usa goverment 3.13 tril. defict its enough?

mnporter2001

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Quote from: bL4nkcode on October 17, 2020, 01:03:17 PM

Year by year USD will be devalued that some kind of currency will replaced it as world currency, china is pushing forward to replace it by their yuan.

And maybe some time that bitcoin price will not be based on USD, but just BTC.

Why does USD lose value every year while their economy is always the most developed in the world? I think it should be up against the common currencies.

Besides, I have never underestimated USD, nor was I negative about the emergence of BTC in the centralized market. We really shouldn't have such a one-dimensional perspective, why should we think about combining the two and creating a perfect economy? When fiat money is experiencing inflation (current situation), Bitcoin is an asset to help people avoid inflation and they will not be poor. After the economy stabilizes and inflation is over, then fiat money is circulating as usual. Isn't it much better? Undecided

claire_lovely

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At some point the United States will no longer be able to pay out Social Security and other ponzi scheme obligations, and they will either have to discontinue these programs or print money to the point of hyperinflation like Venezuela. At this point, fixed supply cryptocurrencies like BTC are a very great investment that are free from Federal Reserve manipulation.

Shasha80

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If you look at the worsening world economy, where inflation and debt are increasing. While the price of Bitcoin continues to rise today,
like Bitcoin this year it is very possible will reach a price of $ 15,000. I am quite surprised also with the state of America today, Moreover,
America has experienced a deficit of more than 3 trillion. And maybe if it's like this the USD will be devalued, Even though the USD is still
the best fiat currency until now, with a situation like this there may be surprises in the future. We don't speculate too much now, just wait
and see.

exstasie

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Quote from: Hydrogen on October 22, 2020, 10:41:00 AM

Suicide rates soared post 2008 economic crisis. During times of economic trauma, many lose their jobs, can't afford to pay bills or rent. It translates to suicide rates climbing significantly. At a certain juncture we might ask whether additional suicide deaths caused by economic lockdowns are resulting in a higher suicide casualty rate than the number of deaths claimed by the corona virus.

The suicide rate never actually stopped rising after 2007, during the entire economic recovery. The suicide rate in the US reached historic highs just prior to COVID-19. That probably suggests that low unemployment rates and expanding GDP don't tell the whole story, regarding the connection between a poor economy and high rates of depression and suicide.

I also think it would be silly at this point to blame the entirety of economic contraction on the lockdowns. We had more than 10 years of economic expansion prior to COVID-19 and growth was already slowing significantly. Arguably, this recession was already coming.

wheelz1200

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Quote from: btc_angela on October 24, 2020, 06:08:36 AM

Quote from: wheelz1200 on October 23, 2020, 10:39:41 PM

Quote from: Darker45 on October 23, 2020, 10:09:54 PM

If the reason for Bitcoin hitting $15,000 this year is the falling value of the US dollar, partly due to its ballooning deficit, I am sure a lot of Bitcoin owners and hodlers outside the USA would also be disadvantaged in one way or another.

A largely weakened USD might mean another country's local currency rising in value. So those who are taking advantage of the exchange rates between their local fiat currency versus the USD will also be facing a decrease of profit.

If bitcoin goes to $15k its because usd is devaluing? So why did bitcoin go to $20k in 2017? Or dump to $3k is that because in 2018 usd value soared? I don't think there is a direct link between US economy and the price of bitcoin. Besides if it is tied together it should be with the world economy not just the United States.

To be fair it's BTC is being hedge against USD because USD is still the main currency around the world. We can't compare the surge of BTC in 2017, different economic scenario, it is the beginning of BTC and crypto in general, and probably one reason for it's massive increase is that young investors thought that it will go on parabolic rise, they got REKT eventually and learn their lessons. US being the leading world economy would have a big impact on BTC, just wait till the US presidential election next month and see how it will affect the price be positive or negative.

So you are saying if the price goes up or down next month its because of the election? I don't think its that simple with explaining bitcoin price moves. Manipulators can hide behind the guise of "world events" and pull the strings. I do agree these things do have a piece of the reason just not as much as most people think.

Fortify

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At the end of the day, through all the ups and downs of its politics, the US dollar is going to be the reserve currency of the world for the foreseeable future. Other currencies like the Euro are gaining, but even the Euro has the weakness of many countries with differing economies affecting its success. China likes to complain about US dollar manipulation (printing too much currency which devalues the debt they own) but will not allow its own currency to float freely. It might help to nudge the value of bitcoin up though, as the world is apparently heading towards negative interest rates, so asset managers are more willing to take a bit of cryptocurrency risk in their portfolios.

The Sceptical Chymist

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Quote from: bL4nkcode on October 17, 2020, 01:03:17 PM

And maybe some time that bitcoin price will not be based on USD, but just BTC.

