle im sure volume and price will skyrocket.

I expect volatility in price but I think there is a chance bitcoin core holders may have an opportunity to make gains off both if they have access to them.

Finally, this dip in price is a joke and a "certain element of the coin community" is making a lot of money off it.


A Bitcoin Beginner’s Guide to Surviving a Coin-Split
March 22, 2017, 05:58:14 PM EDT By Aaron van Wirdum, Bitcoin Magazine


There is a chance Bitcoin will experience a coin-split soon. If a majority of miners (by hash power) switch to Bitcoin Unlimited and decide to mine blocks bigger than one megabyte, while at least some users stick to the current Bitcoin protocol, the network and blockchain can split in two. In that case, there may be two different types of Bitcoin tokens: "BTC," which follows the current Bitcoin protocol, and "BTU," which follows the new Bitcoin Unlimited protocol. 

The good news is that each bitcoin would effectively be copied onto the Bitcoin Unlimited chain. If you hold bitcoin right now, you will hold both BTC and BTU after a split.
The bad news is that a coin-split can be messy and risky. This is mainly because, at first, all BTCs and all BTUs will be stuck together. You will need to separate them somehow; otherwise you can lose your BTC or your BTU.

This guide will provide you with the basics to stay safe during a coin-split, and make sure you make it to the "other side" with both your BTC and BTU intact.
Author's note: If you want to play the BTC/BTU markets as soon as possible and you are fine with taking risks, and/or you really know what you are doing, this article is probably not for you. (Perhaps try this Electrum article instead. Especially, of course, if you use Electrum already.)
If you mostly just want to make sure not to lose your BTC or BTU, read on …
Before the Coin-Split (That's Now)
First of all, be aware that a coin-split is a high-risk situation. There is a real chance a sort of cyber-battle will break out between the two camps, perhaps even escalating to the point where bitcoin's exchange rate(s) drops sharply, possibly to zero. Make absolutely sure you are not holding more value in bitcoin than what you are willing to lose.
If you do decide to hold on to your bitcoins, the single most important piece of advice is this: control your own private keys.
If you are storing your bitcoins on an exchange, in a custodial wallet like Coinbase, Circle or Xapo, or on any other service that holds your private keys for you, you may or may not eventually receive coins on both ends of the chain. Several exchanges have so far suggested you may but have made no guarantees. And at least one exchange, GDAX, has explicitly indicated you may not.
If you're using any of these kinds of services to store your bitcoins, you need to create your own wallet. Send your bitcoins to this new wallet; this wallet now holds your private keys.
What kind of wallet you want to use is up to you. That said, here are some basic solutions:
If you don't care about transacting with either BTC or BTU anytime soon, and really just want to keep both as a long-term investment, printing your private keys on a paper wallet is one option. This option, however, is only really secure if you follow strict security precautions, which you can find here .
An even better option is to get a hardware wallet. Any of the hardware wallets listed on bitcoin.org will keep your private keys secure. One hardware wallet provider in particular, Trezor , has explicitly acknowledged that users will have access to their coins on both ends of the chain if a coin-split happens.
Regular wallets are about as secure as your computer (or phone) is. Since most computers and phones are not all that secure, these are not ideal for large amounts. With that in mind, all mobile wallets and desktop wallets listed on bitcoin.org will store your private keys for you. Additionally, a full node like Bitcoin Core or Bitcoin Knots gives you a little extra security during a coin-split, as you'll see below.
In any case: Make sure you make backups of your keys! Most wallets require you to do this when installing; don't skip this step.
During the Coin-Split
If Bitcoin Unlimited forks, things could get messy for anywhere between a couple of hours to a couple of days, or longer.
Unfortunately, Bitcoin Unlimited currently does not include "replay protection." This means that post-fork, transactions on both sides of the fork will look identical. If a transaction is picked up by both networks - for example, because the receiver of a transaction re-transmits the transaction on the other network - that transaction may be valid on both chains. This is called a "replay attack."
As such, spending coins on one end of the chain could make you accidentally spend the equivalent coin on the other side of the chain. Instead of paying someone only BTC, you may unintentionally send BTU as well - or vice versa. This is how the BTCs and BTUs are "stuck together."
The best way to prevent replay attacks is simple: do not send any transactions. Not until it is clearer to everyone what the post-fork situation looks like.
If you use Bitcoin Core or Bitcoin Knots as a wallet and you want to accept BTC, that should still be fine. (Someone who didn't read this article may accidentally send you the equivalent in BTU, though. If this happens, you should probably return the funds later on.)
Bitcoin Unlimited, on the other hand, does not include "wipeout protection." If the amount of mining power on the BTC chain ever overtakes the BTU chain, the entire BTU chain will be discarded (unless users on the BTU chain coordinate fast enough to prevent this in unconventional ways).
Unless and until it is absolutely clear that Bitcoin Unlimited emerges as a definitive winner forever, accepting any BTU is very risky, and you probably shouldn't do it at all.
After the Coin-Split
If both chains survive, and you control your private keys, you will have coins on both sides of the fork. But as mentioned, it will be tricky to spend coins on one chain without accidentally spending the equivalent on the other side.
Fortunately, there are ways to avoid these replay attacks. The most straightforward solution requires brand-new coins, mined after the split. These new coins are the only coins that do not exist on both chains and cannot, therefore, be spent on both. Combining these new coins with old coins effectively splits the BTC from BTU.
This coin-splitting can, and probably will, be a bit complex. But some exchanges will likely set up coin-splitting services and take care of most of the complexity behind the screens. You'd just need to send your bitcoins to an exchange, and the exchange will credit your account with BTC and BTU. (They should even replay the transaction for you, to make sure they indeed receive both your coins and can split them for you.) If you want, you can now also sell your BTU for BTC (or USD), or the other way round.
There may also be other solutions to split your coins in the event of a coin-split, perhaps even trustless solutions. But that remains to be seen.
After the split, there will probably be wallets for both coins soon enough. Of course, you may need to upgrade your existing wallet or download a new wallet if and when this happens. This also remains to be seen.
Further specifics on what to do after a coin-split will be announced on Bitcoin Magazine (and most likely on bitcoin.org and other sources of information) if and when a coin-split occurs and we have a better understanding of the post-fork situation. 

Oh, and when you, years from now, want to use the funds stored on your paper wallet, don't forget you now own both BTC and BTU! (Wallets like Electrum and Blockchain allow you to upload the private keys, and you'll probably need to go through the same splitting ceremony.)
If only one chain survives, operations should continue at some point. However, it's not exactly clear what this post-fork landscape will look like. Perhaps you'll have to upgrade your wallet. This will also be announced on Bitcoin Magazine if and when it comes to it.
If neither chain survives, the Bitcoin experiment has failed, and your private keys will probably be worthless.
So, to Recap ...
1. Control your private keys.
2. To be on the safe side, avoid any transactions shortly after the split.
3. As the dust settles, split your coins. How, exactly, will depend on Bitcoin's post-fork landscape.



The views and opinions expressed herein are the views and opinions of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of Nasdaq, Inc.

Read more: http://www.nasdaq.com/article/a-beginners-guide-to-surviving-a-coin-split-cm764421#ixzz4cHXnFmGX