SEC chairman on why the SEC will not approve a bitcoin ETF

bbc.reporter

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Quote from: guy369 on November 28, 2018, 10:01:23 PM

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 28, 2018, 09:00:48 PM

“What investors expect is that trading in that commodity that’s underlying the ETF is free from the risk or significant risk of manipulation,” said Clayton. “Those kinds of safeguards don’t exist in many of the markets where digital currencies trade.”[/i]

Read in full https://btcmanager.com/bitcoin-etf-sec-annoucement/

Risk of manipulation?

Gold has been proven to be manipulated, and yet they allow gold etfs

Most markets are easily manipulated by market movers on a daily basis.

Why? It is because gold is manipulated by the monarchs of the banking industry which are the masters of all the world's governments.

There will only be an ETF approved for bitcoin once the monarchs have already won enough control of all trading for the bitcoin market.

avikz

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 28, 2018, 09:00:48 PM

Examine what Jay Clayton said. It would only be very good for the SEC to approve an ETF if the manipulators of bitcoin and the whole cryptospace was their monarchs from the banking industry.

Our political and financial system is a big scam to enrich the monarchs.

Business Insider reported that the cryptocurrency industry needs to address certain security issues before seeing the approval of a Bitcoin ETF.

“What investors expect is that trading in that commodity that’s underlying the ETF is free from the risk or significant risk of manipulation,” said Clayton. “Those kinds of safeguards don’t exist in many of the markets where digital currencies trade.”

Read in full https://btcmanager.com/bitcoin-etf-sec-annoucement/

Personally I wouldn't want SEC to approve the ETF, because it will effectively hand over the control of the market to a market regulator, which is certainly not desirable! Even though few ETFs are going to infuse fresh liquidity to the market which is again needed now, but for the larger picture, handing over the controlling interest to SEC, is not a wise thing to do!

Also I believe crypto markets need to be more stable because common investors can't handle such volatile market even with the professional help! It will lead to a negative mindset for the crypto market among the common mass. I would say, let SEC do their things, but lets not bank on that!

zhanyiguai261315

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It may be because BTC and other cryptocurrencies lack effective supervision and are difficult to control!
At present, almost all the large bitcoin trading markets in the world are immature, and there is a great lack of strict supervision by the local government.

coinwizard_

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The speed at which the drop occurred tells us that the prices are highly likely to be manipulated. The flock is easily moved so a dump by the bitcoincash crowd is going to trigger the masses to panic sell

jseverson

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I don't see anything wrong with the reasoning presented. Yes, everything can and likely is manipulated, but it's not as black and white as that. There are varying degrees to this, and as things currently are, Bitcoin is more vulnerable to it than other traditional assets. Think about it: a large chunk of the community still believes that a single person could move the market on a whim. You can't really say that about other established assets.

At the end of the day, ETFs are completely under the SEC's prerogative so we can't really do anything to influence it either way. It doesn't have any fundamental effects on Bitcoin either, so it's not like the absence of an approval is a con for the community.

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Promise to approve soon ...

VanEck: SEC Will Approve Bitcoin ETF Soon
Separately, VanEck is still trying to win approval from the Securities and Exchange Commission to launch the first-ever bitcoin ETF.

In August 2018, the SEC rejected nine bitcoin ETF applications, dashing the hopes of crypto evangelists like the Winklevoss twins, who have repeatedly failed to win SEC approval.

In its order rejecting the latest round of bitcoin ETFs, the SEC said the applicants failed to demonstrate how they could prevent fraud and market manipulation.

Despite the recent SEC rejections, VanEck’s Gabor Gurbacs said he believes SEC approval is around the corner, as CCN reported.
https://www.ccn.com/nasdaq-to-launch-bitcoin-futures-2-0-in-early-2019/

nutildah

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Quote from: BuyBuyBitcoin on November 29, 2018, 12:35:33 AM

The protocol isn't changing so that the SEC can regulate it. It is not something the SEC can control the manipulation of in it's current form.

There wont be a bitcoin ETF. Ever.

Has nothing to do with the protocol. It has to do with measures being put in place to prevent price manipulation of a new category of asset.

BuyBuyBitcoin

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Quote from: nutildah on November 29, 2018, 12:14:01 AM

Its a Bitcoin ETF we're talking about.

You realize its a waste of time?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/youngjoseph/2018/07/27/sec-commissioner-bitcoin-is-regulated-and-mature-enough-to-have-an-etf/

Quote

The SEC further emphasized that the proposed ETF by the Winklevoss twins, who oversee a major US crypto exchange known as Gemini, does not have sufficient tools to identify and deter fraud and manipulation that could impose a negative impact on the price movement of Bitcoin.

The protocol isn't changing so that the SEC can regulate it. It is not something the SEC can control the manipulation of in it's current form.

There wont be a bitcoin ETF. Ever.

Kakmakr

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The thing is, they want to control and manipulate Bitcoin and they cannot do that, so the best thing they can come up with is to use regulation to slow it down. The SEC has never seriously considered any Bitcoin ETF, because their puppet masters already pulled the strings in the background to stop it from happening.

