Use less (No subject) in MP, please | Bitcointalksearch.org

Sexylizzy2813

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Quote from: philipma1957 on September 18, 2023, 08:40:23 AM

I have had over 20000 pm's more than 1000 pages of them.

I deleted a lot of them but still have 800 pages of pm's

Are you serious about this? That a lot of pms if you ask me, are they love letters or what? I believe you haven't had the time to even glance through 500 of them...
Try your best to give some if not all that little time to know why it was sent before deleting them.

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I would love to be able to find ways to manage them better than I do now.

But I am not sure if a subject title would help much.

I think a subject title would even be of great help to you than you can imagine.
Imagine all pms that comes to you have "titles" all on them, with that you don't need to even read further or even opening the message, just by reading only the title and you're done.

joker_josue

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Quote from: joker_josue on September 20, 2023, 01:23:04 PM

Well... by the way, I have an idea, which might be interesting. I'll see if I have time, and I'll put it into practice. I think it will be useful for everyone. Roll Eyes

As I said, I have already put the idea I had into practice:
Mini tutorial for using PM

I hope you like it, and that it is useful for everyone. Wink

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Quote from: NotATether on September 21, 2023, 03:19:59 AM

If coming up with a title for your PM is difficult then you can just run it through ChatGPT which will give you a concise title.

That's a terrible suggestion for privacy! The company behind ChatGPT built a business around plagiarising other people's text. By sharing your PM with them, you can bet they keep it and may at some point share bits and pieces with other people. Or sell it.

NotATether

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If coming up with a title for your PM is difficult then you can just run it through ChatGPT which will give you a concise title.

Adbitco

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Actually receiving a pm isn't bad anyway but that aspect of subject or do I call it title is what gets me weird at times if I am not on the forum and I gat some pm it easily pop up on my mail even without me opening my web to login my account to read messages that pop up along with the subject explaining the body of the pm so even without someone opening the browser the receiver already have a clue of what the message is saying. Maybe it will get the receiver on a quick reminder to easily respond to what the message is saying.

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Quote from: Dr.Bitcoin_Strange on September 20, 2023, 08:43:00 AM

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In my secular work, I send/receive a lot of emails, and it is really frustrating when people send a new email, instead of replying to the email, to respond to the previous email.

Yes, it really would be frustrating. But I guess it's just being unexpirenced or a newbie that can make such mistakes, by sending a fresh mail instead of replying to the first one.

If it was just the newbies, we would be fine. It usually happens to those who are not used to using the forum's PMs.

For example, I usually quote the previous message I'm replying to. Therefore, the message always has the context of the conversation. Personally, I think it helps to maintain the line of reasoning in the message. Especially those who use it a lot.

Well... by the way, I have an idea, which might be interesting. I'll see if I have time, and I'll put it into practice. I think it will be useful for everyone. Roll Eyes

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Quote from: joker_josue on September 17, 2023, 02:39:59 AM

Furthermore, if you put the title in the first PM, when you do "reply" the title automatically stays the same.

I honestly have not taken note of it; I usually overlook a second reply's subject in a PM without realizing that the subjects are automatically added since it was just a reply from the first discussion or PM.

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It's a good idea to put a title on all the PMs we send, and make people respond when we're continuing a conversation.

Yeah, you are right.

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In my secular work, I send/receive a lot of emails, and it is really frustrating when people send a new email, instead of replying to the email, to respond to the previous email.

Yes, it really would be frustrating. But I guess it's just being unexpirenced or a newbie that can make such mistakes, by sending a fresh mail instead of replying to the first one.

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Quote from: joker_josue on September 15, 2023, 03:20:43 PM

The only thing that bothers me is that the MP's title is just "(No subject)". I know this is what appears by default, but it can be changed. Normally this field serves to define the title of the message - three or four words that identify the objective of the PM.

It's ok to some users not using a PM title while some will always want to receive a clue on the possible content of what the message conveyed, if we see it the way it appears when using the forum new topic button by creating a thread, after writing the whole contents of the post, then comes the title as well and without giving your thread a title, it will not be further processed to be posted, maybe such could be introduced as well to always notify the use of message title as a reminder in read coloured, in the other way round, if we consider the use of message in general, maybe through emails and the likes, it's not also mandatory to use a message title, which means it should be of user's discretion more than been a default function.

