Topic: There is no consistent money left in online poker cash tables, my analysis. (Read 498 times)

To be honest, I do not agree with what you are saying. Online poker cannot be possible in the absence of money.
Still, there are many users who play online poker, it's a matter of fact that they are gaining benefits that's why there are keep on playing.
But luck also matters. If you are lucky enough you can have good winnings. We cannot blame poker itself.

Ah, I see now, thank you for explaining it! Thank God, no one believes in magic numbers here!


I've played more 25k hands for sure, but I still don't dare to buy a ticket worth more than $10 for a tournament. Sometimes I'm "forced to". A ticket for a game in Bitcointalk Poker Series can be from $15 to $25. But I never buy such expensive tickets for other events.

25k hands in a month is from recreational players / Regards.

Well at least in any crypto site it does take time to make 25k hands but in a place like the red spade in a day (+,- 10 h. ) or a few hours, opening at least 4 cash tables.

Anyway, just have fun bet according to your bankroll level and enter with 100BB always and at least leave 100x in your bankroll. That is what is really important always.

He is not talking about winning 1k$/day, instead he is saying that laying 1k hands.

Good luck with your challenge, I hope to see some good results and hopefully we can see a new pro that we can proudly say is a member of this forum. 1k wins a day is a dream for many to do in a day just saying.

Well it is because it is a large enough sample size to know if you are good at it especially if you are four tabling. Nothing is peculiar about 25k, it can be 30k or 20k. The idea is the more volume you put the less variance you will encounter.

Lol I'm not that good I wanted to give an update on this thread since it has been a while.

I have not actually started this challenge, due to school. However, I am committing to 25k hands. I could possibly get it done in a month. if I play 1k hands/day (very possible),

Stay tuned!

I had encountered with @CCwatcher420 several times in Bitcointalk Poker Series. Imo he/she is good at playing poker, and chances are we are going to see a new poker star in them in the future.

Can you please explain in simple words what does this magic "25k hands" mean? I've seen it on poker forums, but I don't understand why exactly this number, 25k? Thanks in advance!

I play on pokerstars mostly. If you want to play anonymously with bitcoin choose 7xl, it is a skin of gg poker for crypto users.

Livestream would be a challenge. What sites do you play on ?

Please do.
If you are able to beat micro stakes after 25k hands that must be an achievement. Live stream must be there with graph.

Should I run a bankroll challenge?

Bitcointalk Poker Series regulars are hanging out here, I see.

First off, thaks, OP, for staring a poker topic! It happens not that often in the Gambling section here, so all poker lovers will thank you.

Regarding these words from the OP


I disagree, because robots' way of playing can be figured out within couple hours, and then exploited. ( By "robots" I also mean people playing like them).

Indeed, there's always a limitation of playing unless a player gets addicted towards poker game. He would try to seek money just for betting and worst is recovering the lost may frustrates a gambler in the midst of game pressures. If you're a rich person, maybe that wouldn't be a problem to consider increasing money on the table but for those who didn't have such, I think it's really a big problem here.

Well, I agree, --great players most likely transfer to Poker Tournaments instead of playing at the tables. Money isn’t there anymore and for the Casinos and online gambling platforms, I guess they are trying to chase the amount they should have been earned since then and that is why. Poker even with its nature of mechanics, cards being given randomly which would give people impressions that it is just lucked, it is actually a game of skills and patience, bluffs, and so on and so forth. But honestly, stable income does not have to be in poker, I think there are still lots of cliches you will find entertaining that would give you stable income in the long run.

Exactly you have nailed it.

What's it to you if that was really the case, I mean it's not like everyone has the money to consistently play poker that will increase the money on the table, not everyone will be playing with a lot of money.

The OP does not seem to be complaining about that, what he is saying is that mostly the ones that are playing at the poker tables on cryptocurrency casinos are regulars of the casino that have improved to the point they are in a stalemate in which no one can beat the other consistently, this is very common offline if you practice with your friends and it seems the same is happening online as people get to know each other so well it is almost impossible to get an advantage over them.

