@zasad@. I reckon if projects want to receive funding from venture capitalists, the development teams will need to form a company and accept funding in exchange for shares in the company. The tokens will have to be bought from the market if they want the project's tokens.
What I am not quite certain if is if the tokens held by the projects in their treasury will be securities if they sell them direct to the public market. If not then venture capitalists can let the projects' teams to hold the tokens for them before unlock.
In any case, I predict the ruling will discourage venture capitalists from entering the cryptospace and we will witness these small projects that have smart and hardworking development teams become successful. Do you know the project Unibot?
Topic: Stand with crypto. Bitcoin is not a security (Read 307 times)
@zasad@. Agreed that it is arguable but only on how the sales of those tokens transpired. But the most important part of the ruling is the tokens by themselves are not illegal securities. If the next projects to be created take the judge's ruling as a predecent, they should avoid token sales as shares directly to investors and make direct to public market sales with them. This will need some creativity, however, it is not impossible similar to how we are witnessing airdrops and memecoins start their markets.
Airdrops and other distributions of tokens for activity are a way to distribute tokens, but the question arises: how to receive investments?In this case, the tokens will not be sold. The company will receive money from investors, and then these tokens will become the property of the investors who own the company. And it turns out that there was no token sale or what?
@zasad@. Agreed that it is arguable but only on how the sales of those tokens transpired. But the most important part of the ruling is the tokens by themselves are not illegal securities. If the next projects to be created take the judge's ruling as a predecent, they should avoid token sales as shares directly to investors and make direct to public market sales with them. This will need some creativity, however, it is not impossible similar to how we are witnessing airdrops and memecoins start their markets.
I don’t quite agree with the opinion about Ripple, because according to the court’s decision, some of the coins are recognized as the sale of shares and Ripple will still have to negotiate with regulators for a very long time to resolve all open issues. But this will not help all new projects, because they do not have such resources.
Hahaha I don't know what exactly Gary Gensler wants, he probably want to buy Bitcoin at lowest as possible and then he make good news like approval of Bitcoin etf.
In my country bitcoin is considered as an asset or commodity and it is legal to trade here even government gets a slice of the trade fee. This is best meme for Mr gary right now
In my country bitcoin is considered as an asset or commodity and it is legal to trade here even government gets a slice of the trade fee. This is best meme for Mr gary right now
Similar to what everyone who is following the news on uncle Gary has said, it took a judge to do the SEC's job for them and ruled the XRP token by itself as not a security. This has created a legal precedent that many of the tokens by themselves in the cryptospace are not securities.
Uncle Gary is the security hehehehehe.
Thanks for the information. According to the information provided by the BlackRock ex-director Bitcoin spot ETF is expected to be approved in the next 3 to 6 months.
Could it be that the CFTC and the banking regulators supervise the crypto sector is what's leading the Bitcoin sector ETF?
Because the government has always mentally enslaved us while making us feel we're free (democracy)whereas we're completely controlled and we only see what they want us to see
Everything is complicated by the fact that in the United States there is no legislation, and any initiative there has to be pushed through the courts, which takes a very long time.
About the Bitcoin forest most analysts, made the forecast in order to boost the market commitment and also to trend in the news. This reminds me of when the $100K price was predicted in the previous halving market, I am one of the few users of the forum who believe the ATH price won't reach $100K.
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Thanks for the information. According to the information provided by the BlackRock ex-director Bitcoin spot ETF is expected to be approved in the next 3 to 6 months.
Could it be that the CFTC and the banking regulators supervise the crypto sector is what's leading the Bitcoin sector ETF?
Because the government has always mentally enslaved us while making us feel we're free (democracy)whereas we're completely controlled and we only see what they want us to see
Everything is complicated by the fact that in the United States there is no legislation, and any initiative there has to be pushed through the courts, which takes a very long time.
About the Bitcoin forest most analysts, made the forecast in order to boost the market commitment and also to trend in the news. This reminds me of when the $100K price was predicted in the previous halving market, I am one of the few users of the forum who believe the ATH price won't reach $100K.
Thanks for the information. According to the information provided by the BlackRock ex-director Bitcoin spot ETF is expected to be approved in the next 3 to 6 months.
Could it be that the CFTC and the banking regulators supervise the crypto sector is what's leading the Bitcoin sector ETF?
Because the government has always mentally enslaved us while making us feel we're free (democracy)whereas we're completely controlled and we only see what they want us to see
Everything is complicated by the fact that in the United States there is no legislation, and any initiative there has to be pushed through the courts, which takes a very long time.
