Topic: The disappointing outcome of BRICS 2024 (Read 589 times)

The BRICS will undoubtedly be a strong connection as protection for the economy, they are very strong countries, but this is if the dominance of the Dollar ends, I see that it is difficult for that to happen, I know that for now the US economy is decadent, the debt that this Buiden government has left has been very strong and this is a silent bomb, but come on, a generation of politicians is coming in who are knowledgeable on the subject and who know how to get it forward, however the BRICS can become a very great force to support those who do not want to depend on the dollar, knowing that there are also the options of Bitcoin, gold.

BRICS can still work and develop effectively as an economic union, as a part of the world economy, for this purpose it is enough just to throw out of BRICS toxic participants who cannot live according to the laws, with respect for other countries and moreover push other countries to do so. The problem is that, for example, the terrorist country Russia is very profitable for China and partly for India as a submissive raw material appendage. And until a new “iron curtain” falls around Russia, they will receive cheap natural resources from Russia in exchange for “glass beads”....

That could be true, but there's no way to fix that. Since most countries have their own currencies they'd have to agree to give it up and allow someone to print new money for them.
Imagine that you're a leader of a strong country and someone wants you to dump hundreds of years of history where you had your own currency and accept something that some other poorer countries will also be able to use.

BRICS could work if there was no war in Ukraine and Russia wasn't sanctioned. If it encouraged other leaders to join them, slowly trying to create Asian monetary union, stronger than the Euro zone... Now they look more like a union of outcasts, mainly thanks to Russia.

I recommend to read this article on Brazilian + Chinese negotiations.
Reason being it shows why so many countries distrust the US.
A smart move would have been to double the investment China puts into latín America.

But rather they used the usual threat:

Ripped from the article:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-11-13/brazil-s-embrace-of-china-for-economic-growth-tests-trump-tariff-plan?srnd=homepage-europe
Without paywall https://archive.ph/BaYIL

Here you write about friendship lifting sanctions against terrorist countries, and then you write about how they will still continue to fight the US and the dollar Do you believe it yourself ?
BRICS needs to get rid of toxic “friends” who not only create problems for the whole world, but also drag down the “BRICS partners”, the reason is banal - Russia, Iran and the like do not need a quality, effective alliance and development. They need terror and intimidation, they need impunity, they need stupid propaganda that will be consumed, they need to threaten everything developed and civilized, driving everyone around them into the Middle Ages, ...and “the whole world at their knees”. So - either the BRICS will use their brains and kick these cancer cells out of the BRICS, or it will just destroy itself.
And many adequate BRICS members have already said - we will not oppose the West, we will not fight the dollar - it makes no sense and it will only hurt everyone!

That is plainly wrong. Its not the $ who is weaponized but the passing it on.
Imagine our world currency is tulips,  If a sanctioned person wishes to pass his 1000 tulips to a person or organization crossing a border the transporting business refuses to act due to sanctions.

That is the very reason Bitcoin was created or used. They could easily be called e-tulips.
Banks refuse some transaction, they accept them then turn around and tell you its not possible but we have to take our fee for handling the matter.
Such as some exchanges try to squeeze their clients.
 
A sanctioned person is not able to do business of any kind with the country issuing the sanction.
Take the latest, Russia sanctioned Kazakhstan, They cannot sell their Tomatoes to Russians.   

BRICS' ambitions to create an alternative payments system of its own, is partly due to rising US sanctions against Russia and its allies. The current administration has weaponized the US Dollar, leading many countries to look for other options. I'm confident this will end during Trump's second-term as President. Especially when Trump has a good relationship with Russia's Putin. He will settle down with world leaders and put an end to wars and the economic uncertainty once and for all.

With sanctions lifted, Russia and its allies will have no reason to move away from the USD. It's likely BRICS will drop its ambitions to create its very own currency powered by Blockchain tech. We'll see. The future is unpredictable, so I'd hope for the best.

I don't quite agree that monopolism is a good idea, as there should be alternatives. But they should be really high quality and promote high quality competition. And of course I agree that 100500 currencies on the world market will only mean more complicated interaction on the world market. And if we talk about the qualitative basis of BRICS, and this is economic interaction within the union, without disturbing the interrelations with the rest of the world - it will also be beneficial! But if the system is built not “for the good” but “to the detriment of someone”, and moreover, giving out as a “good idea” an attempt to solve only their own problems (by the way - absolutely deserved), such a solution will not benefit the participants, moreover, will harm them.

In reality, the world only needs one currency. Every country having their own currency only adds some % to the price of everything. I completely understand their wish of dedollarisation but what I don't understand is that how are they gonna do it? They blame all of their problems to dollar, which is not true. The reason of the low quality of life in BRICS countries is corruption, nepotism and some other problems, which needs a small cultural change and things will go well for them.

