Topic: The fatal error of Stalin, which saved the world (Read 781 times)

  There are facts: Stalin concluded an agreement with Germany on friendship and mutual assistance. In 1939, the Red Army followed the German army into Poland. The victory over Poland was celebrated with a joint parade of the German Army and the Red Army. 24,000 Polish prisoners of war were secretly shot by the Russians in 1940.

My suspicions were justified.  History still need to know, so as not to ask such questions.  Dear Madam, when Russia and Germany were fraternizing and conducting joint military military parades in Brest, Britain and France were at war with Germany.  As a result of a joint attack by Germany and the USSR on Poland, the state of Poland ceased to exist.  September 17, 1939 after the Soviet attack on Poland, the Polish government was forced to leave the country to continue the struggle in exile.  While in Moscow admired friendship with Hitler in the Atlantic was a war.  From September to December 1939, Britain as a result of the action of German submarines and battleships lost more than 100 merchant ships, which significantly undermined its economy.  The Soviet Union during this time attacked Finland, for which he was expelled from the League of Nations.  In short, better read historical sources.

Was it the sole responsibility of the USSR to prevent the Nazi invasion of Poland? What was Great Britain doing at that time? What was France doing? And most importantly, where was the United States?

Holy moly, thanks for typing this all out? What'd you go to school for?

Dude, this is not the fault of Stalin
It's not his fault

Well, for example, about the alleged equal responsibility of the USSR and Hitler's Germany for the outbreak of World War II. They say that our country does not conclude a nonaggression pact with the Third Reich, the Fascists would not be attacked by Poland. But this was categorically disagreed with the OKW officer (the High Command of the Hitlerites) Helmut Greiner. In his book "Military Campaigns of the Wehrmacht" published by Tsentrpoligraf in 2011 on page 26, the refutation of these insinuations is actually given: "In late March, Colonel-General Keitel, chief of the OKW, notified the chief of the Warlimont defense department that the Führer ordered the commander-in-chief Wehrmacht armed forces before the end of August prepare for military clashes with Poland, which seemed inevitable. "

At the end of March (referring to 1939), that is, six months before the conclusion of the treaty signed by Molotov and Ribbentrop, the fascists began to prepare for an invasion of Poland. There was no hint yet that Moscow might be disappointed in sabotaging the UK and France with an agreement on joint actions in the event of Hitler's aggression and would decide to conclude a pact with Nazi Germany.

The first mistake was the deportation of Lev Trotsky abroad.
The second mistake - after suppressing the attempt of a very probable military coup, Stalin allowed the head of the NKVD Nikolai Yezhov to untwist the flywheel of repression.
Error three - Stalin did not believe in the possibility of an attack by the Nazis on the USSR in 1941.
The fourth mistake is that Stalin did not remove Khrushchev, who hates him, from public affairs.

Seems like you are interested in re-writing the history. If you have ever read Mein Kampf, then you will realize how much Hitler hated the Slavs. He hated them more than any other ethnic group. He tried to exterminate the Polish race when he invaded Poland. His idea was to repopulate Poland with Saxons. Tried the same in Belarus, Ukraine and Western Russia, but there were not enough Germans to repopulate these regions.

Thank you for the evaluation of the article. Yes, if Stalin and Hitler had continued cooperation, the scientific and technical potential of Germany and the unlimited resources of Russia made the Germany-Russia-Japan axis superior to the British Commonwealth.

No matter how it was, one can say with certainty that if it were not for Stalin's fatal error, the political map of the World was different today.

Stalin, as a politician, made no mistake, except for the one that caused Germany's attack on the Soviet Union in the summer of 1941 and the violation of the strategic non-aggression pact important for both countries, with a secret part that provides for the redrawing of borders in Eastern Europe.

Interesting article you have, admired the way you have told such an interesting yet horrific era not too long ago. If Stalin placed his bet on the Axis, then possibly much of Asia would be communist.

