Topic: Nvidia (Read 1131 times)

Bit of a conundrum isn't it?

How to get the most out of mining.  Mine alts and hold for long term value or sell short for Bitcoin. The latter has a larger tax liability but guaranteed profit. The former is cheaper on taxes and has potential for huge gains if you hold the right coin.  Could also get burned and hold the bag full of something totally worthless.

Interesting choices.

While I agree it sucks that cards  are expensive right now. Waiting a few months defeats the purpose of mining. The mining difficulty is ever increasing so you want to mine as much as you can today, for tomorrow’s increase in the coin. While the price today of mining indicates an ROI of longer than it will be to wait and save cash to buy the card, this has never been the way to get the most out of mining.

The one caveat to this is we have both a GPU shortage AND a market crash. You’re better off buying coin in this situation. If it was only a GPU shortage, then you were better off buying cards no matter the increase (to a certain extent).  For example, if you believe Ethereum will EVER reach 2k, why would anyone care to save $200 today? Makes no sense.

This announcement is just a drama towards Gamers. I don’t believe they really care as a business who buys and uses their graphic cards and for what. This is where they make a lot of money.

The first ones released will be blower cooler models.  Demand will be through the roof.  Prices high.

Good luck obtaining one.  You'll have to camp out and snipe cards as they get in stock.  Or compete with bots to get one.

Unless the crypto market goes further down and stays down for months.  Then it may be easier to  score a GPU.

For me it is a good move since the GPU market is solely been held by crypto miners which is not good for the target market of these products, though they manufacturers do not have the control of selling this card it is the distributors that should implements this. Although there are cards that were released for mining it seams like miners do not like it because of its warranty.

I've seen the same rumors - and they all seem to have ORIGINATED from a single source that was SPECULATING.

The only hard info at this time on Ampere out of NVidia is "the generation after Volta" - and there are comments from folks that ARE in the know (like TSMC) that indicate the next generation consumer cards WILL be Volta.

I would not expect to see actual Ampere hardware 'till somewhere in 2019 at the earliest.

Given the TSMC announcement about shifting production TO VOLTA GPUs "around the end of the year" I expect Volta to get announced in early Spring and possibly be available immediately, for at least the first higher-end models - though actual sales might be delayed a month or two after the announcement like Nvidia has done before, they HAVE to be feeling some pressure to get SOME high-end cards back in the market ASAP.



 Interesting thing, I'm starting to see some spotty availability improvements on the AMD side - but not on the Nvidia side so far.

The new Ampere cards will prolly be out in fall 2018. They wont make new 1080TIs and 1070TIs until then. The perfect time to sell your current cards would be in the beginning of June. The demand will be highest, and the supply will be lowest. No one will know the hashrate of the new cards, so its abit of a gamble. Will it be worth buying the new ones? It almost always is.

So now I'm hearing rumors that NVIDIA will skip the voltas and move on to the amperes.  What does this mean? Do you think they will be out in April?  I'm thinking it will be more like Fall 2018.

You can get NVidia cards at minimal markup - with a LOT of patience, or a willingness to "go small" on the GTX 1050 and 1050 ti models (which are NOT in short supply, still sell for LESS than MSRP in many cases, and use GPU chips made by Samsung as opposed to the GTX 1060 and up being TSMC made GPU chips IN VERY SHORT SUPPLY).

Looks like before new anounciation IMHO no sense to buy nvidia cards on x2 price:)will wait fee months:)

maybe not on their roadmap but it will inevitably have an impact on their pricing, when offer and demand are distorted like it is today, it will have an impact on pricing. If they do as if there was no difference for them (which might be the case), prices are likely to go up fast and stocks go down.

1 april.

They will produce as much as they project they can sell, no matter mining or not.
They earn on sold cards. Their profit is approx 2x on the cost for manufacture + the usual  other expenses r&d, etc.

Memory seems the bottleneck last years because nowadays it's used everywhere.

When will be new nvidia generation cards? May be they can produce more cards? Samsung is going to produce asics chips and new memory. This can solve gpu problems ?

