Topic: US GOVERNMENT CONTINUES BITCOIN SEIZURES, CONTROLS NEARLY 1% OF CIRCULATING SUPP (Read 410 times)

I think 1% of the circulating supply of bitcoin is a very insignificant amount to cause worry in the space. Circulating supply is not the total supply, and I think they want to do more of the take over if they have the opportunity. That is one of the reasons I love bitcoin decentralized nature, the more you want to take the dominance of the bitcoin the more it gets difficult for whoever.

but do you think the us government might print some type of fiat that is backed by bitcoin? then people just use that instead of the us dollar but then we would need to make sure that the us government never went off the "bitcoin" standard like the did the gold standard because if they tried to do that then it would be a disaster for bitcoin users. their paper money with the private key would immediately become questionable to whether it was worth anything at all.

Selling to whom? The people? Or private/institutional investors? Even though the US government is selling BTC, it still holds a substantial amount of coins in its reserves. Cashing out for USD will keep them in the profit zone before the market correction. After BTC dumps, they will buy more and "hodl" it until the next pump.

The point is that governments are now deep in the game. As long as they don't get to hold the majority of BTC's circulating supply, there should be nothing to worry about.

yes, but this is not new. they extort money with the threat of violence on a daily basis.

criminal cabal control the world, lines drawn between countries have been put there to divide us, to prevent unity & uprising. it's all a scam.

stop complying with criminals because it's the right thing to do. all they do is lie and deceive.

if you're feeding the system at all right now, you're part of the problem.

good to see bitcoin is pumping though - lots of money exiting the fiat ponzi. people are starting to figure it out.

Apparently they auction off the bitcoin to the highest bidder so that kind of makes people who buy from the usa government complicit in stealing other peoples' bitcoin. it's kind of like someone that fails to pay their property taxes and loses their house and someone else paid the back taxes and takes over the house. the person taking over the house profits and lives off of other peoples' misfortune, lets not sugar coat it.

the thing is though when uncle sam auctions off his bitcoin, he doesnt pay any capital gains tax. oh no. it's all profit. and no taxes for him. he just sticks the proceeds in his back pocket and spends them on anything he wants to.   meanwhile the people he sells his bitcoin too have to pay taxes anytime they sell any of their bitcoin.

US never fails to amaze me as they try to get a piece of everything be it gold, oil or diamonds or even crypto in that cases as they just want sot control everything and show that they are the biggest superpower or World police. But they cannot control Bitcoin like they do other resources as that's the advantage of decentralization and as of now I don't think we should worry about involvement of US as they are mostly seizing the Bitcoin of criminals and eventually they will increase their reach but can never fully control it. Now what do they do with the seized BTC? 

Then why are they constantly selling every coins thats has been seized once it's status is cleared?
Just last month they auctioned more coins than Salvador has:
https://cryptonews.net/news/bitcoin/28459784/


It's far more complicated than that!
It's not about refusal to return the coins, it's about to whom the coins should be returned!
Under US laws you can't just simply give it back if there is a lawsuit between the exchange and the people who actually owns those coins!

The DoJ has said it clearly, until there is consensus between the exchange and the ones that have been reimbursed via tokens on how the sums will be distributed there will be no return, Bitfinex claims they have paid back in their return tokens the sums, but they have done in $ value, the former victims demand that the difference between the prices at the moment of the hack and the current levels should also be distributed.


So, to who should the DoJ return the coins, the exchange or the clients?
Because if they decide to return it to Bitfinex it means by law that it has Bitfinex property and the former victims are screwed, and again by law, they will have to take not Bitfinex to court but the DoJ.

This was expected op since it's the US that we are talking about who always want to be first in literally anything no matter what. Their control over the crypto world will definitely keep rising, but they will never fully control BTC and other popular crypto.

This is what makes these cryptocurrencies so special since all other currencies are completely controlled by them.

Having a large chunk of Bitcoin's circulating supply is intriguing. It shows how the asset is becoming legitimate and how existing financial systems will merge with digital currency. This doesnt mean Bitcoin is bad; it shows its effect and mainstream potential.

