The cost of mining bitcoin from large miners

WillyAp

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Quote from: stompix on July 17, 2023, 02:24:34 PM

Incorrect!
Sending electricity over high voltage lines has little loss, they are minimal over 765 and 500kV, what makes the oses are distribution issues and smaller lines, you lose more power between a transformer and your house 50 meters away than in 300 miles of high voltage lines., of course, percentage-wise.
And no, going small is not efficient at all.

Well if a storm takes out the high power lines a few 1000 households are without power.
Each solution has advantages and disadvantages.

safar1980

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Quote from: Z390 on July 16, 2023, 03:58:52 AM

Quote from: safar1980 on June 13, 2023, 11:39:43 AM

Solar electricity is very good for large cities, because with the help of solar panels you can not consume the energy of the power supply plant during the day, and run the turbines only in the evening, night and morning. And this justifies itself in countries such as India or China. Home miners use electricity at night when it is 30-40% cheap.

It seems you have more knowledge about mining than I do, since you made mention of turbines I will like to tell you about the challenges I faced as a miner in the past and maybe you can give me a proper solution that will work in my case.

I have a solar mining setup at home, basically for gPUs not Asic miners, even with GPU miners I can't run them at night because my batteries can't run them till the next morning, I only enjoy mining once the sun rise in the morning, so that's like 8am to 5pm of continuous mining, but once the sun goes down, it's problem.

Can turbine works in my case? I am guessing you meant wind turbine energy, I am from Nigeria and I heard Turbines are good in a windy area, what can you tell me about this?

It's why I haven't started mining Bitcoin with free energy yet because it takes lots of watts from the wall.

You have the option of mining from 8:00 to 17:00 with solar panels, although I don't think you don't have rainy and cloudy days, but wind turbines are wind dependent and each turbine has an optimal wind speed for maximum power. You will not be able to mine at night without batteries. But for lighting, it can be used, but it is better to ask local experience in using such equipment and how it works in conditions of storms, sand, dust and similar weather conditions.

stompix

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Quote from: WillyAp on July 17, 2023, 09:37:06 AM

That is a plus. a big one too. It forces the industry to go small. Those huge farms are not the best, just sending off Terawatts to a 250 km away destination has a drag, a loss which could power a small city most likely.

Incorrect!
Sending electricity over high voltage lines has little loss, they are minimal over 765 and 500kV, what makes the oses are distribution issues and smaller lines, you lose more power between a transformer and your house 50 meters away than in 300 miles of high voltage lines., of course, percentage-wise.
And no, going small is not efficient at all.

Quote from: Z390 on July 16, 2023, 03:58:52 AM

Can turbine works in my case? I am guessing you meant wind turbine energy, I am from Nigeria and I heard Turbines are good in a windy area, what can you tell me about this?

I think he meant steam turbines because those are the only ones you can predictably turn on at a fixed hour when the sun goes down, wind although still predictable close to even 48 in advance wiht new er technology if it doesn't happen it doesn't, so you're stuck with no power.

Quote from: Z390 on July 16, 2023, 03:58:52 AM

It's why I haven't started mining Bitcoin with free energy yet because it takes lots of watts from the wall.

As long as it costs you even a penny to make it's no longer free. Solar panels, wind turbines and batteries cost money, thus making the produced electricity not free.

WillyAp

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Quote from: Z390 on July 16, 2023, 03:58:52 AM

Can turbine works in my case? I am guessing you meant wind turbine energy, I am from Nigeria and I heard Turbines are good in a windy area, what can you tell me about this?

Around 30 meters high there is plenty of wind everywhere.
Fact is you need to have a wind turbine which is able to withstand a lot of wind. Storm like wind.
Those destroy wind turbines easily.

Quote from: kano on June 12, 2023, 07:23:24 PM

Energy storage is, to be blunt, in it's infancy, and anyone trying to store 100's of kilowatts or megawatts will have already learned the hard way how problematic, with current technology, that is.

That is a plus. a big one too. It forces the industry to go small. Those huge farms are not the best, just sending off Terawatts to a 250 km away destination has a drag, a loss which could power a small city most likely.

Z390

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Quote from: safar1980 on June 13, 2023, 11:39:43 AM

Solar electricity is very good for large cities, because with the help of solar panels you can not consume the energy of the power supply plant during the day, and run the turbines only in the evening, night and morning. And this justifies itself in countries such as India or China. Home miners use electricity at night when it is 30-40% cheap.

It seems you have more knowledge about mining than I do, since you made mention of turbines I will like to tell you about the challenges I faced as a miner in the past and maybe you can give me a proper solution that will work in my case.

I have a solar mining setup at home, basically for gPUs not Asic miners, even with GPU miners I can't run them at night because my batteries can't run them till the next morning, I only enjoy mining once the sun rise in the morning, so that's like 8am to 5pm of continuous mining, but once the sun goes down, it's problem.

Can turbine works in my case? I am guessing you meant wind turbine energy, I am from Nigeria and I heard Turbines are good in a windy area, what can you tell me about this?