PytagoraZ

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Quote from: joker_josue on September 15, 2023, 03:20:43 PM

I know that many users don't like receiving PM. I understand and you are within your rights.

Personally, I don't mind being PM'd because I know it's a way for people to reach out to me. And if someone abuses it, I can take action in that case.

The only thing that bothers me is that the MP's title is just "(No subject)". I know this is what appears by default, but it can be changed. Normally this field serves to define the title of the message - three or four words that identify the objective of the PM.

Therefore, I ask that when you send a PM, write something in the subject of the PM and not just leave the "(No subject)". This helps a lot in managing PMs.

I believe that most people will not read this information, but here's a note. Maybe other users "suffer" from the same "problem".

Hugs to everyone, fellow Bitcoiners and Bitcointalkers! Wink

I've never sent you a PM, but what you say is true, especially since many people have probably sent you a PM.

My PM is always empty... maybe someone can PM me, with or without a subject doesn't matter. come on... please PM me, maybe we can talk... Grin

The term bitcoiners may not be appropriate, but bitcointalkners is very strange to hear. How about BTners Cheesy

Majestic-milf

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I do not have much PMs so I can't relate but I think giving a title helps one to be saved the stress of going through the whole thing. I received a PM and was notified of it in my mail and just from the title I got what the sender was referring to. Maybe Op feels it's irritating because he doesn't get a choice whether to ignore or treat it as important Grin

.. hehehe, maybe they just love having to work you up. Sometimes these lil exercises are needed to keep the mind working, you might never know. Wink

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Quote from: philipma1957 on September 18, 2023, 08:40:23 AM

I deleted a lot of them but still have 800 pages of pm's

It must be very slow to load. I have "only" 238 pages, and it already takes many seconds to show. For comparison: on my Mobile account, the (empty) PM page loads very fast.

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I would love to be able to find ways to manage them better than I do now.

Have you seen Backup/Sort Private Messages/PM/DM? Note that I haven't tested it, so do your own research before trusting software.

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I'm not getting that many PM's, so, it's not such big deal for me. But forthese members who are getting lot of it, I can imagine that how annoying it can be. Especially when you want to find specific messages from someone.
Just looked at my outbox and almost all recent messages have subjects. Probably in perfect scenario it shouldn't be allowed to leave subject empty by default.

Quote from: DYING_S0UL on September 16, 2023, 02:26:13 AM

To be honest, If I say from my perspective most of the newbies aren't familiar with the forum. Even me! I forget things time to time. I forget to add subject or sometimes I mess up BBcodes. Those who are here in this platform for a longer period of time should always use a subject. And there isn't any default, "Remember Subject" or anything like that. If I remember correctly the first time I send you a PM, I added a subject named "Talkimg" but the 2nd time I forgot to add any subject. It happens. Tongue

I think it's not about being new on forum. I think that most of members are sending email messages more or less frequently. And I'm sure that most of them add subjects to their email messages (I'm not even sure that you can send message without subject on some providers). So, PM's on Bitcointalk is something similar.
Bt maybe before this topic many didn't even thought about it.

joker_josue

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Quote from: philipma1957 on September 18, 2023, 08:40:23 AM

I would love to be able to find ways to manage them better than I do now.

But I am not sure if a subject title would help much.

Have you ever thought about using labels? I recently started using this feature, and it helps a lot.

Because, after you create a label, you can assign each PM to a label and remove it from Inbox. So this could free up PM from your inbox and manage things better.

EDIT: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=pm;sa=manlabels Wink

philipma1957

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I have had over 20000 pm's more than 1000 pages of them.

I deleted a lot of them but still have 800 pages of pm's

I would love to be able to find ways to manage them better than I do now.

But I am not sure if a subject title would help much.

joker_josue

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Quote from: Dr.Bitcoin_Strange on September 16, 2023, 05:49:07 PM

Yea, as for some folks that I have PM'd, I usually add the title of the PM, unless it's not just any serious PM. Maybe if we have talked about a particular thing on PM before and you had to reply to me, then if I reply back to you, I will not bother to add a title because I assume you already know it's the same matter we are still talking about.

I know about the topic, but I need to read the message first to know the topic.
Furthermore, if you put the title in the first PM, when you do "reply" the title automatically stays the same. It's a good idea to put a title on all the PMs we send, and make people respond when we're continuing a conversation.