This discussion requires empathy. Individuals with affected assets face a personal and complex predicament. Recognizing their experiences and considering the big picture is crucial. Bitcoin is designed to last. Its decentralization and worldwide community's devotion to its values counteract government or other control.

The role of governments in cryptocurrency is debated. Positively pushing for regulations that foster innovation, safeguard individual rights, and improve digital currency security and utility is vital. Education and dialogue are crucial in this dynamic climate. Bitcoin's mission of financial empowerment and freedom may thrive despite its limitations by creating a knowledgeable and active community.

The source said that US holdings came from another seize, from bitfinex hackers but since bitfinex does not operate in US so they refuse to give back those coins to the exchange which is really absurd. Will they be called thief too?

Selling those coins through OTC like coinbase is possible and additional fund for them, welp, a free investments.

Of course the US is accumulating Bitcoin. The government is not that stupid. It knows that the more supply it controls, the less people will be able to gain self-custody of their funds. The numbers will keep growing as Bitcoin becomes more popular. Even institutional investment companies such as BlackRock and VanEck are giving indirect control of BTC to the US government.

Fortunately, the network's consensus is determined by nodes and miners (not those with a lot of economic power). So I'm hopeful Bitcoin will stay decentralized and censorship-resistant forever. We must encourage people to practice self-custody for the betterment of Bitcoin as a free (as in freedom) currency for all. Who knows what the future holds for the cryptocurrency?

that very well may be true. so why not have a multi-government organization kind of like interpol except for bitcoin criminals. once this organization agrees that a certain bitcoin address has stolen funds or is related to criminal activity, they can issue a transaction to the blockchain to sieze the bitcoin on that address and have it transferred to their own address for further processing.

if they can establish a missing persons unit of interpol they could establish a bitcoin recovery unit too. and get that integrated directly into the bitcoin network if possible!

Interview: INTERPOL Launches Missing Persons Unit
https://www.hstoday.us/featured/interview-interpol-launches-missing-persons-unit/

it's not always possible to recover stolen bitcoin otherwise...



all of those scenarios you mentioned franky are impossible since we're talking about a special government unit that does their own drug human trafficking hacker investigations and decides what addresses need to be confiscated. no one is going to walk into a courthouse and have access to that special government unit so keep your private keys backed up they wouldn't save you if you lost them.  

and the good news in that type of scenario is drug dealers lose their bitcoin at worst and also go to jail at best! everyone wins right?

bitcoin ownership decided by human court.. um no thanks, lets not bastardise bitcoin via more code softened dev human control politics.

for instance.. lets take normal court:
in your silly scheme i could just say reward from blocks 1-100,000 are illegal, i file a claim in court, satoshi doesnt turn up to defend his coins, i win by default(absentee defence) and court writes a special tx which bitcoin recognises as a court created tx, court gets paid then court pays me

1 day later everyone is at the court house claiming every bitcoin is stolen and hope the real owners dont turn up, thus win by default due to absent defence

sorry but lets not bastardise bitcoin by breaking its security model

#not-your-keys-not-your-coin

if we agree that the usa government is allowed to confiscate peoples' bitcoin if they are criminals then why not put some type of feature in bitcoin where that can happen in a more automated fashion. example: still go through the legal system if you must but once they get the court order, they can present that order as a bitcoin transaction that miners would put into a block which would transfer the stolen bitcoin to the usa government's address. that seems reasonable to me. and no one here that agrees with government confiscation should have any issue with that since it increases the number of situations where victims can get their money back.



imagine if they could prove a certain bitcoin address was involved in say drug smuggling but they didn't know who was behind it exactly. no need to know. just issue the special transaction to the blockchain and the bitcoin is automatically transferred out of those bad peoples' addresses into the government coffers to be used for whatever they see fit. again, if you're not a criminal then you shouldn't have any issue with this at all

The US government does not immediately confiscate if there is no good reason, in this case confiscating it from criminals, etc. Regardless of the agenda out there that says that the US always has what everyone else in the world has and what all countries have. Only one goal is full dick and maintaining its status as a superpower that controls every financial producing sector. Everyone already knows the story, but they can't completely control Bitcoin. Even though you hold 1%, it doesn't mean the US government is part of the legal owner because it was taken from confiscated proceeds. We have known about the US government's tradition of confiscation for a long time.