Nvidia has 0 issues.  They were my #1 stock pick last year and their market cap has gone up 700% in the last yr.  You should look at the amount of patents they own mostly to do with VR and AI.  They are no worried about some of their video cards mining crypto.

It's called Gaming market for the gpu companies. Its more than 200 million gamers.
The fact people can mine is coincidence.

I don't see mining having ANY effect on their roadmap as such.
Support for efforts to create mining-specific cards from their existing GPUs, sure - but the mining market is to VARIABLE to plan a roadmap around for a GPU company.

what I'm wondering is how much the mining hype has influenced their roadmap. If they indeed plan to release new models, the whole price & demand ratio is out of proportion. Will they release something based on their initial plan or will it follow the same inflation but from the start? If they want to make gamers happy, they should release cards at a normal price but if those cards are good at mining, it will spin out of control again.

AMD is concentrating on Bristol Ridge and second-gen Ryzen this year, they've stated they don't plan any new discrete GPU indroductions in 2018.

Nvidia - I anticipate their GTC confrence in late March will see Volta announced (same as Pascal 2 years back), not sure on availability but they can't AFFORD to delay Volta consumer cards very long unless they're going to ramp Pascal back up for a short bit to tide folks through.
The initial release will be Founder Edition cards, dunno how long it will be 'till 3'd party Volta cards show up (in THEORY it could be same timeframe, but past experience suggests "couple weeks to a month delay after the FE version of a particular GPU shows up" is more likely.
I would guess that pricing will be at least 10% higher on MSRP than Pascal cards if only due to the increase in RAM pricing in 2017 - and won't be shocked at a 15-20% jump in some cases.

ETH - will be around a while longer as mineable, but I can't find firm information on the current "anticipated timeline" for Casper introduction. Probably a year more or less at least to go.

The Titan Xp "Star Wars" cards were in stock 'till Friday or Saturday last week, then Nvidia made some "regular" Titan Xp cards available early this week - but those seem to have dried up already.

Titans are pretty close to the 1080 ti on mining - the 1080 ti is basically 11/12ths of a Titan Xp across the board after all.

They're Founder Edition designs, so they should have pretty much the same thermal curve as the 180 ti FE cards.

Based on the Titan V benchmarks, I'm anticipating 20-30% performance jump over the "equivalent" Pascal cards at the same power consumption, or some mix of "lower power" + "not as much performance gain".
Might vary with the specific model, and they might not try to "match" the Pascal models with the new models - if nothing else, they need to CHANGE that deceptive 1060 naming where the 3GB card is NOT the same GPU as the 6GB card (it's a cut-down version, one CU disabled or some such).

More or less similar to 1080ti
Cooling is blower so probably hotter.

Titans were out of stock too recently 

How are the titans for mining?  Is it worth it at this point to pick one up or are some of the cheaper cards better at their price point.  Anyone also know how hot the titans run while mining?

2018 is a bad year for nvidia, they cant meet their customers demands, their customers being gamers...

And as has been said countless times, don't expect the cards that debut initially to have the greatest cooling solutions that you get with a mature product like the 1070 ti.

10-15% more vs Pascals....probably. Who knows for sure.
the question you should ask is what performance % increase will be.  My guess - big (not saying big for mining, but big as card performance).  But we would see.

Titans and Volta current one are different kind of beasts.
Different customer base by design. They are not mass- adopted GPUs.  Usually mid levels and low high levels are the mass production.  i.e. 1060, 1070s.

any idea what thesw voltas will cost?  will the increase in the price match or exceed the increase in effectiveness?  those are the important questions to answer.  if not, then x1070s will still be better to mine with than a volta.  


kind of like the titan situation right now.

My guess is similar dates for Nvidia  - possible news sometime around end March or even April, with cards available may be May-June.
What is interesting for me is what AMD is planning. Its all quiet lately with the change in their tech department.
It would be pretty bad if ETH is gone for all the milions of AMDs, given the fact cryptonight is not that interesting lately as well. 