In my secular work, I send/receive a lot of emails, and it is really frustrating when people send a new email, instead of replying to the email, to respond to the previous email. It's twice as much work, bringing together the entire conversation.

Quote from: LoyceMobile on September 16, 2023, 02:52:00 PM

I figured you have notifications enabled for "patch" by now. If it gets implemented, let's PM OP with (No subject) in the title, lol.

Don't give up ideas! I'm screwed... Cheesy

Pmalek

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Quote from: _act_ on September 16, 2023, 03:37:24 AM

Sending message to someone on this forum should also be seen as formal and informal, not just in one way.

If it is formal, title supposed to be added, even if you are writing a letter on a paper officially. But if it is informal, for example I am writing to a friend on this forum, I may decide not to include a title.

I don't think it should matter whether the PM is formal or informal. The way you write your main message determines if it's a formal or informal conversation.

As an example, let's go with your thoughts that you are writing with a friend and sending new messages every few days without any subject. You guys are just joking around and there is nothing serious in the conversation worth remembering and reading in the future. All of a sudden your friend recommends an excellent wallet he has tried, a new service, website, exchange, whatever. Some time later, you decide to try what your friend recommended but you can't remember the name. So, you have to find the message your friend sent you or ask him.

Which of these do you think would be easier to find?

A. 30 pages of PM exchanges with no titles.
B. Specific titles about the topics of discussions. And among those, a PM from your friend saying 'Try this new wallet, service'...

Sexylizzy2813

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Quote from: Pmalek on September 16, 2023, 03:33:14 AM

Quote from: Sexylizzy2813 on September 15, 2023, 04:57:07 PM

OP that's true but at the same time, not everybody cares if the message comes with a title or not, they just open and glance through.

I agree with OP here. I would like to see a subject in all my PMs as well. It literally takes a few seconds to write one. It can get especially frustrating if you are talking to the same person on different subjects, and at one point in the future you have to go back to check something. Imagine dozens of PMs without a title where you have to search for that exact message that contains the information you need. I would rather that I can figure out what we talked about based on the title of the PMs. But that also means that the original PM sender has to be professional enough to write a correct subject and not something like 'Hi' or 'Yo'. That doesn't help anyone.

I sometimes do delete some crazy PMs (like who have the time to PM me anyway) that I find to be uninteresting, I only do that when I'm bored.
Some people sees it to a lot of stress to even indicate why they're sending a PMs and from all being said I think the only way to make it come to stay is for every message been sent must have a title, like without you the sender not placing the title of the message it won't go through, unless you state your reason (like the title) that message won't be delivered. Let there be something like "message not delivered, title must be stated" . It has to be compulsory that you fill in that "no subject" space.

Dr.Bitcoin_Strange

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Yea, as for some folks that I have PM'd, I usually add the title of the PM, unless it's not just any serious PM. Maybe if we have talked about a particular thing on PM before and you had to reply to me, then if I reply back to you, I will not bother to add a title because I assume you already know it's the same matter we are still talking about. But if it's just a fresh and first PM, I usually like to add a title because I know that it's the first thing that will give the reader the clue to what the PM is. Right from when I started sending emails, I realized how important it is to add the subject, and when I saw the same pattern on the forum, it always crossed my mind to always add the subject of a pm.

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Quote from: joker_josue on September 15, 2023, 05:50:15 PM

It's just annoying when you want to go to a specific message, and in the index there are 10 messages saying "no subject". Roll Eyes

There I have to go into more detail to choose the one I want. Fortunately, I have managed to control the situation. But, I think it's always better to have a title than "no subject".

In fact, if it's "no subject", why send a PM!? Grin

Yeah, it's annoying for many of us while some of us ignore the title all together. But, I think there should be a proper title for each PM and and it should be requisite for PM sending. The one who receives the PM can easily get an idea after reading the title. I think the patch should be implemented in a way that the title should be compulsory. Yeah, when it's no subject then sending of PM doesn't make sense.

I don't send PM's a lot because many people don't like getting PM's, but whenever I send a PM I try my best to give it proper title. But, there are times when I miss the title part and the PM is sent using the default "no subject" title which is really annoying.

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Quote from: PowerGlove on September 15, 2023, 08:49:10 PM

When I hear "patch time?" I flick my head up like my dog does when he hears "walkies?". Grin

(I've sent a patch to theymos. If he merges it quickly, we might set a new record for time between suggestion and implementation.)