Nice theory but I can totally agree with you on that but I'd like to add that it's probably not Blackrock that's getting those bitcoins sold to, most likely it's big banks like JP Morgan, even though they're a total opposition to bitcoin, they'll definitely buy those because it's sold to them at a discount by the US government. Or we can both be wrong about this and it's just the US government selling their bitcoins and getting all the profits for themselves, they need that money after all so why go through more complications when they can get the money themselves right? And maybe they might consider assuming control on bitcoin market after all, they're not the really good kind of government at all so the possibilities of evil things that they can do is just too many to list down.

It all still return to the circulation even if there is confiscation by the US government happened since they sold it all again in an auction. If all of that confiscated Bitcoins will be sent into a dead address it would be nice as it may help skyrocket prices. 
Bitcoin community will benefit on this whatever they wanted to do with it at the end of the day.

you don't know that for sure though.

yes, probably so. the same thing that happens with someone who loses their private key there is no refund, no passing go no collecting $200. sorry if you don't see it that way.

people should be responsible for securing their bitcoin that's the premise of bitcoin if not then don't use it but if you want to use it then accept the risks and act accordingly.

that's right. you can let him go free and he will be an example of what happens when people are dumb and trust someone else with their bitcoin. that way they learn not to do it again.

when are people going to understand that once bitcoin is transferred to a new address, there is no reversing it. and there is a new owner. all the bitcoin miners have to go with that and the government can't reverse it no matter what they do because if they could, which seems to be something you would agree with, then they would be taking complete control of bitcoin and it would not be decentralized anymore. 

Auctions are like that sometimes you get great deals as the buyer, other times the seller is looking at you like you lost your mind that you paid that much for something.
Government auctions are even more wonky because of the mixture of stuff that may be in it.
Cars, other vehicles and parts, tents, some BTC, snow removal equipment, all being auctioned on the same day at the same site.
We like to think that people are going to show up for the BTC, but more people might be interested in the cars.

On that note, anyone near Waco, TX who wants a good deal on a scrap Beechcraft?
https://www.gsaauctions.gov/auctions/preview/275409

-Dave

You said it yourself. The US government does not want to keep its bitcoins because they want (what they call) "liquid cash". That's why they auction off their bitcoins like crazy, sometimes vastly deviating from the market price of Bitcoin at the time it is sold.

It's a good opportunity for arbitrage though. Either way, those USA bitcoins usually end up in the hands of exchanges. So it's not like the US is going to control an ever-increasing amount of bitcoin. As long as they keep auctioning it that is.

Paranoia much?

So the coins they have seized from the Bitfinex hackers are dirty coins, they should have just left the hackers enjoy them , right?
The coins they got from James Zhong were against stolen coins, right? Or coins that a hacker got from Silk Road where legitimate gains in your opinion?
Why don't you open a petition, the government should not try to seize any of the FTX coins, they are SBF's coins, he duped people for it legally, they should not seize one coin to pay back the ones that lost money on it. Same for Celsius or MtGox, just let the scammers enjoy the benefits!

The money they hold is not something they stole from people. It's the money confiscated from hackers (from people who actually stole it). The historical chart in the article shows that they're not accumulating coins to have some control over the market or whatever. They just confiscate illegally obtained coins from scams and hacks and regularly sell them on auctions. While it's true that they're holding 200k BTC, it's also likely that they will sell a significant amount, so even this 1% is temporary. Not to mention that 1% isn't that much.

This article says repayment date was October 31, 2023. They missed it. Although it is written in the article that they may ask for an extension of the deadline from the Tokyo District Court if they are unable to meet up, at this time, there is no new information on this. 

