Topic: This Made Me Angry (Read 392 times)

You accepted their terms while opening an account so getting angry is not going to make any changes, if it helped you to move towards p2p decentralized monetary system like cryptocurrencies then as crypto enthusiast I am happy about it. But about the savings account and withdrawal limit then its understandable they are here to make money not to provide the service, already they created s paper as money now simply want to keep making money to grow them.

I think this restriction depends on the country you are located. In my country there are no limitations to withdrawals in a savings account.  Over here, indigenes are adviced by the bank officials to get there debit cards for easy withdrawal when ever they need cash for them selves. To them (bank officials), giving customers debit card is a trick they use to add a high cost charge for every transaction that is carried out with the card and that's what I hate so much too. Any time you do transaction with the card, you will pay for;
 1. Transfer fee,
 2. withdrawal fee,
 3.deposit fee and
 4.debit card maintenance fee.
With this charges summed up, you notice you can pay your worker a month salary with those fees.
BTC transaction  has no limit and only little gas is spent for fee, but in my country, if you carry out a bank transaction of $2000, you may be spending over $200 to cover fee charge.

Centralized finance problems…

However, I think both decentralized and centralized finance have their use. You just need to know their limits and when to use them. In your example, you didn’t know about that stupid law and that’s why you became angry. If you knew, you would have tried it.

Decentralization isn’t perfect or suitable for everyone neither. Like I said it is not one or another. You just need to use the necessary one when you need it. Banks are mostly dumb but we still need them somehow.

From my understanding it's one of those things that was logical at the time, but times have changed but the rules stayed.
Go back in time before there was an online never-mind online banking.

You had checking accounts, and savings accounts. (yes there were other types but that covered most accounts in the US)
Savings accounts used to pay really good interest, we are talking double digits.
Checking accounts paid no interest or very very minimal.

There were no instantiations ACH transfers like we have today, no call your credit card company to make a payment over the phone. Nothing like that. You either mailed a check to pay a bill or want to the bank that did your credit card / mortgage / whatever and gave them some cash.

So they drew a line. If you wanted money to pay bills you took it out of savings and put it in checking.
In theory, if you paid bills once a week. You could go to the bank, take money out of savings and put it in your checking and then go home and write checks to pay those bills.

Online banking, more things paid by credit & debit cards, low interest rates, and a host of other things have changed the banking dynamic. Bur the rules was never changed.
Most people don't really care. There are obviously some that do, and sooner or later the rule may be changed but I don't see anyone rushing to do it.
But if you take money out more then 6 times a month is it really a savings account where you put money int to save, or is it now more like a checking account with money going in for the sole reason of taking it out to pay bills.

-Dave
 

Yep, that was what I was fussing about including how the banks rehypothicate and are over leveraged themselves, the put restrictions on your savings account so they can try to stay solvent. This Ponzi idea all backed by the government.

No wonder they lift it because there was completely no connection between a number of withdrawals and maintaining supply. If somebody really wanted to move their money they wouldn't do it in 6 withdrawals or more. They'd do it in 1 or 2 and it would be all gone. If I have 100k and want to close the account withdrawing it all in one transaction is not a problem for me. If the bank wants to limit me it's just another red flag in my mind that can make me exit faster.

I didn't know about this regulation because it seems like a US thing, and I've never had a US bank account. To be honest, I'm finding a hard time trying to understand how it works because it seems that it doesn't apply to al cases and that it was suspended for the time of the pandemic (and remains suspended) but some banks enforce it anyway. And it's only for savings accounts, right? I agree it's all easier with Bitcoin and bank fees can be ridiculous, but Bitcoin also has transaction fees which might amount to solid sums from time to time (although not over the last year or so), but it seems this regulation only applies to certain types of withdrawals, on a particular type of account, isn't enforced on the federal level (it's enforced only by some individual banks), and the fee also varies greatly.

They're becoming even more strict which i do also observe which is really just a normal thing considering on how many or what things been existing specially now having this crypto space then asking out

on where funds might be coming from would really be even more often which is also a case here on my place where banks are really putting up some alarms whether you are pulling or putting big amounts

on your bank account.We know that it is understandable about money laundering issue but they are really just too hassle in my opinion but is there something we can do?
thats why having crypto or bitcoin itself does give out soo much convenience into someone who do tend to use it.

Not all banks have the same restrictions, there are many which have lesser restrictions.
The bank I have my money in allows 5 free withdrawals and then charges around $0.2 for every withdrawal.
But ofcourse that's bad because why the hell should we pay money to withdraw our own money from the bank.
Bitcoin is the true definition of being your own boss and holding money in your own bank.

The point of this post is to make clear the difference between the banks and your crypto wallet. of course, it has lots of differences and the good thing about the crypto wallet, you are the only one who can access it and it is convenient to use as well. You can do as many transactions as you like in a day or week or month without any restriction or limit. In most banks, you don't have this kind of feature and sometimes they will gonna investigate if the transactions are so many they don't make any sense to them. That's why people nowadays see the importance of having a crypto wallet, specifically a hard wallet for the safety of their cryptocurrencies.

