South Africa tells Putin -"If you come, you will be arrested"

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Quote from: LTU_btc on May 08, 2023, 05:45:13 PM

For me it looks like South Africa is trying to sit on two chairs on the same time. They don't want to ruin their relationship with West too much, but at the same time they don't really want to arrest Putin. So, they now simply ask him not to come to South Africa.

This is similar to what Germany was doing early in the war, and let's not forget about Hungary and Turkey.

Quote from: BADecker on May 08, 2023, 05:34:13 PM

Yabut, Medvedev would be in power, and he is smart enough and mean enough to destroy SA with nukes just to make an example of them. And Putin would agree to it if he were given the chance.

Cool

Maybe Putin wants to become a martyr Cheesy

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For me it looks like South Africa is trying to sit on two chairs on the same time. They don't want to ruin their relationship with West too much, but at the same time they don't really want to arrest Putin. So, they now simply ask him not to come to South Africa.

Quote from: coolcoinz on May 08, 2023, 05:53:22 AM

To me it was a poor attempt from Russians to explain why Putin has to stay in the bunker because the enemy can even reach the Kremlin.
Ukrainian drone operators who can throw a grenade through an open hatch of a moving tank would miss one of many windows and security guards and hit a flag pole? Pretty low chance of that if you ask me. At the same time someone conveniently records the roof and manages to capture the whole incident from a hand held camera, or a phone.

For me it's difficult to believe that it would be Ukrainian drone. Especially when not so long time ago we saw news from Russia that they covering Moscow with more air defense systems around the city and even putting it on roof of buildings.
Maybe it's worth to turn on 9th May pared from Moscow tomorrow, maybe something will happen there Cheesy

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Quote from: coolcoinz on May 08, 2023, 05:15:12 PM

Sure... SA will arrest Putin and Russia will nuke SA in retaliation, or they'll pack some of their tanks on ships and ferry them to SA to take over.

There was messages from Russian propaganda and politicians that if someone will arrest Putin, they will nuke that country. So, let's say South Africa arrest Putin. Does it mean that Russia will nuke South Africa together with arrested Putin. Interesting logic.

paxmao

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Quote from: Ebede on May 08, 2023, 09:43:37 AM

Can south Africa fight Russian, because if South Africa arrest Putin they will be ambush in south Africa because they don't have equipment to fight Russian when Russian come to them, and all the African will be affected, let south Africa maintain silence so that the fight of Russia and Ukraine will not affect them because they have no amenities of fight

My guess? If they arrest Putin someone else takes his place and thanks South Africa. It is a kleptocracy, there is no loyalty and anyone could replace the guy and keep the war with Ukraine going just as badly. The RF could do absolutely zero in military terms against S.A. They simply can't even if they wanted. Nuking and the like is a game with no winners.

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Quote from: coolcoinz on May 08, 2023, 05:15:12 PM

Quote from: Ebede on May 08, 2023, 09:43:37 AM

Can south Africa fight Russian, because if South Africa arrest Putin they will be ambush in south Africa because they don't have equipment to fight Russian when Russian come to them, and all the African will be affected, let south Africa maintain silence so that the fight of Russia and Ukraine will not affect them because they have no amenities of fight

Sure... SA will arrest Putin and Russia will nuke SA in retaliation, or they'll pack some of their tanks on ships and ferry them to SA to take over.
To win against SA that has over 200 MBT's, Russia would have to somehow transport 400 of their tanks there and even with twice the numbers they'd have a hard time, since Russian tanks are junk.
There's not going to be an arrest because Putin will not go there to risk an incident, but if he was arrested there would be no way for Russia to ferry enough forces to SA to defeat them. All they'd be able to do is to either try to bomb them, but SA has British starstreak systems to defend, or surround them with ships to put pressure and block trade.

Yabut, Medvedev would be in power, and he is smart enough and mean enough to destroy SA with nukes just to make an example of them. And Putin would agree to it if he were given the chance.

