Topic: Russia &amp; China bypass USD (Read 2977 times)

Quote from: onlyu on June 25, 2014, 10:36:44 PM

In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

This is good advice to anyone.
However, the euro seems to be walking down the same path...

The Euro is much worse off. The EU will always need to support it's weaker member countries, while the US has massive taxing and borrowing capabilities.

Reason why EU should just kick out the weak member countries.

The EU kicking out weaker member countries would mean the end of the Euro as all countries will eventually go through their own downturns.

deftonikus

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Russia is working on creating an economical block that could compete with transantantic aliance. I think first Putin will try to get together Asia and then join it with South America, which is notoriously against US policies. There are actually many educated people like professors, economists and sociologist that predicts, shift of world influence from West to East.

Fun fact: Most famous and respected fortunetellers predicted Russia/Asia to be main force in world of 21 century.

We live in intereting times.

smashingpumpkin

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Reason why EU should just kick out the weak member countries.

Meanwhile they seem like they are willing to accept one more country, which is more messed up than the most possibly messed up EU country.

Kprawn

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It's scary how much of the USA is owned by foreign countries. They have too much invested in the USA to start a war.

But wars help unemployment and create markets for goods, e.g. Tanks, jets .... So who knows why decisions are made these days.

Thing is, people suffer and get killed for mostly wrong reasons, but sometimes it's a neccesarry evil to defeat evil.

ShakyhandsBTCer

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It's Money 2.0| It’s gold for nerds | It's Bitcoin

Quote from: onlyu on June 25, 2014, 10:36:44 PM

Quote from: Harley997 on June 25, 2014, 10:33:36 PM

Quote from: Harley997 on June 25, 2014, 10:33:36 PM

In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

This is good advice to anyone.
However, the euro seems to be walking down the same path...

The Euro is much worse off. The EU will always need to support it's weaker member countries, while the US has massive taxing and borrowing capabilities.

Reason why EU should just kick out the weak member countries.

This would threaten the EU as being an ongoing concern. Many countries experience economic recession and this will not necessarily happen at the same time as the rest of the EU.

onlyu

full member

Activity: 165

Merit: 100

In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

This is good advice to anyone.
However, the euro seems to be walking down the same path...

The Euro is much worse off. The EU will always need to support it's weaker member countries, while the US has massive taxing and borrowing capabilities.

Reason why EU should just kick out the weak member countries.

Harley997

sr. member

Activity: 266

Merit: 250

Quote from: IIOII on June 22, 2014, 08:56:44 AM

In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

This is good advice to anyone.
However, the euro seems to be walking down the same path...

The Euro is much worse off. The EU will always need to support it's weaker member countries, while the US has massive taxing and borrowing capabilities.

ShakyhandsBTCer

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

It's Money 2.0| It’s gold for nerds | It's Bitcoin

Quote from: ShakyhandsBTCer on June 14, 2014, 06:15:56 PM

Quote from: waldox on May 27, 2014, 12:14:07 PM

US's broke, no money to bomb Syria and the US "help" to Ukraine is laughable, considering the Canadians sent more aircraft and advisors.

US can't fight a war with anyone - the Empire is gone, it's like the British Empire back in the 1950s.

USA has a president with brains now. Why should we give a rat's ass about Syria, the country is already infighting at this time and so is Ukraine. Why waste our money on it?

There is just no reason to fight like a fool is the point when there is no need to.

USA are in syria, iraq, libya, and not in north korea, is because of oil

venuezla, and iran are next they have lots of oil too

The vast majority of wars are based on oil.

Almost all wars in history were based on competition over resources of some kind.

I agree that US empire has reached its climax and is now collapsing. The US have made far too many enemies through their aggressive "foreign policy".

Unfortunately new empires will emerge - hopefully less powerfull ones that will have to respect the rights of weaker nations to a greater extend than the US.

The US empire is collapsing because of the fact that we have a president that doesn't have a clue what it is doing in relation to foreign policy (among other things).