Ever since I began studying, learning and trading Bitcoin, I have never saved much money in my bank account. Despite that the bank I am in right now is “crypto friendly”, I still wouldn’t trust them when it comes for me to put all of my money there.

As of this time, I have put most of my money into Bitcoin in a hardware wallet for storage purposes and only a few BUSD in Binance for trading purposes. Our money needs to be protected at all costs and should be under our full custody and not being controlled by a 3rd party.

In my country we also have such restrictions. But these restrictions is targeted mostly at revenue generation by the government. An individual has to pay a certain fee for over-withdrawal. That means, if you want to withdraw above the statutory limit, you would have to pay for it. Also they government also claim that this policy would also curb corruption, fraud and money laundering because huge sums of money might now be difficult to move from one person to another. Generally, this policy affects individuals and businesses negatively. But having multiply bank accounts can be a good way of invading these restrictions.

And apart from the limited number of transactions, you'll also have a limited amount on top of that. Depends highly on the type of savings account you opened on the bank but it's still annoying all the same. Personally, what I do is I have two bank accounts. One for spending with customized limits that still follow the mandated regulations and one for your normal savings account. The fees are a pain in the ass over time but it's something that one should consider doing if their spending habits cross the monthly limits imposed by the central banks.

Ha! That's what I have experienced a couple of weeks ago when I visited a local bank branch. I was trying to open an account since it is required with the niche that I'm in currently. I've been their for like 3 long hrs trying to get to their customer service. You can't really imagine how inconvenient visiting a bank with not so long queue but would typically take you minimum of 1 hr before you can walk out of the branch. While Btc gives you the best convenience in terms of sending and receiving money.

This, we have limits in our country, and perhaps this was a red flag for banks to see that huge amount being converted to PHP.

I also totally stay away from banks, I mean even opening accounts in our country is hard as hell. Lots of questions on where the money is coming from and that was 2018, so not sure how banks have change throughout the years here.

Or you could always get a checking account. Also there are no dollar amount limit for withdraws just a maximum number of withdraws.
It was put in place years ago to differentiate account types and never changed since most people don't care. 
Not a big deal unless you don't pay attention to how you spend money.

-Dave

This is exactly why we Bitcoiners talk about "Financial Freedom"..... we are not bound to Banking hours to do financial business. We do not have to visit a Bank when your debit card chip malfunction.... or when you get red flagged for making too many large transactions. 

I have had so many bad experiences with Banks that I was forced to look for alternative payment options that are not linked to centralized authorities. (My credit card account was maxed, when someone fraudulently used my credit card) - Cloned card!

the next lesson to ruffle your feathers and get you angry.. is
..
that the banks notes you have in your back pocket are not yours.
they are patented products of the bank.

they can
set any rule they like.
decide one day to inflate it,
deflate it
negotiate with government to only offer $2 of it per hour as minimum wage or offer $20 for min wage.
take a bit, some, majority, all of it out of circulation, or change the design making 'old' notes defunct
introduce a bit, some, majority more, causing notes to buy less and have less value

as well as all the terms and conditions and limits of banks notes you give to banks in their custody to manage 'on your cough behalf' cough

they control the inflation rate and the circulation rate.
and there is no 'public vote'/consensus to decide on such changes

More and more people who know how to think are angry and annoyed at the design of banking systems. Banks are not for such people. For such there are bitcoin. All the rest, satisfied with the way banks work, give them their money with reverence and, as you rightly noted, then beg with humiliation for their money back. It is impossible to call it otherwise than a humiliation with all these begging, confirmations and evidence that it is you who have the right to your money. Banks have double standards: they carefully check the account owner, block transfers and create a bunch of various obstacles, but when scammers rob bank users (not a rare occurrence in my country), they shrug their shoulders, unable to help. Then why are they needed at all? Owner transactions are blocked, but fraudsters are not. It's not a normal practice. It is like a lock that the owner cannot open, but unlocks at the sight of thieves. Why is it needed.

Is it possible that your account was created with certain restrictions at the time you opened it?
I have heard of limitations like these, but they usually apply when a minor creates an account with the bank, or when someone does so with limited personal information shared, like a student account.
But for a fully functional account, there are no such steep limitations to withdrawals, at least not where I am located.

I am in agreement that banking regulations can be a bit of a hassle and i would rather do away with it, if that was completely possible. Maybe in the future when adoption of alternative payment solutions grow.

There are transfer limits in most banks in the country I'm currently in, and $10,000 is a good chunk of money when converted to the local currency. Not sure how easy/hard it is to raise the daily limits and to what extent it can be raised, but idk I don't use banks much as you'd have to call them(and sometimes even need to go to the bank physically) to fix most stuff.

