NY BITCOIN LICENSE REGULATIONS ARE HERE

Hyena

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Quote from: becoin on July 21, 2014, 02:58:50 AM

Quote from: GrandmaJean on July 20, 2014, 03:45:47 PM

The regulations are to make it so we don't have an exchange operator lose all of their customers' bitcoin

This is not necessary. Leave it to market!

Forget about regulating something you've no control of. You don't have the bitcoin printing press! Bitcoin is not fiat money. It can't be printed at will of any government. If exchanges are regulated and even then they lose customers' bitcoins how will you compensate their customers? You can't "print" more bitcoins just like you can't "print" more gold or silver.

I'd like to see them regulating friend-to-friend trading.

becoin

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Quote from: GrandmaJean on July 20, 2014, 03:45:47 PM

The regulations are to make it so we don't have an exchange operator lose all of their customers' bitcoin

This is not necessary. Leave it to market!

Forget about regulating something you've no control of. You don't have the bitcoin printing press! Bitcoin is not fiat money. It can't be printed at will of any government. If exchanges are regulated and even then they lose customers' bitcoins how will you compensate their customers? You can't "print" more bitcoins just like you can't "print" more gold or silver.

GrandmaJean

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Quote from: RodeoX on July 18, 2014, 12:26:24 PM

I think we should have gotten a better deal. Some of the rules are going to be difficult to implement for basic users. It is starting to look like NYC is out of the running as a financial leader in the future. Let's hope other states make far better decisions or America may loose it's edge as a bitcoin friendly country.

the license really only applies to exchanges and businesses that act as exchanges so it will not affect most bitcoin related businesses. The regulations are to make it so we don't have an exchange operator lose all of their customers' bitcoin

Tzupy

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http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/proposed-bitcoin-regulation-bitlicense-shut-mining-bitcoin-businesses-us/2014/07/20

RodeoX

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The revolution will be monetized!

I think we should have gotten a better deal. Some of the rules are going to be difficult to implement for basic users. It is starting to look like NYC is out of the running as a financial leader in the future. Let's hope other states make far better decisions or America may loose it's edge as a bitcoin friendly country.

becoin

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Quote from: Ibian on July 18, 2014, 11:37:19 AM

Well, it's happening.

What is happening?

T.Stuart

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One Token to Move Anything Anywhere

Quote from: ?? on ??

sweet, time for my domains to go to the moon!!!!

NEWYORKBITCOINLICENSE.COM
NEWYORKBITLICENSE.COM
NEWYORKBITLICENSES.COM
NYBITCOINLICENSE.COM
NYBITLICENSE.COM
NYBITLICENSES.COM

... And you to get charged with cybersquatting by NYC! Grin

Ibian

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Quote from: becoin on July 18, 2014, 10:41:57 AM

Quote from: Ibian on July 18, 2014, 09:39:21 AM

The reality is, first, that regulation was going to happen.

The reality is, first, bitcoin can't be regulated. And, second, if it can then bitcoin price will drop to zero and another better crypto coin that can't be regulated will emerge from the dark unregulated Internet.

99% of the value of bitcoin comes from the fact it can't be regulated. So, if it gets regulated then bye bye bitcoin and hello darkcoin! Simple as that.

Well, it's happening. Would you like to sell me all your bitcoins for the generous price of zero?

Raystonn

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I think of the regulations as a bait and switch. Fiat needs a central authority. Bitcoin does not. So Bitcoin can survive without following regulations. We will cooperate with the regulations to get global adoption. Once that happens, the world will tell the U.S. to go to hell, and the U.S. will have no recourse.

Torque

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Quote from: Ibian on July 18, 2014, 09:39:21 AM

Quote

http://moneyandstate.com/reflections-right-privacy-response-nydfs-bitcoin-proposal/

Got around to reading this just now. Not super impressed. The reality is, first, that regulation was going to happen. No way around this and hopefully he is smart enough to know this, and if so, it amounts to little more than whining. Second, that those of us who want our coins to be anonymous have the ability to do so. And perhaps, third, that yes Satoshi would be locked up for life or simply killed by our great leaders if he stepped forward, unless he happens to be working for them.

People can whine all they want about the NY reg proposal. But the only people whining are bitcoin users, not NY-based bitcoin companies:

http://internet.itbusinessnet.com/article/itBit-To-Comply-With-NY-DFS-BitLicense-Regulatory-Guidelines-3389846

becoin

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Quote from: Ibian on July 18, 2014, 09:39:21 AM

The reality is, first, that regulation was going to happen.

The reality is, first, bitcoin can't be regulated. And, second, if it can then bitcoin price will drop to zero and another better crypto coin that can't be regulated will emerge from the dark unregulated Internet.

