Topic: [poll] Should doxing be banned? (Read 3033 times)

Doxing is fine, as long as it's not me 

On a serious note, those who support doxing scammers need to understand that they can't have it both ways. With such a low standard for making a scam accusation nowadays, it isn't hard to dox an innocent person and harass/defame them for no good reason. I would change my vote to a no if doxing had some degree of moderation (ie. requiring actual evidence against the accused).

Which can be done in a controlled and constructive manner and setting.

Thanks for mentioning your story devthedev.

doxxing is needed for scammers

Exactly. A service of mine was exploited in the past without reason and my DOX was dumped on the forum. All of the information was obviously obtained by illicit means and I've brought it up with the staff on multiple occasions. A global mod replied with

It didn't make any sense, service exploited, and then a DOX was dumped with information obtained from the single hacked account and the thread's removal was refused.
I could care less now, but there needs to be consistency with the moderation of these instances.

How would this forums stop others from doxing others? If they ban dox dump type of posts, it isn't going to stop anyone from doing it

If you left you car parked at a mall, unlocked with the keys in the ignition, it's not allowed for anyone to take your car without your explicit permission. However I would suggest to be a bit more careful and not leaving your car like that in the first place. Because some people don't follow the rule book and your car will be gone.

Nowhere did I say any criminal should get off the hook because the victim was (too) careless. I will say however that I am against rules that cannot be enforced. Those will only restrict decent people and help those who do not care about rules to get ahead.

I'm not against releasing someones personal information without their consent if it's the best option there is. We've seen scammers do it to discredit their critics. Those scammers would do it regardless of any rule (though they may have to use a different storage location). I don't want the "good guys" to be limited where the bad guys can do it without any consequence.

Yeah by your logic everything should be allowed, you would tell people to be more careful, why did you get raped? You werent careful enough, why did you got hacked, you werent careful enough, by your logic we should let any criminal free because it´s not their fault, it´s our fault

IMHO
if someone is calling you a pedo or making false claims contact a lawyer. he will contact theymos for ip info.
then your lawyer / law enforcement can/will dox that guy...

i dont think forum users should do this, nor should such info be allowed in any public form.

EDIT: anything else smells like vigilantism

you don't get a correct dox everyday, you know. every now and then people make mistakes. so stopping people from doxing the wrong guy is almost impossible. (cmiiw)
it's either ban doxxing entirely or allow it.

btw I'm not sure which one is better so I didn't vote.

Hopefully I didn't make a mistake.  If I did - hopefully nothing happens to the guy when they investigate and see he went no where near this forum.

I shouldn't have been goaded into sending the email in the first place.  I hope others learn from my mistake.

(No email from CVS yet)

Yes , it should be banned definitly in my opinion and it's not the only that should be banned on the forums , Social Engineering that people keep doing to get refunds on Amazon items , and gift cards and stuff should be banned aswell .

Only if it's the right guy :-/

So you are saying I should just lie back while someone prepares to sue me and posts pedophile links about me?   

I would only dox people who really does scam, and i would not send emails to employers etc thats just going to far.

I tried.

Theymos shrugged.

I can't really repeat this this many times. Most doxes (including mine) include non public, non listed private information but under the guise that "how can we know" the admins won't action it. So to say a dox is just a collection of known information is false and misleading, because there is no way to moderate between public and private. So.... it can and will include private information.

Its not about "being careful", its that with the current moderation policy its both hypocritical, unusable and damaging to all.


If someone doxing you as part of a proven extortion attempt doesn't get you in trouble, nothing will.

Exactly. As I've previously stated, there is no efficient way of preventing this. If someone is out to get you, they will find a way. This would require constant moderation of both users (as a person would probably created a lot of accounts) and trust (will leave negative feedback with DOX). DOX is usually just a summary of publicly available information. If you do not want this information to be public, then I suggest that you do something about it.
Also, there are cases in which 'doxing' will get you in trouble (e.g. where it is considered trolling).

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Update: I've corrected my statement, and now it is correct by definition.

Depend on the situation :

I vote no if doxing is being done for some reason ( excample : Someone ever scam for a huge amount)

And vote yes, if someone try to dox for personal reason ( example : extorting )

And I'd suggest anyone voting yes to be more careful with their personal information. Because some rule on this forum is not going to protect you much.

I'd ask anyone voting no to volunteer your doxes, because that's essentially what you're saying.

Either would be fine, but the rules should be clear and consistent, and enforcement transparent (e.g. not involve forum software searching for substrings of theymos' address/phone#/BTC addy containing this info in the form of a public message).

~~Comrade Napoleon, Father of All Animals, Terror of Mankind, Protector of the Sheep-fold.