I figured you have notifications enabled for "patch" by now. If it gets implemented, let's PM OP with (No subject) in the title, lol.

Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on September 16, 2023, 11:40:02 AM

I stopped caring about PM or e-mail titles a long time ago

With email, reading the title is often enough to delete it.

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Let me just say it's a copycat kind of way, and it's only on Bitcointalk that I've ever seen a higher number of people sending messages to me without properly titling it. To buttress your point, I found it hard to know which one to select after locating the sender's name for later work at times, it could be frustrating if they are much.

Since I believe this started and was encouraged by the first people here, especially the highest respected members including the CMs, they can encourage it to be changed. I believe if they continue to title PMs, Others will follow in due time.

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Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on September 16, 2023, 11:40:02 AM

Nice to see a thread about some forum etiquette. There should probably be more like this for newbies (though I'm betting this thread is going to eventually get buried under tons of new threads until it reaches a page where nobody's going to find it). Lol. Unless something good gets stickied, it vanishes pretty quickly.

Well... I can bump every month. Grin

Unless I forget this topic too. LOL Cool

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OP, I guess everyone's got their pet peeves and I can sympathize with you....but personally I stopped caring about PM or e-mail titles a long time ago, and now that I'm actually thinking about it I'm not sure why that is.

But e-mails aside, when it comes to PMs on this forum, mostly what I get are requests for post history reviews with a very small number of messages directed at me on a more personal level. My mind has been like a overflowing snake pit lately, so maybe if members do follow your suggestion it might help me get my messages organized at least. We'll see what happens.

Nice to see a thread about some forum etiquette. There should probably be more like this for newbies (though I'm betting this thread is going to eventually get buried under tons of new threads until it reaches a page where nobody's going to find it). Lol. Unless something good gets stickied, it vanishes pretty quickly.

joker_josue

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Quote from: _act_ on September 16, 2023, 03:37:24 AM

If it is formal, title supposed to be added, even if you are writing a letter on a paper officially. But if it is informal, for example I am writing to a friend on this forum, I may decide not to include a title.

I understand your point, but it doesn't matter if you are a friend or not, there can be a title. I am not questioning the content of the message, nor am I looking at the sender. I'm just analyzing the title, which is the indexing element, which if they are all the same, ceases to exist.

Let's assume you are having a conversation with 3 friends here on the forum. They all sent the message with "(no subject)". When you look at the message list, from the title you don't know who is who. You need to look at the user's name and you still have to "get" the message you want to reread.

This is a habit on my part, maybe that's it, but every message you send (here or elsewhere) I like to put a title on. This element is useful for indexing subjects and locating them in the future.

_act_

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Quote from: LoyceMobile on September 15, 2023, 04:04:15 PM

Good one, I dislike receiving this too.
You can't create a topic without entering a title. PMs should reject the default too. Patch time?

Quote from: joker_josue on September 15, 2023, 05:50:15 PM

It's just annoying when you want to go to a specific message, and in the index there are 10 messages saying "no subject". Roll Eyes
There I have to go into more detail to choose the one I want. Fortunately, I have managed to control the situation. But, I think it's always better to have a title than "no subject".

Quote from: PowerGlove on September 15, 2023, 08:49:10 PM

When I hear "patch time?" I flick my head up like my dog does when he hears "walkies?". Grin

(I've sent a patch to theymos. If he merges it quickly, we might set a new record for time between suggestion and implementation.)

Sending message to someone on this forum should also be seen as formal and informal, not just in one way.

If it is formal, title supposed to be added, even if you are writing a letter on a paper officially. But if it is informal, for example I am writing to a friend on this forum, I may decide not to include a title.

If you are writing an official letter, you can write it the way you want. It is left for the person you are writing it to to either read it or not. In official cases, the person a letter is written to may not read it if it is written informally. That option is left also on this forum. Even on emails, you can send a message without the title, just like if you write a letter to someone on a paper.

If you do not see the title, you may like and not read it than to make a suggestion about how PM supposed not to be.

Or if it can be in a way that someone can option for it on their profile settings, that all messages that should be received should have a title, it would be better like that. But the default should be as it is now.

This is just my suggestion. Messages can have a title or not. If the suggestion should be added, it should be optioned for.

