Topic: Turkey will not apologise for shooting down Russian jet (Read 7058 times)

The Russians have already hinted that the Americans might have leaked the flight path of the Su-24 to the Turks. Else, how could they take out the fighter jet, which was inside the Turkish airspace (by their own claims) for just 5 or 6 seconds? BTW... I know that you are from Turkey. Tell us about the public opinion there, regarding this incident.

I think it was an ambush and probably was planned weeks before it happened. In fact I saw a leak from October from some Turkish twitter guy suggesting that Turkey was planning such an ambush. He seems to be a Deep Throat around some circles. Maybe it´s disinfo but it seemed interesting.

Israel Shamir had this stuff, if you haven´t read his material I suggest you start.

Anybody who think Erdogan (the puppet) and Davutoglu (puppet of the puppet) can take a decision like this without the knowledge of America is so naive that I can make their girl pregnant and they don't even know it.
Of course they won't apologize for this decision.

Russia is claiming that it was the Americans who leaked the flight path of the Su-24 to the Turks. If that was the case, then it seems to me that the Turks shot down the plane, after getting orders to do so from the Americans. The Americans just used the Turks to do some dirty work on their behalf. After all, it is not just the Turks who are benefiting out of the ISIS oil trade.

Yep. And this is getting pretty worrying because Turkey is a part of NATO. This could take is directly to an open 3rd world war. And I don't see what was the point of Turkey taking down the Russian plane unless they are really lookingf for trouble...

It´s moot points patrolman. The Turks belong to our team and therefore are like us exempt from all accountability.

Our team can run roughshod over anyone, anywhere as it pleases and doesn´t need to waste a single thought on any consequences, well apart from the occasional blowback. But that doesn´t have to do with us destroying countries and killing and maiming millions and displacing even more, it´s just some crazed muzzies that hate our freedoms. We´ll just have a brief emotional porn binge and then go back to bombing. Anyway; a hundred victims here and there in our cities is a small price to pay for soaring war industry shares.

Here are a few interesting articles which are at odds with Turkey's version of events:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-24/17-seconds-changed-world-leaked-letter-exposes-turkeys-hair-trigger-reality

http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2015/12/01/an-experienced-pilot-explains-stall-speed/

A few key points:


17 seconds is hardly enough time for there to been any significant discussion about the air space violation, so the plane must have been either shot down in Syrian air space or without sufficient verbal communication to defuse the situation.

Hmm, this is strange...

Meanwhile the US Secretary of State John Kerry said Syrian and Arab ground forces must be found to take on the jihadist group. “Without the ability to find some ground forces that are prepared to take on Daesh, this will not be won completely from the air,” he said.

----------------------------

But General Pigfinder, London´s chief warmonger, stated emphatically the other day that there were 70,000 of them ready and willing to support his war effort. I'm surprised Mr. Kerry didn't already know of them, usually the relationship of these people is about as tight as that of an ass and the boil on it.

Or maybe they forgot to coordinate their stories, happens all the time even to the best of criminals.

In an American turkey shoot, the turkey loses.   

"Stop that nonsense or we'll create new strait on the place of Istanbul"

Hahaha, pretty persuasive. I guess the Turks won´t try that one again. 

Well, NATO premier personalities are nuts for sure but I doubt that they´re nuts enough to let this Erdogan guy run around much longer. I think they have something in the works to get rid of him and his gang, probably through a coup by the Turkish military. Maybe he´ll end up in a garbage dumpster in Ukraine, joining other refuse that NATO has dumped there.

Won't work at all because that would be an open declaration of war. They've tried this against USSR, defence minister said then "Stop that nonsense or we'll create new strait on the place of Istanbul". And they stopped a blockade of Bosphorus immediately.

Turning off the gas flow is not an option yet, current pretext isn't enough for breaking the contract.

This will happen even without that. Erdogan is currently acting exactly like Yanukovich, he's doing everything to be overthrown. Probably, because he wants to drop this business, leaving the dirty incomings untouched. I'm pretty sure he have made enough money for the rest of life.

So, what´s next? Turkey will  block the Bosphorus for Russian traffic? I´m sure that as usual NATO nutbags don´t give a hoot about international law unless it suits their interests so they´d back Turkey on that. Russia could turn off the gas in retaliation which would probably soon lead to an Erdogan "government in exile" in London or some other favorite shelter for favored criminals.

Nobody has the right to ignore standard interception procedure under pretext of "defending airspace". Please learn the subject before repeating baseless propaganda.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.13112138

Article 5 is a non-binding agreement. They don't have to be united, it's just a proposal. That's the reason why US has all these military bases located in the NATO countries. They won't need military bases if article 5 would be a binding agreement.

Turkey do have the rights to defend their airspace but they are part of NATO. They have to be united but instead they are fighting with each other. Thats very sad

Just seen the press conference... A lot of satellite images, drone footages of oil trucks and so on... And yes, they've finally said that.