Bitcoin is a viable Investment which entails that the US government is making the right decision to keep the coin. From time to time we have seen the government auction some of the confiscated coins to fund its crusade against crypto criminals and payment to people who have suffered from crypto scams. China would have had the opportunity to stockpile enough Bitcoin but they missed the opportunity when they started making anti Bitcoin policies.

Most of the crypto currencies which the US government has seized were connected to fraud, hacks, or scams. I might not be correct, I don't know any case where the government confiscated people's funds without them being connected to criminal activities.

if the government just takes coin, for no legal ethical reason.. then yea theft
but if someone else steal coin or uses coin in a crime and is then caught, where those coins are then seized by a gov/court..
or if a company files bankruptcy.. then its just admin/bureaucracy to take control of the coin and decide who deserves payouts later

japan courts had admin control of coin due to bankruptcy and finding previous stolen coin. they didnt just take it and sell it for themselves(like a tax). japan court is still DECADE LATER deciding on pay out dates to creditors. so SOME amount is going to be distributed out.. as with how fiat laws work

But it really matters who wins it. If the countries win in this game, it wouldn't really matter to commoners like us whether Bitcoin is at the top or not. Because then we will not be in a position to use it in our favour and the entire system will become centralised. It is definitely not ideal.

But countries like United States will continue to play their dirty games. Some Bitcoins they have seized, are from criminals and hackers so those should be fine. But if us is really snatching from the common people, then it's a matter of concern.

We cant have account on the previously seized assets, i don't see the reason why they needed to continue with the seizure when all they are doing is to confiscate the hackers and exchange funds to their own treasury, this is nothing than a corporate practice of corruption in a modern and advanced theft, theirs is more worse than the intended act of scam from exchanges and individuals.

from my memory the mtgox creditors wanted all payouts converted to BTC
this meant that the ~141k btc + dollar found + all forked coin airdrops get converted to BTC
(bankruptcy administrator buys btc with dollar and converts forked air-drops to btc to be a total far bigger then the ~141k btc base amount the bankruptcy found) so total BTC accumulated/held by bankruptcy administrator could be way higher than reported, but they have to release based on japanese gov(court order)

https://bitcointreasuries.net/
https://bitcointreasuries.com/

These sites have different figures for Mt.Gox and they both don't list it as Japanese government. The first site has a figure of 141,686 BTC but the second site has a number of 200,000.

Even with 200,000 BTC, if it belongs to Japanese government, this number is still smaller than the USA. government with 215,000 BTC.

I don't see how it would matter where you buy your BTC and you have no idea whether you ever bought from Uncle Sam or not. Whether they auction it in several lots publicly or whether they deposit it on some exchange and sell it there, it doesn't make a whole lot of a difference.

Apart from that, I doubt that they arbitrarily put people into jail. There have been some questionable cases for sure, but I would say the vast majority of confiscated BTC was rightfully confiscated according to existing law.

But one thing is clear here: BTC seizures have become a profitable business for government authorities. It's a many birds with one stone situation as they need to stock up their cybersecurity agencies anyway and they know they need to develop capabilities and capacities as they sector and its relevance will be growing further and further. Understanding how digital assets work, can be stored and hidden and used is a must no matter what. Pursuing cases like hacks and theft will be the bread and butter in the future and if they develop the understanding and the tools how to best locate and seize digital assets, they can grow their security agencies while financing the expansion with seizures. At the same time they gain influence over the most important financial network in the world.

They’ll probably sell it to Blackrock on the cheap discretely. Just a mild conspiracy theory but it wouldn’t surprise me now that Spot ETFs are here. Bitcoin is now firmly planted in mainstream US finance & it’s going nowhere. If they really wanted to benefit from Bitcoin then the US Government should be holding that Bitcoin plus buying more to hedge against their forever devaluing fiat ponzi scheme aka the USD.