Germany stop the Soviet Union to invade Europe. USRR was planing to destroy the identity of nations to make an United states of Europe (search this concept on Wikipedia) To avoid a war in to fronts Rudolf Hess jumped with a parachute to the UK to negotiate peace. Churchill made an ultimatum to sign peace ( change work standard for gold stabdard again and allow masonic societies). That Stalin didn't took any wrong decition is very questionable.

We are very lucky WWII ended the way it did. The outcome as horrific as it was could have been so much worse.

In October of 1941 Germany was advancing on Moscow with around 2 million men with essentially only hastily thrown together units and draftees between them and the capital.

Had the Germans taken Moscow the Russian rail network would have been cut and there is a good chance Japan would have seized the opportunity to strike in the east. Under those conditions it is questionable whether Russia could
have offered much in the way of effective resistance.

Instead bizarre and wildly atypical weather stalled and significantly damaged the German war machine, and very unusual circumstances dramatically shifted the political landscape in Japan leading them to foolishly attack the USA.

For some interesting speculation on this topic and an overview of some history see:
Intervention Theory: Did a Higher Powere Defeat the Nazis

The facts speak to the contrary. On the side of Germany was fought by the Russian army of General Vlasov, so your statement is absurd. Hitler wanted to persuade the Russians to take his side against the Bolsheviks of the Communists, whom he considered Jews. I do not know the fact that on the side of Germany, the Jews fought. Another fact in support of the fact that Hitler wanted to persuade the Russians to his side is that when the Germans came to the Caucasus he forbade the mountaineers who hated Russians to kill them.
  It seems to me, based on previous posts, you either do not know the story or deliberately mislead. Hitler made a genocide against Jews and Gypsies.

He hated the ethnic Slavs, perhaps even more fiercely than the Jews/Roma. It is evident from the fact that Hitler killed more than 30 million Slavs (Soviets, Poles, Serbs.etc) during the WW2 when compared to the deaths of 6 million Jews during the holocaust. The real genocide during the WW2 was carried out against the Slavs, and not against the Jews.

I don't see what the fatal error of Stalin would have been for this.

You would need to read more about how crazy Hitler was, his vision was to take over the entire world slowly.

He also hated Russians with a passion and wanted to wipe them out. Creating an alliance with them was basically only to keep them from coming into the war. He eventually wanted to take over everything(even any allies).

What sort of BS? The allies were getting their asses kicked big-time, before Hitler made the mistake of attacking the USSR. Had Hitler delayed his Soviet invasion by a few more years, then the entire Western Europe would have come under Nazi rule.

I agree with you.
Because of the same reason Napoleon also lost war in Russia.
Hitler attacked USSR to late, on the end of June, because of war in Yugoslavia before.
If he did it before, let's say in April, outcome could be different.
His big mistake also was announcement of war to America.
If Hitler waited just a year or two with announcement of war to America, and with an attack on USSR, and concentrated to first conquer Britain, the outcome of the war could be different.
We will never know.

Stalin didn't made any error, the error was from the German side. After having conquer most of Europe in the second World War they thought they could conquer Russia. The problem was that Germans could not deal with the rough winter, very common in Russia for the Russian army and very uncommon for the Germans. That was the key that decided that Russia won the world war 2 and they every year make a parade in Moscow to celebrate that.

When you play with snakes, you will get bitten. It would have been naive for the Russians to be loyal to Germany. Russia's main problem is its containment. A continental Europe completely controlled by Germany would have been disadvantageous to Russia. Not to mention that if allowed to steamroll everyone else, Germany is likely to go after Russia next.

So I don't think that Stalin really made a mistake here. Sooner or later, Hitler will turn on him anyway, it really was just a matter of time.

The main in this article at the end. Hitler could not defeat the Soviet Union only because it was not beneficial to Americans and the British. Russian arrogate to themselves the main credit for the victory over Hitler, but it's not. Without the help of allies of the USSR would have lost the confrontation. But the Russians never know how to draw conclusions from their mistakes.

