Topic: Palmyra presents a new twist: First Syrian city the group has taken from Government (Read 1658 times)

They are not even friends of Muslims, they disguise as belongs to Muslim community and in the reality is they their targets are the people, not the heritage such that.. the Muslims people who hid for the safety in those cultural heritage places, they drove them away from that place and killed them, then eventually destroyed such place to make them homeless.

A user in this forum who is okay with ISIS' activities send me this link -- http://keabsahankhilafah.blogspot.com/. It is in Indonesian though. ATM I am in mobile. So I can't translate whole page in a go now. If someone is doing it and find anything interesting(negative or positive), please post here. Thank you!


Think politically and/or financially.

Yup... they have destroyed every single Shiite shrine in the territory which they control. This is what makes me suspicious. They are attacking Shiites, Yazidis, Christians.etc, but they are never attacking the Jews or Israel. What is the reason behind this?


They can't take the jizya payment from the Shiites, since they are Muslims. So the ISIS is massacring them, or driving them out towards the government controlled territory.

In Palmyra and elsewhere they are destroying muslim heritage also. Local graveyard was razed to the ground, since in belief of this apocalyptic sect - graves ought to be unmarked. Same fate awaits any busts or paintings by muslims or shrines and temples of non-sunni muslims.

It is proverb of ISIS/sunni Arabs that slavery is fit for Christians and Jews, grave for atheists and Shias.

The River Euphrates, one of the largest rivers in the Middle East (by volume) flows through the ISIS controlled territory in Syria. And River Tigris, another large river flows through the ISIS territory in Iraq. Both these rivers have a combined water flow of some 43.2 billion cubic meters per year, which can be used to irrigate some 5,300,000 acres of farmland.

It is a cyclic thing. No places on earth stay green for a long time. Long enough for multiple generations of human beings sure... But not forever.

The pyramids were built, their 'feet' almost touching the river nile. Now not so much.

The greenery in Palmyra may have been more so  in the past, but right now it doesn't seem like very much.

I can understand why Arabs and ISIS might be angry. Who wants to live in a land with all that brown sand and dirt and rocks? Just look at the United States. Outside of the Southern West, the U.S. is full of greenery. The east coast states are green. The northern states are green. Portions of all the other states are green.

No wonder the Arabs fight. They hate their land and really don't even know it!

ISIS BLOWS UP ANCIENT Shrines in Palmyra, Syria


Islamic State militants have blown up two ancient shrines they consider sacrilegious in Palmyra, a 2,000-year-old UNESCO World Heritage site in central Syria, the ultra hardline Sunni Muslim group said on Tuesday.

The report was the first of any damage being done by the militants to buildings in Palmyra since they seized control of the city, also known as Tadmur, in May. Syrian forces have bombed the city, and the militants camped within it, since then.

Before-and-after pictures showed several militants carrying explosives and the shrines, which are not among the city’s monumental Roman-era buildings, reduced to rubble.

The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, a Britain-based monitoring group, said this week that the militants had planted mines in Palmyra but that it was not clear whether it was preparing to destroy the site or wanted to deter government forces from advancing towards it.

Syrian antiquities chief Abdul Maamoun Abdulkarim said, “In all the areas where they spread when they see tombs they destroy them as see them as sacrilegious and a return to paganism.”


http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2015/06/breaking-isis-blows-up-ancient-shrines-in-palmyra-syria/

Before the arrival of the "Blessed" Junípero Serra in 1771, the Tongva numbered some 10,000 people. Out of that some 5,000 were taken as slaves, and transported to San Gabriel Arcángel. The remainder were killed by warfare, epidemics, starvation or were assimilated in to the "wild" Indian tribes.

In San Gabriel Arcángel, the Tongva slaves were treated extremely harshly, and the life expectancy at birth was just 6.4 years.

Within the first two decades, almost all of the slaves died of torture, exhaustion, epidemics, or were executed by the "Blessed" guy and his gospel messengers for "disobedience".

Some 100 Tongva survived by the end of the 18th century (mostly women), and they were mostly intermarried to Spanish people. The last person, with some knowledge of the Tongva language died around 100 years ago. Probably the last full blooded Tongva died much before that.

Currently, some 2,000 people claim that they are Tongva (obviously with no proof), but their claims are not recognized by the Bureau of Indian Affairs (BIA).

The Tongva are gone. No one speaks their language, and no one follows their religion. We should thank "Blessed" Junípero Serra for eradicating a 10,000-year old culture.

Only 100?

That view doesn't agree with Wikipedia.

These were "hunter gatherers" number unknown estimated 5000-10000 and operating over 4000 square miles.

