Topic: Once China fully realizes it has been betrayed... (Read 5023 times)

Meh...I have been using Bitcoin for years but have been speculating with it for not much more than 3 weeks or so......although I have missed the glittering opportunity that most of the rest of you have experienced, I have done pretty well so far....up about £5K - £7K...hard to keep track of exactly how much and of course, I have had some bad trades and there is plenty opportunity yet, for these gains to be reversed and turn into body numbing losses, especially now that I am gambling in a clear and undisputable bear market.

Your post sounded like you were projecting China as some kind of hero that was going to come and save Bitcoin, but in reality, it is the Chinese market that is bringing Bitcoin down.

What you say about BTC 'precipitating' the end game makes you sound like a Bitcoin fundamentalist. Fundamentalistic thought, always leads it's bearers up dead end alleys.

Thats good. I hope you do well in whatever trade(s) you make, and are able to get out/in at the right moment. I am envious of those that are successful trading, I hear lots of stories about how much people made. I made a few good trades in my time, but I made more losses. Its funny you don't hear so much about people's losses.

China's currency may indeed be pegged to the dollar, much as every currency is. I think that kind of misses the point that the amount of *money* China has isn't actually affected by US shenanigans. When all is said and done, the great fiat currency experiment will see winners and losers. When the 'war' is finished, I think those on the losing side will find little comfort in the battles they won.

I see BTC as a part of the experiment. In fact I see it as precipitating the endgame. I might be wrong, but if I am the risk to me is tiny. If I am right the reward is high.

More importantly, if you position yourself on the other side of the argument, your risk reward ratio is transposed. I've been around long enough to know that high risk for little reward is not a good bet.

China, in order to keep its industry competitive, has pegged its currency to the dollar which broadly speaking means that every time Ben Barnanke or the US banks churn out a new dollar, China must churn out 8 new RMB. China has therefore imported the US's inflation problem or another way of looking at it, China has been accepting US funny money in exchange for real goods and services. Not smart!

However, since u think China is so smart, I will advise that BTC is cheaper now in China than anywhere else.

What do these 'smart' Chinamen know that us dumb westerners don't?

Oh yes, and market seems to be going the way that I am betting it will.

China is smarter than "the west". The reason they are all over BTC is because they understand what is happening to the global economy.

Whether bitcoin was invented by the legendary and mystical Satoshi Nakomoto, or is actually the work of some highly secret govt dept in the US that has delivered what it hopes will prevent the total collapse of the USD based currency ponzi. It matters not.

The fact remains the current system is unsustainable, bitcoin conceptually serves as a sound replacement (implementation details are incidental, but to date those details have been pretty goddamn bulletproof, still not the point). All that needs to happen is for the current economic wealth (as measured int he world reserve currency, the USD) to be transferred to bitcoin. Whilst the US govt knows it was fun being able to print money whilst it lasted, it is not *so* stupid as to see that its not really a sustainable model. It knows it needs a 'gold standard' but alas, all the gold is elsewhere so it can't just pet 'er in reverse. Instead its doing what it does best - printing money! Just this money is 'special'. It's actually a digital version of all that gold they once had.

So, when people argue that bitcoin isn't backed by anything, then saying "well neither is the USD" is missing the point.

Bitcoin *is* backed by the USD. The world's reserve currency. If USD is (was?) good as gold, then by extension, so is bitcoin. Sure it will be a easier to swallow once it gets fully recognised by the banking system, and is good for paying taxes etc but patience my children, we can't really expect that at this early stage in the game. As the wealth transfer progresses, these things will come to pass.

So this thread, is absolutely way off the mark. China hasn't *been betrayed* that is just typical western arrogance. Toake a dose in humility, China is once again pwning the rest of the world.

China is and always has been smart. China knows exactly what is going on. I don't see any news stories about how China doesn't have enough gold, is running the presses or is at risk of hyperinflation. Ask yourself why that is.

(Yeah i'm long. Wish I was longer).

+1 Agreed.

I like to add though, that in the past 5 years the U.S Federal reserve has been printing Trillions of U.S dollars.  The chart for the money printing now looks like a hockey stick.

So in the last 5 years, China has gotten really screwed by the U.S.A. 
China owns over 1 Trillion dollars of U.S Treasuries, and as the bankrupt U.S government prints more money, it puts itself further into debt heading toward default and eventually will not even be able to pay interest to investors/holders of U.S bonds/treasuries like China, Japan and Germany (3 largest holders of U.S debt).  So you see, it's not just China that is going to be screwed.