Well we can all agree that this wasn't a mistake from Stalin, he knew all along that if Hitler was done conquering Europe, he was going to come after the USSR before he can go for the Americans and the rest of the world, they all knew they couldn't trust each other, they just postponed the conflict between themselves till they were both ready to engage.

Alex Bahshi
The fatal error of Stalin, which saved the world
          
        Stalin as a politician does not make any mistakes, except the one that was the cause of the German attack on the Soviet Union in the summer of 1941 and violations important for both countries strategic agreement " nonaggression pact " with the secret part, which provides redrawing of borders in Eastern Europe.
      
      Germany and Russia have suffered from the First World War , after having increased a huge military potential , they decided to take revenge. The fact that these two countries are the aggressors and the initiators of the Second World War is the date of the sequence agreed between Germany and the Soviet Union 's political and military actions.
August 23, 1939 in Moscow, Germany and the Soviet Union sign a nonaggression pact.
September 1, 1939 Germany and the Soviet Union like the predators are torn between Poland. Start of the Second World War.
September 28, 1939 in Moscow, again, is the German- Soviet Treaty of Friendship and the border between the USSR and Germany. On the new border between the aggressors carried out joint military parades and fraternization Russian and German soldiers. The former Russian colony of Poland ceased to exist as a state. However, part of Poland with Warsaw had to give Germany, but it is, so to speak, the fee for the fraternal friendship.

31 October 1939. The political and military successes Moscow said at a specially convened on the occasion of the Fifth Extraordinary Session of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR . Here's an excerpt from the report of the Minister of Foreign Affairs, VM Molotov (http://www.oldgazette.ru/lib/propagit/21/01.html):
 
    "First, it is necessary to point out the changes that have taken place in the relations between the Soviet Union and Germany. Since the conclusion of August 23 Soviet-German non-aggression treaty put an end to abnormal relations that existed for years between the Soviet Union and Germany. In place of hatred, fostered in every part of certain European powers, it is the convergence and the establishment of friendly relations between the USSR and Germany. Further improvement in these new, good relations found its expression in the German- Soviet Treaty of Friendship and the border between the USSR and Germany signed on September 28 in Moscow. This radical change in the relations between the Soviet Union and Germany, the two largest states in Europe, could not but affect the entire international situation. "
    
       "Secondly, it is necessary to point out this fact as the defeat of Poland and the collapse of the Polish state. The ruling circles of Poland boasted quite a lot "strength" of the state and the “power "of the army. However , one swift blow to Poland, first by the German army , and then - the Red Army , so that nothing is left of this ugly offspring of the Versailles Treaty, which had by oppressing the non-Polish nationality. "

      
     Further events are moving quickly. While Germany is at war with Britain and France, Moscow is using the opportune moment to further reprisals against its former colonies, lost in the First World War.
November 30, 1939 The Soviet Union invades Finland, for which the aggressor is excluded from the League of Nations. A few Finnish people, only some 2.6 million (the population of Leningrad only one at that time was 2.5 million), buried the plans of Moscow together with the corpses of hundreds of thousands of Red Army soldiers, frozen in the deep Finnish snowdrifts. Despite the enormous Russian numerical superiority in all respects, the Finns have defended their independence. Thanks to the heroism of the Finns, Finland The world knows today as the most prosperous country. With nothing other than the harsh nature of the Finnish people have proved that it is sufficient for prosperity are the desire and ability to work, and of course freedom. Although the aggressor yet captured a small part of the Finnish territory, but, as history shows, the Empire tend to break down sooner or later return Finns captured Russian land.
April 9, 1940 Germany invades Denmark and Norway.
May 10, 1940, German troops occupied Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg.
June 22, 1940 France surrenders.
July 17, 1940 the Soviet Union presents an ultimatum to Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia, after which the state no longer exist.
July 27, 1940 the Soviet Union presents an ultimatum to Romania, and her tears away from Bessarabia and Bukovina.

