Topic: Symmetric Step Trading: Now Closed (Read 7049 times)

We are happy to announce after agreement from existing shareholders and large investment of three figures from new shareholder this fund is now active at much greater depth of order book. Under agreement with new large investor this fund is closed immediately to others and all reports made privately.

This has now been very good result for us with full funding for our trading method.

Thank you to some few who left comments that are positive. We have learned most comments do not help or make insightful questions so on the forum we will resume our previous listening and learning and not discussing. We will not now also check PMs.

want to be part of the next btc arbs? go areas and throw your coins away.

Even if your English was perfect you'd still be an idiot.

You are one ignorant nigga. It's used mainly by bitcoin-otc for trading. I liked you better when I thought you were just a tool, now I know you're a tool and a dumb fuck.

@fluffypony: Too bad you do not understand joke was on pankkake. Sometimes native english speakers make mistake to think that poor english equals being stupid or just pretend this is true.

Dividends to May 21

No dividends will be distributed to shareholders up to ex-dividend date May 21 because we have small trading loss for this week.

Order book setups evaluated:   9
Order book setups executed:   3
Trading profits absolute:   -0.00060201
Trading profits percentage:   -0.0034%
Shares outstanding:   17,750

Passthrough Update and Direct Redeeming

Still the new exchange does not operate enough for the passthrough we described in OP. The direct redemption method therefore now will be operating for all shareholders to redeem.

Also we consider now buying back all shares because total capital for this fund does not enable to reach far enough order book depth to generate higher returns. Without order book depth returns will be limited in absolute. Shareholders with views about this or with interest to participate in our other trading activity can please contact us directly.

Dividends to May 14

Total dividends of 0.18611438 or 0.00001049 per share will be distributed in the next minutes coming to shareholders up to ex-dividend date May 14.

Order book setups evaluated:   12
Order book setups executed:   5
Trading profits absolute:   0.18611438
Trading profits percentage:   1.05%
Shares outstanding:   17,750

Sorry for you that GPG is hard. Probably you can find introduction guide to help you understand.

We have used PGP/GPG for long years before Bitcoin paper was written. Many people who are not very technical or have not been technical for long time think GPG was born from Bitcoin but such is a mistake. The Bitcoin people using GPG are like a drop of water in the ocean of PGP/GPG users.

Bitcoin-otc WoT is an ancient and ineffective trust system perpetuated by scammers.

It is no different than this forum trust system other than a few technicalities and a separate group of scammers.(cult of bitcoin-assets)

Refusing to join the Web of Trust is a red flag, indicating that you are trying to hide something.

@fluffypony: WoT total is under 5500 users and most do not do very much except to have account. During 10 or 11 months past the WoT has grown only 25% and forum has grown more than 150%. Therefore most people in WoT are old time users or dormant accounts and WoT is popular for scammers there because old time users more likely have many old bitcoins which did not need very much capital to buy. Yes some old time users like WoT very much and scammers like WoT very much and most bitcoin people do not care.

LOL. When I've been here long enough? You're a joke, guy.

Please enlighten me and name some non-scamming people that have been involved in Bitcoin from 2012 and aren't in the WoT.

Dividends to May 7

Total dividends of 0.16831129 or 0.00000948 per share will be distributed in the next minutes coming to shareholders up to ex-dividend date May 7.

Order book setups evaluated:   10
Order book setups executed:   4
Trading profits absolute:   0.16831129
Trading profits percentage:   0.95%
Shares outstanding:   17,750

@fluffypony: When you have been here long enough you do learn that not many people with long experience in bitcoin care about WoT and most people who do turn out to be scammers are very happy to be part of Wot. Biggest scammers usually have been here for very long time planning and making trust from others.

We are here to learn and to improve our trading method and now to share profits of that method with others.

You guys aren't noobs? Oh good - what's your WoT account?

FTFY.  If you wish to enjoy the credibility of an established Bitcointalk user, post from an established account.

@Namworld: It is not for offense to you or to call you a scammer but just part of our introduction to say we are not newbies and these are some things we have seen during the last many months.