Pmalek

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Quote from: Sexylizzy2813 on September 15, 2023, 04:57:07 PM

OP that's true but at the same time, not everybody cares if the message comes with a title or not, they just open and glance through.

I agree with OP here. I would like to see a subject in all my PMs as well. It literally takes a few seconds to write one. It can get especially frustrating if you are talking to the same person on different subjects, and at one point in the future you have to go back to check something. Imagine dozens of PMs without a title where you have to search for that exact message that contains the information you need. I would rather that I can figure out what we talked about based on the title of the PMs. But that also means that the original PM sender has to be professional enough to write a correct subject and not something like 'Hi' or 'Yo'. That doesn't help anyone.

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Quote from: DYING_S0UL on September 16, 2023, 02:26:13 AM

If I remember correctly the first time I send you a PM, I added a subject named "Talkimg" but the 2nd time I forgot to add any subject. It happens. Tongue

This has nothing to do with your MP! I appreciate the concern.
If it was just you, or newbies, we'd be fine. I believe that there are many legendary users, who also do not write anything on the subject. Wink

It really is a question of widespread behavior. Perhaps because it is a resource little used by the majority, over time people stopped paying attention to this detail. Simply click on send PM and write the message, and send it just like that.

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To be honest, If I say from my perspective most of the newbies aren't familiar with the forum. Even me! I forget things time to time. I forget to add subject or sometimes I mess up BBcodes. Those who are here in this platform for a longer period of time should always use a subject. And there isn't any default, "Remember Subject" or anything like that. If I remember correctly the first time I send you a PM, I added a subject named "Talkimg" but the 2nd time I forgot to add any subject. It happens. Tongue

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Quote from: 1miau on September 15, 2023, 07:13:58 PM

Bitcointalk's PM feature is already causing lots of issues, (see here) and leaving subject field empty will just make it even worse.

Adding a subject is taking 10 seconds, maybe. Hopefully, OP's post will be a good reminder.

I remember that conversation. I'm not even saying to make radical changes to this section of the forum - because I'm aware that it will be very complicated nowadays.

I thought more about the idea of changing behavior. But I also know that it is something more difficult.

However...

Quote from: PowerGlove on September 15, 2023, 08:49:10 PM

When I hear "patch time?" I flick my head up like my dog does when he hears "walkies?". Grin

(I've sent a patch to theymos. If he merges it quickly, we might set a new record for time between suggestion and implementation.)

Our colleague @PowerGlove has already thought of some help. Tongue

What did you suggest: Leave the field blank, to force something to be written? Or something else?

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Quote from: LoyceMobile on September 15, 2023, 04:04:15 PM

Good one, I dislike receiving this too.
You can't create a topic without entering a title. PMs should reject the default too. Patch time?

When I hear "patch time?" I flick my head up like my dog does when he hears "walkies?". Grin

(I've sent a patch to theymos. If he merges it quickly, we might set a new record for time between suggestion and implementation.)

Edit: I made a patch topic about this (Encouraging non-lazy PM subjects).

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Quote from: joker_josue on September 15, 2023, 05:50:15 PM

It's just annoying when you want to go to a specific message, and in the index there are 10 messages saying "no subject". Roll Eyes

Same here...
I'm getting tons of PMs and most people add a subject but some don't and if we are searching specific PM's from one category, it's almost impossible to dig it up if we forget, who sent the PM.
Bitcointalk's PM feature is already causing lots of issues, (see here) and leaving subject field empty will just make it even worse.

Adding a subject is taking 10 seconds, maybe. Hopefully, OP's post will be a good reminder.

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Quote from: dkbit98 on September 15, 2023, 05:59:02 PM

How about instead of changing titles we change and improve the whole messaging system.

Well, it's easier to change the way the title appears automatically than the forum's PM system. Changing the entire PM involves deeply tweaking the forum system. And I think that's unlikely to happen.

Therefore, when asking, I was asking for something that I know would be easier to deal with: readjusting the way in which the PM's title appears.

Speaking of which...

Quote from: LoyceMobile on September 15, 2023, 04:04:15 PM

Good one, I dislike receiving this too.
You can't create a topic without entering a title. PMs should reject the default too. Patch time?