In 1994, the state of California recognized the Tongva "as the aboriginal tribe of the Los Angeles Basin," but no group representing the Tongva has attained recognition by the federal government.[5] In 2008, more than 1,700 people identified as Tongva or claimed partial ancestry.[

As far as I am concerned, "Blessed" Junípero Serra was a monster who almost wiped out the native Tongva people.

Junípero Serra and his obidient goons rounded up the Tongva people, banned their language and religion, and forced them to convert to Christianity at gunpoint. After the conversion, the Tongva slaves were shipped to a plantation, where they worked for 16-hours a day without adequate food or other provisions. Rape and torture was rife. The life expectancy at birth was just 6 years. In just two decades, only around 100 Tongva survived, out of an original population of 5,000. 

I think you'd have to support that claim before anyone believed it, and as I earlier mentioned, state the scope of the premises.

Also, doesn't sound like you have the facts about Serra right.  He wasn't a "genocide perp", and nobody I have ever ran into "worshiped" so-called saints or so-called martyrs.   As for sexual abuse that really has zero relation to the question.

Not all of them whom medias call Muslims aren't Muslims and you should use Muslims at the least instead of Islam as Islam doesn't try to kill innocent people. Actually, 'Muslims' isn't the right word, 'Munafikhs' is.

The two business-cartel like religions (Christianity and Islam) have killed more people than the Communists or the Nazis ever managed. And worse still, many of the genocide perpetrators, such as Junípero Serra are worshiped by the brainwashed believers as "saints"or "martyrs". And don't even mention  about the millions of children, sexually abused by these "saints".

Says who?

Can you prove this?

If you did, you would do it how, exactly?

Is this the statement to be proved?

"3000 years of religious wars killed more people as a fraction of existent populations that major "Isms" of the 20th century."

I can't read that - is the assertion in the aggregate, cumulative, per century, per decade, or what?

It's certainly an interesting question, a comparison of "religious deaths" versus "communist deaths" versus "Nazi deaths."

The ISIS hasn't destroyed FSA. On the other hand, 90% of the FSA units simply defected to the ISIS, as there is a feeling within the FSA rank and file that the leadership is not conservative enough. And regarding the battles between ISIS and Al Nusra, they were a thing of the past. Latest reports indicates that the two groups have reconciled and are examining the possibility of a merger.

There is a little problem with your analysis.  Even in his time, Pizarro was recognized as something of a madman.    And the Spanish conquests were pretty much all about gold and silver.  Yes they made a bit of a show about "converting the Indians," but it really wasn't taken seriously.  They came for gold, then they sent ships back full of it. 

So there isn't any parallel between ISIS and the Conquistadors, is there?


As for your listing of Christian stuff, there is a little problem there, also.  It is as if you are saying something like "ISIS is like the barbarians we Christians were a thousand years ago."

Well, Duhh.....

Yeah, they are totally medieval.  I don't think you've even created a case for moral equivalency here.

That's why Buddhist monks are fighting Muslims, now. They realize that they might be next on ISIS's list.

No apologist but the tactics and techniques used by ISIS seem to mirror that of the Conquestadors in Latin America.  Daily Life of the Aztecs by Jacques Soustelle goes into detail about the brutality of the Spaniards on the indigenous peoples of the Americas.  The Spaniards would do stuff like grab babies, by their feet, and smash their heads on cobbled stones.

Or even the Christian Missionaries after the year 600 who converted the Germanic, Finnic and Romuva pagans to Christianity and carried out campaigns of terrorism, destruction of artifacts and monuments, et cetera.  There is a lot of literature, for instance, which covers the German missionaries in the Baltic who went on murder, loot and rape rampages in their quest to extend Christianity.  One prominent tactic of those German crusaders, if I recall, was they would slice the breasts off women and shoot arrows into people tied to trees.  All in the name of his lord Jesus Christ.



Organized religion, in terms of population per capita, has always been the greatest blood letter in human history.  In per capita terms, the religious wars in Eurasia (e.g., 30 years war) was more devastating than both Nazism and Communism put together.

Of course I don't hear voices in my head. I was simply answering RodeoX before he asked.

Nobody hears voices in his/her head. They hear the sounds that voices make in their heads because that's where their eardrums are.

 

Right, there is only one God and Mohamed is his messenger. Right?

Of course, not. Just because some radical Muslims WOULD do the job, doesn't mean that they have the right god either. But it puts the Christians to shame, that rather than get rid of the idols, they adore the art. Weakling Christians! God simply used what He found at hand to get the job done.

'Bout time somebody got rid of this false god garbage that has been leading people away from the truth of the real God for way too long.

The sad part is that daesh is now attacking government troops because they have destroyed the FSA and other moderate groups. Next comes the fight between daesh and Al Nusra (Al-Qaeda). Last I checked Nusra was a few kilometers from the center of Damascus.