I mean among so many outright scams to choose for, that you mention me being late on repayment on loan repayment based on a single post in the middle of a thread.

Dividends to April 30

Total dividends of 0.20088165 or 0.00001132 per share will be distributed in the next minutes coming to shareholders up to ex-dividend date April 30.

Order book setups evaluated:   12
Order book setups executed:   3
Trading profits absolute:   0.20088165
Trading profits percentage:   1.13%
Shares outstanding:   17,750

End of month reporting will be made after May because April results have included only one trading week.

Capital Allocation Update

During the next few days we will initiate moving of IPO funds into accounts for fund activity.

There cannot be any trading returns for first week before ex-dividend date on Wednesday so we plan for first trading update after second week.

Thank you for all feedback and for supporting PMs.

I have never heard the phrase "put your money where your mouth is" used by anybody else than people from USA and especially assholes from USA. All other reasonable people understand that investing is done with completely different strategies and not touching something with a 10 foot pole is a perfectly valid strategy for suspected cons even and especially if there seems to be an asshole that starts bullying and insulting you with the "put your money" crap.

I do not like a steaming pile of shit in the middle of carpet in my livingroom and even if I happen to express my dislike for it there is no way in hell I will start investing money anywhere near it and especially so if somebody start annoying me telling I have to put my money where my mouth is when he hears me talking about this dog excrement in my livingroom.

This comment is written solely to express my extreme dislike for the phrase "put your money where your mouth is".

OP, you're too broke to pay attention?

Too bad NotLamchop the OP did not challenge you to a bet.

We said if the loud noise mouths have so much certainty that they are right then they should put their money where their mouth is. If you think you are certain then you put up challenge. Example for 5:1 odds was guess about how right you think you are. If you think you are wrong then you should not choose 5:1. If you think you are certain then you should choose 100:1. If you like only to make noise about other people but you don't know anything as much as you claim then you should learn the phrase STFU. More now to the ignore link for NotLambchop.

@Darkstone2: Yes.

Only real discussions come from PM from people who do understand something about trading method and want to know more technically. Here on forum thread is noise from loud people only not saying anything but try to look like experts.

Fair point.

If OP challenges me to a bet, asks me for 5:1 odds in his favor, the very least he can do is set it up

Why are you waiting for something you can setup yourself at bitbet? I'd imagine OP has something better to do than creating bets.

Still waiting, OP, still waiting...

Remember sporket you are the newbie here making loud noises to impress others with false accusations and bad reasoning. We have developed method over nearly now one year and have made very nice profit from our work. You only make loud noises about you are so certain we are scammers but you have no evidence and no valid reasoning you have only fact that we wish to remain anonymous. We have said if you are so certain then you show us how certain you are and make bet. Now you just complain that we make too much work for you or guess wrong odds to show how certain you are. If you have nothing to say maybe you should learn the phrase STFU. For us we will use the link to ignore you.

Thank you to others for your patience while we listened to sporket that we are done with this waste now.

Thank you to others for your investments in 17,750 shares.

I think that, again, you haven't read half of my posts since you clearly misunderstood my opinion. I have indeed expressed interest in investments, but have decided against it for reasons mentioned in this thread (most important, the lack of openness provided about previous results).

This doesn't mean i think this is a total scam, but i am not on the side of SymStep either.  If anything, i would bet against SymStep because the odds (5:1) provided are so ridiculously.

You want me to make a bet with you.
You want me to give you 5:1 odds.
And you want me to also set it up for you?
Anything else you'd like, OP?
Oh yeah, you'd like people to send you some bitcoins,
Good luck, OP

Probably this is what people are meaning when they say Namworld default from original Bitfunder contract.

@NotLambchop and @sporket who are not scientists and do not understand that absence of evidence does not equal evidence of absence. You make many accusations and say they are obvious and reasoned but really are just prejudice because you cannot understand how somebody could make competent offering from successful research and you can only understand that they must be scammers. Now even when I say put your money where your mouth is and set up a bet because you are so certain we are scammers still you just use mouth and make no bet. Now you say wait for me instead to set up bet but I am not the one making false accusations because I can only understand people being bad people. This is what I thought that you have only mouth and you have shown this is true.