I believe that if the title field changes from a new PM to being blank by default, without the term "(no subject)", the problem will soon be resolved.
Because, if I remember correctly, how the SMF system works, all it takes is for the field to be blank to be asked to fill it in, as happens when creating topics.
Therefore, this issue will be quickly resolved if this default text is removed.

Now, if it was placed there... I believe it was for a valid reason. Undecided

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Quote from: joker_josue on September 15, 2023, 03:20:43 PM

Therefore, I ask that when you send a PM, write something in the subject of the PM and not just leave the "(No subject)". This helps a lot in managing PMs.

I am guilty for mostly using default option aka No subject in forum Wink

If this was email or if bitcointalk had better personal message system I would probably pay more attention to this, but now it sucks and adding different title when someone already sent me ''No subject'' is silly.
How about instead of changing titles we change and improve the whole messaging system.

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Quote from: SamReomo on September 15, 2023, 04:33:18 PM

Yeah, it would be better if the admin implement a patch where the user has to select his/her PM's title instead of no subject because that way someone who receives a lot of PM's can decide to read which one of those first. I personally don't really care about the title of the PM's because I try to read any PM's as possible and to be honest I rarely get a PM and I rarely send one to someone else.

It's just annoying when you want to go to a specific message, and in the index there are 10 messages saying "no subject". Roll Eyes

There I have to go into more detail to choose the one I want. Fortunately, I have managed to control the situation. But, I think it's always better to have a title than "no subject".

In fact, if it's "no subject", why send a PM!? Grin

Quote from: Sexylizzy2813 on September 15, 2023, 04:57:07 PM

OP for that I'm sending you a message 😅.

Be my guest! I'll be waiting! Wink

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OP that's true but at the same time, not everybody cares if the message comes with a title or not, they just open and glance through.
Every receiver has his or her own way of taking PMs. Some find it hard to even reply while some forget about the title and flow with the message.
I don't have issues if the message comes with a "greeting" title, as long as your messages are not abusive, I'm cool with that.
But must some, if not all the messages come with a title or a reason why you have to receive or respond to the message?
Why not read it and reply if you choose to?

OP for that I'm sending you a message 😅.

SamReomo

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Quote from: LoyceMobile on September 15, 2023, 04:04:15 PM

Good one, I dislike receiving this too.
You can't create a topic without entering a title. PMs should reject the default too. Patch time?

Yeah, it would be better if the admin implement a patch where the user has to select his/her PM's title instead of no subject because that way someone who receives a lot of PM's can decide to read which one of those first. I personally don't really care about the title of the PM's because I try to read any PM's as possible and to be honest I rarely get a PM and I rarely send one to someone else.

Stalker22

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Quote from: joker_josue on September 15, 2023, 03:20:43 PM

~
I believe that most people will not read this information, but here's a note. Maybe other users "suffer" from the same "problem".

Yes, I "suffer" from the same problem as you, and it is not limited to private messages; I receive loads of such emails too. Not sure why this is happening, but it might be due to mobile platforms and the popularity of instant messaging among younger generations. Since my early days of using digital communication, I have been taught that the subject line is just as important as the message itself. However, it appears that younger generations have disregarded this practice, and "(No subject)" seems to be gaining popularity as a trend. This is, of course, just my personal observation.

LoyceMobile

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Good one, I dislike receiving this too.
You can't create a topic without entering a title. PMs should reject the default too. Patch time?

_act_

legendary

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What is funny to me is that I did not bother to read the title of any personal messages that anyone send to me, what I look at first is the person that send the personal message, after checking the person, I go straight to the message to read it. They are just few sentences which I can easily read. But people are different from people.

joker_josue

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I know that many users don't like receiving PM. I understand and you are within your rights.

Personally, I don't mind being PM'd because I know it's a way for people to reach out to me. And if someone abuses it, I can take action in that case.

The only thing that bothers me is that the MP's title is just "(No subject)". I know this is what appears by default, but it can be changed. Normally this field serves to define the title of the message - three or four words that identify the objective of the PM.

Therefore, I ask that when you send a PM, write something in the subject of the PM and not just leave the "(No subject)". This helps a lot in managing PMs.

I believe that most people will not read this information, but here's a note. Maybe other users "suffer" from the same "problem".

Hugs to everyone, fellow Bitcoiners and Bitcointalkers! Wink

Topic: Use less (No subject) in MP, please (Read 527 times)