Topic: Trezor accounts (Read 148 times)

I guess another wallet gives you more security than just creating another account. Other accounts will help you organize and classify your funds but they won't give you additional privacy or security. Different accounts in a single wallet could be accessed with a single set of seed, after all.

As for me I have a separate wallet for the coins I intend to HODL for a long time. That is basically a saving wallet for me. I keep that untouched and more private than my other wallets. I have another wallet that is intended for the coins I need or want to spend every now and then, which is further classified into a few more accounts: for gambling, bills payment, etc. 

Yes. You should also learn about coin control if you are really concerned about that. You won't need it if you are going to consequently use one account for one thing.


You can have a dummy wallet in case someone forced you to unlock the wallet. Highly unlikely event, but still possible. Using several passphrases is useful if you are afraid of your seed and passphrases being discovered by someone. There is no other reason.


Oh, that's what you are referring to. That post describes how to use either Trezor or Ledger hardware wallet with multiple accounts in Electrum. I didn't mention passphrases there.

Sounds like that I don't actually need to create several passphrase wallets only to prevent other to see all of my coins? When will there ever be a point to create several wallets instead of creating accounts?
Ok for security and the classic wrench threat or if you don't want to show any one sitting next to you all your coins (as they see the total amount of the accounts). But what other values are there to have passphrases instead of accounts?

(Perheps BitCryptex answer could be a reason)

It might help if you understand how the accounts are actually derived... Starting from your "seed mnemonic" (12/24 words), the mnemonic is converted to a "seed" (a very large number)... Then from this seed, various "derivation paths" are used to derive various things (based on BIP44 standard)

The derivation path format is: m / purpose' / coin_type' / account' / change / address_index

For BIP44, purpose is always "44"...  For "Bitcoin", the coin_type is "0", for BCH it is "145"... (other registered coin_types are listed here: https://github.com/satoshilabs/slips/blob/master/slip-0044.md)

Then you get to account... these are simply a "0 indexed" value... so you start from 0 and increment as you want to use a new account.

Account #1 - m/44'/0'/0'
Account #2 - m/44'/0'/1'
Account #3 - m/44'/0'/2'
Account #4 - m/44'/0'/3'

You can read more here: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0044.mediawiki


The "labels" you see in Trezor GUI or Ledger Live etc... are simply that... "labels". They are not stored anywhere except within the apps themselves. If you wipe and reset the device... or restore to another device, the accounts will still be viewable simply by looking at the correct derivation path (which both Trezor Wallet and Ledger Live will do automagically)... however the "labels" will NOT be recoverable (unless you have backed them up somehow, trezor uses dropbox etc)


As for what the recipient will see... ALL they will see is the "addresses/public keys" of the UTXOs that were used to fund the transaction (and the address/public key of a change address if any)... they will NOT be able to see the contents/addresses of any of the other "accounts".

As far as I am aware, both Trezor and Ledger do NOT allow you to spend from multiple accounts in one transaction... you are only able to spend from 1 account per transaction (but it might be using multiple UTXOs from that account that are from different addresses/public keys).

Ie. if you had the following:

Account 1:
Address1A - 0.5 BTC
Address1B - 0.1 BTC
Address1C - 0.2 BTC

Account 2:
Address2A - 0.3 BTC

- You couldn't create a transaction that sends 1 BTC as neither of your accounts has 1 BTC total.
- If you tried to send 0.6 BTC from Account 1... it could use Address1A & Address1B to send... and the recipient would see both of those but NOT Address1C. Nor would it know anything about Account 2 (and it's addresses/amounts)
- If you sent 0.1 BTC from Account 2... it would use Address2A, create a change address (ChangeAddress2A)... and the recipient would see your original Address2A AND your newly created ChangeAddress2A but would know nothing about Account 1 (and it's addresses/amounts)

So there is a privacy layer after all. However only if you don't sign in to Dropbox (I didn't know there was this Dropbox option)
This is interesting, to avoid mixing coins. Some of your coins may be attached to your Bitcointalk account, some others to your real I'd (using verified exchanges accounts). So you could avoid mixing them, for example

No, the whole point of using accounts is that you don't expose your addresses from other accounts. You might accidentally mix some coins (or addresses) from the same account since the official web interface doesn't support coin control. The receipent can only see the address from which they received coins. They can't learn the account's name and all of its addresses unless you use all of them in one transaction.

Ok, I thought that it was like the passphrases.
So if I receive transaction to Account #1 and Account #2 in my wallet with passphrase "abcde". Then if I send from Account #2, the recipient will not only see that the transaction is from "Account #2". They will see my wallet "abcde"?

Yes, it's only for organisation. I wouldn't say it's a privacy enhancement since you have to connect your Dropbox account. If someone gets access to your Dropbox account then they will be able to see that you have a Trezor device. Labels themselves are encrypted. It will be possible in the future to save them on a SD card on Trezor T.

If you want to manage your coins properly then pair your wallet with Electrum which has great coin control capabilities.

But is it only for my own organization? Isn't it as another layer of privacy as well?

Don't worry about those account names or label

All you need is your seed. Even your trezor device can be lost, and with your seed you can recover all your funds in Electrum or any other wallet.

Those account name's are just for your organization and software interface, they don't affect anything in the blockchain or in your balance

Those names are the default ones which help users to distinguish the accounts. As I wrote in my previous message, you don't have to remember their names. The seed is enough to recover your whole wallet. You have to enable labeling (Dropbox required) if you want to rename them. You don't have to remember their new names.

Not the label, only the account "name". I think it is named "Account #1" and if I create a new account it get named "Account #2". It is those names that I refer to. What if I rename those accounts to "buisness" and "shopping"? Do I need to remember that? Or is that only possible to rename them if I activeated dropbox and labels?

Are you referring to labels? No, you don't have don't remember them and they won't appear unless you connect your Dropbox account again. The seed and the passphrase (only if you enabled it) are enough to restore everything.


If you use the official Trezor wallet then you won't have to do anything. However, If you decide to use Electrum then you will have to create a separate wallet for each of your accounts. I described it here a moment ago.

Do I need to remember the name of my accounts if I need to restore my device? What if I restore my pass seed to another wallet that supports account. Does it automatically show all my accounts or do I need to specify them?