Think about it, if you bought bonds from a bank and the bank defaults and you lose your interest and principle (all your money) investment. Are you going to be happy?

That is why the world is the way it is today, because the U.S government spent tomorrows money today, and it got worst from president to president, they just wracked up the credit card with no intention to pay back.  This will eventually lead to "WAR". Why do you think the U.S is in middle east, why do you think tensions are rising between Japan and China.  A war is being instigated, trying to coax China into a war.

Any, how does all this relate to Bitcoins. 

Bitcoins is a store of value, similar to gold. This comparison has been made several times by finance writers.

The world's geo-political situation is getting worse, and if you can see the writing on the wall ... a United States major devaluation of the dollar or default is coming.  RESET.   This can lead to war and other bad economic events to happen. 

In an environment like that, what are people going to do?  Look towards history.

- People will use their money to buy things of value, because if the U.S dollar doesn't survive,  gold and silver will and possibly Bitcoins and other crypto currencies. During a reset there is also "confiscation of GOLD". 
- People might by Bitcoins because it will be harder to confiscate....who knows.

The really long term view is that if and when the SH!T hits the fan, those stores of value will go up in price significantly. 

Just my 2 cents....and there is a chance I may be completely wrong. 

You can learn more about the U.S economic situation by taking a course , link below:

http://www.peakprosperity.com/video/218/playlist/153/chapter-1-three-beliefs

My opinion is no need to hurry buying now, price is relatively stable and can go both ways. Better is wait for more news

There's nothing wrong with dissenting opinions.

"Somebody bet on the bobtail nag, somebody bet on the bay."

Doo dah.

 

I am not afraid to read quality dissenting opinions but I have to take measures to filter out the chaff from the grain, cos on this forum subsection, there is a whole lot more chaff than grain. I think the problem is that there are a hell of a lot of people who are basically gullible emotionally driven reactionary idiots, who have gotten rich through Bitcoin, who now consider themselves to be real hot shot market predators as opposed to recognising that they just got lucky.

Whilst I recognise the need to have an opinion, I also recognise the need to do a complete 180° on that opinion whenever the circumstances demand it. The people I know, who tend to fall in love with their opinions or have the need to rally under some kind of ideology as though it were a warriors coat of arms, are all people who when it has come to investing, have made a good bit of money to begin with, but then lost far more than they ever made, before limping meekly away from the 'battlefield'.

Right now, for me, Bitcoin is trending down, interspersed with pronounced corrections and temporary rebounds. I have based my Bitcoin investment decisions around this and so far things have gone well for me. I also dumped a big pile of Bitcoin at $1000 before the previous weekend, incurring a small loss in order that I could buy back in at around the $600 - $700 mark. Unlike most of the other claims on this forum of people 'Trading like a Pro', if you can be arsed to check my post history, you will see that I clearly stated my forecast and intentions before the event.

So for now, I will stick to my prognosis. If I get my arse spanked or someone can present a strong measured argument that things are going to go the other way in the immediate short term, then I may change my stance, but:

"FK YOU TRAITOR......U WILL BE CRYING WHEN BITCOIN IS AT 5K BY JAN 2014 U B!TCH"

....just isn't going to have an effect on me beyond reaching for the 'ignore' button.

right

Yes, we'll see won't we?

As I said.

LOL 

who laughs last laughs best. Oh and double digits aren't even something to talk about or even single digits, when it comes down, (which can be not for another few years or it might be next month, who knows) we are talking about fractional of a dollar to worthless.

To each their own, but personally I'm not afraid to read dissenting opinions.

I don't ignore FUD spammers nor the kind of people whose posts consist mainly of:

"Oversold PONZI pyramid scam... no real value... deluded cultists... BITCOIN GOING TO DA DOUBLE DIGITS"

I laugh at them.

Oh yes, because I ignore people whose posts mainly consist of:

"What!? you say Bitcoin might go down!!!! FK YOU TRAITOR...Bitcoin dont need you...BITCOIN GOING TO DA MOON"

I must surely have my head in the sand.

Ok. This is cheap retarded FUD. What China really did was to finally decentralise mtgox  price influence. People are not looking at mighty mtgox like they did before ( April crash anybody?) and that's why I believe BTC is NOT crashing but slowly going down.