"We know that he won't resign even if his face will be poured with stolen oil. Although Erdogan must go, his resignation is not our priority."

Well, it seems that nobody is waiting for apologies, another "democratic coup" is on the way... Not a US-staged one.

Erdogan must go...he's worn out his welcome with moderate and reasonable and BRAVE Turks. Turkey used to be an important ally....with this pinhead, Turkey has become an ally of ISIS. Turkey will go nowhere but downhill with this Muslim terrorist. Hang 'em!!!

In any event they gave the Russians the perfect opportunity to bring those S-400 systems into Syria. Absent the downing of the plane, imagine the uproar such a move would have caused with politicians in the west and idiots posting on countless internet message boards. Not to mention the presstitutes, hahahaha.

Great win for Russia.

Turkey is playing dangerous game by continuing to poke bear.

British Nutballs Hameron and Hammond to probably join the fracas in Syria. Now I´m starting to get a bit worried. The fewer NATO crazies there the better for world peace as far as I´m concerned.

https://www.rt.com/news/324189-defense-ministry-briefing-terrorism/

20 minutes left before the beginning of MoD press conference.

The Syrian crisis has actually benefited the Turks. Some 2.2 million Syrians have fled to Turkey, and now the Turks are having cheap labor in the form of these migrants. In addition, Turkey is going to receive EUR 3 billion per year from the European Union, to look after these migrants. And last but the least, the EU has also agreed to permit Visa-free travel for the Turkish citizens.

I dont have any information about this osetya issue. Im following this isis news in internation news and local news and i dont agree with you about turkish goverment support isis. this Syria war has damaged us most. more then 3 million syrian live in turkey now and most of people (and i ) really dont want to live with this people. we dont understand their languages and their culture very different from us. even so we have no choise about that.

Tell this to people, who have been killed by terrorists in Chechnya, North Ossetia, Dagestan and so on. By terrorists, who have had received the medical treatment, monetary support and asylum from Turkish authorities. Who took advantage of the weakness of the state at that time and tried to cut off a piece for themselves, just like they're acting now in Syria. With friends like that, who needs enemies?

We have nothing against significant part of turkish people, but your government and IS are variations of the same thing. We still remember what Grey Wolves and other thugs have done in our country, and we won't forgive that. Downed plane was just a pretext to bring the old memories back, simple as a piece of cake.

erdogan never do apologize for this.they need to do apologize also but we didnt want to do it. Putin wants to threaten with sanctions turkey. but they will lose us in the area soon. turkish people and govement always looks a friend country russia. but putin will change this idea in turkish people mind. (sorry for bad english my 3. languages.)

Won't happen. For Erdogan, any apologizes would mean an instant political death. And, what is the most offensive to Erdogan, he himself has created this problem. That's is why he would rather turn the entire country into a sinking Titanic than apologize.

just apologize and move on! they're just creating more unnecessary tensions which might soon lead to war or idiots from both countries doing something they might regret like committing a hate crime. just be the better person and apologize and move forward. wars and nonsense hatred begin with something as pathetic and simple as this.

Today more information has been released. Russia says Turkey buys the ISIS oil, which if you read from many sources then you already knew this, and Turkey shot it down because Russia really is attacking ISIS and moderate rebels( some of which come from Turkey) and Turkey wanted to secure the oil trade routes.  It's an interesting accusation and although I dislike Putin very much, I think this is one of those things that the American public just isn't supposed to know. Personally I think the meda paints Turkey(prior to this) as a cooperative country in this whole operation. Remember last year when it was big news that Turkey was allowing us to setup shop in Turkey to combat ISIS?

This is all part of something much bigger and we all must do what we can to read between the lines of the media and see what's really going on. That way we can actually prepare for what may be.

In the end, while oil is the #1 power source in the world, the poor middle east( which is abundant in oil, duh) is going to remain a chess board with big boys playing for keeps using the ignorant consumer as a pawn. High ranked officers are more like rooks or bishops in this, this not aware of what's really going on. They just think they are fighting to make sure their loved ones can stay safe on home soil. It's all an illusion. This safety net can be crushed in minutes or less and panic would ensue.

Pretty stupid idea, such scenario has never ends well. War eventually ends, and then original owners are coming back, armed with overwhelming fighting experience and crazy amount of weapons.

Why can't Turkey asked Russia for apology for its jet unintentionally crossed into Turkey's border with concrete proof and then apologizes for shooting down the jet and agrees to some kind of compensations for the jet and the killed pilot? Prolonging the conflict does not do anybody any good.

Erdogan was planning to annex the Turkmen inhabited regions of North-Western Syria to Turkey,taking advantage of the ongoing civil war. Until a few days ago, everything was going according to the plan. The Turks had ethnically cleansed the region of other ethnic groups (Kurds, Alawites, Armenians.etc). But then the Russian retaliation happened and all the Turkmen fled to Hatay. 

Downing a Russian aircraft was probably a reaction to Russia sending cruise missiles over Turkey Airspace without notification.