It's why I haven't started mining Bitcoin with free energy yet because it takes lots of watts from the wall.

safar1980

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Solar electricity is very good for large cities, because with the help of solar panels you can not consume the energy of the power supply plant during the day, and run the turbines only in the evening, night and morning. And this justifies itself in countries such as India or China. Home miners use electricity at night when it is 30-40% cheap.

kano

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Indeed, solar energy is not a good 24/7 solution for anyone except those on grid that can over-produce and thus provide the rest of the grid extra power during the day, to cover their grid usage for the 66-75% of the time they can't use solar power.

Energy storage is, to be blunt, in it's infancy, and anyone trying to store 100's of kilowatts or megawatts will have already learned the hard way how problematic, with current technology, that is.

A real sustainable solar coin network would be one where miners only mine during the day when they have solar energy.
Having world wide involvement would of course mean the network itself would work 24/7 without major issue, though the difficulty management would need to be timezone-hours controlled to ensure continuous transaction throughput rates.

The main problem with this is that the big time miners are cheap, poorly designed junk.
They can't handle regular power cycling and don't have power-up and power-down management at all.
Considering how much power they use, this is ridiculous.
(though wattsminers seem to do something akin to power-up handling by accident, with their default slow tuning when you turn them on)

stompix

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Quote from: BlockBeat on June 11, 2023, 11:47:48 AM

Miners should really figure out how to use solar properly, improve that tech, then use the sun. There panels out there that can handle decent sized wall rigs so maybe it's unseen thus far?

Yeah, all those miners who have poured millions into data centers and gear are just so stupid and they haven't figured out how cheap solar energy is, they need some random dude on a forum to tell them so.

An S19 burns 72kwh a day, in a scenario in which you get 6 hours of peak sun, remember just because it's sunny outside doesn't mean the panels are producing at full capacity, so you need 15 kWh of solar panels to be safe and 40kwh in batteries equivalent and this is to keep you safe only for one day.
Now google a 10kw solar panel system and tell me how "cheap" that is!

Anyhow, mining revenue per raw th is still 20% higher than at the start of the year, including that is the picture of dropping energy rates all over the world and it stops beings such an apocalyptic future. Remember that at the start of the year, the revenue was almost half of what is now so if miners have survived that they will survive a having even with just a 25% increase in price.

WillyAp

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Quote from: safar1980 on June 08, 2023, 10:53:16 AM

Quote from: WillyAp on June 08, 2023, 09:10:38 AM

See it as an investment into yourself.
Setting up a miner has a learning effect, one with rewards.
Teaching more people is needed and that badly.

Large mining farms are managed by a small number of good engineers. Other jobs are done by electricians and loaders, who do not need much training to perform job duties. At less than 10,000 per bitcoin, this is good business and it is now clear why so many companies are investing in mining.

It's good business when it has an attractive price.
Nevertheless you can set up a rig and mine, you learn something and you might get pay-out off as you mine. Depending where you are mining.
It's kind of hard nowadays alone to download the core.

safar1980

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Quote from: BlockBeat on June 11, 2023, 11:47:48 AM

Miners should really figure out how to use solar properly, improve that tech, then use the sun. There panels out there that can handle decent sized wall rigs so maybe it's unseen thus far?

All the miners in the world will remember you if you teach them how to extract electricity on solar panels at night or how to extract electricity efficiently in non-solar weather.
Hydropower or geothermal power generation is more attractive for mining.
Solar power with batteries for backup use only.

BlockBeat

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Miners should really figure out how to use solar properly, improve that tech, then use the sun. There panels out there that can handle decent sized wall rigs so maybe it's unseen thus far?

FP91G

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In the second quarter of 2023, the cost of mining may be even lower due to large commissions thanks to new tokens. Companies are willing to invest in mining, but they risk higher mining taxes or being banned.In every country, the laws change as soon as many miners arrive there.

safar1980

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Quote from: WillyAp on June 08, 2023, 09:10:38 AM

See it as an investment into yourself.
Setting up a miner has a learning effect, one with rewards.
Teaching more people is needed and that badly.

Large mining farms are managed by a small number of good engineers. Other jobs are done by electricians and loaders, who do not need much training to perform job duties. At less than 10,000 per bitcoin, this is good business and it is now clear why so many companies are investing in mining.

WillyAp

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See it as an investment into yourself.
Setting up a miner has a learning effect, one with rewards.
Teaching more people is needed and that badly.

safar1980

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"Roughly every four years, the reward for successfully mining a bitcoin block is cut in half. This event, known as the halving, reduces inflationary pressure on bitcoin. Currently, rewards are 6.25 BTC per block ($170,000) and in April 2024 they will be reduced to 3.125 BTC per block ($85,000).
Currently, publicly listed miners mine at a cost of $10,000-$15,000 per bitcoin, said Wolfie Zhao, head of research at mining consultancy Blocksbridge. Once the halving happens, these costs will double, bringing miners’ breakeven point to $20,000-$30,000.

Operators with higher production costs per bitcoin will have a more difficult time surviving the halving. According to data compiled by Zhao:

Stronghold Digital Mining (SDIG)- $8,200
Cipher Mining (CIFR) - $8,600
Riot Platforms (RIOT) -$10,400
per bitcoin in the first quarter."
https://www.coindesk.com/business/2023/06/07/bitcoin-halving-is-coming-and-only-the-most-efficient-miners-will-survive/

Topic: The cost of mining bitcoin from large miners (Read 215 times)