Cool

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Quote from: Ebede on May 08, 2023, 09:43:37 AM

Can south Africa fight Russian, because if South Africa arrest Putin they will be ambush in south Africa because they don't have equipment to fight Russian when Russian come to them, and all the African will be affected, let south Africa maintain silence so that the fight of Russia and Ukraine will not affect them because they have no amenities of fight

Sure... SA will arrest Putin and Russia will nuke SA in retaliation, or they'll pack some of their tanks on ships and ferry them to SA to take over.
To win against SA that has over 200 MBT's, Russia would have to somehow transport 400 of their tanks there and even with twice the numbers they'd have a hard time, since Russian tanks are junk.
There's not going to be an arrest because Putin will not go there to risk an incident, but if he was arrested there would be no way for Russia to ferry enough forces to SA to defeat them. All they'd be able to do is to either try to bomb them, but SA has British starstreak systems to defend, or surround them with ships to put pressure and block trade.

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Can south Africa fight Russian, because if South Africa arrest Putin they will be ambush in south Africa because they don't have equipment to fight Russian when Russian come to them, and all the African will be affected, let south Africa maintain silence so that the fight of Russia and Ukraine will not affect them because they have no amenities of fight

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Quote from: paxmao on May 07, 2023, 05:57:41 PM

There has been no attempt on Putin's life, that is a lie from the official propaganda. Putin was not in the Kremlin when the drones struck near the flag (if you are referring to that as an "attempt"). It is nearly impossible to kill anyone other than by mistake doing such a thing.

To me it was a poor attempt from Russians to explain why Putin has to stay in the bunker because the enemy can even reach the Kremlin.
Ukrainian drone operators who can throw a grenade through an open hatch of a moving tank would miss one of many windows and security guards and hit a flag pole? Pretty low chance of that if you ask me. At the same time someone conveniently records the roof and manages to capture the whole incident from a hand held camera, or a phone.

It would be interesting to see what Putin's security would do if the police of another country tried to arrest him.

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Quote from: OgNasty on May 04, 2023, 09:48:37 AM

Quote from: paxmao on May 03, 2023, 06:07:49 AM

https://www.intellinews.com/south-africa-tells-putin-don-t-come-or-we-will-arrest-you-277462/
https://novayagazeta.eu/articles/2023/05/01/sunday-times-south-africas-government-asks-putin-not-to-come-to-brics-summit-because-of-his-icc-arrest-warrant-en-news

Some people would say that the International Court of Justice order to arrest Putin does not make any difference. However, it seems that it actually does in international terms. A large part of any diplomatic negotiation happens behind the scenes, if informal networking and talks that happen in the corridors, not over the table. Putin's out of it now and that is going to create problems - mostly for the RF.

Quote

South Africa’s authorities have asked Russian President Vladimir Putin not to come to the country to participate in the upcoming BRICS Summit, Sunday Times reports, citing sources.

Was he really planning on being there anyway? I doubt it. Especially after the recent attempt on his life. Still, this sends a little bit of a message that his actions have consequences on the international stage so it's a good thing. I'm sure Putin appreciates the heads up as well that if he were to go there would be trouble. All in all, it seems this is a positive thing for everyone, unless Putin had some sort of desire to be there. I suspect that's not the case, but you never know.

Yes he was very interesting in attending, Putin is in dire need of international recognition and would have liked to have a picture with the "block opposing the US". Now that I think of it, I wonder what short of indirect route would have Putin's plan follow to get there avoiding the air space of all signatories of the treaty that may put him in jail.

There has been no attempt on Putin's life, that is a lie from the official propaganda. Putin was not in the Kremlin when the drones struck near the flag (if you are referring to that as an "attempt"). It is nearly impossible to kill anyone other than by mistake doing such a thing.

Yes, I am sure he likes the heads up, as South Africa appreciates that he has installed Zoom in his computer, so that they do not have to arrest him and create a problem for themselves.

Quote from: yhiaali3 on May 04, 2023, 05:32:14 AM

I believe that the arrest warrant is primarily a moral matter[...]

They know that they cannot bring Putin by force [...]

They cannot bring Putin to justice for now. But if there is a coup, whoever takes power may send him as a peace offering and at the same time not having to hang him. It is something more dangerous for the guy than a mere "moral judgement."