If you are looking for some consistent money then gambling is surely not a option.Gambling is based on luck and your strategies and you can win huge,small or even incurr heavy losses.If you have made gambling your profession and try to earn a stable or regular income from poker or similar games then your analysis is totally wrong.Poker table have huge money pots and there are certain competition like Betnomi freeroll on this forum where prizes are huge with minimal entry fees with 9-10 players on final series.I have also played poker a lot but never expected to always win which is first thing which you should also learn before entering into this gambling industry.Play with entertainment and build your gameplay then surely there are funds flowing in your wallet at that time.Always try to be realistic in this market and that will give you enough profits.

As we know 'generally' the game of poker gambling existed long before online poker gambling games were like today, If you want to have consistent money in online poker games, you must first understand and know the basic rules of online poker itself.

If you understand the loopholes or strategies, you won't be easy to beat, chances of consistently winning more money in battle if you know it well.

Making bets in stages also has a good chance for you, I mean minimal deposits and points to assess your opponent's strategy It is a priority to beat the bonus opponent as well as something that must be considered in online poker games in having money consistently.

Winning with bad cards is possible but it is unlikely especially if you are going against a player with the same level of skill, what happens is that when you are going through a bad day in which luck is not smiling to you people get desperate and begin to make mistakes that they would not have made otherwise, this is why one of the most important characteristics that a successful poker player must have is patience as sooner or later you will get over that period of bad luck and in order to take advantage of that you need to keep your capital as intact as possible.

Poker has been taken by many (even people I know) as their day job and they take it as it comes. Sometimes there are good days and sometimes there are bad days. It is all about luck really, and a tiny amount of skill, but at the end of the day if you can't manage that level of stress and loss then definitely its a good sign you're not cut out for poker or any gambling. Some people just keep at it and get better but that's also because their lifestyle choice enables them to do so. Obviously, this won't work out for everyone.

Do you really believe there's such a thing as "the cards aren't going our way"? I think if it comes to bad games, bad days - the main factor here is the player. Maybe something's on the mind that distracts from critical thinking. Because I know for a fact that winning with bad cards is possible with the right attitude and strategy. In such a case it's important to think straight and not to make snap decisions. Because when you're in the right mood there are no "wrong cards" and unlucky days, everything is on your hands. 

Disagree with this. You can see people winning on twitch consistently, even at NL500. Up your game.

Well, the people who win big doesn't necessarily go back to the table to throw back all the wins into the prize pool. It doesn't warrant any worry though because as long as people are playing poker, there will always be money. Or maybe they just put less money for playing poker.

The truth is that I had to read two and up to 3 times very slowly to be able to decipher the idea you wanted to raise very well, but think about it and take a test, play in real life and tell me how many times it is successful, I'm sure you will have the Same success rate you get when you play at online casinos.

One of my favorite games is poker, when I started playing online I looked for many techniques, I read many times the strategies that pokerstars.com puts, they really apply those strategies to the world of cryptocurrencies in online casinos and I did see when real people won, although many who use Robots on platforms today tend to fail, there would be no games or poker tournaments if everyone loses, there are people who win the money they want at 2 or 3 tables and leave, others last a long time in the tournaments and win or lose, whoever loses only assumes defeat, that's the game.

OP: when you discover warm water ...  

Call:
The Cash tables have been tough in the past in the present ... and tomorrow is another day to play.
So, it is there the really important thing, having the desire to return but the best thing is always to get bankroll to start.

There are still sites in Fiat that allow fish trackers on the tables and tell you where to go, or using programs that will make the decision, this is the norm of + NLH100...

I don't know but of a moment to another, I lost the will in my game (cash tables) and without realizing it I started with sit & go and then MTT, then came black friday and it helped me go from regular to recreational. I almost went from playing a lot to not playing at all.-

That is my advice, when you criticize your gaming environment and do not accept to adapt, it is best to leave the tables for a while, even months, that first shows you that you are in control of your emotional decisions, because the problem is not that the poker in its current version of cash tables (your opinion) does not leave consistent money, the real problem is ... that thinking that way you can not send poker to shit for a while.

Everyone who really "loves" to play poker comes back, I recommend that you seek advice but not psychological I do not know how crazy you are and I am not a psychologist to evaluate you, that is your problem, but on the player side, and based on what You write, so, you may to send your game history to third parties and they will analyze it.

