Topic: Trump declares "cartels" terrorists. What about the US consumers of drugs? (Read 200 times)

It's likely meant for violent drug gangs whose actions directly or indirectly harm the innocent. However, I consider the declareration inconsistent with his unconditional pardoning of someone who certainly and deliberately was a facilitator of the sale of harmful/evil drugs. This has become an obstacle that will make one stumble. Anyway, there is always bad consequences for bad decisions unless correction is taken which the public should know about to serve as a deterrent

Wannabe maths prof.





Please let us what works, it will help everyone, Mr literate  

@Least trump is trying to fix the stuff.

Your problem is that you are simply too dense to see anything in any way other than you want to see it.

Today the date is the 23 of January... Trump 3 days in office. And you can't even see that an increase in price of Big Pharma products reduces the use of them, and speeds insurance into a death spiral. Why would anybody want to do something like this? And how does this fit in with MAGA. >>> Back in 1977 the doctors in Orange County went on strike for a month for more pay. There were 50% fewer deaths in Orange County that month.

MAGA doesn't include killing off Americans.

Nothing effective happens because drug users are treated as victims of society. And why are they treated like that? Because there are many influent people who make use of drugs and also people who are close to authorities, like doctors, politicians, judiciary members, police officers, celebrities and so on. If drugs are heavily censored, these people lose their "hobby" and will have to be punished severily.

It's not interesting for the ones who make the laws and enforce it, so cartels aren't going to stop existing anytime soon. Meanwhile, politicians can continue speaking loud and indignant about how harmful drugs are for the country and its future. They aren't going to change anything, but it will guarantee votes for the next election.

This could be a good thing for the youth of US. Drug control seem to have worked many times and when the price is high and availability low, people would settle for less expensive intoxication.

I see, so you are saying that trump is in the pocket of big pharma now? Gotcha! It actually fits as trump reversed all the cost caps, that Biden negotiated for anyone on Medicare or Medicaid (affecting >120M people). So that big pharma can make all the money it wants now without government control. Raising the cost of prescription drugs also sure is weird way of making everything cheaper for Americans.

As i know that you are a believer, i thought you might hate trump now, when he didn't even place his hand on the bible while taking the oath of office, or when triggered by a bishop saying most christian things ever.

But you now also acknowledge, that big pharma owns him? What a time to be alive.

I found out that united state is the biggest consumer of drugs?
The United States consumes more unlawful  drugs than any other country in the world. It is estimated that somewhere about six percent of people in the United States use illegal drugs.

United States is the largest national medicament       market worldwide.

The only reason why the cartels have been declared terrorists is because Big Pharma wants it that way. Why do they want it that way? It's one of the ways they are stamping out competition.

THE WALL JUST GOT 10 FEET HIGHER!!!!1!!

There would be no consumers if there was no product in the first place. President Trump is going to wage war on cartels who are not simply providing a "product" that some people may want to snort off their tables in Beverly hills etc but who are acting outside the rules of civilised conduct in how they operate their so called "business" murdering innocent people and elected officials.

The cartels by definition are not merely outlaws but are indeed terrorist organisations due to the sheer terror they instill upon the citizenry.


President Trump is correct to use the resources available to fight against cartels instead of wasting said resources making ordinary non violent peoples lives a misery . People who smoke pot or even snort coke should have the choice to buy it from government approved sources although I personally think coke should be best only an ingredient in coca cola like in the good old days.


Cartels are vicious but most of their customers are merely fools.

Start at the basics by noting that the FDA stands for Food and Drug Administration. What does government have to do with food? If you eat drugs, they are food for you.

Our thinking is backward. Get rid of the FDA because it shouldn't have anything to do with what we eat.

One either attacks the production or tackles the demand, and obviously going after cartels and those who are producers of drugs is easier for the Republican party, as it seems to me a straight forward strategy which does not involve spending on people, as taking care of addicts would be.
Cutting expenses on healthcsre also includes cutting funds that go towards rehabilitation clinics and helping those living in hopelessness.
I am rather in favor of an approach which tries to both things as the same time, taking care of your own people how unfortunately fell into addiction, and attacking those criminal organizations which feeds the country with cocaine, Fentanyl and crack.
But I guess since Trump is going to cut taxes, there will not be enough money to help people out and show them there is life beyond being physically dependant on drugs.

If you choose to use drugs - and it is nearly all cases a choice - to buy and use - you are NOT a victim. The victim is a young girl in Mexico that goes to a crappy school and gets killed in the street simply because she was in the wrong place. She did not have the choice and has to live in a country corrupted by your money.

I am not concerned about the people put in jail, I am concerned that thanks to the US money they are in jail without a trial.


How is fentanyl made and distributed? Hint: as opossed to other drugs, it does not grow on trees.