At the moment, I genuinely believe that if they even manage to create their own currency, their quality of life won't magically improve. Also, it's not like BRICS countries are gonna live in peace with each-other. Strong always wants to take over weak, so, their currency will be influenced by the strongest member and strongest member will try to get the benefit out of it.

If there are replacements, they can just say that they are doing the best they can. Like many believe, this doesn't have to work in a perfect way and make them all rich, economy all around the world is terrible, not like dollar is doing great, look at how much purchasing power a regular person lost in USA to see how dollar is losing value too, they printed more than 50% of the dollars in existence in the past five years, only reason why they are strong is because they spend a trillion dollars to military every year.

However, if we are talking about why these other nations (brics) is weaker, it is not just because of military power, obviously not, it's because they are not really ruled properly. USA may get some shit from people, but they are ruled properly, even a criminal got elected lol, the "freedom" they talk is real, and I mean very real, you can flip the bird to trump to his face, and nothing will happen. Try that in Russia or China, you will soon "disappear" without anyone knowing what happened to you.

I think there are a number of obstacles to the de-dollarization and BRICS currency ambition, 1 thing is that not all member countries, including India and Brazil, are fully on board with Russia's anti-Western stance, instead, they look to a far wider economic collaboration without directly opposing the dollar. It is also questionable how practical a single BRICS currency can be, considering the different economic goals and systems of its members, which make unified action rather difficult.

Besides that, economic integration within BRICS still remains limited, the internal trade constitutes but a tiny fraction of global trade, the lion's share of which is still performed using the dollar. That reliance on the global payment system represented by SWIFT and dollar based settlements implies that a clean break with the dollar is impossible in the near term. Particularly, attempts at creating an independent economic bloc are complicated by the fact that BRICS members remain deeply linked to the external markets of the US and Europe as a means of not undermining their own growth and stability.

I must commend your constructiveness and disposition in this article, it shows you understand the politics and economics around the BRICS of a thing and how they want to use it against the USD, and Western powers and their allies. But a "house built on a conspiracy will not stand."

Russia will also continue to prove the boss as every new development I see about BRICS is all about Russia. The latest one was the new BRICS Pay, and guess what again? The only version we saw was in Russian Ruppe.

This could be technically viewed as an alliance being forced on others due to political ties and respect for each other, but the real questions are; are they ready? Are they capable? I doubt that because the economic and political "might" of the USA and USD did not just happen today, and has been built on a solid foundation with huge branches across the globe.

Yeah, there is really not going to be something that will based on this at all. Think about this, if there is a BRICS method of moving money, then that would mean that it would only be between BRICS nations.

So what we are talking about here is the only downside would be BRICS nations which uses dollars to money to move money between other BRICS nations. That means, we are going to end up seeing only BRICS to BRICS that was done on Dollar to move to a new method. Does that really considered to be something high? I do not think that they were using all that much dollars anyway, and that is why I do not think that change would be anything all that complicated at all, we are not going to see Dollar be impacted.

In my opinion, in order to create a geopolitical union, there must be some factor that unites all the participants of this union.

What unites the BRICS countries? Geographical location? No. Single economic zone? No. Single currency? Also no.

Most of the countries that joined BRICS do not want to feud with the US and other Western countries, and do not want to give up the dollar as the world reserve currency. At the same time, these countries probably have a need to declare that the current world order is not entirely fair.

After all, almost all world trade is by sea and is controlled by English-speaking countries. That is, in my opinion, we are not talking about creating an effective and viable geopolitical union (too many different and dissimilar countries have joined this union).

Probably, we are talking about some message that developing countries want to convey to developed Western countries (which currently control all trade and financial flows of the world).

So who did he actually impose sanctions on ? Against the citizens of his country, who now will not receive products from Kazakhstan, and what is the most subtle - and Russia has nothing to replace it ! I.e. Putin has simply punished his citizens, he has never cared about them - they are only obedient labor force and expendable material for him ...
And Kazakhstan will find markets outside of Russia and will not return to them again. It's like the EU scare - “we'll be left without gas”. EU almost 90% refused from Russian gas, EU solved its problem by finding alternative suppliers, Russia lost this market forever, and has to either burn gas or sell it to China for pennies )

By the way, China has a strong enough influence on Kazakhstan, that's why Russia squeals when Kazakhstan makes decisions that Russia didn't expect, because it understands perfectly well - China is behind Kazakhstan, and you can't behave aggressively with Kazakhstan, you can “get a slap on the head from the master”

That didn't stop Russia from sanctioning others.

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-bans-vegetables-from-kazakhstan-after-country-refuses-to-join-brics/

That demonstrates how a homogeneous a country acts in many ways.
It shows that there is little symmetry between ministers and Putin himself

The fact is that they will not be able to replace SWIFT (international payment system). What they will be able to do is a mimish SWIFT “on minimal”, for a small group of countries, for internal mutual settlements, and to a large extent - afraid of sanctions for violations they plan to make:)
But the essence of the key mistake of the “BRICS joy” is that they will be forced to interact with the rest of the world, because the BRICS will not be able to “close themselves in the BRICS shell” - it is absolutely not a self-sufficient union.

