Topic: Venezuelan Leader Maduro Is Charged in the U.S. With Drug Trafficking (Read 281 times)

But that's the point, the point is for the masses to suffer so they begin to rebel against their government. Sanctions typically aren't going to cripple to people at the top, as they have MANY other means to gain $$$ -- they can avoid traditional markets (Stocks,Bonds, etc) and just go ahead and sell drugs (Maduro)

By the way you're explaining things, it seems like this is just a system of corruption that has only been further expanded by the Maduro regime b/c of the hurt that come from US sanctions. The US thinks that at a certain point the people aren't going to allow the government to continue to exploit them, and they're going to rebel and instill a democratic government. Eh?

Maybe I'm wrong here, just spitballing with ya.

No the sanctions are doing nothing of the sort. If anything, only the masses suffer. In any case this could also explain why Maduro created a mining company for the military, so he could keep them happy from the spoils underground (gold and diamonds, they said).

Maduro allows the military to conduct bribes usually (but not always) at the border, this is a decades old institution that only strengthened even more under his regime. The military knows that this "operation" could be endangered if another (not accomplice) government comes.

You see, the foot guard at the border will accept the bribe to let you pass, say, food or medicine (because you are supposed to have a permit, yadda, yadda). Part of the bribe goes to his superior, and part of that goes to his superior's superior, all the way to the top. This is kinda like an MLM with the (compulsory) bribes being the main fuel.

Of course traditionally most of the money came from smuggling out (not in) gasoline, because of the absolutely ridiculous subsidy its nearly free, so what takes you 100 USD to fill a cistern tank truck, in Colombia easily becomes 40 thousand or more USD. That's enough money for everyone, including the smugglers and all the irregular groups operating on both sides of the border. Note that while Colombia has traditionally been a "drug" cartel, Venezuela instead has been a gasoline traffic cartel (sure they could have probably also expanded into drugs, or that's what the DEA says anyway).

This has been going at least since the 90ies, which is when they got the fear of adjusting gasoline prices following Caracazo, sowing this much worse future (this is what happens when you deny the market and attempt to peg the price of things).

Yes what I'm saying is that this corrupt military caste was produced by decades of absurd gasoline subsidy, and from those habits came the rest. Incidentally while they can bully and extort civilians or even rival irregular groups, for actual military operations they suck. Of course Venezuela has not faced a REAL military confrontation in centuries.

All this means is the Maduro has been given the job of controlling the drug flow into the US... given control by the Federal Bureau of Narcotics. I mean, Mexican drug lords are fighting so hard among themselves that they aren't effective for drug trafficking any longer. Maduro has shown himself capable by the way he wrecked Venezuela.

That's literally what this is and they said this is what they're doing. The guy literally just got charged with distributing drugs throughout the US, pretty much running a cartel, and so on and so forth. For the US this is the best time for them to leverage their military, and their money, to be able to get someone to flip and to join team US.

They've just gotta pray that the sanctions have been working, and that they've forced Maduro to have to skimp out on paying certain members of his military. Which may sway them towards taking the big money bags from the US. It'd be stupid if Maduro does this, but greed and intelligence don't go hand in hand.

Doubt much will come out of this now though, Trump wants to ride off the approval bounce that comes with being the president during some sort of disaster (in this case, corona pandemic) not being a wartime president when people hate boots on the ground, and really any war.

Following up, the President of the United States just ordered the "largest U.S. military operations in the region since the 1989 invasion of Panama".


So this is totally not a display of power to persuade the Venezuelan military that they should cooperate with the US and hand over the indicted, or else...

They say they have been planning this operation for months but the timing couldn't be more opportune, right after indicting Maduro and his friends. The constitution of Venezuela states that if both President and Vice-president (both indicted) go missing or resign, the National Assembly President takes charge and is supposed to call elections within 30 days.

But the regime installed a "national constituent assembly" that declared itself above the constitution and law, that makes no new constitution but keeps issuing decrees and laws like the National Assembly should, but they don't recognize it after losing the majority of seats in 2015.

As for the naval ship sinking itself after ramming against a much larger cruiser ship, well that should give you an idea of the military condition of this country...

US will find it a threat if Maduro's friends are going to move their military forces, its like igniting a wildfire which may not help.

Venezuela got oil there that has been making Venezuela's economy alive and if Venezuela is friends with China then trading with China is one big advantage to provide good life for Venezuelans maybe enriching the country's forces too by asking help from Russia. All Maduro has do to is stay in their country I don't think US will just go there are snatch him.

This pattern of neo-colonialism has been going on for a long time. Remember the Banana Republics, they were lead by company backed leaders and if things go astray then the companies asked for the help of USA, maybe this is not so different from what is happening right now because we all know that Venezuela have a very rich oil depsit and you know that superpower nations love that and they are going to do whatever it takes to get a tap on that black gold.

no the mainland is where the core of the population with certain social memes lives (americanism, tax payer, usd currency capitalism etc.

putting an american flag somewhere doesn't has a lot of meaning for some exceptions

Thing are going so well in the US that we have to scour the globe for problems to try and "fix".    They know a crisis is coming with oil prices this low and are trying to exacerbate it in order to get Maduro out and Guido in.  This ultimately will make the future a lot worse for Venezuela and then we will blame the outcome solely on Maduro's policies. 

The astronauts planted the US flag on the moon. Is that where USA mainland exists?

mainland usa is the usa

That's actually a very good point, and they do realize this as well. Though it really depends on how happy everyone in their inner circle is and if they think that the US (and allies) are going to do something. The generals are going to want to leave when they think things are going to turn bad -- what's the upside to stay around as their leader is toppled and they're being hung by their people. If I was one of these generals and I was thinking that it's probably pretty likely that in the next 10 years they're toppled -- give up the guy to the US and get like 15m and some sort of deal to get you and your entire family to the US.

