Question about rollback of the btc blockchain

OcTradism

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Quote from: jerrison on July 13, 2020, 01:07:18 PM

The rollback was actually proposed to CZ upon Binance's hack but he turned the offer down. For a rollback to occur, 51% of the miners have to approve of it and rollback that transaction on a particular block. but beyond the price are the psychological consequences that follows. Imagine preaching Bitcoin's immutability and later altered a block confirmation and a rollback on a particular trascation, who will wan to believe that Bitcoin and blockchain in entirety is truely immutable.

The problem with roll back is a consensus of mininum 51% of miners by their total contributed mining hashrates and how far the target block is from the newest block. The farther that block gap number is, the hardest the rollback will be challenge. The blockchain is like a soil layer and if the target block is 1 month before newest block today, it is a huge challenge. Why I use the time 1 month? As being said, it need a consensus that never easy to be reached.

Bitcoin blockchain is built up to be decentralized and its network is truly decentralized. It is not centralized as Ethereum or Ripple to be rollback whenever the companies want as with Ethereum and the DAO hack.

Ethereum Executes Blockchain Hard Fork to Return DAO Funds

jerrison

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Quote from: Soonandwaite on July 12, 2020, 09:44:17 AM

hi . i have a question about the btc blockchain ! i have read the following quiz question

Quote

How often is it known that a rollback of the Bitcoin Blockchain took place

does anyone know the answer or can I find or read it on the internet . thank you so much

i do not know the answer. but i think some experienced btc users know the answer . thx

The rollback was actually proposed to CZ upon Binance's hack but he turned the offer down. For a rollback to occur, 51% of the miners have to approve of it and rollback that transaction on a particular block. but beyond the price are the psychological consequences that follows. Imagine preaching Bitcoin's immutability and later altered a block confirmation and a rollback on a particular trascation, who will wan to believe that Bitcoin and blockchain in entirety is truely immutable.

Soonandwaite

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i have found something else from 2010 by satoshi and lfm . august 2010

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/version-0310-block-74638-overflow-patch-827
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/overflow-bug-serious-823

ABCbits

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Quote from: BrewMaster on July 12, 2020, 10:19:57 AM

there was one case which may be categorized as a roll back but it was mostly a group of nodes that went on an invalid chain. it happened in early years and it is referred to as the "overflow bug" where due to a bug a miner created a bigger than allowed number of new coins which made its block invalid and other miners built on top of that invalid block and created an invalid chain which had to be discarded.

in my personal opinion this can't be categorized as a "roll back" because those blocks were invalid.

Quote

Further update: Binance CEO Zhao said the company will not pursue a rollback of the bitcoin blockchain.

this is a lie that they spread to cover their embarrassment. they didn't stop pursuing rollback! they faced the reality that is is not possible to do so and every miner they tried to bribe laughed at their proposal.

You forget rollback when bitcoin-qt 0.8 is released, which turns out isn't backward compatible with other full node client. IIRC some miners/pools kind enough to agree with the rollback to bitcoin-qt 0.7 knowing they'd lose some Bitcoin they mined with bitcoin-qt 0.8

See https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/alert-chain-fork-caused-by-pre-08-clients-dealing-badly-with-large-blocks-152030

gentlemand

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Quote from: crwth on July 12, 2020, 07:43:48 PM

Quote from: gmaxwell on July 12, 2020, 07:20:55 PM

Quote from: gentlemand on July 12, 2020, 04:47:11 PM

As for CZ, I hope no one ever forgets that proposal. What a clueless dick move.

Meh, it's not wrong of someone to ask. Of course, everyone said no. Plus, he had gotten bad advice from people who misleading represented themselves as authorities.

Since everyone that is registered to Binance was affected by then, it seems CZ wants to do everything to lessen the impact that they have with it. If you were in his shoes, trying to get it done is a way that he thought that is worth it but of course, it won't happen.

What is bizarre about the whole thing is that he blithely proposed it without either acknowledging or knowing that if it actually happened a large amount of Bitcoin's trust would evaporate. For someone with that much heft to come out with something that childlike reveals more about them than it should have.

bithisach

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Quote from: Bttzed03 on July 12, 2020, 09:50:55 AM

None.

I remember CZ proposed for a rollback when Binance was hacked but later retracted. AFAIK, the chances of that happening is close to zero. It's simply too costly to even try.

Yeah, I remember CZ got SHIT ON for just thinking about it, goes to show that even powerful people in the space are bound to the same rules that regular users are (inmutability, fuck yeah)

crwth

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Quote from: gmaxwell on July 12, 2020, 07:20:55 PM

Quote from: gentlemand on July 12, 2020, 04:47:11 PM

As for CZ, I hope no one ever forgets that proposal. What a clueless dick move.

Meh, it's not wrong of someone to ask. Of course, everyone said no. Plus, he had gotten bad advice from people who misleading represented themselves as authorities.

Since everyone that is registered to Binance was affected by then, it seems CZ wants to do everything to lessen the impact that they have with it. If you were in his shoes, trying to get it done is a way that he thought that is worth it but of course, it won't happen.

gmaxwell

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Quote from: gentlemand on July 12, 2020, 04:47:11 PM

As for CZ, I hope no one ever forgets that proposal. What a clueless dick move.