    Having dealt with continental Europe , Germany and the fall of the Soviet Union in 1940 engaged in intense negotiations on further strategic plan is to create a so-called "Pact of the Axis" finally fixing the division of spheres of influence between the aggressors in Europe and in the direction of further expansion. Hitler, Stalin, offers Asian direction, while Germany will conduct operations in Africa and the final defeat of England. However, apart from Stalin annexation of Finland, in the region includes the interests of the USSR, Romania, Bulgaria, Greece, Yugoslavia and Turkey, which had already selected another victim of Moscow, as received in the form of an ultimatum, as was the case with the Baltic countries, the requirement permit the establishment of a Soviet naval base in the Bosporus and the Dardanelles. It should be noted that the seizure of the Straits was the main purpose of Russia in the First World War. Hitler considered excessive appetites of Moscow, and the negotiations reach an impasse. In the future , namely, November 25, 1940 , Stalin made concessions , limited to Finland, Bulgaria and the Bosporus with the Dardanelles , but too late , apparently, Hitler had already made a decision about the Soviet Union , leaving the last sentence of Stalin unanswered. Russia to hand over to Turkey, which was loyal ally of Germany in World War I, Hitler clearly did not want.
    
      I must say that Hitler was good enough reason not to trust Stalin, because shortly before the Soviet Union signed a treaty with Germany, Moscow was in talks with Britain and France on the establishment of the anti-Hitler coalition and opposition of these countries only give Finland and the Baltic countries to the Soviet Union to the slaughter Moscow was the reason for the reorientation towards Germany. Moreover, Hitler was initially believed that the power in Russia after the Revolution of 1917 the Bolsheviks seized the Jews, and his attitude towards the Jews is well known. In the first approximation, this is true, but in reality it is history because Stalin in the power struggle all their Jewish colleagues -Leninists including second in importance only to Lenin's Bolshevik Trotsky is physically removed. It is inconceivable , but a Georgian Stalin, who does not have the gift of oratory , bad speaker in Russian , managed phenomenally alone to cheat a large group of revolutionaries greater part of the Jewish nationality and become a beloved leader of the Russian people (1).
    
      On the other hand, I think, Stalin, which is well versed in the national question, understood the uniqueness of the Jewish people stay in the Russian Empire and to some extent used this circumstance. The fact that Jews are not indigenous people, unlike many other peoples of the empire, and , in fact, due to the lack of separatist sentiment and equal treatment of other nations might be cementing the people of the Soviet empire , and even more so than the Russian nation chauvinism ( Great Russian chauvinism , by definition, Stalin ), which had a negative impact on the "friendship of peoples." Stalin used the Jews to organize violent, punitive measures , such as withdrawal of food, collectivization, the migration of peoples , and other mass repression . With this purpose, he retained from the old Bolsheviks Lazarus Koganovich , Mendel Khataevich , Genriha Berries (aka Enox Yehuda) , which, in his opinion, could not feel a sense of pity and is perfectly suited for mass repression of the Ukrainians, Cossacks , Kazakhs and other indigenous peoples of the Soviet empire . Stalin relied on the Jews , not only in the punitive organs , many Jews worked in the management of the economy , science and education, at least, against the Jews as a people, Stalin any repressive measures did not undertake , unlike Hitler , who exterminated the Jews , including their parasitic element of society . It is because of Jewish scientists and spies to the Soviet Union was able to quickly build an atomic bomb, and to achieve parity with the United States in possession of nuclear weapons. You could say Hitler, being unable to overcome personal animosity toward Jews as a people as a whole, unlike Stalin made a mistake by organizing the persecution of the Jews.
    