ETH was profitable TWO YEARS AGO when it was still low double-digit pricing - if you had low electric cost and didn't pay a ton for your GPUs.

It had a lot lower diff at the time.

it is profitable if you can get a decent price for GPUs and have low power costs. I started 8 months ago while ETH was still around 200$, it was already profitable at that time but return on investment for the hardware was longer. Now it's way more profitable than 8 months ago.

My best estimate is that Nvidia will "announce" the first Volta Consumer cards at their GTC event in late March, availability is looking more and more likely to be "immediate" at that point but MIGHT be delayed 'till April.

No idea how long it will take for their "stockpile" to deplete after that - TSMC should have been making GPUs for the last month for them per their announcement from October, but the current extreme shortage on Pascal parts indicates they are going to have a TON of sale pressure when they show up for sale.

Nvidia plans to bring us the Voltas soon, how soon I don't know but they will make a big difference in mining as their memory will be a GDDR6 which will be a really big improvement over current GDDR5 memory, kinda like the GDDR5 was to GDDR3.

It shouldn't take 2 years to test the PoS system - I'd bet on 6 months possibly less.
Isn't the first stage "1% POS" supposed to deploy in the next month or so?
Or did it get delayed AGAIN?

They keep saying that but even the first stage is hybrid POS and so miners are still needed for at least two years to test and vette that system

and the main factor you must take into account is that if the Ethereum team can deliver a scalable POS system that is faster than POW ( thier stated goal) Eth tokens will be worth far far more than they are now

so you could mine for the next 2 years and hold alot of coins and make alot of $$ long term in any case.

It is amazing that you mention these cards because I just saw them being sold on ebay yesterday and asked the seller what cards are they more likely to resemble in performance.
He didn't seem to know and just randomly spurted out some card models which were from the range of 1050-1080.
I found that quite hilarious.

 The profitability train is going to run into a major wreck called "Ethereum move to Proof of Stake" at some point, currently intended for late this year IIRC.

 Gonna be a BIG shakeout when that happens, since there are more cards mining Ethereum THAN ALL OTHER COINS COMBINED and that huge hoard of GPUs is all going to be looking for new homes at the SAME time.

Nobody knows how long it will last and there may be another huge crash and sale of cards followed up by a period of time where not much happens.  Then suddenly the market blows up again and we're back here talking about the same thing for the third time.

I agree with Travis.  I'm a computer hobbyist and part time gamer primarily and I completely understand people being upset that the miners hoard everything and hog it all to themselves.  It's not easy to get anything at msrp or close to it without putting some effort into it.  Takes patience, knowledge, and luck to find something and get it before another person jumps in and gets it.

They are probably right not to do anything about it, I'm not sure mining as we know it today will still exist in one or two years. The model is not viable, wasting so much electricity is not something sustainable on the longer run. Like you wrote earlier, there will be one day where the second hand market will be flooded with gpus used for mining because nobody will want those cards anymore, price will strongly go down and only those willing to buy second hand mining cards will be happy. Sellers and manufacturers will both lose something in that game.

 They're worried about LONG TERM profitability vs short term spike then long term DUMP.

Holy cow.....not releasing any card for a whole year sounds like business suicide....unbelievable!

Lmao not our fault they're too closed-minded to see the profitability. This trains not stopping for anyone. Mine on.

 They don't, and both Nvidia AND AMD have made comments about being worried that the current "mining demand" will lead to a major glut of used cards somewhere soon down the road, killing their sales and profitability when it happens for months if not years.

 With that said, they probably CAN'T ramp their production up enough to meet the full demand right now, due to limits of the foundries on 14/16nm production and them ALREADY being swamped with folks wanting chips on the current node.

 That seems to be the NVidia 3'd party makers, NOT Nvidia itself, pushing those.
 The P104 is a GTX 1070 GPU set up with GDDR5x instead of the normal GDDR5, and some BIOS changes to make it work better with the different RAM.