Meh, it's not wrong of someone to ask. Of course, everyone said no. Plus, he had gotten bad advice from people who misleading represented themselves as authorities.

gentlemand

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Welt Am Draht

OP should seek out the quiz master and smack them on the bum for being too woolly. It looks like there's some trouble here agreeing on what a rollback is.

I assumed the two events that happened in 2010 and 2013 were non contentious hard forks since there was a chain that had gone wrong that was abandoned both times. But others will know more about this.

As for CZ, I hope no one ever forgets that proposal. What a clueless dick move.

philipma1957

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Quote from: BrewMaster on July 12, 2020, 10:19:57 AM

there was one case which may be categorized as a roll back but it was mostly a group of nodes that went on an invalid chain. it happened in early years and it is referred to as the "overflow bug" where due to a bug a miner created a bigger than allowed number of new coins which made its block invalid and other miners built on top of that invalid block and created an invalid chain which had to be discarded.

in my personal opinion this can't be categorized as a "roll back" because those blocks were invalid.

Quote

Further update: Binance CEO Zhao said the company will not pursue a rollback of the bitcoin blockchain.

this is a lie that they spread to cover their embarrassment. they didn't stop pursuing rollback! they faced the reality that is is not possible to do so and every miner they tried to bribe laughed at their proposal.

I would argue this unexpected fork was a rollback. edit caused a rollback to fix the issue.

At the exact second the fork occurred no one knew which fork was 'bad' once it was determined which fork to kill off i would say that the voided fork was a rollbacked fork.

By definition if an unexpected fork happens either fork could be viable.

Since it is not a planned fork a discussion to decide which fork must happen and the voided fork along with any coins go by by

So people hit for coins in the 'bad' fork and the coins were later poofed into thin air.

It is not like the eth rollback but I would think it is still a rollback.

I would have to say the pool I was on at the time was on the good fork. I did not lose coins but others lost coins being on the bad fork.

It took more then 1 bad block to fix it. so more then 50 coins were disappeared . I am thinking it was 2013 when it happened.

I mined with bitminter and we got a boost since 30% of the network was on the wrong fork. I know we got multiple extra blocks at the time.

DooMAD

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Leave no FUD unchallenged

Quote from: BrewMaster on July 12, 2020, 10:19:57 AM

Quote

Further update: Binance CEO Zhao said the company will not pursue a rollback of the bitcoin blockchain.

this is a lie that they spread to cover their embarrassment. they didn't stop pursuing rollback! they faced the reality that is is not possible to do so and every miner they tried to bribe laughed at their proposal.

Exactly. That's like someone trying to save face by saying they are no longer working on their perpetual motion machine. That fact that they even tried to begin with was the stupid part. Stopping doesn't earn them any credibility back.

BrewMaster

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There is trouble abrewing

there was one case which may be categorized as a roll back but it was mostly a group of nodes that went on an invalid chain. it happened in early years and it is referred to as the "overflow bug" where due to a bug a miner created a bigger than allowed number of new coins which made its block invalid and other miners built on top of that invalid block and created an invalid chain which had to be discarded.

in my personal opinion this can't be categorized as a "roll back" because those blocks were invalid.

Quote

Further update: Binance CEO Zhao said the company will not pursue a rollback of the bitcoin blockchain.

this is a lie that they spread to cover their embarrassment. they didn't stop pursuing rollback! they faced the reality that is is not possible to do so and every miner they tried to bribe laughed at their proposal.

hd49728

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Not your keys, not your coins!

If replay attacks don't appear on Bitcoin network, nowadays with very high cost, there will be no rollback. Cost is only one problem that people can not do it with good or bad goals (rollback to retrieve funds back from hacks or rollbacks to do double spends).

Moreover, rollbacks will make Bitcoin as another Ethereum with its DAO hack. Such rollbacks on Bitcoin network are not welcome, AFAIK. Do you expect such rollbacks, tell me please.

Soonandwaite

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Quote from: Bttzed03 on July 12, 2020, 09:50:55 AM

None.

I remember CZ proposed for a rollback when Binance was hacked but later retracted. AFAIK, the chances of that happening is close to zero. It's simply too costly to even try.

aha. ok. the story with over 7000 bitcoins in 2019
quote from Binance CEO Wink

Quote

Further update: Binance CEO Zhao said the company will not pursue a rollback of the bitcoin blockchain.

Ok.none. thank you. i was really not sure. so i asked here and found the right answer. thanks

Bttzed03

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https://bitcoincleanup.com/

None.

I remember CZ proposed for a rollback when Binance was hacked but later retracted. AFAIK, the chances of that happening is close to zero. It's simply too costly to even try.

Soonandwaite

legendary

Activity: 2156

Merit: 1506

hi . i have a question about the btc blockchain ! i have read the following quiz question

Quote

How often is it known that a rollback of the Bitcoin Blockchain took place

does anyone know the answer or can I find or read it on the internet . thank you so much

i do not know the answer. but i think some experienced btc users know the answer . thx

Topic: Question about rollback of the btc blockchain (Read 301 times)