That isn't going to happen unless or until goods and services are priced in terms of BTC--and I don't see that happening in my lifetime.

Bitcoin is a new, global currency/asset thing that doesn't have a good track record so far of people adopting it--and when I say "adopting" I mean using it to buy things. The USD and Chinese yuan are only two fiat currencies out of many, and I don't think the performance of either one of those will have a significant impact on bitcoin's price.

As far as the US's addiction to debt goes, something's got to give eventually. We can't continue printing money and accumulating debt like we have been. Somebody is going to pay for all of the shit that happened between 2008-now, but I don't know if it's going to be the current generation or one or more of the future ones. And frankly, I don't think anyone in the US government's money management department is paying attention.

fiulpro

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Quote

The final tally for the budget deficit in fiscal 2020 came to $3.13 trillion.

That was more than triple last year’s shortfall of $984 billion and double the previous record of $1.4 trillion in 2009.

Government debt totaled about $27 trillion by the end of the fiscal year.

{Some quote from the source you mentioned to make sure people notice the main points without going there}

~BTC is the least of the worries the US economy is going to shrink day by day because I don't even see anyone who will be able to become the president of this country ... If people vote for donald again , it's bound to collapse and die.

~I don't think that China will be the one to take over , I believe it would essentially be some country like : UK

~China is not only facing political crisis but internally it's battling with things like : Other Viruses which is hilarious since yet again they are not willing to inform us or the world about it.

~The developing nations and the underdeveloped Nations are the ones which these rich nations should have supported instead of killing their own economy themselves.

BTC might be 15k , might not be 15k , we have to think about the practical situation of BTC , not the price since do believe that all of us here have seen how scarce the jobs are and still BTC continue to work for the people like us who work on the forum part time and the people who are using BTC to make sure their business reaches international customers

Its not about the price anymore , it's the usage..

Febo

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Quote from: cryptoboss2020 on October 17, 2020, 11:29:06 AM

is this is enough? Grin

i think it will bring btc 15k this year:D

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/10/16/us-government-budget-ends-fiscal-year-with-a-more-than-3-trillion-deficit.html

All countries will have a deficit this year. Probably even China. What is problematic is that most countries will also have deficit next year and in 2022 also. And even more problematic is that some countries had deficit also in 2019 and most of countries did not had enough surplus in 2019 to pay off old debts. When GDP growth happens countries needs to not spend all but pay off some old debts to reduce debt. From article I see that USA increased dept last year. How is that possible? Already having high debt. You are elected on elections to reduce debt and when you can easily do it since there is an economic growth you simply dont even there will be elections next year. Totally irresponsible.

bryant.coleman

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Quote from: wheelz1200 on October 23, 2020, 10:39:41 PM

If bitcoin goes to $15k its because usd is devaluing? So why did bitcoin go to $20k in 2017? Or dump to $3k is that because in 2018 usd value soared? I don't think there is a direct link between US economy and the price of bitcoin. Besides if it is tied together it should be with the world economy not just the United States.

If the United States Dollar is getting devalued, then the exchange rates of other commodities should increase. As far as I can see, the prices of crude oil and gold have remained stable. Bitcoin prices are going up as a result of PayPal allowing the purchase and storage of cryptocurrency in its platform. It has nothing to do with the value or purchasing power of US Dollar.

jaysabi

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Quote from: bL4nkcode on October 18, 2020, 09:11:28 AM

Quote from: cryptoboss2020 on October 17, 2020, 04:10:09 PM

i have traveled and lived many countries myself seen things seen life from my perspective the currencies might fall yes but saying that usa dollar will be devalued i can tell you that china yuan is less useless then USD the usa dollar still has big market.
usa dollar is king of the fiat curriencies and btc is king of crypto.
Before the dollar falling there might many other currencies what can fall down first i think so.
i think russian ruble and usa dollars are both very needed since russia got resources what everybody want and usa is just reservecurreny.

Yeah, at least not for now as I mentioned year by year, I'll just say that since china is the 2nd richest by GDP after US, and look how they managed this pandemic regardless where the virus origins while other including USA are still struggling

China may have the second largest economy but that doesn't mean they are the second richest. The have well over a billion people, you would expect the economy to be big an a pure GDP basis. However, the standard of living or GDP per capita puts them far below many other more advanced economies in Europe and some in Asia, like Japan and Singapore.

btc_angela

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Quote from: wheelz1200 on October 23, 2020, 10:39:41 PM

Quote from: Darker45 on October 23, 2020, 10:09:54 PM

If the reason for Bitcoin hitting $15,000 this year is the falling value of the US dollar, partly due to its ballooning deficit, I am sure a lot of Bitcoin owners and hodlers outside the USA would also be disadvantaged in one way or another.