99% of the value of bitcoin comes from the fact it can't be regulated. So, if it gets regulated then bye bye bitcoin and hello darkcoin! Simple as that.

Ibian

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Quote

http://moneyandstate.com/reflections-right-privacy-response-nydfs-bitcoin-proposal/

Got around to reading this just now. Not super impressed. The reality is, first, that regulation was going to happen. No way around this and hopefully he is smart enough to know this, and if so, it amounts to little more than whining. Second, that those of us who want our coins to be anonymous have the ability to do so. And perhaps, third, that yes Satoshi would be locked up for life or simply killed by our great leaders if he stepped forward, unless he happens to be working for them.

becoin

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Quote from: Bagatell on July 18, 2014, 06:04:10 AM

Excellent piece. The best response I've seen.

yep, very good one.

The parody can be summed up in one sentence. The consumer is forced to accept government protection and pay the corresponding price even if he/she doesn't want to! Pay for my protection or you'll lose all you have and this is an offer you can't refuse.

Quote

Racket (crime)

A racket is a service that is fraudulently offered to solve a problem, such as for a problem that does not actually exist, will not be affected, or would not otherwise exist. Conducting a racket is racketeering.[1] Particularly, the potential problem may be caused by the same party that offers to solve it, although that fact may be concealed, with the specific intent to engender continual patronage for this party. A prototype is the protection racket, wherein a person or group indicates that they could protect a store from potential damage, damage that the same person or group would otherwise inflict, while the correlation of threat and protection may be more or less deniably veiled, distinguishing it from the more direct act of extortion.

Bagatell

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Quote from: tabnloz on July 17, 2014, 08:29:00 PM

Having just read Erik Vorhees' article on BitLicences it seems like they are attempting to track users worldwide.

An ewallet provider will require photo ID, address etc worldwide, for example.

Doesn't seem feasible.

Hopefully industry leaders can change these features in the 45 day window.

http://moneyandstate.com/reflections-right-privacy-response-nydfs-bitcoin-proposal/

Excellent piece. The best response I've seen.

GangkisKhan

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Quote from: minerpumpkin on July 17, 2014, 08:42:07 PM

Regulation = Acceptance by the state. We need this in order for big investors/institutional money to really start flowing. Many just aren't willing to jump through all the hoops in order to buy BTC.

Small players will slowly be price out of the game.

minerpumpkin

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A pumpkin mines 27 hours a night

Regulation = Acceptance by the state. We need this in order for big investors/institutional money to really start flowing. Many just aren't willing to jump through all the hoops in order to buy BTC.

tabnloz

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Having just read Erik Vorhees' article on BitLicences it seems like they are attempting to track users worldwide.

An ewallet provider will require photo ID, address etc worldwide, for example.

Doesn't seem feasible.

Hopefully industry leaders can change these features in the 45 day window.

http://moneyandstate.com/reflections-right-privacy-response-nydfs-bitcoin-proposal/

Raystonn

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Same regulations we've had forever for all financial institutions. Abandoned accounts go to the State, where they can be reclaimed by the owner. This only affects funds (Bitcoin included) kept in a financial institution, such as an exchange or bank.

Ibian

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Quote from: alexeft on July 17, 2014, 01:51:24 PM

Quote from: BitchicksHusband on July 17, 2014, 01:37:40 PM

Quote from: alexeft on July 17, 2014, 01:22:27 PM

Since I didn't really read the thing, does it really say that bitcoins that haven't moved for 5 years become the property of the state? Exactly how is that supposed to happen?

You open a Coinbase account. You have bitcoins on there. You don't touch them for 5 years. The government forces Coinbase to follow their existing escheatment laws and send them the money (assuming you are a resident of NY). This already happens with your bank accounts. I had one with a few bucks in it that I hadn't used for years. They sent me a letter that said in 60 days they were sending it to the state. I had to call and "reset the clock".

Obviously, nobody can seize bitcoins that you hold yourself.

Hmmm, I see! I think that's not bad! We should be using the blockchain instead of eg goxcoins, ious and whatnot!

How is that not bad?

alexeft

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Quote from: BitchicksHusband on July 17, 2014, 01:37:40 PM

Quote from: alexeft on July 17, 2014, 01:22:27 PM

Since I didn't really read the thing, does it really say that bitcoins that haven't moved for 5 years become the property of the state? Exactly how is that supposed to happen?

You open a Coinbase account. You have bitcoins on there. You don't touch them for 5 years. The government forces Coinbase to follow their existing escheatment laws and send them the money (assuming you are a resident of NY). This already happens with your bank accounts. I had one with a few bucks in it that I hadn't used for years. They sent me a letter that said in 60 days they were sending it to the state. I had to call and "reset the clock".