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Quote from: paxmao on May 03, 2023, 06:07:49 AM

https://www.intellinews.com/south-africa-tells-putin-don-t-come-or-we-will-arrest-you-277462/
https://novayagazeta.eu/articles/2023/05/01/sunday-times-south-africas-government-asks-putin-not-to-come-to-brics-summit-because-of-his-icc-arrest-warrant-en-news

Some people would say that the International Court of Justice order to arrest Putin does not make any difference. However, it seems that it actually does in international terms. A large part of any diplomatic negotiation happens behind the scenes, if informal networking and talks that happen in the corridors, not over the table. Putin's out of it now and that is going to create problems - mostly for the RF.

Quote

South Africa’s authorities have asked Russian President Vladimir Putin not to come to the country to participate in the upcoming BRICS Summit, Sunday Times reports, citing sources.

The ICC has the same effect as a pirate ship has on a regular ship. If the pirates are strong enough, the ship is lost. If the pirates are too weak, they leave... or maybe die in their attempt. Same with the ICC.

You don't see the captain of the ship being attacked by pirates (ICC) go for a visit to the pirate ship... at least not until he takes control of it.

24 Nations Align Against US Dollar As BRICS Looks to Launch New Global Currency

https://dailyhodl-com.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/dailyhodl.com/2023/04/28/24-nations-align-against-us-dollar-as-brics-looks-to-launch-new-global-currency/amp/
A total of 24 nations are now looking to build a strategic alliance that will challenge the US dollar's decades-long role as the world's reserve currency.

The group of five economically-aligned countries collectively known as BRICS is reportedly on the cusp of a massive expansion.

The core collective consists of Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa – and a surge of nations interested in joining the alliance would bring the total number of nations to 24.
...

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That really sucks what is happening to children and other civilian pop. In this war.
I fear it may get much worse when Ukraine tryes to retake the lost teritory.

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Quote from: paxmao on May 03, 2023, 06:07:49 AM

https://www.intellinews.com/south-africa-tells-putin-don-t-come-or-we-will-arrest-you-277462/
https://novayagazeta.eu/articles/2023/05/01/sunday-times-south-africas-government-asks-putin-not-to-come-to-brics-summit-because-of-his-icc-arrest-warrant-en-news

Some people would say that the International Court of Justice order to arrest Putin does not make any difference. However, it seems that it actually does in international terms. A large part of any diplomatic negotiation happens behind the scenes, if informal networking and talks that happen in the corridors, not over the table. Putin's out of it now and that is going to create problems - mostly for the RF.

Quote

South Africa’s authorities have asked Russian President Vladimir Putin not to come to the country to participate in the upcoming BRICS Summit, Sunday Times reports, citing sources.

Was he really planning on being there anyway? I doubt it. Especially after the recent attempt on his life. Still, this sends a little bit of a message that his actions have consequences on the international stage so it's a good thing. I'm sure Putin appreciates the heads up as well that if he were to go there would be trouble. All in all, it seems this is a positive thing for everyone, unless Putin had some sort of desire to be there. I suspect that's not the case, but you never know.

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I believe that the arrest warrant is primarily a moral matter, as it will increase the hatred of Putin and Russia around the world, since the Russian president is wanted as a war criminal by the International Court of Justice.

They know that they cannot bring Putin by force as they could not do it with the leaders of countries weaker than Russia before, but they issued the decision as a kind of isolating Russia from the world.

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I think this is just to concord with Hague International Court so they are saying to Hague since they are a member that if Putin comes here we will arrest him.The truth though is much different and that is even if Putin goes there which I doubt he will but in the case he goes I don't think anyone would dare arresting here as this would create an even bigger mess than the one already in Ukraine and would move balances which are in place so far.The fact that BRICS have a lot of disagreement between them adds to the fact that most likely Putin won't go there and nothing will happen.

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Quote from: Zlantann on May 03, 2023, 11:15:05 AM

Quote from: paxmao on May 03, 2023, 06:07:49 AM

Some people would say that the International Court of Huh

order to arrest Putin does not make any difference. However, it seems that it actually does in international terms. A large part of any diplomatic negotiation happens behind the scenes, if informal networking and talks happen in the corridors, not over the table. Putin's out of it now and that is going to create problems - mostly for the RF.