If the United States wanted to take over Bitcoin, it would not be difficult for them to print $2 trillion. I mean, they do that annually.
Also, the Bitcoins that are confiscated are resold in auctions within 2 to 5 years, and I do not think that the laws will allow them to keep them as a reserve. If that happens, Bitcoin is not a POS. Even if the United States were able to collect 2 million Bitcoins, it would not make any change other than increasing the value of Bitcoin.

lol...stolen?? They literally confiscate it from criminals, people either who did illegal stuff to get bitcoin or who stole the bitcoin themselves. "throwing people in jail"...yeah cuz they were criminals who got caught. Very bizarre narrative you're trying to make.

Anyway I'm sure they will eventually sell all the bitcoin they have, as they always do. Or in the case of retrieving bitcoin from hackers presumably they will go through the courts to hand those bitcoin back to the people they were stolen from.

It's indeed concerning to see reports of the US government seizing Bitcoin assets and exerting control over a significant portion of the circulating supply. These actions raise questions about the balance between individual ownership and government authority in the realm of digital currencies. The concept of Bitcoin was founded on principles of decentralization and autonomy, yet incidents like these highlight the challenges it faces in the real world.

While governments have legitimate concerns about illicit activities involving cryptocurrencies, such as money laundering and terrorism financing, it's crucial that any measures taken to address these issues respect individuals' rights and the core tenets of privacy and property ownership. Transparency and accountability are paramount in ensuring that government actions in the cryptocurrency space are justified and ethical.

The idea of any single entity, especially a government, controlling a significant portion of a decentralized currency like Bitcoin raises red flags regarding centralization and manipulation. Such actions could potentially undermine the trust and credibility of the entire cryptocurrency ecosystem, affecting its long-term viability and adoption.

The notion of "blood money" associated with Bitcoin transactions involving seized assets underscores the ethical dilemmas posed by government interventions in the cryptocurrency market. It's essential for users to be aware of the origins of the assets they acquire and the implications of supporting entities involved in questionable practices.

As governments around the world navigate the complexities of regulating cryptocurrencies, finding a balance between safeguarding against illicit activities and preserving individual freedoms is paramount. Collaborative efforts between regulatory authorities, industry stakeholders, and the broader community are necessary to develop effective and fair policies that uphold the principles of decentralization and financial sovereignty.

In the face of government intervention and control, Bitcoin's resilience lies in its decentralized nature and the widespread adoption and support it enjoys from a diverse community of users, developers, and advocates worldwide. The inherent transparency and immutability of the blockchain provide a level of accountability that traditional financial systems often lack, offering a beacon of hope for those seeking alternatives to centralized authority.

While incidents of government seizure and control may cast a shadow over the cryptocurrency landscape, they also serve as a reminder of the importance of remaining vigilant and proactive in defending the principles of decentralization, privacy, and individual sovereignty. Ultimately, the future of Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies will be shaped by the collective actions and decisions of its users and supporters, who strive to uphold its founding principles in the face of adversity.

What a nice new regulations by US government, this will make them able to earn Bitcoin for free! without need to spend a lot time and effort to claim every hour.

However, I wonder why when it comes to Bitcoin seizures, it's always be US that handle it? each country has it's own Bitcoin regulations, Bitcoin isn't a currency that can be used in there. I know there were few news about Bitcoin seizures in other countries and it's the local police that handle it, but there are related to clear cases e.g. scam and ponzi scheme.

japanese gov(courts) had control of more coin than US, and from just one source (mtgox bankruptcy)

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/markets/us-government-continues-bitcoin-seizures-controls-nearly-1-of-circulating-supply-

The US, after all, controls nearly 1% of a massive industry with substantial leverage over it. Are they going to be the only country with this leverage? It may be difficult for any nation to build up these stockpiles in secret, but even so, the race has already begun. No matter who wins it, it’s Bitcoin that will be on top in the end.


unfortunately it would appear that the usa governments hands are dirty and it has stolen peoples bitcoins, confiscated them, throwing people in jail and all kinds of things. enjoy your bitcoins you buy from uncle sam because it is blood money...