Obviously, nobody can seize bitcoins that you hold yourself.

Hmmm, I see! I think that's not bad! We should be using the blockchain instead of eg goxcoins, ious and whatnot!

BitchicksHusband

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Quote from: alexeft on July 17, 2014, 01:22:27 PM

Since I didn't really read the thing, does it really say that bitcoins that haven't moved for 5 years become the property of the state? Exactly how is that supposed to happen?

You open a Coinbase account. You have bitcoins on there. You don't touch them for 5 years. The government forces Coinbase to follow their existing escheatment laws and send them the money (assuming you are a resident of NY). This already happens with your bank accounts. I had one with a few bucks in it that I hadn't used for years. They sent me a letter that said in 60 days they were sending it to the state. I had to call and "reset the clock".

Obviously, nobody can seize bitcoins that you hold yourself.

Hunyadi

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☑ ♟ ☐ ♚

Quote from: elux on July 17, 2014, 09:54:50 AM

Quote from: theonewhowaskazu on July 17, 2014, 09:49:21 AM

This changes nothing. Only news is that we might be on the news, lol.

History will prove you wrong, friend.

This changes the game... for... who? Businesses and financial institutions in the world's #1 financial hub.

This means existing financial entities are getting the necessary go-ahead from regulators.

This means they are getting an onboarding path for working with Bitcoin.

This means Financial technology startups are going to base out of New York instead of California.

Less than a year ago, before the senate hearings, Bitcoin being effectively outlawed in the United States was totally plausible.

And now look where we are...

Maybe nothing changes to you, right now, but in the big picture of things, this is as crucial as it gets.

+1

This is very good news for the Wallstreet.

alexeft

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Since I didn't really read the thing, does it really say that bitcoins that haven't moved for 5 years become the property of the state? Exactly how is that supposed to happen?

the_sunship

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They are trying to take bitcoin out of the "dark web". Not sure it will work since we have mixers and dark wallet, for example. If it gives bitcoin more legitimacy for billion dollar investment types, I don't think it's a bad thing. Users who want anonymous transactions with bitcoin will find a way. The state has to at least pretend it can do something about it.

Lawsky seems to really like bitcoin, so I think some compromises with the community will be forthcoming.

notme

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Quote from: jl2012 on July 17, 2014, 10:03:02 AM

Quote from: RodeoX on July 17, 2014, 09:14:06 AM

You can't show us a little of what your link is? I don't click on random pdf files.

It's a .gov site.

Right, because we should trust every government employee that can upload to a webserver Roll Eyes

.

Do you have any idea how many government workers there are out there who know nothing about computer security? Even without a malicious actor, the PDF could become infected if the producer's PC was infected. As someone who did tech support for many government entities back in the day, I can assure you that government workers frequently manage to infect their computers. Trusting it just because it is from a .gov site is foolish.

Hyena

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Quote from: ?? on ??

sweet, time for my domains to go to the moon!!!!

NEWYORKBITCOINLICENSE.COM
NEWYORKBITLICENSE.COM
NEWYORKBITLICENSES.COM
NYBITCOINLICENSE.COM
NYBITLICENSE.COM
NYBITLICENSES.COM

wtf? why would such domain names be of any value?

alex0909

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Quote from: elux on July 17, 2014, 10:05:18 AM

Quote from: jl2012 on July 17, 2014, 10:03:02 AM

Quote from: RodeoX on July 17, 2014, 09:14:06 AM

You can't show us a little of what your link is? I don't click on random pdf files.

It's a .gov site.

*puts on tinfoil hat*

...Exactly.

I see what you did here Grin

Bullish news, but not sure if it will have a great impact

JimNastics

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Quote from: elux on July 17, 2014, 09:54:50 AM

History will prove you wrong, friend.

This changes the game... for... who? Businesses and financial institutions in the world's #1 financial hub.

What's this got to do with London?

elux

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Quote from: jl2012 on July 17, 2014, 10:03:02 AM

Quote from: RodeoX on July 17, 2014, 09:14:06 AM

You can't show us a little of what your link is? I don't click on random pdf files.

It's a .gov site.

*puts on tinfoil hat*

...Exactly.

jl2012

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Quote from: dgarcia on July 17, 2014, 09:47:08 AM

Quote from: Ibian on July 17, 2014, 09:42:53 AM

Notice to bears: This Is Actually Good News™.

To bears, to bulls. To cowboys and to indians:

It's nothing more than as expected. Neutral.

Nodding, next news pls.