Now we go back to others who would like to invest and spend no more time on loud mouths who pretend certainty.

Asking others to take risks -> Best Risk Management

*Waiting for OP to get that bitbet going.  You can start one too, since you've expressed interest.  Mebby you 2 could pool ur coins together?

because risk management.

Darkstone2, now it's YOUR logic that fails.  Here's what OP is trying to do:

1.  OP promises you 2 doughnuts tomorrow if you give him one doughnut today. <== "invest with OP" 
2.  I point out shit ain't happening. <== "OP, put down teh glue"
3.  OP tells me he'll bet me a doughnut, @ 5:1 odds, that he will.  If he gives you 2 doughnuts tomorrow, I will owe him 5 doughnuts.
4.  I, being an average "investor" of this forum, gladly accept.
5.  OP gives you 2 doughnuts, collects my 5 doughnuts, ends up with 4 doughnuts.
6.   PROFIT!!1!

But hey, I'll play along with OP.  OP, set up a bet on bitbet, fund it with something interesting, let's say 50 BTC, and I'll take it.  Put your money where your mouth is

BTW, ask yourself:  If OP has personal funds to tie up in bets, why is he asking for your money?

If you're talking to me, both of those company's where purely hypothetical.

His logic fails? Ehm.. I think that you have skipped over his last few posts, because he clearly mentions:


There are various websites for this, for example there is an 'neobee orphaned in 2014' bet here: http://bitbet.us/bet/762/neobee-orphaned-in-2014/. If you are so certain this is an obvious scam, putting your money in bitbet seems like a solid investment.

I think I missed something here.

Laughter is the only reasonable response to your offer.  It also happens to be a textbook example of "putting my money where my moth is."
Giving you money, while simultaneously calling you out, would be absurd.  Your logic fails at this, the most basic of levels.
Leaving me without doubts about your other abilities.

Protip:  Don't rush things, OP.  Start with realistic, attainable goals -- stealing apples from street vendors, for instance.  If things work out, you could work up from there.  Best of luck.

We have offered you opportunity to put your money where your mouth is and turn your certainty into easy money. You decided not to do this and I wonder why?


As you say it admitting to running afoul of country's laws is not same as seeing that nobody's country has made crowdsourced bitcoin fundraising explicitly legal. I am sorry you do not understand logical structure of statement but insist to make your own false conclusion without reason.

We do not come here to argue with some people who troll the securities forum to talk about bitcoin securities are not legal.


We are sorry you find us lacking skill and making clumsy manner so you choose being disrespectful.

We have been doing this for nearly one year and have developed step trading method with 36% return during 9 months. It has been very profitable thank you. If you have any technical questions about real investment method please ask.

My reasoning is sound.  Above you admit to running afoul of your country's laws by soliciting money for this scheme.
I have no problem with petty financial crime, but your obvious lack of skill and clumsy manner make it painful to watch.  Such hapless antics are catnip for budding LEO, and are bound to end badly for you and your ... "investors."

We know our English is not perfect but we did not expect this to be so hard for a few people to understand and for so many false reasonings to seem correct to a few people. Show us somewhere that relaxed governments have made it legal for raising funds in bitcoins with crowdsourcing. No you can't think of any? Then maybe you should reconsider your reasonings that seem so correct to you about what we have said.

Since some handful of nameless people now are making such loud noises once our offering begins we have a perfect gentleman proposal for you. If you are so certain that we are lying or making an obvious con then you can make easy money by placing a bet that you win if we run away with investor money. Put your money where your mouth is and make a bet for us. You must be willing to give us very good odds since you are so certain maybe you would like to make it 5 to 1? Set up the bet please and put your money up in escrow so we can see how certain you are really. We will take your bet with personal capital.

If your offering is legal in your home country, your fear of "legal and personal problems" implies one of the following:

1.  You plan on doing other shady shit to cause those problems.
2.  You are insane.
3.  You are lying.
4.  ? [Feel free to construct another plausible scenario here to show me wrong]

I have no problem with you trying to eek out a living, OP, but have little patience for the clumsy, lazy, poorly conceived and badly executed scams that quickly become a source of embarrassment -- both to you and your marks.