I would disagree that the US has made too many enemies. Several democracies have been formed shortly after Bush left office (as a result in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, but IMO mostly Iraq). We have used our "big sward" to police the world and help countries in need (when they have no way of returning the favor).

okthen

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Quote from: bryant.coleman on June 22, 2014, 10:37:19 AM

In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

This is good advice to anyone.
However, the euro seems to be walking down the same path...

peeveepee

full member

Activity: 211

Merit: 100

Quote from: ShakyhandsBTCer on June 21, 2014, 03:30:08 PM

In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

True. Also, no one should store massive amounts of USD in their savings accounts. It is losing value everyday. One more major war (Iram may be?) and the US Dollar will become even more worthless than the toilet paper.

Not true.

The cost of Iran war will most likely less than the resources get back in return.

scryptasicminer

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Quote from: PolarPoint on June 21, 2014, 02:46:47 PM

The US cannot afford to go to war with China. China is the number one investor of US treasuries. If China stops buying, yield will rise. It would be more costly for the US to borrow for financing government.

I don't think China would stop buying US treasuries and/or sell off their treasury holdings, they would stand to lose to much if they did.

They can hedge the dollar depreciation/collapse by buying and locking in long term contract on foreign resources.

US has much more to lose if any foreign country refuse to accept dollar. The reason why there is so many on going conflict going on right now around the globe.

In essence, you can say US is doing China dirty work by invading another country for resources. But doing so only strengthen the dollar and benefiting country with high USD reserve and US is getting all the blame.

pening

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Quote from: zimmah on June 22, 2014, 07:13:21 AM

Quote from: pening on May 24, 2014, 02:30:31 PM

Quote from: Ron~Popeil on May 24, 2014, 12:12:01 AM

The last two countries to try this were Iraq and Libya.

This is tired old myth. Countries and companies deal in oil and gas using non-dollar currency all the time. Just because its booked in accounts as $ doesn't mean $ where used for the trade.

but it does strengthen the dollar, and that's what's important.

countries are revolting against the dollar monopoly and USA can't keep them down anymore.

It doesn't strengthen anything unless there is a trade in $ that requires $ to be acquired. If you are just booking the value to the days $/Currency x rate, there is no impact on either currency. There are billions traded in products from toys to pharmaceuticals to and from the US and across the globe, far greater than the oil value. billions more in $ denominated bonds stocks and simple currency speculation.

bryant.coleman

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In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

True. Also, no one should store massive amounts of USD in their savings accounts. It is losing value everyday. One more major war (Iram may be?) and the US Dollar will become even more worthless than the toilet paper.

IIOII

legendary

Activity: 1153

Merit: 1012

Quote from: ShakyhandsBTCer on June 14, 2014, 06:15:56 PM

In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

Many countries already would have done this, if there wasn't a huge pressure to avoid such steps. US military power prevented such initiatives successfully for decades.

Now, with US overloaded with debt and China and Russia leading the way, acceptance of USD as trade currency will erode quickly.

DubFX

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Activity: 434

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In my opinion it would be better for every country to skip USD, it's masively, but this is true meaning of masively inflated currency and its debt is growing every day.

IIOII

legendary

Activity: 1153

Merit: 1012

Quote from: waldox on May 27, 2014, 12:14:07 PM

Quote from: pening on May 24, 2014, 02:30:31 PM

US's broke, no money to bomb Syria and the US "help" to Ukraine is laughable, considering the Canadians sent more aircraft and advisors.

US can't fight a war with anyone - the Empire is gone, it's like the British Empire back in the 1950s.

USA has a president with brains now. Why should we give a rat's ass about Syria, the country is already infighting at this time and so is Ukraine. Why waste our money on it?

There is just no reason to fight like a fool is the point when there is no need to.

USA are in syria, iraq, libya, and not in north korea, is because of oil

venuezla, and iran are next they have lots of oil too

The vast majority of wars are based on oil.

Almost all wars in history were based on competition over resources of some kind.

I agree that US empire has reached its climax and is now collapsing. The US have made far too many enemies through their aggressive "foreign policy".