Hahaha I don't know what exactly Gary Gensler wants, he probably want to buy Bitcoin at lowest as possible and then he make good news like approval of Bitcoin etf.
In my country bitcoin is considered as an asset or commodity and it is legal to trade here even government gets a slice of the trade fee. This is best meme for Mr gary right now
In my country bitcoin is considered as an asset or commodity and it is legal to trade here even government gets a slice of the trade fee. This is best meme for Mr gary right now
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Technical, Bitcoin is security, and since it always makes new ATH in the halving effect market through the effort and investment of others.
I don't think that's what they refer to as effort by others. That would be too confusing, and by that logic, any asset like gold would be a security too since you need help from miners and so on. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if the government changes its interpretation to suit its goal if the opportunity comes.Yes, if the ETF is approved it will help the whole cryptocurrency and also boost the positive stance of other institutional investors but this is somehow not something the government wants now.
Futures ET is much easier to open due to fewer requirements and this is approved by the CFTC.
For a spot ETF, you must provide evidence that the market is not manipulative. Therefore, it is not Gary’s fault that this ETF still does not exist.
Let's look at it from this angle, Is the Gold market not manipulated? Why is it that there's a Gold spot ETF in the USA?
At least for now, they don't want BTC to spot ETFs that will provide investors with a convenient way to invest in BTC.
https://www.cftc.gov/sites/default/files/2019-12/oceo_bitcoinbasics0218.pdf
"Is Bitcoin a commodity?
Yes, virtual currencies, such as Bitcoin, have been
determined to be commodities under the Commodity
Exchange Act (CEA).
Does the CFTC oversee Bitcoin?
The U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission’s
(CFTC) jurisdiction is implicated when a virtual
currency is used in a derivatives contract, or if there
is fraud or manipulation involving a virtual currency
traded in interstate commerce."
It just happened today
SEC Chair Gensler Affirms Bitcoin Is a Commodity — 'That's the Only One I'm Going to Say'
https://news.bitcoin.com/sec-chair-gensler-bitcoin-is-a-commodity
"The chairman of the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), Gary Gensler, says bitcoin is a commodity. He emphasized that the SEC, the Commodity Futures Trading Commission (CFTC), and banking regulators will collaborate to oversee the crypto sector."
Could it be that the CFTC and the banking regulators supervise the crypto sector is what's leading the Bitcoin sector ETF?
Because the government has always mentally enslaved us while making us feel we're free (democracy)whereas we're completely controlled and we only see what they want us to see
Technical, Bitcoin is security, and since it always makes new ATH in the halving effect market through the effort and investment of others.
I don't think that's what they refer to as effort by others. That would be too confusing, and by that logic, any asset like gold would be a security too since you need help from miners and so on. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if the government changes its interpretation to suit its goal if the opportunity comes.Yes, if the ETF is approved it will help the whole cryptocurrency and also boost the positive stance of other institutional investors but this is somehow not something the government wants now.
Futures ET is much easier to open due to fewer requirements and this is approved by the CFTC.
For a spot ETF, you must provide evidence that the market is not manipulative. Therefore, it is not Gary’s fault that this ETF still does not exist.
Let's look at it from this angle, Is the Gold market not manipulated? Why is it that there's a Gold spot ETF in the USA?
At least for now, they don't want BTC to spot ETFs that will provide investors with a convenient way to invest in BTC.
https://www.cftc.gov/sites/default/files/2019-12/oceo_bitcoinbasics0218.pdf
"Is Bitcoin a commodity?
Yes, virtual currencies, such as Bitcoin, have been
determined to be commodities under the Commodity
Exchange Act (CEA).
Does the CFTC oversee Bitcoin?
The U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission’s
(CFTC) jurisdiction is implicated when a virtual
currency is used in a derivatives contract, or if there
is fraud or manipulation involving a virtual currency
traded in interstate commerce."
It just happened today
SEC Chair Gensler Affirms Bitcoin Is a Commodity — 'That's the Only One I'm Going to Say'
https://news.bitcoin.com/sec-chair-gensler-bitcoin-is-a-commodity
"The chairman of the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), Gary Gensler, says bitcoin is a commodity. He emphasized that the SEC, the Commodity Futures Trading Commission (CFTC), and banking regulators will collaborate to oversee the crypto sector."
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Technical, Bitcoin is security, and since it always makes new ATH in the halving effect market through the effort and investment of others.