I read what you wrote, which is why I asked the questions.   You're choosing not to answer. 



(emphasis mine)

I'd love to judge your proposal on its provable merit.  However, there is none.  The problem is that there are no elements we can examine, no proof to your claims, and no recourse if you're lying or incompetent.  If we take only what can be proven here then we have only an anonymous post on a forum and a BTC address. 

No it is not safe to assume any such plans.

We understand that it is hard for some people to judge a proposal on merits maybe because they have only bad personal experiences or maybe because they see only bad in others. We have not come to ask for your personal endorsement but to make offering to be judged on merits.

We respect that you can see only bad in our offer and we respect that you will not be involved.

Thank you for support from others who continue with creation of fund during these last hours. Now 12,750 shares are held.

If what you propose is legal in your country, is it safe to assume you're planning on doing some other shady shit to cause those "legal and personal problems"?

Obvious con is obvious.

Please read what we have written. What it means is that bitcoin trading of this type could cause legal problems and personal risk and that is why we have no choice except that both of us remain anonymous.


Please read what we have written. We do not welcome investments from locations where an offering of this type is prohibited according to law.


Please read what we have written.


Please read what we have written and that reporting will include an update on our trading activity.

Please read what we have written about verifying our method with public trading data. Many people who understand how method works already can look at public trading data to see why our success has sustained for many months.


Please read what we have written including our history of developing this method now over last 10 months and placing our capital at risk and earning very satisfactory reward during this time. Now we are continuing our method to be open for other people.

There are many ways to contribute to fund and you think that only money is mattering to success. However without our research and development for creating method there would not be a fund at all. If you know how to apply our method then you do not need us to do it and you can do it yourself without having worries about our money or your money.


Please read what we have written including our respect for those people who will not be involved in any anonymous fund. Many times bitcoin community welcomes those who need affordance of anonymity but many people are hostile to this. We respect that you are hostile to this and that you will not be involved in fund.

Thank you already to others who have already supported creation of fund with now 6500 shares in last few hours.

If I understand correctly, this means that bitcoin trading and offering investments is not legal in one or more of the countries where you live.  Is that correct?


Are you rescinding the offering?  If not, then you should have enough confidence in your legal standing to provide identification.

Which countries do you operate out of?



What exactly will be in the reports besides the NAV and the weekly gains/losses you report already in the form of dividend payments?  How can the information you report be verified as truth?


So...  none of your own money.  You share none of the risk.

You get a 15% reward of the profit, but none of your trading activity and resulting gains or losses can be verified.  You can report whatever profits or losses you wish and keep the results.  If you are inept or dishonest, there is no way to prove it.  You are unwilling to provide proof of identity, and can simply disappear when you want with no recourse for the 'investor'.

This might as well be one of those "Send me your money and I'll send 2x back to you!" threads, for all of the evidence provided.

Now we are ready to begin and have updated the OP with details of share offering mechanism.

Thank you for your feedback.

We have now updated the OP with improved method for setting ex-dividend date. Each week this will be Wednesday so that shareholders on Wednesday according to transaction time shown by blockchain.info will be entitled to share of dividends paid by end of that week. No separate ex-dividend date will apply when dividends are paid every second week so still it will be the Wednesday before dividend payment.

If there are not other questions we will begin offering soon.

Many good order book setups have happened during the recent days so we are eager for the start.

We have now updated the OP with improved offering document to show private guaranteed buyback method and explain initial offering method. Also we have increased the minimum dividend payment per shareholder from 0.0005 to 0.001 bitcoins each so that possible network fee occupies smaller proportion of total amount of payment.

If there are other questions about offering we thank you for your feedback. We hope to open the offering soon with improved offering document.

Aside from graphs being 'pretty', they're also an extremely valuable reporting tool.

I have no questions about the technical aspects because i understand exactly what you're doing. I'm not using this technique myself since i found it too hard to automate. The technical aspect of your IPO is solid, it is the personal aspect that does not convince me.