And the result seems quite opposite.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1tYn-SkDA8

It is all plain and simple. Turkey was supporting the ISIS, the Al Nusra and its affiliates. They were also earning a lot of money, by selling the oil and the artifacts given to them by the ISIS pigs. When Russia started bombing the facatics, this source of revenue was cut off, and the goatfuckers decided to retaliate against it.

https://www.rt.com/politics/323979-kadyrov-blames-turkey-for-executing/

Kadyrov blames Turkey for executing ‘Western plan to destroy Muslim nations’

POINT: according to USA satellites etc it WAS in Turkey's air space. Even if you are correct and such, I still state if the circumstances were reversed ..Russia would not apologize to Turkey for such.....but again because Turkey is a less powerful country and the Russian Plane (like previous incidents) was in or too close to Turkey air space and such happened ...again it would be NON ISSUE on an Apology..if the roles were reversed..heh ...no way in hell Russia would apologize to Turkey for shooting down a plane that was (or they thought was) in Russian Air Space.

The Russian's played fast and loose on the Turkish border ..freaked Turkey out from previous warnings....and did what any country would do ...shot the plane down.

But again my point is Russia would never apologize if it thought it was in the right..to expect Turkey to do so is dumb imho....just posturing....and even more dire if the Russian's really were in Turkey Air Space and 'assumed' they would not get shot down...not that would be embarrassing as hell .thus all the posturing on the Russian side imho...

anyway to clarify my point on the previous post

Thank you man!
I am searching about that statement but it didn't come to my mind )

Erdogan and Ankara still refuses to apologize for its mistake of shooting down a Russian plane while it's still over Syrian space. Ankara claims its duty to protect its country. But the Russian plane was not even in their country's airspace! It's useless to deal with stubborn parties.

So many excuses and instances brought up but none pertains to shooting down the Russian plane while it wasn't in Turkey's airspace. Radical Muslims and Turks alike will never admit their mistakes. Reason to bomb them to kingdom come, if at all possible. And NATO just keeps mum.

Well I don't get why Russia is upset...a modern Turkish Jet flying into Russian air space would be shot down without an apology imho .in fact probably most would be surprised if such was the case after the fact ..mostly Russian response would be "no comment"...Russia would be like FU Turkey.

But because they are a big world power ..they tried to do wtf they wanted in Turkish Air Space and now got burned and are 'embarrassed" are now tossing weight around imho

But a thread asking for Russia to do the same as they expect Turkey to do now (ie apologise) lol ..hell the would be so unlikely and equivalent thread as such would not have even passed the OP's mind

just saying....the way it looks to me if it was the other way around

I remember a quote stated by Sir Putin.

   “To Forgive terrorists is up to God, to send them to him is up to me.”

And i think this means a lot to all the nations concern

Ever since the Russians moved some of their S-400 Triumf (SA-21 Growler) systems to Syria, the Turkish warplanes have stopped intruding in to the Greek and the Syrian air-spaces. In particular, the Greeks are overjoyed. Earlier, there used to be up to a dozen Turkish violations in a single day. For the past few days, there have been none.

Apologies are for pussies. Now it's time to increase the intensity of bombing of terrorists supported by Turkey in Syria, and shoot down every fucking Turkish plane which will cross the border of Syria, Greece or Armenia.

Now they don't need to apologize, as their NATO backers are solidly supporting them. Any economic damage from the Russian sanctions will be neutralized by the billions of EUR that the European Union is willing to provide to them (for "managing" the "refugees"). And the Turkish laborers will start swamping the local workforce in various European nations, once the visa requirement is waived.

So their relations will continue to deteriorate. They weren't protecting themselves as they are not in a state of war. On the contrary they have an embassy in Moscow and their relations were friendly until the incident.

Turkish PM says during Nato talks that it has right to defend airspace, as allies try to prevent escalation and say focus should be on battling Isis

Ankara will not apologise for downing a Russian fighter jet on the Syrian border but Moscow should reconsider retaliatory sanctions, the Turkish prime minister has said.

Ahmet Davutoğlu said: “Protection of our airspace, our border is not only a right but a duty for my government and no Turkish premier or president ... will apologise [for] doing our duty.”

Speaking on Monday, at a joint press conference with the Nato head, Jens Stoltenberg, Davutoğlu added that he hoped “Russia will reconsider these measures in both our interests”, referring to the sanctions that Moscow imposed after the shooting down of the jet last week.

“If the Russian side wants to talk, we are ready; if they want more information, we are ready; if they want to normalise relations, we are ready to talk,” he said.

Davutoğlu was speaking as the Kremlin said Vladimir Putin had rejected an invitation to meet his Turkish counterpart, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, on the sidelines of the Paris global climate conference.

Erdoğan had called for face-to-face talks with Putin as Moscow and Ankara trade accusations over who was responsible for downing the plane. Ankara said on Monday it had returned the body of the pilot to Russia.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/30/turkey-will-not-apologise-for-shooting-down-russian-jet