A largely weakened USD might mean another country's local currency rising in value. So those who are taking advantage of the exchange rates between their local fiat currency versus the USD will also be facing a decrease of profit.

If bitcoin goes to $15k its because usd is devaluing? So why did bitcoin go to $20k in 2017? Or dump to $3k is that because in 2018 usd value soared? I don't think there is a direct link between US economy and the price of bitcoin. Besides if it is tied together it should be with the world economy not just the United States.

To be fair it's BTC is being hedge against USD because USD is still the main currency around the world. We can't compare the surge of BTC in 2017, different economic scenario, it is the beginning of BTC and crypto in general, and probably one reason for it's massive increase is that young investors thought that it will go on parabolic rise, they got REKT eventually and learn their lessons. US being the leading world economy would have a big impact on BTC, just wait till the US presidential election next month and see how it will affect the price be positive or negative.

boyptc

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Quote from: holahola2021 on October 23, 2020, 08:18:48 PM

The position of USD is difficult to change in the coming time, because of some advantages that other currencies cannot have. Warnings of a dollar's collapse are not new, as the debate over whether economic stimulus measures lead to inflation has risen from the financial crisis more than a decade ago.

And there were requests that are being called for an additional stimulus which will actually lead to addition to the inflation.

$13k happened and if it's only $15k at the end of this year, it's going to be easy. Look at the price of bitcoin, becoming stable to $12,900 - $13k and that's a win for us.

wheelz1200

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Quote from: Darker45 on October 23, 2020, 10:09:54 PM

If the reason for Bitcoin hitting $15,000 this year is the falling value of the US dollar, partly due to its ballooning deficit, I am sure a lot of Bitcoin owners and hodlers outside the USA would also be disadvantaged in one way or another.

A largely weakened USD might mean another country's local currency rising in value. So those who are taking advantage of the exchange rates between their local fiat currency versus the USD will also be facing a decrease of profit.

If bitcoin goes to $15k its because usd is devaluing? So why did bitcoin go to $20k in 2017? Or dump to $3k is that because in 2018 usd value soared? I don't think there is a direct link between US economy and the price of bitcoin. Besides if it is tied together it should be with the world economy not just the United States.

Darker45

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If the reason for Bitcoin hitting $15,000 this year is the falling value of the US dollar, partly due to its ballooning deficit, I am sure a lot of Bitcoin owners and hodlers outside the USA would also be disadvantaged in one way or another.

A largely weakened USD might mean another country's local currency rising in value. So those who are taking advantage of the exchange rates between their local fiat currency versus the USD will also be facing a decrease of profit.

holahola2021

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The position of USD is difficult to change in the coming time, because of some advantages that other currencies cannot have. Warnings of a dollar's collapse are not new, as the debate over whether economic stimulus measures lead to inflation has risen from the financial crisis more than a decade ago.

Hydrogen

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Suicide rates soared post 2008 economic crisis. During times of economic trauma, many lose their jobs, can't afford to pay bills or rent. It translates to suicide rates climbing significantly. At a certain juncture we might ask whether additional suicide deaths caused by economic lockdowns are resulting in a higher suicide casualty rate than the number of deaths claimed by the corona virus. I haven't looked at statistics but there is a chance lockdowns and the jobs and businesses destroyed by them are producing greater damage than the virus has the potential to cause atm. If indeed the mortality rate of the virus is decreasing as many have claimed.

The US deficit carries a potential to elevate the value of bitcoin. But to be honest, nations around the world are likely experiencing the same difficulties the USA is. If not worse. Economic slowdown in america, the largest consumer market in the world, can pull the global economy down with it. As occurred during the 2008 subprime mortgage crisis.

cryptoboss2020

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Quote from: bL4nkcode on October 18, 2020, 09:11:28 AM

Quote from: cryptoboss2020 on October 17, 2020, 04:10:09 PM

i have traveled and lived many countries myself seen things seen life from my perspective the currencies might fall yes but saying that usa dollar will be devalued i can tell you that china yuan is less useless then USD the usa dollar still has big market.
usa dollar is king of the fiat curriencies and btc is king of crypto.
Before the dollar falling there might many other currencies what can fall down first i think so.
i think russian ruble and usa dollars are both very needed since russia got resources what everybody want and usa is just reservecurreny.

Yeah, at least not for now as I mentioned year by year, I'll just say that since china is the 2nd richest by GDP after US, and look how they managed this pandemic regardless where the virus origins while other including USA are still struggling

im not scientist so i dotn have clue about if the usa dollar crash or any other currencies crashing....
all i know i have dollars i go to shop and buy food anything with dollars not bitcoins.
i dont have clue if usa dollar will be replaced or not really dont know but i know with dollars i buy shit.

bL4nkcode

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Quote from: cryptoboss2020 on October 17, 2020, 04:10:09 PM

i have traveled and lived many countries myself seen things seen life from my perspective the currencies might fall yes but saying that usa dollar will be devalued i can tell you that china yuan is less useless then USD the usa dollar still has big market.
usa dollar is king of the fiat curriencies and btc is king of crypto.
Before the dollar falling there might many other currencies what can fall down first i think so.
i think russian ruble and usa dollars are both very needed since russia got resources what everybody want and usa is just reservecurreny.