 

Wow.

The OP has really upset the Bitcoin Nutters on here.....about 75% of the replies in this thread are from people who I have on ignore (all slavering emotional idiots to a man).

I don't know about buying this irrational fear story, seems like counterbalance extreme sentiment to me......but I have had dreams three nights running now, about Bitcoin being valued at low double figures......probably low double figures is what Bitcoin would really be worth if Bitcoin speculation was somehow prevented from taking place.

Personally, I am targeting lows in the $300, but doubt that this will be achieved in go, more likely is a gradual series of downwards trends punctuated by brutal corrections followed by temporary upswings....(this is where traders can make their dough).

I have readjusted my next buy-in tranche on Bitstamp to the $550 - $650 range.

omg $600

I was prepared to but it kept dropping so I'll wait for now.

Looking at the price rise over the last few months it's pretty obvious a crash is coming sooner or later.  When does it arrive?  When we run out of greater fools who think buying in at $1k/btc is a bargain because it'll be $4k/btc within a month or two.  The Chinese have a large gambling population so we've found another group to sell to.  Their interest however doesn't seem to have lasted very long so we're on a search for another.  There is a certain irony in China going bananas for bitcoin, a commodity released under a Japanese pseudonym.

On this forum, who would be willing to pump a few thousand US dollars into bitcoin at the current price?

LOL the usual 'we are more patient/cultured/deeper than u' bitch excuse.

They do not understand the true meaning of 'patience'. Just look at their foreign and monetary policy. How did they fall into the dollar trap again?

It's always the ones lacking who bitch the most.

OP is all true, please send me your soon to be worthless BTC

Maybe Chinese understand patience is necessary, the word western world do not want to hear 

how long do you think they will keep buying or not sell bitcoins?  remember they can not spend bitcoins right now.  why would they hold on to their bitcoins unless it goes up in value?

I didn't say what i did was honorable.  I did it for the best of my own interest.  I went from bearish to bullish in the immediate short term and decided to hide my post making it from bearish to super bullish.  My point is, don't attack the person, attack the argument.

Trolling is fine with me to... but you're not just trolling.

When you get members on this board to engage in your discussion, whether its a FUD or not ... you should respect your fellow members.

The fact that you changed the title, then deleted the OP content, makes all the participating members looked like fools. Its not about your ego, its about being a decent member with a slightness of manner.

Everyone here trolls at one point, i never attacked you. I just pointed out the obvious what scumbag you are.

Lastly, i might sound angry to you because i posted the truth about your character.

Stuck in silver sadly and only going down

Anyone give me any idea on what to do with it. Should I cut heavy losses in Silver and move at least half into BTC?

Yeah, I remember people saying (and me thinking) back in April - if it ever goes to single digits I'd go full in.

Well, neither will happen so better plan something else with your 20k

Dude, you're just an angry drunk redneck. Bitcoin doesn't care about you.

I'm talking about my current post.  You are obviously taking THIS post seriously.  It is irrelevant if I am respected or not.  The market speaks for itself.  My ego is okay with being disrespected and looked down upon.

Americans once again will own the Chinese. First with our cheap debt and now with our cheap bitcoins!

No i was fine when you said you were bearish....

Until you switched position and CHANGED the your FUD thread's title, deleting the OP and post completely different content (bullish)

Thats low.... And no1 should have any respect for you.

lol

You fell for it? You , the master of all trolls? The OP of the troll thread? =))))

You are obviously taking me seriously if my post, which obviously has merit, is irritating you so much.  Yes, I did get greedy in previous threads and lost a decent amount of money trying to make a quick buck from risky trades.  But overall, I am still bearish.

edit- you give it away in your screename.  You are a seriouscoin holder.  You take everything seriously!

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.3917650


Why you guys even take this joker seriously?

Hes fcking bad at FUD,..... Hey OP go fck yourself

where are you looking

i see 800+ everywhere

700  already , down it goes

Lol, China already has.  That's why the price has dropped 30%.

i think he meant every time the price drops 50$ we get a new wave of panicky bears

but ya if the price drop to 50$ I'd go all in aswell

but the market is not THAT crazy...

If bitcoin drops to $50 I will buy in 20K worth.

China can **** off.

Isn't time for you to go into hibernation? It's almost x-mas!