If you're smart about investing of that money (not in bitcoin folks, sorry) -- you'd be able to live off that money forever and not have to worry about another thing. What's better then that?

Well, they have done it before, and the world didn't care. Would they care if they did that again today? Of course not.

According to the indictment, it is for crimes in American soil this time. This is exactly what happened to Manuel Noriega in Panama in 1989, and back then there were no remote controlled UAVs; the very first use of a stealth plane (the "F-117") in a (real) military operation. Desert storm, etc, would come later.

If any country objects an unilateral intervention, it would be like siding with "narco-terrorism" (the words from the indictment). Of course the "friends" of Maduro are already protesting: China, Russia, Cuba, Nicaragua, etc. But can they REALLY stop the US? Only if they moved their military to Venezuelan waters (again).

Of course this could be "yet another bluff" from Trump. He likes to push, but when it comes to action, somehow he withholds like the democrats. All the previous sanctions have done nothing but fuel Maduro's regime with more excuses for neglecting to solve any issues the Venezuelan people suffer from, all they care is to remain in power at any cost.

just another coup attempt... nothing new, since Chavez that happens every 2 or 3 months

I wonder when will they start worrying about human rights in saudi arabia, qatar...

But what right does US have to extract someone in their own country and jail them on their soil?

Looks very disrespectful to a president of a country. What Maduro had done its not their jurisdiction to do something about it but the people of Venezuela. Its just unfortunate that they don''t don't have a neighbor country strong enough to bond with for support.

Trump has an excuse to drop a bomb on Maduro's house now. I wouldn't be surprised if he decides to do that if no one else will bring Maduro's head to him.

This is probably what the Trump administration expects, but they fail to realize that: Those very generals, or inner circle (not all have been indicted) are the ones getting the most money from the (corrupt) situation of the country. Its literally their wealth at the expense (misery) of the masses.

And, there is a soviet style counter-intelligence system in place within the armed forces and government officials. At the slightest suspicion (and often even without any) people are removed and extorted, imprisoned, etc, etc... US agencies have been trying for many years, and they managed to convince the 3rd highest ranking officer, but after a failed attempt (around 2018) he fled the country and nothing ever changed.

I'd say offering the people of a country in a horrible financial situation that amount of money is going to lead them to help the US in taking him down. We're talking about a country with like 2 million percent inflation yearly that is in a full crisis at this point.

I wouldn't be surprised if we learned about a general in his army or someone within his inner circle that turns on him to pick up money and support from the US.

The thing that we don't see is what the real reason is. There has to be a breaking of a treaty/contract/agreement, or some other paperwork that shows he is subject to the U.S. It might all have to do with some oil contract he made with the US, and never kept up his part of the bargain. Or it could have to do with some secret agreement he made with the CIA to set him in power in the first place. You probably won't see the real thing in the news.

And the indictment comes with a hefty bounty. A staggering $15 million for Maduro's arrest and another $10 million for his inner circle members. I don't how necessary this is, if at all, while some ordinary people within their territory itself are getting laid off from their jobs with no salaries.

And the funny thing here is that while the US government is terribly failing on its own soil, they are trying to appear to be one which puts up good governments abroad. And they have the gall to talk of the "need an effective government that cares about the people.”^[1] LOL!

[1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/the-united-states-indicts-venezuelas-maduro-on-narco-terrorism-charges/2020/03/26/a5a64122-6f68-11ea-a156-0048b62cdb51_story.html

Mainland USA does not belong to the US. It belongs to the States or to the people. There are only a few spots in the Constitution that are allotted to the US. Essentially it is the District of Columbia and forts that have been Ceded by the States to the Federal. It's in the 10th Amendment and the Contract Clause in the Constitution, itself. The only real rule the US government has is regarding banking and interstate/international commerce.

This is why the USA is free.

you mean you want to join the usa?

mainland usa doesnt expand since decades, and they don't want to expand as long as they have open borders.

Not surprised to see this happen, the Trump administration and honestly most of US politicians agree that he shouldn't be the President of Venezuela and that he is an illegitimate president. The NY Times article also has some pretty great quotes that is the reason that the US is taking such strong action, and should continue to do so.


and FURTHER


AND THEN THE FAMILY CONNECTION


This man shouldn't be in power, end of story.

Right. When this is over, we should petition for a referendum to join the Union, no need to remain like Puerto Rico as a modern variant of a colony...

according to us logic you can accuse the leader of a failed state that never had any financial air to breat to pay even just 1% of the police needed of anything that suits your agenda,

third world should beg for colonialism to escape their problems

Official indictment press release:

Nicolás Maduro Moros and 14 Current and Former Venezuelan Officials Charged with Narco-Terrorism, Corruption, Drug Trafficking and Other Criminal Charges


So if we go back to the year 1989, Manuel Noriega in Panama was accused of similar charges. This of course was followed by the invasion of Panama and the capture and extraction of the accused, who was trialed and sentenced (for life) in the USA.

Is this the prelude to a similar formula to end Maduro's regime? During the middle of COVID-19 no less... Well at least the people are conveniently isolating themselves in their homes...

The New York times also wrote an article:

Federal prosecutors accused President Nicolás Maduro of participating in a “narco-terrorism conspiracy” in a major escalation of the Trump administration’s efforts to pressure him to leave office.


So... Open season to hunt the current Venezuelan regime, open to all civilian contractors worldwide? Hmmm basically they just painted a giant target symbol to my country...