Unfortunately new empires will emerge - hopefully less powerfull ones that will have to respect the rights of weaker nations to a greater extend than the US.

zimmah

legendary

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Quote from: Ron~Popeil on May 24, 2014, 12:12:01 AM

The last two countries to try this were Iraq and Libya.

This is tired old myth. Countries and companies deal in oil and gas using non-dollar currency all the time. Just because its booked in accounts as $ doesn't mean $ where used for the trade.

but it does strengthen the dollar, and that's what's important.

countries are revolting against the dollar monopoly and USA can't keep them down anymore.

ShakyhandsBTCer

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

It's Money 2.0| It’s gold for nerds | It's Bitcoin

Quote from: PolarPoint on June 21, 2014, 02:46:47 PM

The US cannot afford to go to war with China. China is the number one investor of US treasuries. If China stops buying, yield will rise. It would be more costly for the US to borrow for financing government.

I don't think China would stop buying US treasuries and/or sell off their treasury holdings, they would stand to lose to much if they did.

PolarPoint

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The US cannot afford to go to war with China. China is the number one investor of US treasuries. If China stops buying, yield will rise. It would be more costly for the US to borrow for financing government.

Harley997

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Merit: 250

Quote from: Ron~Popeil on May 24, 2014, 12:12:01 AM

The last two countries to try this were Iraq and Libya. Thankfully the American people don't have the stomach to allow our government "bring democracy" to these newest offenders.

This would not be military feasible. If the US were to declare war on both Russia and China then they would likely become allies and we would likely not win

tabnloz

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I think there is a designated decline in the USD.

The game is up and the US implicitly acknowledges this; hence the gold stacking from central banks across the world. They'll never repay their debt and QE has not worked.

Further the big banking and finance stuff has been co-ordinated since the financial crisis and so countries have recently begun set up currency lines without remonstration. This is part of the move away from dependence on the USD.

The BRICS have been agitating for this for a while now, the US has sided with Iran and not the House of Saud in Iraq, Russia and China are doing direct deals, trusting their own currencies and not using the reserve currency as their will be no consequence - it wasn't long ago that this would have been a major shot across the bow.

arbitrage001

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China already have bilateral currency agreement with some countries to by pass USD.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internationalization_of_the_renminbi

Isn't it interesting to see Ukraine is on the list also? May be US will pick their next target on the list.

okthen

hero member

Activity: 490

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This is great news for btc!
Dollar down, bitcoin up!
Let's see if Russia and China realize that getting into bitcoin would also help bypassing the dollar...

Jonton

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Quote from: SunBin on June 20, 2014, 11:01:54 AM

Quote from: bitsmichel on May 24, 2014, 05:08:58 AM

Quote

The last two countries to try this were Iraq and Libya. Thankfully the American people don't have the stomach to allow our government "bring democracy" to these newest offenders.

The US cannot start war with Russia and China at the same time, its not a strategic decision.

Arrogance will make country/leader do foolish thing.

No way. Maybe there are some map exercises about such a scenario.

SunBin

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Quote from: bitsmichel on May 24, 2014, 05:08:58 AM

Quote

The last two countries to try this were Iraq and Libya. Thankfully the American people don't have the stomach to allow our government "bring democracy" to these newest offenders.

The US cannot start war with Russia and China at the same time, its not a strategic decision.

Arrogance will make country/leader do foolish thing.

ljudotina

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Falling dollar affects BTC only in a way that more Americans would go to BTC as value storage and effectivly rise the price of BTC. Nothing else. If dollar looses half of it's value, 1 BTC would be 1000$. One would say: "wow i have doubled my wealth!". Well you did not. As if that happens, 1 bread wouldn not cost x$ it would cost x*2$. So basicly, you as BTC holder did not gain anything...you just saved your wealth (which is goo thing for itself).
So, question is not : "How much $$$ is BTC worth?", question is : "What is buying power of BTC". Would buying power of BTC rise if dollar starts falling? Not if Americans decide to, for example go into Gold instead of BTC. Noone would gain nothing in that scenario (except gold owners as gold would go up).

tsoPANos

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In math we trust.