They probably don't believe in mining on the longer run. Designing new cards takes months if not years, creating a specific product line for mining is an investment for them and they don't seem to be in a hurry to enter that market. There probably also a question of production capacity, mining is driven by euphoria and you can't match your production capacity to euphoria.

They definitely could raise the price of their products, and the miners can thank the gamers that they dont.  If they were focusing on miners you can be sure the price would follow the price of bitcoin (profits possible) the way asics do.

As far as I know, they didn't say that they are going to limit GPUs that are being sold to miners. They only admitted that a lot of GPUs are being bought by people who want to use them only for mining. How would they know that someone will be mining? What if someone runs a shop which sells multi-GPU gaming setups? They can't, that's why it doesn't bother them. Probably they are content because the demand is huge, supplies are low so they can't rise the price of their products.

Being a gamer I totally understand the frustration. . . Nothing like wanting to upgrade to a shiny new gpu so you can play your games in 4k, or play VR (or whatever) to find you are going to pay 2x+ msrp because miners are buying them all up as soon as they hit the shelves/sites.

I get that Ill get hate for saying that here, but anyone that is even slightly capable of empathy should see my point...  As far as nvidia feeling that way, good for them. Gamers made them the company they are and will be buying gpu's long after miners will be Id be willing to bet.

It is possible

They already have started a 100% mining dedicated solution. There is the cheaper version the Nvidia GP106 which is based on Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB version and the more expensive version the Nvidia GP104 which is some sort of near GTX 1080 and is excellent for mining. This latest card have come out only lately.

Yes they are limiting the purchase of GPU to miners because the stocks for the gamers are getting out of no where. It's designed for gaming not for mining. But, it's capable  for mining.most likely what would happen is they would askyou if you're buying a bulk set of GPU's. Asic miners are the real deal when it comes to mining cryptoes not GPU.

It is not hashcash mining.  It are many other mining hashes that are not implemented on asics.  There, GPU is king.

Actually, NVIDIA is not against crypto mining.  They have different markets, and sell similar products at different prices in those markets.  Essentially, they sell to gamers, to computer scientists (deep learning) and data centers.  Their problem is that the gamer products are in fact quality/price much better (Geforce) than their high-end Tesla products.  For less than $1000, you have a high-end Geforce, while you have to pay an order of magnitude more for a a Tesla component for professional use.  At a certain point, they had forbidden their Geforce to be bought by data centers, but they had made an exception for amateur cryptocurrencies.  Now, they have also to exclude this category.  They'd like you to buy Teslas.

New technology has come to light. Probably you heard of Antminer S9 and S7. Your GPU is not considered as the best machine for mining. You can say this could be reason behind the act of nVIDIA. I believe Nvidia is moving on, not leaving behind.

Nvidia is in a good position to do something in the market the way it is right now with alot of people who are selling their cards for maximum profits for what their company is selling them for.

AMD said they will not be releasing another model of card until 2019!
So one whole year without another 6XX model from them for the entire year.

Atleast they see they are losing alot from those people who are buying up all the stock and hording these cards and selling them for upto 6x as much as they price were upon release.

For example. I saw one ebayer selling their 560rx for $1200.
Those cards are not really that good but people are telling others to buy up whatever card that came out within the past 7-9 months and you can be getting that money back with mining within 5-6 months, which is a complete and utter lie.
You can not make that much with one of those cards.
Maybe a 1080ti which they were selling for that same price ($1200) just when the 1070ti were coming out and cards were not as rare as they are now to see on store shelves.

Because the gamers are getting pissed off at miners hoarding all the graphic card for themselves. Nvidia created these GPU's for gaming, not to mine shitcoins, so they are getting tired of it and will now demand that you are not a miner.

I find it kinda sad that they want to control this tho, anyone should be able to buy their product for any reason, but it seems it's having an impact on their business model.


I think they should start a 100% mining dedicated solution and they would make a lot of sales and leave common GPU's for gaming.

What do you think about that nVidia wants to limit gpu sales to miners? Why are they moving on?