This is a result of the weaponization of the US Dollar. The Biden administration is to blame for this. Fortunately, Trump won the presidency again. So BRICS will no longer have a reason to exist. Or at least, it won't have a need to make an international monetary system of its own. Trump is known to be a staunch ally of Putin. I'm certain things will go well between the US and Russia within the next 4 years.

It's likely countries that once rejected the USD because of sanctions, will start using it again. A win-win for both the US and foreign countries. In the worse case scenario, BRICS can use an existing Blockchain network instead of making one from scratch. It could either use Bitcoin, XRP, Ethereum, or any of the many public blockchain networks (cryptocurrencies) we know and love today. Bitcoin seems to be the most likely option due to its store of value properties just like Gold. Some countries outside the bloc already made it legal tender, so adding a BTC reserve should be a no-brainer. If BRICS adopts Bitcoin, it will usher a new era in decentralized economics. It's an uncertain future. Therefore, I'd hope for the best.

BRICS is nothing more than a replacement of SWIFT.
It's hard to imagine that it goes further as Russia would like it.
I wonder how the BRICS nations wish to make a unique currency where the two factor they have in common, lack of their citizens purchase powers plus currencies not internationally accepted.

It seems that the joy of some people regarding the results of the US elections was ill-considered and now BRICS will face difficult times

The first problem is Trump's tough policy on China. China, with its economy in the state it is in now, receiving “gifts from Trump” may be if not fatal, but such that it will set China back for many years, with no prospects for quick fixes.  And this is after a blow from the EU, with their decision to raise duties on Chinese cars. You have to realize that in quantitative terms, the EU buys 40% of the Chinese car industry. In monetary terms, that's almost 60% of the car industry's profits.
But this is only the beginning of the problems. Further we will observe even faster degradation of economy of Chinese raw material appendage - Russia (terrorist country) ! The decline in production in China will definitely reduce the demand for resources that Russia supplies to its master for a penny.... Falling demand for resources means falling incomes and markets inside Russia (terrorist country).

And that's not all - it was Trump who stated that his goal is to reduce the price of oil to 50 dollars.... In a word it will be interesting !

PS At the same time, as part of the fight against terrorism, as Trump promised, all rogue countries and terrorists - Iran North Korea and ... again Russia

I highly recommend studying the financial interaction between russia and China. since 2022, when russia started a new stage of war against Ukraine, and started a large-scale terrorist war against Ukraine, russia has had problems with oil and gas sales. This accounts for half of Russia's total income (selling raw materials, in fact). Most of the oil, the terrorist countries, now actively 2 countries China and India. So find out how is the mutual settlement in rubles, yuan and rupee ? You will be surprised, but India simply blocked all the funds of Russia, for the sold oil, promising to return them later, somehow, in the form of dividends, from ... and China, paying for oil with yuan, simply does not allow to buy anything worthwhile in China for “dirty” yuan (dirty with Russia). It is “Russia's best friend” and “partner” in BRICS  

Let me remind you once again: BRICS is not a union of partners, it is a union of competitors, where the smartest are trying to maximize their profits by destroying some countries without the slightest hesitation. Or do the latest examples tell a different story ?

No sooner had I said that the presence of some countries in the BRICS is just a ploy to get additional benefits from the “suffering” pariah countries than some surprising news appeared:

Russia has started emergency purchases of butter from the UAE.
For those who did not understand the news - I explain.
There is a Vologda region in Russia. It is famous for its butter.
So the UAE is almost half the size of the Vologda region.
In addition, the UAE is a country created entirely in the desert. There is nothing but desert there. There are regular sandstorms there. In the summer, it's +50 in the shade.
And now huge Russia (the largest country by territory, 40% of the world's natural resources, ....) has rushed to buy butter from these tiny desert Emirates.
Boundless Russia. With all its endless flooded meadows and generous fields, with all its centuries-old praised cows, with all the “rich traditions of agriculture”.
Russia just doesn't care about oil. Russia is busy making cannons.
But cannons are good at killing people, but cannons are not good at feeding people.
That's why we need to ask for oil from the Emirates. But at the same time you must continue to shout about the greatness of Russia.

PS And “the cherry on the cake” - do you know for what currency the UAE sells its oil to “the richest Russia”? Yes, you guessed it - for US DOLLARS 

I never knew if Brics would have a single currency, I don't think they would do that. BRICS countries are examining various alternatives including digital currencies.
For example, countries like China and Russia have made great progress in the field of central bank digital currencies CBDC, so issuing a digital currency under the BRICS umbrella is also among the options.
Or they could issue a common currency in the future, but I don't think they would force any BRICS member to do so.
Not a disappointment, they are slowly expanding and getting more participation.