Well this is a start.
The dollar could slowly decline as the global trade volume decreases.
So the US wouldn't be able to print dollars from thin air without reducing it's value.
Which means that the US wouldn't be able to pay it's huge debt.

ljudotina

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Quote from: waldox on May 27, 2014, 12:14:07 PM

US's broke, no money to bomb Syria and the US "help" to Ukraine is laughable, considering the Canadians sent more aircraft and advisors.

US can't fight a war with anyone - the Empire is gone, it's like the British Empire back in the 1950s.

USA has a president with brains now. Why should we give a rat's ass about Syria, the country is already infighting at this time and so is Ukraine. Why waste our money on it?

There is just no reason to fight like a fool is the point when there is no need to.

You really have no idea why all recent wars were fought? Oil dude...noone gives flying fuck for Saddam or Bin Laden or any of those pricks...all they want is Oil. If they get get it from Devil itself for cheap, they will side with him, no questions asked. In adition, it's not State that runs it all, it's private organizations. To be honest...FED is private organization...cmon now...get down to earth from that cloud of yours.

Febo

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This deal is 10 years old. All is allready build. What is more important is But the BRICS countries — Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa, are making new Wold bank. For sure wil not be place for USD there. Maybe bitcoin.

waldox

sr. member

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yes
defund oil wars
hope they wake up and go bitcoin next

ShakyhandsBTCer

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Activity: 448

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It's Money 2.0| It’s gold for nerds | It's Bitcoin

US's broke, no money to bomb Syria and the US "help" to Ukraine is laughable, considering the Canadians sent more aircraft and advisors.

US can't fight a war with anyone - the Empire is gone, it's like the British Empire back in the 1950s.

USA has a president with brains now. Why should we give a rat's ass about Syria, the country is already infighting at this time and so is Ukraine. Why waste our money on it?

There is just no reason to fight like a fool is the point when there is no need to.

USA are in syria, iraq, libya, and not in north korea, is because of oil

venuezla, and iran are next they have lots of oil too

The vast majority of wars are based on oil.

Skele

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Activity: 224

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VocalPlatform.com

I see this as a very good thing. It clearly defines who is with who. The risk in that part of the world is growing stronger every day and where there is risk, smart business usually flees from it. That is the whole concept behind RISK MANAGEMENT. So if American manufacturing decides to move away from the far east, China's economy contracts creating problems. Such as what to do with all that energy they just signed a 30 year agreement with Russia to provide. Their economy began shrinking in 2007/2008 when the US went through the recession.

spazzdla

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US's broke, no money to bomb Syria and the US "help" to Ukraine is laughable, considering the Canadians sent more aircraft and advisors.

US can't fight a war with anyone - the Empire is gone, it's like the British Empire back in the 1950s.

no no no.. it's going to be like Rome... except everyone is now ruled by the same monetary system say for 3 countries. When....if the lazy dumbasses of this planet ever open their eyes things might change for the better.. Odds are they will never open them, things will crash and they will be to stupid to understand food and water are what wealth is and be begging for more paper...

At least the Romans knew paper and fake coins are worth absoultly nothing... If it can be printed to infinity.. it will become worth nothing.

waldox

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hopefully the chinese and russian or bric governments grow some braincells and use bitcoins as their reserve currency

waldox

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Activity: 252

Merit: 250

US's broke, no money to bomb Syria and the US "help" to Ukraine is laughable, considering the Canadians sent more aircraft and advisors.

US can't fight a war with anyone - the Empire is gone, it's like the British Empire back in the 1950s.

USA has a president with brains now. Why should we give a rat's ass about Syria, the country is already infighting at this time and so is Ukraine. Why waste our money on it?

There is just no reason to fight like a fool is the point when there is no need to.

USA are in syria, iraq, libya, and not in north korea, is because of oil

venuezla, and iran are next they have lots of oil too

DustyRah

sr. member

Activity: 533

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