     It is hard to argue that Stalin was more perspicacious than Hitler, or he would join the "Covenant of the Axis" agreeing to send the expansion of the Soviet Union to South Asia, and Romania not to declare an area of interest of the Soviet Union, knowing in advance how important it is for Germany Romanian oil . Drag out the negotiations and the uncertainty in the future strategic intentions of the Soviet Union put Germany in a dependent position. It is not difficult to understand the reasons prompted Hitler to go on a risky move - to attack the Soviet Union. Moreover, defeating the Soviet Union, Hitler solved many problems. First, take off the threat to strike back. Secondly, Germany received an access to energy resources - coal Donbass, the Baku oil, rare metals Caucasus, tungsten, molybdenum, - components for the production of high-strength steel. How important molybdenum says the next episode , when the Red Army left the foothills of Mount Elbrus , each soldier had to fill his knapsack molybdenum ore, which is often the cause of death. Due to the excessive burden untrained people frustrated with climbing the mountain ledges, still find frozen into glaciers dead soldiers. And third, through the Caucasus opened the opportunity to strike at the Asian possessions of the British Empire that is what was offered to Stalin if he agreed to sign the "Pact of the Axis." Here we should note one important nuance - Stalin refused to sign the "Pact of the Axis" , he just wanted to get more concessions from Hitler .
    
       Stalin was convinced that Germany has not yet straightened with England, will be more compliant in terms of the division of Europe , he did not want to miss this auspicious moment in my thoughts without holding that Germany would dare to attack the Soviet Union. Still affected eastern mentality of Stalin - a tendency to bargain to the last, that is contrary to the German mentality and that eventually led to the German attack on the Soviet Union. You tell me, because on the western border of the USSR it was at this time greatly increased the number of divisions and military equipment, yes, but not for defense in case of aggression on the part of Germany, and for the attack, and not on Germany, but for the seizure of Romania , Bulgaria, Serbia, Turkey , Greece, which corresponds exactly to the plans of the Soviet Union, Hitler presented at the talks in Berlin. Therefore, the German attack on the Soviet Union was a complete surprise to Stalin and plunged him into a deep emotional shock. Do not make any mistakes on the road to power and hold it, it is usually faster than in the application of Sinister Strike, and then Hitler had deceived him as a boy. Perhaps Stalin , after all , and would have agreed to sign the " Pact of the Axis" , but drag out the negotiations during the war, when time is a critical factor , was a fatal mistake.
    
      One can not help wonder about whether there were in Germany, the Soviet Union beat the odds? Sure are. Hitler relied on surprise and the power of a first strike , in addition, judging from the infamous Finnish campaign , Hitler was not a high opinion of the combat capabilities of the Red Army , which, in general, was confirmed in the first months of the war. In my opinion, Hitler made a mistake in time, not taking into account the climatic conditions of Russia. If Germany invaded the Soviet Union in April or May 1941, the Germans were in Moscow before, but not uniquely harsh winter of 1941. It should be noted, because of the severe frosts technique even the Germans could not be fully utilized, the German combustive-lubricating materials were not designed for such low temperatures . Second defeat the German troops were again the following winter at Stalingrad. Blitzkrieg, which counted on Hitler failed, and the resources of Germany did not allow her to continue to conduct large-scale military operations against the background of increasing aid allies and the devastating bombing of the Anglo- American air actually in Germany.
    
     It is a paradox, but the error of Stalin, the Soviet empire led to the tragic trials, saved the world from fascist, but you can say to a certain extent, and the communist threat. The world was lucky that the aggressors grappled with each other in mortal combat. Scary to imagine what would have happened if Stalin had not bargained and managed to sign a "Pact of the Axis." Hitler would have no reason not to trust Moscow and Germany would have collapsed all the power in the UK. The United States of America could be alone in front of the block of the Axis Germany - Italy - Japan - USSR.
    
     As if there was not, one can say with certainty that , if not fatal mistake of Stalin , the political map of the World today was different.

1. Stalin phenomenon.