As someone has said before in this thread, the Gold price is being manipulated by cartels and they are fine with that, because they are the biggest hoarders of Gold. Roll Eyes

Coin-1

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As far as I remember, the SEC explained why they did not approve a Bitcoin ETF at the end of August 2018. One of the reasons is that 95% of BTC coins are concentrated on 5% of the BTC addresses which are in circulation. SEC also stated that the BTC price is highly manipulated and they mentioned Bitconnect.

I hope that the opinion of this agency will change in the future. Undoubtedly, ETF could be a strong driver for the growth of the Bitcoin price.

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Quote from: pooya87 on November 28, 2018, 11:46:32 PM

Quote from: guy369 on November 28, 2018, 10:01:23 PM

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 28, 2018, 09:00:48 PM

“What investors expect is that trading in that commodity that’s underlying the ETF is free from the risk or significant risk of manipulation,” said Clayton. “Those kinds of safeguards don’t exist in many of the markets where digital currencies trade.”[/i]

Read in full https://btcmanager.com/bitcoin-etf-sec-annoucement/

Risk of manipulation?

Gold has been proven to be manipulated, and yet they allow gold etfs

Most markets are easily manipulated by market movers on a daily basis.

i think the important word here is "significant".
we all know manipulation is everywhere. nobody dislikes making more money and there is always people with more money who try taking control of some markets trying to make more money from them. but when it comes to something like gold you never see its price drop 40% in a week out of nowhere and just because some whale accumulators wanted cheaper coins...
of course i believe that the reasons for denying ETFs is a lot more complicated than what they publicly say.

I agree with the notion that the underlying reasons for the ETF denials has layers to the situation that we simply cannot see. I also think the deep pockets with their hands on the button are not yet in a dominant position to control people with/through bitcoin and thus it becomes a direct threat to the wealth that they have accumulated. That is at least partly why ETFs keep getting turned down. Wait and see what happens though- it will all come to a boiling point when the grasps of the Federal Reserve are made weak, by decentralized efforts.
It gives me the chills!

History in the making!

nutildah

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I don't think its a conspiracy to keep the people down so much as bitcoin being an entirely new class of asset that doesn't have any of the traditional safeguards that protect stocks and other commodities. Its pretty much undoubted that BTC was being manipulated up to the MtGOX collapse and nearly certain that it was being manipulated late last year in its big run up. One step at a time... first Bakkt and then a bit more institutional involvement, and then maybe the SEC will have a different opinion. Still might take about 6 months or even longer.

https://xbt.net/blog/sec-chair-says-bitcoin-etf-possible-when-price-manipulation-concerns-are-addressed/

Quote from: BuyBuyBitcoin on November 28, 2018, 11:53:29 PM

ETF talk? This is bitcoin talk and nobody cares about ETF's or what the SEC says or does.

Its a Bitcoin ETF we're talking about.

BuyBuyBitcoin

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ETF talk? This is bitcoin talk and nobody cares about ETF's or what the SEC says or does.

pooya87

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Quote from: guy369 on November 28, 2018, 10:01:23 PM

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 28, 2018, 09:00:48 PM

“What investors expect is that trading in that commodity that’s underlying the ETF is free from the risk or significant risk of manipulation,” said Clayton. “Those kinds of safeguards don’t exist in many of the markets where digital currencies trade.”[/i]

Read in full https://btcmanager.com/bitcoin-etf-sec-annoucement/

Risk of manipulation?

Gold has been proven to be manipulated, and yet they allow gold etfs

Most markets are easily manipulated by market movers on a daily basis.

i think the important word here is "significant".
we all know manipulation is everywhere. nobody dislikes making more money and there is always people with more money who try taking control of some markets trying to make more money from them. but when it comes to something like gold you never see its price drop 40% in a week out of nowhere and just because some whale accumulators wanted cheaper coins...
of course i believe that the reasons for denying ETFs is a lot more complicated than what they publicly say.

guy369

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 28, 2018, 09:00:48 PM

“What investors expect is that trading in that commodity that’s underlying the ETF is free from the risk or significant risk of manipulation,” said Clayton. “Those kinds of safeguards don’t exist in many of the markets where digital currencies trade.”[/i]

Read in full https://btcmanager.com/bitcoin-etf-sec-annoucement/

Risk of manipulation?

Gold has been proven to be manipulated, and yet they allow gold etfs

Most markets are easily manipulated by market movers on a daily basis.

bbc.reporter

legendary

Activity: 3122

Merit: 1492

Examine what Jay Clayton said. It would only be very good for the SEC to approve an ETF if the manipulators of bitcoin and the whole cryptospace was their monarchs from the banking industry.

Our political and financial system is a big scam to enrich the monarchs.

Business Insider reported that the cryptocurrency industry needs to address certain security issues before seeing the approval of a Bitcoin ETF.

“What investors expect is that trading in that commodity that’s underlying the ETF is free from the risk or significant risk of manipulation,” said Clayton. “Those kinds of safeguards don’t exist in many of the markets where digital currencies trade.”

Read in full https://btcmanager.com/bitcoin-etf-sec-annoucement/

Topic: SEC chairman on why the SEC will not approve a bitcoin ETF (Read 257 times)