I voted for ' Yes: it should be banned.'

Basically it should be banned but in some cases it can be done ,depending upon the context or situations.
[1] Practising of revealing ones personal identity by unknown people can let you in a offense.
[2] Can even lead to mass Falsehood , as the identity provided in dox don't need to be truth.

I've already proven that to be false, and the other thread has more than vehemently proven that admins will delete or shield their own doxes but not those of others, while maintaining the viewpoint that they do. pNote I say "admins" in the general context that we don't know who, or one or many, or some conspiracy or none at all. Don't go witch-hunting.]

Been told this multiple times now. I'll move to meta and mods can decide if it's off topic or not.

I particularly don't like anyone doxing anyone so I voted yes, but shouldn't this topic be discussed in meta?

... and right on cue ...

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.12469748

I quintuple-dog-dare you to post his dox, that are easily obtainable via Google, and see what happens.

a global mod denied it in this topic:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/why-is-non-consensual-release-of-personal-information-allowed-1183191

I would vote Yes. But then again who cares what we say man!

If you see something on the forum which you think is wrong but is allowed, learn to look away..

ps: didn't vote.

From what I know, theymos ban users who post his dox. I read it somewhere on the forum, don't ask me.

i voted yes.
a dox should be made by law enforcement and not by forum users.

I answered No, because if someone did very bad stuff to community, like TradeFortress, it should be publicly recognized, if not scammers will not stop being so.

nope.
unless it contains explicit threats, else it must not be banned to prevent admin abuse (admin self-banning disaster).

Sorry, but I do not have a proposal that could work. We can not generalize anything and thus there are exceptions. If one could prove that that information can not be obtained by randomly using a search engine, then it should be removed and punished. You would have to take these things up higher as I can not do anything besides discuss or suggest potential changes. If there was a good way to effectively stop people from doing this, then the policy might change. As said, someone could be very persistent.
I also did not vote on the poll.

So how do you propose to resolve situations such as Josh Zerlan using private information in their customer database to dox me, and then blatantly lying about it being public information.

A vendor. Now the subject of an FTC lawsuit. Doxing an upset customer.

Theymos shrugs.

Disclosure: Didn't vote in this poll.

The most important lesson to learn from people having their dox released is to protect your identity and info sufficiently. Having it posted on a forum is the least of your worries. IF some randomer on a bitcoin forum can find it then so can criminals and do much worse with it so you should make sure as much info about you is known as possible and minimize the possibility of any of it being leaked. Even if this forum does remove doxs its not going to stop them repeatedly posting it or posting it elsewhere so removing it is largely pointless any way.

I think it should only get deleted but if somebodies actually being really persistent and trying to call for violence against an individual then that's probably the one case where I would consider a banning to be okay, people have a right to privacy, even if some people do behave like total scum.

No. If the DOX (which it usually does) contains only information that is publicly available on search engines (your own fault), then it should not. Social security numbers and such get delete though.

t is not possible to effectively stop someone who is trying to DOX another member. They could create infinite amount of newbie accounts and keep posting it. They could leave their DOX information on their trust page which is not moderated either. Exactly how do you expect the staff to moderate this?

Think this is more a meta question than a Off topic question,you are bound to get some what trolled or flamed and it will alter the outcome.
Almost like phone surveys where only lonely people answer the phone to be surveyed.

For me the dox issues seems very invasive into ones private affairs,this being the internet I would want to have a little more of a wall between me and real life.
I choose not to be on facebook for that reason and I am sure others come at this with the same thinking. This is bitcoin after all!

Recall a time when I was a punk teenager and the police where coming around the house way to often to pretty much get in my kitchen.
Could see the toll it was taking on my mother and one night they came and took me for a ride and kicked the shit out of me and told me I could
leave town or they would trump up some charges against me. They did trump up some charges but fortunately for me I had moved on. It actually was a life changing moment but I will never forget how my mother looked when she saw me and it hit home that I was up to no good.
So I imagine if some one was to dox me she is that much older and it would most likely kill her. Thats my life and you have to think some of us have parents that are fragile as well and you are not just attacking the target you are attacking the whole family. Their co-workers come across the details and its out there for ever.
If I can not wear what I am dealing out to people,I rather not bark up that tree. Lifes to damn short and we need to think more broader when we think we are just hitting one target.

If there is no recourse to a botched doxing then it shouldn't be allowed IMO.
Since Polls are easily stacked, I didn't vote.

What is doxing?

[Doxing] is the Internet-based practice of researching and broadcasting personally identifiable information about an individual.

From Wikipedia.

Post in the meta board for more high level discussion.