Since you were so brave that you got in there to ask them, and then out again, what else did they tell you?

Please don't use 'Islamic' there. It is clearly 'non-Islamic'.

^^^Not surprising at all. Brave Islamic Jihadis destroying evil Pagan idols. 

Each of these statues are worth tens of millions of USD. You can tell how much these idiots hate ancient artifacts by noting the fact that they are destroying them, rather than selling them to artifact collectors.

ISIS 'destroys' famous lion god statue in captured Syrian city of Palmyra... just days after promising locals they would not obliterate ancient monuments


1,900-year-old Lion of Al-Lat statue was reportedly one of the first targets



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3101031/ISIS-destroys-famous-lion-god-statue-captured-Syrian-city-just-days-promising-locals-not-obliterate-Palmyra-s-ancient-monuments.html

Right now, they are delaying the destruction of the Palmyra artifacts, as they have received a lot of negative publicity when they did the same in Nimrud. I haven't heard about the incident in Mali, but I remember the destruction of the Bamiyan Buddha in Afghanistan. What happened in Mali? Is the ISIS active in Mali as well?


The Syrian government under Bashar al Assad have been fighting these monsters for more than four years now. But the Syrian army is no match for the ISIS, which is funded by the Qatari and Saudi oil money.

Extreme Islamic groups have destroyed historic monuments before in Mali and Afghanistan, I don't see any great reason why they would do otherwise in Palmyra.

It is obviously a massive shame that they are so short sighted and can't see past their own beliefs, it seems that local governments don't care enough to stop ISIS either, otherwise they would be moved back in short order.

According to the ISIS, all the human history which dates before the invention of Islam (AD 610) is unislamic, and therefore all the evidences related to it must be destroyed. Also, many of the statues and other artworks go against the ban on idolatory and personal worship in Islam, and therefore must be destroyed without any trace.

I certainly can't answer these. We will have to wait what they say/do. I think their real aim is to gain power rather than destroying non-Islamic cultures. I don't know how many more people will fall in their hands.

Are they going to blow all the ancient heritage? Which is not muslim culture? Heard they have killed 4000 people there. Whta to expect?

[cemter]ISIS Alternates Stick and Carrot to Control Palmyra[/center]


BEIRUT, Lebanon — Hours after they swept into the Syrian city of Palmyra last week, Islamic State militants carried out scores of summary executions, leaving the bodies of victims — including dozens of government soldiers — in the streets.

Then, residents say, they set about acting like municipal functionaries. They fixed the power plant, turned on the water pumps, held meetings with local leaders, opened the city’s lone bakery and started distributing free bread. They planted their flag atop Palmyra’s storied ancient ruins, and did not immediately loot and destroy them, as they have done at other archaeological sites.

Next came dozens of Syrian government airstrikes, some killing civilians. That gave the Islamic State a political assist: Within days, some residents had redirected the immediate focus of their anger and fear from the militants on the ground to the warplanes overhead.

In Palmyra, the Islamic State group appears to be digging into power in a series of steps it has honed over two years of accumulating territory in Iraq and Syria.


Graphic | Syria After Four Years of Mayhem A look at the conflict that has dismembered Syria and inflamed the region with one of the world’s worst religious and sectarian wars.
But Palmyra presents a new twist: It is the first Syrian city the group has taken from the government, not from insurgents. In Raqqa, farther north, and in Iraq, the group has moved quickly and harshly against anyone perceived as a rival.


The Islamic State alternates between terrorizing residents and courting them. It takes over institutions. And it seeks to co-opt opposition to the government, painting itself as the champion of the people — or at least, the Sunnis — against oppressive central authorities.

That method has helped the group entrench itself in the cities of Raqqa, Syria, and Mosul, Iraq, and is now unfolding in Palmyra.

The Palmyra takeover was detailed by half a dozen residents of the city, including supporters and opponents of the government, via phone or electronic messaging. All asked not to be fully identified, to avoid reprisals from the government or from the Islamic State, also known as ISIS, ISIL or Daesh. Most cast themselves as caught between the threats of government airstrikes and ISIS beheadings or other killings.

On Wednesday, for example, several residents reported that the Islamic State had killed 20 army soldiers in an ancient amphitheater. Others recalled seeing the bodies of soldiers burned alive or beheaded by militants.

“They slaughtered many,” a cafe owner exclaimed about ISIS, then switched to the subject of air raids that he would later blame for the deaths of several friends: “God knows what they’re bombing, it’s so scary!”

{...}

http://nytimes.com/2015/05/29/world/middleeast/isis-alternates-stick-and-carrot-to-control-palmyra.html