You are misunderstanding the nature of this process They don't refuse to accept them they can't service them. And whatever China has - China has it, and the “great Russia which fights the US and the dollar” strongly recommended everyone to bring with them ... dollars, which Russia will gladly accept ! Don't you think it is comical and pathetic against the background of statements of Russian President Putin (international criminal) that the dollar is worthless and should be gotten rid of ?

UnionPay is a good Chinese payment system, but it is centrally managed by the Chinese government with all the possible peculiarities, which is also worth paying attention to. It works in my country and payments are accepted.

Regarding Turkey - I will say at once that this is my personal opinion, to me today's steps of Turkey seem to be just a game to get more profit. Turkey is not making an unambiguous choice to one side or the other, Turkey is trying to maneuver, extracting maximum benefits for itself from today's “dynamic situation”. But here is what I support - it is better for Turkey to choose the vector of the EU and the Western market than to “tight embrace” with the pariah countries or criminal countries.
Although Turkey can use these countries for its current benefit, like China made Russia its slave and raw materials appendage

PS Turkey is a beautiful country, I used to vacation there every year and traveled the country from Istambul to Mersin. Culture, history, nature, national cuisine - everything deserves attention !

If they refuse to accept Visa or MasterCard, that's not a problem because China has UnionPay and that's very good too. I have been using UnionPay for years and can't find a difference between it and Visa or Mastercard. I was always able to pay everywhere with it. So if they ban Visa and Mastercard, they have UnionPay. This is not their weak point.

Btw I don't like the idea of joining BRICS and I hope my country won't join it. What's on the table for any country to join BRICS? Dedolarisation? Isn't it better to join the EU? Not every country can join EU because of their location but I think Turkey will do better in the EU than in BRICS. The problem is that the EU takes too long to accept countries and that's what makes BRICS stronger with the help of corrupt politicians. Russian FSB is doing a great job.

It seems that the de-dollarization of BRICS also went down the drain, “thanks to the efforts” of President Putin (an international criminal). As it turned out, as a result of the BRICS2024 summit, India, UAE, Brazil, Egypt, and to a large extent China, abandoned the path of dedollarization. They were smart enough to understand that dedollarization, in today's situation, is the loss of world markets.  This is coming from the countries that make up 75%+ of the BRICS economy. The rest of the “fighters against the dollar” look like bums (although from the point of view of economic solvency they look like that), who tell everyone that they “will not pay attention to the flirtations of Miss World” 

PS And what is very indicative - if you compare the results of the summit in the Western media and the Kremlin media, you will see a surprising, almost diametrical difference in information. Therefore, I recommend to use adequate media as sources of information, not “manual media” of dictators/criminals like Russian, Iranian and similar.

A few observations after the summit.
One of the goals of the summit was for the Russian dictator (and international criminal) to show that he is not an outcast and has some importance.
What really happened in Kazan ?
To understand whether Putin's “Russia is the leader of BRICS” narrative is working or not ?   The answer is very simple - no, Russia is not a leader in BRICS. The leader of BRICS from an economic point of view is China, and China's competitor in the organization is India, not Russia.
It goes without saying that in Russia, propaganda channels were going around talking about the “huge importance” of Putin's meeting with Chinese President Xi Jinping.
But if you read the media of the free and adequate world, the main event for them was the first meeting between Xi Jinping and Narendra Modi, Prime Minister of India, in five years.
Well, and the classic question that has been worrying many people for the last few years - the members of the BRICS alliance - are they allies and partners or ... ? ?
As practice and the summit have shown, at the moment, they are rather competitors fighting for personal gains. And even the huge expectations of the Russian dictator to unite the “global south” under the idea of “anti-American union and the fight against the dollar” failed, because most of the BRICS countries are interested in cooperation with Western countries.

Clearly the disadvantages are much higher than the advantages.
Those ministers don't have companies which buy at the international markets. The US Dollar is accepted in most parts of the world. Not much goods are needed from the non Dollar community.

Both ministers not coming from the economical sphere of a country does not help. Both are career politician. Politics went haywire since no skilled people are at the helm of a country.  