There are sites or players that do it for a low cost, some even do it for free, but if you play levels where you want to win 10bb / 100 there are even well-known professionals, you have to invest time not only in the game, but in studying the game and studying our game, but looking for a third party is excellent, better than the statistics of any support program for playing poker.
__________
___________
_________________
Check (o Fold)
Considerations:
-Thanks for bringing up a poker topic.

-10bb / 100 is honestly beastly, maybe you can be regular player with that level at nlh 1000 +> but for the number of few hands that are played at that level..

-Infected is derogatory,  

-Please, it was difficult to read you OP, separate the paragraphs.

-The 100% crypto poker world waits for those infected.

I can't agree more with your words Yahoo... a poker player!

Who plays poker knows great days when cards are just coming as we want them, and there are bad days... like really bad days! But it all comes down to Yahoo words, we all have swings, and when the cards aren't going our way we should stand up and try another day... but how hard can it be to stand up?!

Yeah, there are a lot of freerolls across multiple platforms which could be played for fun and to fund their poker account to be able to test other tables. There are a lot of explanation videos on youtube now which explain what to do in which position and how to get the best value out of your hand(which needs experience and practice). It is kinda hard to be pit against regulars who probably have played against each other and have more information about the table than you. There is also a famous saying " if you don't know who the fish on the table is, its probably you".. so, yeah. Especially with online poker, it is much harder to find tells of an opponent. I'd agree with point 3, to just play your strong hands at the start and observe how the rest of the players are reacting. Last but not the least, always only gamble with what you can afford to lose.

First line of your post is bang on, I have kind of unstable attitude when it comes to bank roll management and I am surprised by the fact that you infer this from my post, excellent inference.
Multi tabling or not, bank roll management or not rake and deck will eventually catch you up in cash games specially at micro to mid stakes. It is like an edge of a casino.

I get his point since this is true in any poker table whether you are paying online or offline, the truth is that if you are seated at a table where we have only players of your same level then it is impossible to make profits as the rake will eat your capital while the capital of each player just bounces back and forth, you need bad players for your EV to be positive and if no one with those characteristics is there then you cannot make money, it is as simple as that, and since playing poker with cryptocurrencies is nowhere near as popular as other games then I am not surprised this is the current situation.

It reads like you have a very unstable attitude which is usually incompatible with successful long term poker. You're right that rakeback can make a big contribution to the winnings of a career poker player and must be factored in. Long gone are the days that you can make easy money on the tables, fish (or people trying their luck) burn out and disappear very quickly, which means you will always be struggling against others. If you look at an average GGPoker room table you'll see many players from China, Russia and other countries where the cost of living is much lower - they can afford to grind it out and live more cheaply. That is the reality of what you face, so you either adapt or you find something else. How are you multi-tabling skills, because that is one of the few places you might be able to eek out the profit per hour you're seeking? You might have to move around different poker rooms to find newbies as well.

Poker is also a gambling game which you can earn money or lose your money very fast and not for earning profit. You point of view about poker is wrong and it shouldn't be that way. You can search it on google that gambling is to try your chance to earn huge money but comes with a great risk unlike investments and more.

At the same time you can also use the table for what it was meant to serve " for fun " . You can never expect to win always!! What you can expect to do is to play an unbiased game and win if the luck is right but unfortunately it's not going to be a 100% sure.

Whales do control some games but you can actually win. That being said you would need luck+ skills both, any deficiency of one can serve you in a dead end.

If you are that bothered try :
1. Free poker games
2. Use various strategies listed online but use only proven ones
3. Check the most important hands and make sure to memorize them ! This is what I believe is the most important
4. look for a good unbiased casino - check reviews !
5. Make small bets and go for a long haul ! This way you would be able to get more experience as a whole.

This can be said for all games tho. Best of luck and do not worry much. there are still casinos untainted by unfair dominance.

(P.S. please try and move this topic to Gambling discussion)

There are many games where consistent winning is indeed impossible, but I don't think poker is one of them. I think poker is largely a game of skill because otherwise there wouldn't be famous players, worldwide tournaments etc.
But I do get why you're upset. I don't like online poker because I find some people's strategies very stressful (like when someone raises the stakes at the very beginning of the game very high).
And you're saying that some people are winning $10 per hour, but for one, it's totally worth it for many countries, and secondly, I guess it depends on the place where people are playing and what are the stakes there.