That is a sign that it is bullish?  Am i missing something here?  How about because they ahve 0 fees?

They just keep coming as soon as price drops 50$, lol

It's same when it is rising though, than we see "when btc will reach one million" ones.

They are trading more bitcoins than the rest , not buying more of them
You can't buy what is not for sale.
And I don't give a damn about China.
There wasn't even a damn store or a pizza stand accepting bitcoin there.

you should just sell now and stop trolling us.

Their all gamblers.  All it takes is 1 bear to beat 1000 bulls in china. 

chain is the most bullish market of all!

look at their volume on the dorps

wow

why did you buy bitcoin?

All i know is that China is going to crash this market to near hopelessness....

He is not saying it is a fad, just that it is way overvalued right now.

No, bitcoin will die, just like it did after the last two bubbles. Die and return with a vengeance.

I don't believe we'll be using Bitcoin for day to day transaction in 10 years, that will be another, more evolved crypto currency. But bitcoin WILL be the gold standard, the "reserve" crypto currency that all other alts are traded against.

dude China will soon own all the bitcoins. they are now the major player that everyone watches

Sure there is a certain degree of uncertainty, or else I'd be shorting bitcoin leveraged to the max right now, but why would any smart money be pouring it into something like the current state of bitcoin?  

Dumb money can't wait to buy bitcoin right now, because all it sees is $1200.  1200-850 = 350 profit.

Smart money says not a chance am I pouring it into bitcoin right now.

Unfortunately, smart money is not China.  They make the dumbest investments.  I bet there are still people in China buying the bitcoin craze and just getting in on it.

Sure 25million got invested into Coinbase.  That's because they see coinbase as a money robbing machine.  And that's precisely what it is.  It is a machine that is made to steal money.

You honesty believe what you're typing right there  , or this is the weekend booze that's doing the talk.
Bitcoin doesn't care about China. And , nobody really gives a damn about China.
They were good for a rush , now they can go and .... themselves. Bitcoin is here to stay.

+1

fear uncertainty and doubt

have some faith, sure bitcoin might be over bought and is correcting, but its not like anyone was betrayed by the market.

What does FUD mean?

Demand in China seems to still be quite strong to me: http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/

What is interesting about china is that every body complains about them. They rob our jobs etc.

Actually people do not understand economics very well and do not understand that china has propped our economy up so much with cheap goods and buying our debt. In a way they are just handing us free stuff. It is like if we had a robots here building the stuff for free.

China keeps getting burned though.

But you have to also understand they also stole all our ideas on how to build all these goods and build their economy. If it was not for our technological advancements they would probably be nothing. So they gained and we also gained.

So you can look at this both ways.

lmao!

this is such FUD!

Nice try guys.

I think you are very correct. I think some big investor has put a price floor on bitcoin for the time being hoping things will turn around. This is why some people are surprised that bitcoin price is not rising with all the recent news. IT is because their is a price floor and the price right now should be way lower, and if it was not being manipulated would have possibly rose from its lows. 

Bitcoins at $900 is utterly ridiculous. There is no way this price can maintain itself right now.

It looks like the price floor is breaking apart, even the wealthier investor can't prop up a billion dollar bitcoin economy. We should start seeing the drops very soon. It will be ugly for sure.

During this whole rally, it is without a doubt that China has been a main factor.  The reason China was a main factor was because of China itself.  The other exchanges simply followed China's footsteps, and China followed its own mania.  Now that China has come to its senses, it sees that the world has been playing China like a fiddle, just like how the USA played China like a fiddle.  And forget about all the retarded news coming out that a lot of the maniacs on here are screaming about, "OMG Fidelity Fidelity.  OMG Second Market.  OMG Wall street Wall street.  OMG LAMBO for BTC"  Remember something, wall street isn't the guppies, it's you that's the guppy.  Wall street is in it to make money, not to follow a fad.

I feel bad for all those that have finally gotten their money onto bitstamp or has finally convinced their family to loan them $2000, because you're too late.

China is going to unleash its rage on bitcoin, just like it has unleashed its rage on the US dollar.  And just as fast as it has gone up, down it will go.  And no, 2nd market is not going to save bitcoin.

When the chinese maniacs aren't seeing any profits and their wallets getting thinner, there will be mass abandonment.  When the euphoria is over, will bitcoin even be remembered?