That is OK we respect that you will not want to be involved in any anonymous fund. We told in the OP why we must remain anonymous but we understand especially for those in rich countries with relaxed governments it is hard for you to understand why anyone would have need to be anonymous unless it is to steal your property. We respect also that it is hard for you to understand why research and software development process to create our screening tools does not include complete account deposit histories or pretty graphs.

With respect to you to us this is funny because someone can easily make up pretty graphs and publish spreadsheets with every deposit date. We are not going to make up these things because our goal is not to convince you.

We expected many technical questions about problems of dark liquidity because that is important risk for our method. We did not expect questions for things that could be made up.

For people who are interested more in technical details of offering we are still working on some details but will be ready soon. For example we think to offer guaranteed buyback option instead of manual share transfers if passthrough does not proceed or new exchange is too slow to make start. Manual share transfer needs shareholders to contact and show some personal information to us so we think this is not preferred. Instead we will offer guaranteed buyback method so shareholder sends special amount like 0.0123abcd where abcd is number of shares to redeem and fund sends back bitcoins to same address for abcd shares. This way all is on blockchain and no emails take place. This enables up to 9999 shares for redemption at once so for more it just takes separate transaction. Redemption can be at 95% of NAV so this is benefit to fund but also this is smaller than trading spreads and fees on exchanges like Havelock.

There is, at this time, not enough evidence to know wheither your security follows the imaginary ScamInvestments or FairTrading model. Given the track record of bitcoin securities, i'm leaning towards the ScamInvestments model since i see no reason why an honest company would refuse to give such proof.
Actually i was off one decimal.

If i was creating an IPO (which, just to be clear i'm not planning to since i gain nothing from having more capital available). I would be able to give investors some pretty graphs which i use myself. I would also provide investors with an withdraw and deposit history of some of the exchanges i'm on.

For example, i'm active on cryptsy. I would remove all my funds from the exchange, then i would release my api key to the public. Now everybody can verify my trading history (up to the last 9000 or so trades since cryptsy's system has problems processing large trade histories, which would be a problem for me, but not for you), my deposits and withdrawls, and transfers.

Now i'm pulling some numbers out of thin air. Say the total of my deposits add up to 0.5 btc, and the total of my withdraws add up to 5 btc. Now it's pretty clear that i'm not lying to the community, and that i have indeed something on my hands that works.

I don't understand that you say both "ScamInvestments" and "FairTrading" refuses to give proof of success but you think that "ScamInvestments" applies to our method and "FairTrading" applies to somebody else.

Before you said your trading bot was up 55500% and that if you want you could create graphs with automated scripts from trading data to prove to investors how successful is your method.

However there is nothing like proof in pretty graphs. Maybe you have turned 1 unit of currency into 556 units of currency but showing pretty graphs created by bot does not prove anything like that. Also your trading bot has no evidence from blockchain so why can we believe you?

Because we do not have pretty graphs to give you now you say that maybe our method is likely to be "ScamInvestments" but that does not make any sense. It would make sense if having pretty graphs was proving of method but it does not.


Maybe you have misunderstood what returns mean and irrelevance of internal rate of return for our researching.

We said our method has returned 36% during last 9 months but this rate underestimates real gains due to additions we have made to our capital. Since we did not first intend to launch fund we did not keep records in way to calculate rate of return accounting for new additions to our capital. This does not mean we do not know how to calculate rate of return. It means that calculating this rate was not relevant for us in beginning of researching our method.

Instead we focused on making improvements to our method and measuring declining impact from dark liquidity and increasing resilience against orders made by other traders during our order book setups in progress.

Yes if we collect all our bitcoin purchase data and all our dates we added new bitcoins to our investment capital then we can make some show of precise calculation of rate of return but this is not relevant for us because during 9 months our screening tools changed many times.

Otherwise is like saying an investor is stupid because he only keeps track of annual growth in portfolio value and does not have perfect dates when he puts new dollars in his brokerage account. How many real investors calculate internal rate of return instead of annual growth in portfolio? A real investor wants to perfect method for deciding whether should buy IBM or should buy Intel and does not care if his 10% annual gain is really 12% internal rate of return when tracking dates of his deposits.