Yeah, at least not for now as I mentioned year by year, I'll just say that since china is the 2nd richest by GDP after US, and look how they managed this pandemic regardless where the virus origins while other including USA are still struggling

GeorgeJohn

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Quote from: jaysabi on October 18, 2020, 12:21:37 AM

Quote from: cryptoboss2020 on October 17, 2020, 11:29:06 AM

is this is enough? Grin

i think it will bring btc 15k this year:D

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/10/16/us-government-budget-ends-fiscal-year-with-a-more-than-3-trillion-deficit.html

People have been predicting 15k btc every year since it crashed from 20k, so I don't take anyone's predictions seriously because nobody knows and nobody has a good track record of predicting. On another note, the deficit is absolutely mind numbingly large. Trump's tax cuts decimated tax receipts at a time the country should have been using the exceptionally strong economy to pay down some of the debt that was incurred recovering from the housing crisis. That's how that's supposed to work, but Republicans couldn't pass up an opportunity to loot the treasury to line their pockets. So much for having any principles about balancing the budget.

People just predicting base on their emotional feelings, as you said above we have come across numerous prediction of bitcoin getting up to $15 and $20,000 but all avail, to these level we have to know that Btc regulation falling and rising does not base on human capability to control, it's seriously been determined by Btc market based on supply of Btc and demands of Btc,when demands is more than supply, definitely Btc accelerate (rise up), but a situation were buy no demands Btc falls like falling hero, so prediction of Btc to go up and down rely on our hand's.

jaysabi

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Quote from: cryptoboss2020 on October 17, 2020, 11:29:06 AM

is this is enough? Grin

i think it will bring btc 15k this year:D

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/10/16/us-government-budget-ends-fiscal-year-with-a-more-than-3-trillion-deficit.html

People have been predicting 15k btc every year since it crashed from 20k, so I don't take anyone's predictions seriously because nobody knows and nobody has a good track record of predicting. On another note, the deficit is absolutely mind numbingly large. Trump's tax cuts decimated tax receipts at a time the country should have been using the exceptionally strong economy to pay down some of the debt that was incurred recovering from the housing crisis. That's how that's supposed to work, but Republicans couldn't pass up an opportunity to loot the treasury to line their pockets. So much for having any principles about balancing the budget.

blockman

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Quote from: cryptoboss2020 on October 17, 2020, 04:10:09 PM

you people say usa dollar is bad? okay:) np i buy all your tether usd whatever

You'll buy it because it has lesser value when you buy? makes sense. We're 2 1/2 months away until this year ends and $15k is likely. But I wouldn't look to that price in the short time that we have. Most hopes are being dwelled on 2021 and 2022. Where most of the positive speculations are being brought. While inflation rate and debt increases and economy going down, this really could make a positive impact to bitcoin but the valuing in USD will be lesser. I do agree that someday we'll get to see bitcoin being valued in its nature and we're all going to exchange depending on satoshis or mbtc or btc as a whole.

cryptoboss2020

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Quote from: bL4nkcode on October 17, 2020, 01:03:17 PM

Year by year USD will be devalued that some kind of currency will replaced it as world currency, china is pushing forward to replace it by their yuan.

And maybe some time that bitcoin price will not be based on USD, but just BTC.

i have traveled and lived many countries myself seen things seen life from my perspective the currencies might fall yes but saying that usa dollar will be devalued i can tell you that china yuan is less useless then USD the usa dollar still has big market.
usa dollar is king of the fiat curriencies and btc is king of crypto.
Before the dollar falling there might many other currencies what can fall down first i think so.
i think russian ruble and usa dollars are both very needed since russia got resources what everybody want and usa is just reservecurreny.

this is what i think and what i seen is always opposite what the majority of people think and people say usa dollar is bad then i go against this this is like trend now to say usa dollar is bad but i think if many people think that then its better not to follow to them and use own judgement on this.

you people say usa dollar is bad? okay:) np i buy all your tether usd whatever

bL4nkcode

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Year by year USD will be devalued that some kind of currency will replaced it as world currency, china is pushing forward to replace it by their yuan.

And maybe some time that bitcoin price will not be based on USD, but just BTC.

cryptoboss2020

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is this is enough? Grin

i think it will bring btc 15k this year:D

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/10/16/us-government-budget-ends-fiscal-year-with-a-more-than-3-trillion-deficit.html

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