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ned_Nwoko


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Ali_Ndume

What I absolutely agree with is that there should always be an alternative and healthy competition ! It would be foolish to support alternative-free monopolization. But as always, there are nuances
1. The dollar model of international settlements is convenient, familiar, and integrated into many world processes.
2. YES, it brings additional “bonuses” to the USA, it is also stupid to deny. And it makes some less successful people wildly jealous. Yes, the U.S. was once smarter, more nimble and cunning.
3. Yes, they allow to punish some regimes and countries. And this also does not like it, and first of all the countries that are criminals or playing on the edge of legality and lawlessness. And TODAY this is the main reason why the BRICS, Russia in the first place, tells tales about “useless dollar”, an alliance against the US and the dollar. I remember from all the time of the USSR as from all TV, radio in schools and factories, we were told from morning till night that “the dollar will soon die”, “the Western world will collapse”, and other propaganda nonsense. Question - where is the USSR with its “strong ruble and beautiful socialism”? ))
4. BRICS was and hopefully will remain an economic union. And a union for the sake of IMPROVEMENTS, not a union against someone/something.   And its results have shown that adequate and powerful BRICS participants realize where they want to be pushed, and therefore they refuse from an alliance “against someone”, especially when they are pushed to “oppose” those with whom BRICS benefits - the Western markets. That is why the BRICS said: we are not fighting the dollar, we are creating a convenient mechanism of mutual settlements within the BRICS. WE will not oppose the US, we will build mutually beneficial conditions for all, including mutually beneficial interaction with other unions, payment systems and countries. BRICS is not a self-isolated union from the whole world, it is an economic union of countries that have common interests and want to establish more comfortable economic relations between them.

No matter how we perceive the words - softly or more harshly, the meaning is the same: China has ceased to benefit from the “quick victory war” terrorist war launched by Russia against Ukraine. Now Russia has dragged Iran, North Korea, and not openly China into it. Although 3 years ago, Putin promised China this very solution, to show the world that pressure and state terror will not be punished, that the west is weak and fragmented and will be even more fragmented and weakened by contradictions.... And the theroist countries can rule the world, for example China, tacitly supporting such actions of russia, will be able to occupy Taiwan easily and without consequences. Now Putin tried to drag the BRICS into his political games, where they are losing and dragging Iran and North Korea to the bottom.... China has realized that doing business with a loser is not profitable, it is enough for China that russia has become its raw material appendage and new market. But further escalation will hurt China, which already has a lot of problems and no good solutions....

The race for de-dollarisation shouldn't be seen as a political or economic attack on the US. It is a fight to survive the negative effect of the monopoly enjoyed by the dollars. Recently two senators Ned Nwoko and Mohammed Ali Ndume from Nigeria called for the de-dollarisation of the economy. They argue that there is a need for alternatives to transacting international businesses in other currencies other than relying heavily on United States dollars. The world needs to have another dominant currency so that countries can make choices. The only reason why there is this antagonism of BRICS currency is because Russia and China which are enemies of the West are behind it.

Another reason some countries want an alternative currency is the economic weaponisation of the US Dollar and SWIFT. If countries are sanctioned fairly there might be no agitation to have an alternative. Some countries are sanctioned just because they don't want to have a relationship with the US and its partners. Meanwhile, other nations are given the freedom to freely have international relations. If the punishment for nations who invade a nation or kill innocent civilians is an economic sanction, let it be applied to all nations. There should be no segregation or favouritism.          

BRICS single currency might not be a perfect solution but is a step in the right direction.

It is very simple to explain - there are many hysterical hysterics (I will not mention their names here), who do not care about the essence of the dialog, but just shit in the topic they do not like, promote hateful concepts, justifying terrorism, crimes against humanity, and similar things that some rogue countries and terrorists are trying to push in BRICS. I think it is not acceptable. And at the moment, not a single post of a person who simply has an alternative view to my opinion has been deleted, which confirms the above. I recommend that your opinion on self-moderated threads go to other threads that are not far from mine - then share what you get back

You don't like the way I speak the truth ? That's your problem !
You attribute to me patriotism and defense towards USA ? Give me at least one example where I say it directly ! Why are you lying and manipulating now Perhaps you want to give an example where I call some countries terrorists - it does not say that I am a patriot of the USA, but is based solely on personal experience as a citizen of Ukraine. So if I am a patriot, I am a patriot of Ukraine only

Yes I know that not everyone likes the truth, especially the truth about themselves. The main thing is not to hide it and carry it to the masses to resist the purposeful propaganda and attempts to hide the reality !
So those who do not like self-moderation and the truth - can answer nothing and pass by the topic

The fact that this is a self-moderated topic explains a lot about @drbeer himself I mean not even that he is wrong, to be fair he is right and yes Dollar is strong just like it always been and while BRICS are trying, so far they have nothing. Doesn't mean they won't have anything in the future, but we have seen what a common currency does, Europe has one, and they are considering literally disbanding it, so we can safely say that it doesn't really make anything better.

But it's a new thing, and the results are far inferior to what they expected and outlook isn't good, but we need to give them some time. The reason why what @drbeer does is funny because while he is right, he uses his words so carelessly that people literally get annoyed by "how" he says things and not "what" he says He is a pure patriot American, will defend American rights everywhere, and even if he is wrong, he will decline being wrong, which makes him questionable even when he is right, like this topic He is right here, but people still do not want to confirm that lol.

In reality no. Unfortunately we need control to make economic progress for a society. not for the individual. Crime is entrepreneurship with a different set of values. 