 Clearly you don't know enough about poker and I bet you are one of the fish who play occasionally and only remember wins, I will not even care to ask you about your online poker cash game graph because I am sure it is already in negative.
My post is contradiction or there is little maturity level from your side to jump up the conclusion, Can you please show me where I said ''"Nobody can win consistent money because there is a whole load of regulars winning consistent money", since you have quoted it and do not try to give your interpretation because now I know that it sucks.
I said the only way to make money in cash tables consistently is to play for leader boards and rake back, If you discount those it is impossible to make money. And since there are fewer leader board places there are more less winnings.
Let me ask you one more sensible question, how many poker streamers on twitch or YouTube streaming  cash game grinds? May be 2-3, they all are shifted towards tournament poker why? My post is specific about poker cash game tables realty

.

Who said you can not win one or two hands and feel pumped about it but lets play for above 10k hands and you will see my point. As per your logic why casino exist ? because no player can win in long run.

I will not comment on the former half of your post because it is way to generalize. But the people you know are the one who are grinding cash tables? or majority of their winnings came from tournaments?

Even if they are good at it there is always better than them, right? So I'm sure that even they do make a living out of it they still experience loss. Let's say they really do make money from it on a daily basis, if you are just a normal salaryman you won't risk your whole future just to do poker, I'm sure those people that do poker for a living has still a stable life even if they experienced a massive loss. I mean they do it because they enjoy it while earning from it which I assume most of us want.

Don't forget any gambling game is consistent, especially when you are playing online. Today you won the other day double lost or even can have lost streak days. How do you think the people who won the money you lost managed to do it? Learn their method. I'm sure if you are good at it, you can make money for living out of poker because I know people who do.

If there was no winning players, there would be no poker. The regs take massive swings in their games just like anyone else, they might just be better at BRM then others. When the cards aren't going your way, leave the table and try another 1.

Your whole post seems like one giant contradiction, "Nobody can win consistent money because there is a whole load of regulars winning consistent money". Online poker is definitely full of sharks and the level required to compete is extremely high, beyond that it also requires excellent concentration because a few bad hands can undo hours of good play. They say it takes 10,000 hours of practice to master a skill and this is no exception, unless you can put in that sort of commitment because you genuinely enjoy the game, then you might forever be relegated to giving your money away at the tables. You state $10 per hour as some magical number, but there are many reasons people can accept less than that and still play comfortably - they might live in countries where the cost of living is much lower or they might be young and still have low housing costs.

You're definitely right that poker is hyper competitive and nowhere near as easy as it was in the early days, but you either adapt (which may mean leaving the game) or end up writing futile complaints.

Every major poker room is infested by regulars and that too with six max. You cannot find any single limit or game type which is not infested by regulars in major poker rooms (If you know keep that secret close to your chest and grind as many hours you can there). Their aim is gain profit from rake back and leaderboards by playing 6-24 tables with less then 15% VPIP for 10-15 hours a day. Then there are other regulars who play 4-8 tables for exploitative play against formerly mentioned regulars with the aim of stealing as many blinds as they can from leader board players because they can not defend every blind with 24 tables open, you have to play  super tight to ensure less variance. 99% Exploitative regulars are not tough enough for massive variance and they eventually burn out because of the mental fatigue, Less then 1% move up the stakes. At last there are fishes (recreational / new players) who play 2 tables at most with no HUD or strategy, You will found only 3-4 fishes in an entire session that too beats you because of variance, fact is you cannot just wait for the fishes and their mistakes, this will slow down you learning process (you will learn some bad concepts as well) and eventually make you a fish.
So above mentioned three categories are there in any major poker rooms and apart from the first one almost human bot like players no body is earning anything, they too is earning like less then 10$ per hour which is in my opinion is not worth it. But wait, may be you are super genius and somehow adapt your strategy according to every one which will give you an edge in long term over first two categories of regulars, may be you are able to beat them but here comes the biggest and thickest wall for your cash game poker carrier, are you ready for it? Its daddy RAKE. Major trend is high rake almost 8-10bb/100. Lets assume you are a winning player but you cannot win 10bb/100 hands against any serious regulars it is just impossible. So ultimately all living humans are loosing in online cash games.