It's not over-regulated, so it's bullish

jl2012

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Quote from: RodeoX on July 17, 2014, 09:14:06 AM

You can't show us a little of what your link is? I don't click on random pdf files.

It's a .gov site.

dgarcia

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Quote from: elux on July 17, 2014, 09:54:50 AM

Quote from: theonewhowaskazu on July 17, 2014, 09:49:21 AM

This changes nothing. Only news is that we might be on the news, lol.

History will prove you wrong. This changes the game for financial institutions in the world's #1 financial hub.

Financial technology startups are going to base out of New York instead of Silicon Valley or Frankfurt, or London, or...

Maybe that's right, but is this news more than what was already expected? In the longer term this could realy matter by the further progress of adoption and development ...

...but for now? Nothing.

dgarcia

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Quote from: Torque on July 17, 2014, 09:54:23 AM

Quote from: theonewhowaskazu on July 17, 2014, 09:49:21 AM

This changes nothing. Only news is that we might be on the news, lol.

No, say it ain't so! According to everyone, this news and looming ETF news was supposed to take us to the moon!!

Is this not the same as with all news?

elux

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Quote from: theonewhowaskazu on July 17, 2014, 09:49:21 AM

This changes nothing. Only news is that we might be on the news, lol.

History will prove you wrong, friend.

This changes the game... for... who? Businesses and financial institutions in the world's #1 financial hub.

This means existing financial entities are getting the necessary go-ahead from regulators.

This means they are getting an onboarding path for working with Bitcoin.

This means Financial technology startups are going to base out of New York instead of California.

Less than a year ago, before the senate hearings, Bitcoin being effectively outlawed in the United States was totally plausible.

And now look where we are...

Maybe nothing changes to you, right now, but in the big picture of things, this is as crucial as it gets.

Torque

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Activity: 3794

Merit: 5474

Quote from: theonewhowaskazu on July 17, 2014, 09:49:21 AM

This changes nothing. Only news is that we might be on the news, lol.

No, say it ain't so! According to everyone, this news and looming ETF news was supposed to take us to the moon!!

theonewhowaskazu

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This changes nothing. Only news is that we might be on the news, lol.

dgarcia

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Activity: 140

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Quote from: Ibian on July 17, 2014, 09:42:53 AM

Notice to bears: This Is Actually Good News™.

To bears, to bulls. To cowboys and to indians:

It's nothing more than as expected. Neutral.

Nodding, next news pls.

Ibian

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Notice to bears: This Is Actually Good News™.

JimNastics

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45 day comment period, which will go by in no time. After then, any thoughts how long until the regs are in play?

wingsfan23

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Everything looks pretty standard. I don't really like this section however, and I'm not sure how it can be enforced...

Records of Virtual Currency transactions.
Each Licensee shall maintain the following information for all transactions involving the payment, receipt, exchange or conversion, purchase, sale, transfer, or transmission of Virtual Currency: the identity and physical addresses of the parties involved, the amount or value of the transaction, including in what denomination purchased, sold, or transferred, the method of payment, the date(s) on which the transaction was initiated and completed, and a description of the transaction.

Freenhult

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★ BitClave ICO. Join NOW ★

Quote from: becoin on July 17, 2014, 09:23:13 AM

Quote

Superintendent Lawsky said: “We recognize that – as the first state to put forward specially tailored rules for virtual currency firms – continued public feedback will be an important part of finalizing this regulatory framework. We look forward to carefully and thoughtfully reviewing public comments on our proposal.”

What is the definition for a virtual currency firm?

I'm not sure they really know what they are talking about 100%. Seems to me this should be implemented with Cash because that's pretty anonymous and has a diverse, rich history of money laundering. But we're not supposed to know that, so Thanks for regulating something else out of existence NY. We can only hope the neighboring states have wider arms because they'd benefit more now that NY is squeezing.

becoin

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Quote

Superintendent Lawsky said: “We recognize that – as the first state to put forward specially tailored rules for virtual currency firms – continued public feedback will be an important part of finalizing this regulatory framework. We look forward to carefully and thoughtfully reviewing public comments on our proposal.”

What is the definition for a virtual currency firm?

Quote

Receiving or transmitting virtual currency on behalf of consumers;

Every ISP should be a virtual currency company?

Torque

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Here's the press release:

http://www.dfs.ny.gov/about/press2014/pr1407171.html

RodeoX

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The revolution will be monetized!

You can't show us a little of what your link is? I don't click on random pdf files.

yomofo

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http://www.dfs.ny.gov/about/press2014/pr1407171-vc.pdf

Topic: NY BITCOIN LICENSE REGULATIONS ARE HERE (Read 3480 times)