There are so many people involved, many who interpret the words of their leader harsher, other softer.
In that perspective the danger is greater than just using XI's words. Not many people around who keep their words to the letter.

Dedollarisation to fight western domination but of the number of countries that have joined, is there any significant positive economic growth? Only China and India excel in economic growth and the rest are still in a situation that remains unstable. Based on data on projected economic growth it refers to US $35.5 trillion debt and if it continues to surge it will certainly make the US find itself in a financial burden. the impact on other countries is very bad because they store foreign exchange in dollars. the solution is that the US must prove with the new president who will be elected to solve the problem of their accumulated debt.

1. It is enough to listen to Xi Jingping's speech, and the noticeable change in the rhetoric of the Chinese Foreign Ministry towards the war unleashed by Russia against Ukraine. It has become definitively unprofitable for China.....
2. Putin spoke about the BRICS single currency, or rather actively tried to put it in the ears of all participants at the beginning of the summit, and did not hide that the task of the BRICS single currency is to get away from sanctions! He also openly called to make BRICS a union not for the development of the economies of the participants, but a block against the U.S. and the dollar. This is what I have been talking about for several years - some players, or rather BRICS members, the world pariahs and those close to this status, try to use BRICS exclusively to solve their political problems and complexes.

If you don't like the information, immediately hang such clichés, and willfully lie, for example about “is clueless as always and not done his research”
I spent several days studying the materials of this summit. True, I did not use knowingly biased russian media, but read adequate sources and interviews. Let you now try to prove the opposite to everyone here: you “as always ignorant and without having done your research”, and at the same time attributing your own words to me, just primitively broadcasting someone else's opinion without checking it ?

And then let's talk about how Russia and China tried to push the idea of a single currency of the BRICS union in the form of the Chinese yuan (for foreign economic settlements), and then the president of Russia (an international criminal) ran and showed everyone some colorful paper, saying that this is the prototype of the single currency of BRICS
So who here “ignorantly and without information” labels people whose opinion he cannot refute ?

Dr beer is clueless as always and not done his research

brics is not going to be a single currency.. he needs to learn how each country of brics will have its own domestic currency on a new distributed ledger system(crypto) where by the forex is done multi-laterally via a system called the m-bridge

there wont be a single currency reserve, but instead each countries own domestic crypto will have an allotment locked up in the m-bridge to do the currency interchange to other currencies

I wonder where did you get that China told Russia to stop its useless special op (aka war vs Ukraine)?

The PS is really intriguing as the US plus most allies have seen the superiority of the western war doctrine, Capabilities plus skills wins against mass.

In BRICS we should not forget that BRICS is a Replacement of Swift, non bound to any country so their (BRICS memberstate's) vision.
Swift itself is about to change and adopt to modern times.   Mentioned here: https://archive.ph/svgEc 
Original under https://www.economist.com/international/2024/10/20/putins-plan-to-defeat-the-dollar

Yep the West didn't like it when they exported their economy but that's just how they make business. They don't export war but build businesses and drown countries with debts still.

Everybody just wants to rule the world. It just happens that they are about to do it. Whether BRICS wins to dominate and their currency becomes the reserve currency, it still be the same as US would do, they will also be using their currency to sanction countries.

China creates jobs China creates consumer markets because its economy is export-oriented, and as it loses Western markets, it has to find some kind of replacement.  By proxy you mean Russia, which was a guinea pig for China to test how the world would react to annexation of foreign territories ? I agree, it is, and now China is ordering its raw material appendage to end the war, because it is proving to be a big problem for China.

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Nope, it was already debunked that the Chinese offer lower interest rates they even extend dates. In fact, African countries choose China. Remember they are the ones building structures in the countries there providing jobs.

The truth is that they wouldn't be talking about BRICS if they were just nothing. If it was just Libya thinking about having their gold back currency, they could just be bombed and it's over. But because this is Russia and China, there is not much to do but right now skirmishes of proxies.

This is Brics' second big problem - China's attempts to either export its economy's problems to other countries (through its attempt to push the yuan as the BRICS single currency).
The third problem is real colonization and takeover through deliberate bankruptcy or non-implementation of interstate projects, followed by ownership of China, and the obligation of the “China donor” country to pay huge loans and fines. Some countries have already realized what the new colonialism with a “Chinese accent” is. If you are not aware, read what “Chinese friend and honest investor” did to Srilanka !

BRICS was just 5 countries and now it's almost 10. They refuse IMF, they give alternatives to small countries where the US is out of the equation.

This is why it always ends up in war when it comes to who's going to dominate. while BRICS is just a minuscule, it seems like they are still panicking. Well If they have Billions of debts to China and they pay interest to Beijing which Beijing is using the money to build its economy and their Red army, they gotta act.