But the change in trends is irrelevant, in the end this is the US people funding the worst criminal organisations that make Latin America fail.

https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy2719#:~:text=Today%2C%20Mexican%20cartels%20such%20as,sourced%20largely%20from%20the%20PRC.


And then all this article goes about how the Cartels facilitate the traffic, but then....


PRC, just in case is not clear enough: People's Republic of China. Will Trump class China as a terrorist country then?

2+2


We've been fighting the "war on drugs" for ~40 years. Clearly it hasn't worked, whether it was crack in the 1980s or opioids more recently. It's not going to work now that a different guy wants to do the same thing. To think otherwise is the definition of insanity.


Not sure what vaccines have to do with it, but RFK is an abject moron. Didn't he suggest labor camps for drug addicts?

Where did you get that from?


Incorrect point.

How much demand for fentanyl was there in the USA in 1990?


Ya well, I guess you also think that since RFK is anti-vaccine the plan he has is garbage.


No, of course, if I am not surprised, you are lenient with the offender and tough with the victims, but I do not say it only in this case.

The solution is very easy. This one:



But you don't need to tell me that you are very concerned about the rights of the people that Bukele puts in jail and little or nothing about the right to life, liberty and security of honest Salvadorans. I do know about it.

Yes, he isn't wrong, but I feel this policy should be two sided, and not just on the cartel alone. Fine, we know that cartels are the primary sources, but I want to still believe that there are some rich folks out there, that can spend any amount just to have whatever product they consume.

How about heavy fine/punishment on anyone caught buying from them?.
Oh, I just remembered that it might not happen probably because the public sees them as those who needs help.

But that aside, if trump wants to get a better result, he needs to checkmate both the source(cartels) and those who have a high taste (well addictive consumers).

Yes that is the point. My thesis is that Latin America is not the problem of the US, but rather the oposite. How are you going to have properly governed countries when the public budget has to compete with the illegal inflows of US funds comming from the drug users of this country?

On one side, we have a constant discourse from the US criminalising anything that is not white and preferably blond. We are not talking only about Reagans "war on drugs" that crowded the jails of the US with people with relatively minor offences, we are also talking about the Holywood machinery producing movie after movie with Latins on the roles of criminals and gangsters.

In Trumps inaugural speech, he is a milimeter from equating Latin American and criminal. He does not exactly says this, but he exactly gives that general view. But the war on drugs should start in the US. Either you legalise it or, as Suchmoon wrote (I am guessing with a hint of irony) that all the consumers in the US would face charges for financing terrorists.

https://english.elpais.com/elpais/2019/10/07/inenglish/1570461267_201013.html

Legalise and make it taxable and medically controlled or start by cleaning your home.


Well, it seems that you have then financed the terrorists according to Trump.

Of course you can easily pass moral judgement on the cartel - it cannot be any simpler and you would be right in the facts. But half truth is not the truth.

 For example, the US goverment created Guantanamo - where people could be tortured and held in captivity indefinetly - but when that was considered "too good" they CIA flew them to Egypt and other countries whose police would make the Cartels look like amateurs. See? Easy judgement, and as standalone, true. And that was a Republican's creation BTW.

It is not something you should ignore, it is something you should eliminate at the source - the US, where the money comes that make the poor and desperate people of poor and desperate countries kill each other.

So drug users can be prosecuted for financing terrorist organizations. What could possibly go wrong.


Which will do nothing to solve the problem if the demand is still there, is the point I think.

And Trump isn't gonna even try to solve addiction nor any other public health issue because that sounds like an actual real problem that can't be solved with a sharpie.

Yes, you are probably right. I think the US is the world's largest consumer of illegal drugs.  This demand drives the drug trade in Latin America, where many of the drugs are produced. But Trump's moves are politically motivated now. There is usually some hidden agenda behind it, although, he is not wrong.

So? Let me see if I understand you, the bad guy is Trump because he considers the cartels terrorist organizations and instead it is the fault of those who want to get high. That the cartels use methods of extortion, torture and murder that leave the Spanish Holy Inquisition as amateurs is something we should ignore because the blame lies with the soft middle class who wants to get high.

I have tried basically all the classic drugs (marijuana, speed, LSD, extasy, cocaine, and various opiates) and I think that anything that can be done to put the mafia organizations in jail is not enough. At least those who sold them to me were not cutting people into little pieces while they were still alive.

One cannot sell if there is nobody that buys. While Trump claims that anything south of Rio Grande is the land of criminals and all that, the fact is that it is the US consuption of drugs one of the main problems of Latin America.

The goverments of Colombia, Mexico, Honduras, ... they cannot do much to keep law and order if the gangs are getting paid in illegal fresh money comming from the pockets of the US middle class and well to do phoneys of the preppy schools and posh colleges.

Again: For someone to sell, someone is buying and using.