Knowing 12% internal rate of return does not make his 10% annual gain any bigger.

Also it does not tell him whether should buy IBM or should buy Intel.

You want to launch an IPO but you are not able to calculate the internal rate of return for a series of cash flows? 

Imagine my company ScamInvestments:

I create a trading strategy that sounds good but does not work in practice.
I pull some profit numbers out of thin air.
I create a well written IPO thread that advertises these two points and ask people to invest in me.
When people ask for proof of success, i refuse to give them such thing. Since there is obviously none.
After paying about 3 months or dividends or so, i run with the money. 'my money was on mt. gox/cryptostocks/vicurex' (or any other exchange, there are many to choose from every month).

Also imagine the company FairTrading:

FairTrading spent a lot of time to come up with a strategy that works.
FairTrading creates an very well written IPO thread that advertises this strategy with profit numbers and asks to invest in FairTrading.
When people ask for proof of success, FairTrading refuses to give them any sort of proof.
After a few years the company is still paying out dividends.


Given the track record of securities in this forum, which model seems more likely?

@binderclip: We think that bitcoin investors have become cautious about trusting websites which are easy to make. Now investors demand financial records for working companies and good business plans for starting up companies. For mining companies all is on the blockchain for everyone to see. For investing in our method we think the biggest question is have we explained how it works? Or is there only a black blox that is supposed to make profits? We think many worst investments are only black boxes with pretty websites and no explanation how they really make profits.

Do you have a website? This is an interesting idea but how do I know you've actually pulled it off? For an example of transparency check out the website for variable reinvestment mining (I have no affiliation)

Sounds too final. Hope not

@darkstone2: Maybe our explanation has not been good for understanding. Relationship of capital to order book depth happens because moving the market price is adding new "steps" to order book or removing old "steps" from order book. Placing market order for full amount available at a given price removes that step from order book and market price changes to next step in order book. For example when method can take out only one or two steps from the order book because we have not enough capital then asymmetries that are deeper in the order book are past our reach. We can identify them but we cannot act on them. When method can remove more steps from the order book because we have more capital then we can reach asymmetries that are deeper.

There's an high change that the trading algorithm you are using has some kind of correlation between the gain and the amount of cash required.

For example, algorithm X has 10 bitcoin available, over some amount of time algorithm X turns that into 15 bitcoin.
In an different, but parallel dimension, algorithm X has 100 bitcoins to work with. Will the final amount of bitcoins be 105, 150 or something close than 200? In case of my bot, you would end with 105, thus seeking investors is useless.

If you can say with how many bitcoins you started with, and with how many bitcoins you ended with, and can explain why you think the profit margin rises (or levels, as measured in percentages) when you have more capital available. Then you have a much better business case. Based on your IPO's financial structure i expect that you've traded with an amount of between 5 and 10 bitcoins so far.

The pupil becomes the master

@darkstone2: Thank you. I do not understand what it is vague about gaining 36% during 9 months but I think you are making a joke about your bot that already turned 1 unit of currency into 556 units of currency. We use automated tools for identifying order book setups but we do not have an automatic trading bot.

@Peter Lambert: Thank you. It is a great strength of bitcoin that it affords anonymity but we agree that often this has not worked for serving investors. We know that some anonymous users get great trust from doing many successful transactions and then whenever they want they can run away with thousands of bitcoins. For example many people had great trust for TradeFortress and give him their bitcoins when he says he will make profits and give them 22% per year. But how did he ever make these profits and why did people trust when they did not know? We think investors safety benefits from knowing how someone does make their profits when they are anonymous or when they are known by name. So we hope our explanation is easy to understand.

Get that bullshit out of here.

Theres a reason nobody posts in that thread or takes it seriously.

Yes they did. But the way Bter keeps track of 'trades' highly amplifies the amount of entries in their database. So that number means nothing really.

I just wanted to point out that getting an decent history of trades is a lot harder than it seems. This is kind of suck, since the exchanges are nothing more than giant bookkeeping companies.