And the reason for this behavior is simple - they do not want to become hostages and handmaidens of international criminals, they do not want to be used by anyone to solve their problems, they do not want to oppose the developed world, they want to create an effective economic union to make life better in their countries and not to make life worse in others. But some people for some reason listen to “sweet speeches” and do not think about what these speeches are made for and for what purpose. I am glad that some of the BRICS members have not only conscience but also a brain!

At the BRICS summit, which took place in Kazan, Russia, on October 22-24, Putin wanted to agree on creating an alternative system of international payments to carry out transactions without using the US dollar. However, the leading members of the bloc, in particular India, Brazil and South Africa, did not support this initiative.

Also, instead of a single BRICS currency, only a symbolic banknote of the BRICS countries was presented at the forum, which Putin then showed to his ministers. But the issue of a single currency was not even discussed at the summit.
Many BRICS member countries spoke out against the politicization of this association.
https://financy.24tv.ua/ru/putinu-predstavili-alternativnuju-banknotu-briks-finansy_n2669943

Hm...perhaps I don't know English very well, or didn't quite understand your point, I'll ask you to clarify it ! What is my stubbornness ? Is it that I stated the FACTS ? Ok, let's go the other way:
Please argumentatively refute my propositions:
1. trade turnover within the BRICS is minuscule against the background of the world economy, which works with the dollar.
2. BRICS has only SEVERAL countries with more or less strong economies, most are very questionable members and some are global pariahs.
3. Some of the BRICS members have tried and are trying to manipulate the goals of the union, and are trying to turn this economic union into a politically engaged group, to solve exclusively their own interests, and to be completely open - to solve the issues of avoiding deserved punishment for crimes committed ?

I am very much looking forward to your answers to these 3 simple questions, and explanations as to what you meant by the word “stubbornness”

I believe that in the future, even if BRICS succeeds in de-dollarization, you will still be disappointed in them and will continue to come up with thousands of other reasons to justify your stubbornness. Because you are a loyal fan of the United States, anything that harms the dominance of the United States and the USD means nothing to you.

I am not saying that BRICS will definitely succeed in de-dollarization because I know that this is an arduous and challenging process, and they need to put in their best efforts. They may fail too but jumping to conclusions now is premature and somewhat conservative because as long as they don't stop then it means they haven't failed yet. Not to mention, everything is going exactly as they expected, how can one say this won't go anywhere?



We should stop attacking each other just for our egos, instead let time answer everything.

Quantity absolutely does not mean quality ! Tell me, what benefit for example Cuba will bring to BRICS ? Have you ever been to Cuba? I have been there, that is why I am asking you this question, and I am very much waiting for an answer

The second problem is mentioned above - some of the participants do not aim at economic changes at all, but pursue their own selfish goals, far from building a strong economic union.

BRICS are expanding. From 4 countries BRIC to 5 countries BRICS. Now they have expanded and they are 10 countries. Brazil, Russia, India, China, South Africa, UAE, Iran, Egypt and Ethiopia.

They added partner countries recently. They are: Algeria, Belarus, Bolivia, Cuba, Indonesia, Kazakhstan, Malaysia, Nigeria, Thailand, Turkey, Uganda, Uzbekistan and Vietnam.

As more countries will join BRICS, their dedollarization plan chance to succeed is decreasing.

As we know, the Russian president (international criminal) hosted the BRICS summit in Russia last week.

Expectations, he (russia's president) had were as follows:

1. To create an alliance against the US
2. Creating an alliance for “dedollarization”.

He does not hide them and believes that BRICS, for him, should become a tool for the realization of his goals.

The reasons are banal - an attempt to manipulate a fairly significant international union to achieve his own selfish goals. As we know, China made a similar attempt earlier, trying to save its economy through “exporting inflation and problems”, trying to impose the yuan as the BRICS reserve currency.

Unfortunately, we live in a world where they try to realize their political complexes through the economy and try to solve their political problems. Another attempt is BRICS2024.

But, let's return to the facts to understand what happened and what to expect in the future.

1. The BRICS single currency and de-dollarization. Let's start from afar. I am sure that Russian media did not publicize this information, but the fact is the fact: participants and guests of BRICS2024 were warned that they would not be able to use international payment cards Visa and MasterCard. Therefore, they were strongly advised to fill their wallets.... No, not with yuan or rupees..... No. Preferably in dollars, or euros if there will be problems with dollars You feel the “power” of one of the initiators of BRICS, and the fight against the dollar, which according to Russia “is not secured by anything and is of no interest” ) Generally expected...
A single currency of a large economic union is quite logical, but it is necessary to meet several conditions

1 support of the interests of all participants who will work in the space of a single currency
2 technical realization
3 integration with existing systems like SWIFT. Why ? Because the BRICS market is not self-sufficient, it is dependent on non-BRICS countries. Dependent both on goods, technologies and markets, since the majority of the “BRICS economy” is export-oriented or resource-based.
4 common sense.