Couldn't he make the transfer online? Banks are digitizing by leaps and bounds, so it is rare what you say, unless it is in a third world country. I do all my transfers online, although depending on the amount per AML policies they may make you fill out a form or do some paperwork before making the transfer effective.

After a few years of not going to a bank, went with a friend of mine because he needed to transfer $10,000 to his dad's bank account.

We wasted like 40 minutes in that bank even though the queue wasn't even that long. It boggles me how severely inefficient banks are in 2022. Meanwhile sending money with BTC or stables are easy as hell.

Although it is a limited part of the banking system, but the truth is that we cannot stop using banking, it is still essential to our lives. There is still a lack of acceptance of bitcoin throughout the world, so its use is still somewhat limited.

It is suitable only for profitable investment additionally, it can be used to pay for some products but cannot replace the work that fiat is doing.

Not defending the banking system, but this is also the first time that I heard this restrictions. Maybe we are in a recession, however, even in a developing country that I live, never heard of this prior even in the 2008-2009 economic crisis.

But it just highlight was crypto can overcome this traditional system. Nevertheless, there are crypto exchanges at least our local exchange that you have to go to KYC to be able to have a good cash-in/cash out protoocls.

Restrictions on how often sounds very strange to me as well. Restrictions when you want to withdraw or transfer large amounts yes, but not on the frequency, especially nowadays when I do everything online. It is clear that the good thing about Bitcoin is that it does not have these kinds of restrictions. If you want to send money 20 times or send $20B, you can do it without any kind of restriction.

I can withdraw or transfer money freely, but the bank card will limit my daily consumption amount. If I need a lot of money, I need to go to the counter. Putting money in the bank is not a very wise decision, I prefer to invest the extra money in bitcoin and mining. I'm going to get better returns than depositing in the bank.

That's why I don't trust banks anymore hence its our money but they put withdrawal limit per day is not good choice at all. Bank system is a mess and controlling people their money which its ours in the first place. Since then I withdrawn all my money and I just put it on investment to generate passive income and invest on bitcoin as well.

That's the game they make and run them, you can't do anything but accept it. We can deposit as much as we want, they never give us a hard time, but when we want to withdraw they will find a way to slow down the process. Lol, that's how most banks are doing.


The country I live in also has restrictions on withdrawals during the day and month. For example, I can deposit 1000$ or 10000$ in my account but I can only withdraw no more than 1000$/day. If I want to withdraw more than the specified amount, I have to go to the bank and give them full identification and the reason for the withdrawal. They do the procedure for me to withdraw money.

What country do you live in? I'm in the US and in the 50+ years that I've had bank accounts I have never - repeat NEVER EVER - ran into any restrictions in how often I access and use my savings accounts.

The Money Market ones, again, can't say I've ever had an issues with them BUT I can see and understand restrictions but that is due to what they are intended to be - a reserve and (very low yield) investment vehicle and not an account with frequent inputs/outputs. Banks expect to be able to use those funds to generate revenue through loans/investments/etc so yes it would make sense that they have gov backed rules to control that.

Then there is the issue of Debit cards which some folks love to use instead of carrying cash. When you use one that is a direct withdrawal from the acct it is tied to and that makes it very easy for folks using them to do more than 6 tx's in a single day...

It is their network and since it is centralized they can change the rules whenever they want and the end user cannot do anything else but to accept them, so if you do not like it then vote with your wallet and get your money out of there, if you have some withdrawals left this month lol, and then do whatever you want with that money, you could keep the cash or get gold bitcoin or whatever you want, just do not make the mistake of leaving your money there as it is obvious banks feel that money belongs to them and they can do whatever they want with it.

The banking system is really a rotten system. It is a funny system full of ironies and absurd policies.

I myself wouldn't want to make an over-the-counter withdrawal because of all the hassles involved. It also makes me angry that every time I do this, it seems I am the one who is begging for my own money. It seems I am always treated with suspicion. You'll be asked to sign many times, asked for a couple of valid IDs, asked to get the approval of the bank officer or manager, and so on. For heaven's sake, just give me my money!

Bitcoin doesn't have any of these.

do you complain about 1 product or just the type of savings? if you are so burdened try to have many banks with 1 account it will be relevant and allowed.
maybe from the requested service you don't mind but from the limit, right?
coupled with several emerging and legal financial applications, in my opinion, it is an alternative if the situation is urgent, bro.
if you think inflation may be possible yes.but more than that financial companies have services that they write and execute at the time of transaction

I always new that banks limit the number of withdraws per month on savings accounts, but I didnt know why. I just accepted it.

What is Regulation D? Regulation D is a federal law that keeps consumers from making more than six withdrawals or transfers per month from a savings account or money market account. The rule is in place to help banks maintain reserve requirements.

What? Case in point.

And I just made about 8 transactions spreading BTC among wallets and didnt get an email notification from satoshi that I was over my withdrawal limit and owe him $25. LMAO
By the way, the federal reserve just lifted this withdrawal restriction, I am assuming due to inflationary pressures. I dont think its a permanent lift.