Wait...do you mean they gave their complete executed orderbook? Cause 12000 trades in 3.5 days just seems too much for a single account - if true, hats off to you man.
And on that, I certainly would love to hear more about this 55000% up bot

That doen't make any sense. My own trading bot is up 55500% since i first booted it up, i have csv's with data from every account and automated scripts to create graphs from that.

If i wanted to, i'm able to give that information to investors. Yet, you company had been running for way longer than my 'adventure', is evidently way more professional, and all you can do is provide a vague statement that we've made 36% profit over the last 9 months.

If i was an investor, i would like a bit more information than '36% up in 9 months'. Notice i say how i'm up 55500%, a statement that does not tell you anything. Perhaps my initial investment was 1 doge.

This is a lot harder than it looks. I asked the folks at bter.com for a ful trading history to analyze, they gave me an csv with 12000 trades... spanning a total of 3½ days. It doesn't get any better on different exchanges.

Who are you? It has been shown over and over again that having an anonymous business owner does not work for investors.

@twentyseventy: Thank you. During last nine months our total investment capital in bitcoins is 36% above amount we have put into our funds but this makes gains underestimate real gains because of our additions to funds during those months.

@Neo.op: Thank you. Yes we think method has been successful but not as successful as buying more futures which we did before applying the symmetric step method. The method has improved because more people are doing price arbitrage. Yes a human is needed to decide before executing order setup especially when exchange allows dark liquidity. Decision about risk of hidden orders must consider the hour of day and recent dark liquidity but maybe still get it wrong. It is easy to identify order book setups but not so easy to decide when not to do anything with a setup.

@jimmothy: Thank you. Before verifying our identity we must trust the other party and know details of what they do with this knowledge but nobody knows exactly who is Havelock or their legal regulations. For passthrough we only deal with one person to be known to us and trustworthy and only they deal with exchange.

While I understand that you may not have kept impeccable records, you should at least have some records of buys/sells, deposits, etc. Any exchange would keep track of this information. It's not enough here to say 'we've definitely made money in the past, but we don't have any proof of that'.

Firstly, it is one of the most detailed IPO description I have seen. Most skip on the details. Though I have some questions:
a. as asked by twentyseventy - Past results? While it might be less indicative of future performance, this will gives us an idea if the method being employed was at least successful. And if the profit has dried down with many people doing the same thing?

b. Automation - It seems rather strange that the modelling of the method lead to overfitting. Does it mean there is some discretionary part in the plan which has not been covered in the IPO description?

Verify ID and list on havelock and I'm sure many might consider investing.

@twentyseventy: Thank you. We do not know that past performance will be a very reliable indicator but we hope that it will continue to be. The activity on exchanges has changed very much since we started and also we did not track performance numbers in percentage terms of invested funds because we kept adding more bitcoins into the project over the months. For example when we added 25% more to our investment funds in week 3 of the month this makes gains at the end of the month underestimate real gains as percentage because at the start of the month we had 20% lower funds to invest. When we started we did not think to offer fund with others so we did not track performance like this.

@runakOk: Thank you. We agree that this is very limiting for people who will not be involved with any anonymous fund and we respect that maybe this will be most people. We must be very careful about our identities even for only one of us because the connection between us is known to some people. If we list with a passthrough structure then operator would become public face of fund and we just manage. This would be preferred for us because it separates us from the exchange but also we are looking at ways to make share transfers without an exchange and without contacting us. For example we may suggest that shares transfer by agreement to transfer private key for ownership address from seller to buyer.

With respect, this is literally "send us your BTCs and trust us because we can compose a reasonably well written thread".

It's an improvement on some of the IPO threads we see around here, granted, but there is still zero possibility of any recourse should you decide to disappear with people's bitcoins.

A trusted member should be provided with and be able to verify ID for one of the partners at a minimum.

You say you are "in discussion about a passthrough structure for listing on a new exchange" -- in discussion with whom?  Will they be verifying ID?

Liked your introductory paragraph. Can you guys provide any hard numbers about your past performance and/or any evidence to back it up?

IPO details are included now in the OP.

This fund is now closed and fully funded by private investor after May 28.