Quote

South Africa’s authorities have asked Russian President Vladimir Putin not to come to the country to participate in the upcoming BRICS Summit, Sunday Times reports, citing sources.

Putin was given the option of joining the summit using Zoom. I thought the union between these nations is so tight that not even the ICC can break it. But it seems the West still has great influence over some of these nations and all the news of a common currency is just media hype targeted are threatening the West. South Africa decided to abide by the Rome Statute than welcome an economic partner. This might be proof of an internal rift between in alliance. But it will be downplayed by the union after all every organization has its challenges. I was just imagining if South Africa didn't give this warning and Putin is arrested and sent to the Hague Huh

Which is what they wanted to avoid obviously, as they do have to comply with international treaties and at the same time cannot create an international incident in a conflict that probably matters little to SA. It is just diplomacy in action, but it certainly sends the message very clearly: Stay in Russia, China, North Korean and Iran. All the rest... well, at your own risk.

Honestly, arresting Putin would not be a good idea. He has achieved for NATO what they could not ever have dreamed of.

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Quote from: paxmao on May 03, 2023, 06:07:49 AM

Some people would say that the International Court of Huh

order to arrest Putin does not make any difference. However, it seems that it actually does in international terms. A large part of any diplomatic negotiation happens behind the scenes, if informal networking and talks happen in the corridors, not over the table. Putin's out of it now and that is going to create problems - mostly for the RF.

Quote

South Africa’s authorities have asked Russian President Vladimir Putin not to come to the country to participate in the upcoming BRICS Summit, Sunday Times reports, citing sources.

Putin was given the option of joining the summit using Zoom. I thought the union between these nations is so tight that not even the ICC can break it. But it seems the West still has great influence over some of these nations and all the news of a common currency is just media hype targeted are threatening the West. South Africa decided to abide by the Rome Statute than welcome an economic partner. This might be proof of an internal rift between in alliance. But it will be downplayed by the union after all every organization has its challenges. I was just imagining if South Africa didn't give this warning and Putin is arrested and sent to the Hague Huh

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Good. The 'S' in BRICS was needed for 'South America' anyway.

Probably there should be another 'I' added for Iran, although Israel is being pretty careful to preserve the ability to join the party. While the simple freier majority of that country is 'anti-putin/pro-ukraine', some of them are smart enough to see the writing on the wall, or simply read-in on the plan for the so-called 'Jews' to switch hosts when the final 'pull it' command is issued and the 'Collective West' is fully imploded.

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This is one of the reasons I read with a fair grade of skepticism those news that talk about the BRICS and their incoming currency being able to check mate the dominion of the dollar of the United States.
The truth is that BRICS is a quite heterogeneous organization with inner disagreements and problems among the members, while they continue to be that way it will be unlikely for them to face the USA and the European Union to change the balance of power on the planet.

Also, these kinds of arrest threats do not have much sense, they are a symbolic measure so people who are against the war can exclude Putin from visiting their countries and do not deal with the Russian State, etc. We all know that Putin being arrested is a very far away possibly, even if he visited South Africa, the authorities and diplomacy there would think twice before doing something.

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https://www.intellinews.com/south-africa-tells-putin-don-t-come-or-we-will-arrest-you-277462/
https://novayagazeta.eu/articles/2023/05/01/sunday-times-south-africas-government-asks-putin-not-to-come-to-brics-summit-because-of-his-icc-arrest-warrant-en-news

Some people would say that the International Court of Justice order to arrest Putin does not make any difference. However, it seems that it actually does in international terms. A large part of any diplomatic negotiation happens behind the scenes, if informal networking and talks that happen in the corridors, not over the table. Putin's out of it now and that is going to create problems - mostly for the RF.

Quote

South Africa’s authorities have asked Russian President Vladimir Putin not to come to the country to participate in the upcoming BRICS Summit, Sunday Times reports, citing sources.

Topic: South Africa tells Putin -"If you come, you will be arrested" (Read 206 times)