The 1st and 2nd points are realizable, although they will require enormous effort. The problem is that BRICS is not a union of like-minded people, it is a “union of competitors” with different goals and interests, among which there are also very unscrupulous participants who want to solve their own problems, which they have created for themselves.
3. This one is difficult, because integration with SWIFT implies mutual settlements in the dollar... which BRICS is going to abandon.... In a word, a difficult problem to solve
4. This is where some of the participants have it quite bad. For example, Russia openly states that leaving the dollar is necessary... in order not to get under sanctions and not to get deserved punishments. That is, not for the creation and development of the BRICS economy (where most of the participants are adequate, except for a few participants), but only to solve the problems of Russia and a few other pariah countries, such as Iran, or countries that have decided to follow the path of criminals and potentially approaching pariah status and punishment in the form of sanctions.


Another problem, and again not for the BRICS, but for.... Russia's politics again, and more specifically recognizing Russia's crimes against Ukraine. Putin (an international criminal) had a dream that his “master” China would continue to ignore the problem and continue to widely support Russia, its raw material appendage. But it turned out that China has absolutely told russia to end the war unleashed by russia against Ukraine, and to respect international law and other laws. The reason is that Russia's toxicity is beginning to have a very negative impact on its “friends” and even on its host China, which China does not like, especially against the background of growing problems in the Chinese economy.


Russia's attempts to draw the BRICS members into a political alliance not for unification but against the U.S. are guaranteed to bring problems to those who fall for this provocation. But the rogue countries in BRICS have almost nothing to lose, but normal countries have something to lose and it will be painful for their economies and all their citizens. BRICS will probably be forced to reform, because in order to build a quality economic union that will be significant, respected and influential, it is necessary to throw out toxic participants from its membership. Otherwise, BRICS is doomed to failure and self-destruction.

To return to these points:
1. Creation of an alliance against the US
2. Creating an alliance for “de-dollarization”.

As it turned out, the majority of BRICS participants are categorically against such steps, as their economies are strongly integrated into the world economy. And without quality interaction with the world economy, the world financial system and quality relations with the West and the U.S., it will be very difficult for them, because BRICS is still an economic union, but its indicators are extremely low and cannot compete with the “dollar” economy.

Those who like to fight with common sense and reality, very much dislike statistics, honest, verifiable statistics. They remove them cowardly and as quickly as possible, because these indicators destroy all their unsupported fantasies. Let's look at the NAMIPULATIONS of some BRICS participants and the REALITY ?

Very revealing statistics.... Or how to manipulate data for mental self-satisfaction ?
According to Putin, the BRICS are almost 50% of the world economy, population, etc. etc. etc. . “Beautiful facts.” It looks very demonstrative, powerful and immediately Putin's soul becomes calm - “we will definitely dedollarize everyone and defeat the West and the USA!”.
But if we do not clog our brains with cheap and primitive propaganda, and look more broadly at analytics, we will get:
1. Yes, the population of the BRICS countries is a significant portion of the world's population.
2. Yes, the combined economies of the BRICS countries make up about 45% of the world economy.

But.

1. In 2022, world trade amounted to a record 32 trillion dollars
2. And now for the “mighty BRICS alliance.” It turns out that these “de-dollarization allies” and “adversaries of the United States” from 2017 to 2022, trade between the five members of the BRICS bloc totaled $422 billion. Over the five years, a significant part of that volume, was oil and gas from russia. China and India, for the last 2 years have been getting oil and gas from russia virtually for free. Why? Because both China and India refuse to pay with dollars, and “pay” with local currencies that cannot be used in Russia !

Subtract the cost of oil and gas from 442 billion, and divide the rest of the sum by 5 years. And calculate how many percent it will be from 32 trillion dollars, the turnover of the world economy, only for 2022 ! And everything will become clear to you


What is your opinion about the essence and results of the BRICS2024 summit? What else could you add to fully understand what is happening and the consequences of these events ?


PS The Central Bank of Russia's interest rate has increased to 21%!!!! Advice to the citizens of Russia - take loans for extremely large sums in rubles, buy currency with them, no, not the Chinese phantoms, but full-fledged currencies - dollar and euro, and try to take them out of Russia. Believe me - very soon you will either close the loan for less than half of the funds you purchased, and perhaps you will not have to repay the loan because of the collapse of the banking system of Russia, to which there are preconditions.

PS Indicative punishment of Iran by the Israeli Air Force, an event that could very much affect the economy of one of the “fighters against the dollar and the U.S.”. If the ruler of Iran again fails in his brain and tries again to make another terrorist strike on Israel, it will cause the second fair strike, and this time, for a long time, the oil and gas industry will be destroyed, which will destroy the economy of Iran. That will play only to the advantage of the United Arab Emirates, for example, a BRICS member, and the overall picture of the economic performance of the pariah countries, BRICS members, is expected to worsen.