I don't think that's what they refer to as effort by others. That would be too confusing, and by that logic, any asset like gold would be a security too since you need help from miners and so on. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if the government changes its interpretation to suit its goal if the opportunity comes.Yes, if the ETF is approved it will help the whole cryptocurrency and also boost the positive stance of other institutional investors but this is somehow not something the government wants now.
Futures ET is much easier to open due to fewer requirements and this is approved by the CFTC.
For a spot ETF, you must provide evidence that the market is not manipulative. Therefore, it is not Gary’s fault that this ETF still does not exist.
Let's look at it from this angle, Is the Gold market not manipulated? Why is it that there's a Gold spot ETF in the USA?
At least for now, they don't want BTC to spot ETFs that will provide investors with a convenient way to invest in BTC.
Technical, Bitcoin is security, and since it always makes new ATH in the halving effect market through the effort and investment of others.
I don't think that's what they refer to as effort by others. That would be too confusing, and by that logic, any asset like gold would be a security too since you need help from miners and so on. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if the government changes its interpretation to suit its goal if the opportunity comes.Yes, if the ETF is approved it will help the whole cryptocurrency and also boost the positive stance of other institutional investors but this is somehow not something the government wants now.
Futures ET is much easier to open due to fewer requirements and this is approved by the CFTC.
For a spot ETF, you must provide evidence that the market is not manipulative. Therefore, it is not Gary’s fault that this ETF still does not exist.
hero member
Activity: 2660
Merit: 651
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Technical, Bitcoin is security, and since it always makes new ATH in the halving effect market through the effort and investment of others.
I don't think that's what they refer to as effort by others. That would be too confusing, and by that logic, any asset like gold would be a security too since you need help from miners and so on. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if the government changes its interpretation to suit its goal if the opportunity comes.Yes, if the ETF is approved it will help the whole cryptocurrency and also boost the positive stance of other institutional investors but this is somehow not something the government wants now.
Technical, Bitcoin is security, and since it always makes new ATH in the halving effect market through the effort and investment of others.
I don't think that's what they refer to as effort by others. That would be too confusing, and by that logic, any asset like gold would be a security too since you need help from miners and so on. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if the government changes its interpretation to suit its goal if the opportunity comes. I don't even understand why Gensler at first will have to think about bitcoin as being a security. Everyone who understands securities can wholeheartedly attest that bitcoin is not a security. Unless the person purposely wants to hurt bitcoin which will not even be successful because bitcoin is highly centralized.
It feels bad for someone in an esteemed office to speak front he two side of his tongues, it doesn't tell good of his personality.
If Bitcoin is not a security, then answer a very, very important question of our time:It feels bad for someone in an esteemed office to speak front he two side of his tongues, it doesn't tell good of his personality.
Why the hell does the SEC regulate Bitcoin if another organization, the Commodity Futures Trading Commission (CFTC), should do it?
I don't even understand why Gensler at first will have to think about bitcoin as being a security. Everyone who understands securities can wholeheartedly attest that bitcoin is not a security. Unless the person purposely wants to hurt bitcoin which will not even be successful because bitcoin is highly decentralized.
It feels bad for someone in an esteemed office to speak front he two side of his tongues, it doesn't tell good of his personality.
It feels bad for someone in an esteemed office to speak front he two side of his tongues, it doesn't tell good of his personality.
"It's not a security." Gensler finally said it, too bad he made a fool of himself. 
The hearing was tough on Gensler and I heard there were rumors he could be removed from office.
He built his reputation as an enemy of Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, but now he's paying the price.
It is clear from the meeting that Bitcoin gained stronger positivity than before and that there is pressure on the (SEC) to approve Bitcoin ETFs, the decision on which was postponed for the first time, and the next date will be on 10/17/2023. We wait to see the results.
I think that after this meeting, the positivity towards Bitcoin will be clearer and stronger than before. We hope that this positivity shown by Congress will contribute to the market’s recovery.
Dissatisfaction with the activities of the SEC has long been growing in the American Congress, although I am not an expert on American politics, and perhaps I only receive this selection of news.The hearing was tough on Gensler and I heard there were rumors he could be removed from office.
He built his reputation as an enemy of Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, but now he's paying the price.
It is clear from the meeting that Bitcoin gained stronger positivity than before and that there is pressure on the (SEC) to approve Bitcoin ETFs, the decision on which was postponed for the first time, and the next date will be on 10/17/2023. We wait to see the results.
