New FinCEN regulations afecting US hosting for miners?

suryc

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Play2Live pre-sale starts on January 25th

Quote from: villex on June 16, 2013, 06:51:48 PM

So, can you tell me how this services are going to pay their expenses?
I'm guessing the electric company and ISP doesn't accept BTC

Don't know if I understand your question/concern.
There is no problem if you convert bitcoin through an exchanger that is registered as an MSB (i.e. bitinstant)

Alternatively, miners can still sell all the bitcoin they want directly to people even if they don't go through a registered exchange. Just requires registration as an MSB which is not such a big of a deal as people make it out to be.

villex

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Mining hardware assembler and administrator.

Quote from: suryc on June 16, 2013, 05:48:22 PM

Quote from: sergio on June 16, 2013, 05:38:49 PM

The way I read it is as long as you don't sell the bitcoins for dollars you are fine and if you must sell bitcoins for dollars do not use an exchange registered with fincen. Using bitcoins to make purchases seem to be ok. As far as mining there is p2pool which is decentralized.

Correct. Miners are only regulated and required to register as MSB if they sell there btcs to people for fiat.
No regulation if you just spend btc that you mine or if you go through an exchange (that is registered as an MSB).

Also, there are already numerous threads on this topic:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fincens-new-definition-of-money-services-businesses-30152
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fincen-says-you-must-be-msb-if-you-sell-bitcoins-for-119123
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/definition-of-msb-fincen-questions-for-a-bitcoin-startup-213297
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=77194.20
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fincen-responds-to-clarification-requests-155556
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fincen-guidance-issuedmarch-18-2013-fin-2013-g001-218397

Is it really so hard to do a quick search before starting a new thread?

So, can you tell me how this services are going to pay their expenses?
I'm guessing the electric company and ISP doesn't accept BTC

suryc

sr. member

Activity: 298

Merit: 250

Play2Live pre-sale starts on January 25th

Quote from: sergio on June 16, 2013, 05:38:49 PM

The way I read it is as long as you don't sell the bitcoins for dollars you are fine and if you must sell bitcoins for dollars do not use an exchange registered with fincen. Using bitcoins to make purchases seem to be ok. As far as mining there is p2pool which is decentralized.

Correct. Miners are only regulated and required to register as MSB if they sell there btcs to people for fiat.
No regulation if you just spend btc that you mine or if you go through an exchange (that is registered as an MSB).

Also, there are already numerous threads on this topic:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fincens-new-definition-of-money-services-businesses-30152
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fincen-says-you-must-be-msb-if-you-sell-bitcoins-for-119123
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/definition-of-msb-fincen-questions-for-a-bitcoin-startup-213297
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=77194.20
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fincen-responds-to-clarification-requests-155556
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fincen-guidance-issuedmarch-18-2013-fin-2013-g001-218397

Is it really so hard to do a quick search before starting a new thread?

sergio

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Activity: 313

Merit: 258

The way I read it is as long as you don't sell the bitcoins for dollars you are fine and if you must sell bitcoins for dollars do not use an exchange registered with fincen. Using bitcoins to make purchases seem to be ok. As far as mining there is p2pool which is decentralized.

firefop

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Activity: 420

Merit: 250

Well I read it - then printed it and read it again while marking it up for clarity.

Just couple of things I noticed:

Anyone who solo-mines isn't an administrator (but is a user).

Anyone who purchased a bitcoin then uses to to buy a good or service is a 'money transmitter'

Anyone who does escrow service is a 'money transmitter'

Mining pool ops are going to be administrators (although in the case of bitcoin the definition might fail because they are unable to remove/destroy currency once it's created).

~

To me this looks like setting up to fine the average bitcoin user who buys bitcoin off an exchange up for fines once they spend the bitcoin... along with attacking the pool ops in the same way when they allow miner to withdraw bitcoin.

~

I wonder what affect mining over tor would actually have on the network.

villex

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Activity: 154

Merit: 100

Mining hardware assembler and administrator.

I'm asking me this right now, according to this: http://www.fincen.gov/statutes_regs/guidance/html/FIN-2013-G001.html the new regulations of the FinCEN an "Administrator" or "a person engaged as a business in issuing (putting into circulation) a virtual currency, and who has the authority to redeem (to withdraw from circulation) such virtual currency", it will be a problem for the hosting services for miners?

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