I think that after this meeting, the positivity towards Bitcoin will be clearer and stronger than before. We hope that this positivity shown by Congress will contribute to the market’s recovery.
The main question is which ETF will be the first, and it is possible that the first ETF in the US will be an Ethereum spot ETF. And after the Ethereum price pump, the spot Bitcoin ETF will be launched.
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I did some research about the Howey Test and I found out that it means "An investment contract exists if there is an "investment of money in a common enterprise with a reasonable expectation of profits to be derived from the efforts of others."
Technical, Bitcoin is security, and since it always makes new ATH in the halving effect market through the effort and investment of others.
If the spot ETF is accepted it will the Howey Test levels it.
I never expected Gary Gensler who once wanted to work with Binance before he was rejected could say such a thing about BTC. I guess he's just playing politics and will say something positive about BTC when he leaves the office just like Ex-Trump Chief Strategist Bannon
Technical, Bitcoin is security, and since it always makes new ATH in the halving effect market through the effort and investment of others.
If the spot ETF is accepted it will the Howey Test levels it.
I never expected Gary Gensler who once wanted to work with Binance before he was rejected could say such a thing about BTC. I guess he's just playing politics and will say something positive about BTC when he leaves the office just like Ex-Trump Chief Strategist Bannon
"It's not a security." Gensler finally said it, too bad he made a fool of himself.
The hearing was tough on Gensler and I heard there were rumors he could be removed from office.
He built his reputation as an enemy of Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, but now he's paying the price.
It is clear from the meeting that Bitcoin gained stronger positivity than before and that there is pressure on the (SEC) to approve Bitcoin ETFs, the decision on which was postponed for the first time, and the next date will be on 10/17/2023. We wait to see the results.
I think that after this meeting, the positivity towards Bitcoin will be clearer and stronger than before. We hope that this positivity shown by Congress will contribute to the market’s recovery.
The hearing was tough on Gensler and I heard there were rumors he could be removed from office.
He built his reputation as an enemy of Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, but now he's paying the price.
It is clear from the meeting that Bitcoin gained stronger positivity than before and that there is pressure on the (SEC) to approve Bitcoin ETFs, the decision on which was postponed for the first time, and the next date will be on 10/17/2023. We wait to see the results.
I think that after this meeting, the positivity towards Bitcoin will be clearer and stronger than before. We hope that this positivity shown by Congress will contribute to the market’s recovery.
The only thing missing is for Bitcoin to be a security and Eth a commodity, the world upside down. Without knowing about technical issues such as the Howey test, it is clear to me that securities are issued by certain corporations at will, they can issue more or less, as many as they want, while commodities are the ones that exist, at most they can be produced, but not issued at will. For example, wheat has to be produced, and gold not exactly produced but extracted, which we could consider a form of production.
It seems to me that uncle Gary is clear about this, although he supports it with more technical arguments. I don't think we should worry too much.
It seems to me that uncle Gary is clear about this, although he supports it with more technical arguments. I don't think we should worry too much.
"Chairman @PatrickMcHenry asks "What is it about Bitcoin that makes it not a security?"
Gensler after trying to dodge: "It does not meet the Howey Test which is the law of the land for being a security.
Gensler finally says "It's not a security.""
https://twitter.com/EleanorTerrett/status/1707039147091742818
LOL!
https://t.me/crypto_hd/7182
___
Stand with crypto
https://www.coinbase.com/public-policy/advocacy/standwithcrypto
"Stand with Crypto unites global crypto advocates, forming a passionate community committed to driving sensible crypto innovation and crypto policy. Policymakers across the globe are making decisions about the future of crypto. Their choices will determine how, when, and where YOU can build, buy, sell, and use crypto, and it’s critical that they get it right. "
___
Gensler after trying to dodge: "It does not meet the Howey Test which is the law of the land for being a security.
Gensler finally says "It's not a security.""
https://twitter.com/EleanorTerrett/status/1707039147091742818
LOL!
https://t.me/crypto_hd/7182
___
Stand with crypto
https://www.coinbase.com/public-policy/advocacy/standwithcrypto
"Stand with Crypto unites global crypto advocates, forming a passionate community committed to driving sensible crypto innovation and crypto policy. Policymakers across the globe are making decisions about the future of crypto. Their choices will determine how, when, and where YOU can build, buy, sell, and use crypto, and it’s critical that they get it right. "
___
Quote
US Representative McHenry said he is considering subpoenaing Gary Gensler.
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