[video] Nothing At Stake Explained in 4 Minutes

monsterer

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Quote from: jones_ on August 13, 2015, 11:27:39 PM

I think you misunderstand the concept. Sure it is possible to fork a POS cryptocurrency by forging a block on an alternate chain and broadcasting your new chain, but if the chain that you do this on doesn't have over 50% of the stake forging on it, it will lose out to the main branch.

You are talking about the specifics of a subclass of attacks which only exist because of the zero cost of block production.

BayAreaCoins

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Owner at AltQuick.com

Attack CLAM then Roll Eyes

jones_

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Quote from: monsterer on August 13, 2015, 11:25:36 AM

Quote from: HCLivess on August 13, 2015, 05:42:28 AM

Why do you keep beating around this debunked myth? It does not cost nothing to produce a block. Wha t the fuck...

Where is the cost?

I think you misunderstand the concept. Sure it is possible to fork a POS cryptocurrency by forging a block on an alternate chain and broadcasting your new chain, but if the chain that you do this on doesn't have over 50% of the stake forging on it, it will lose out to the main branch.

You are welcome to attempt to forge on as many branches as you want at the same time in Proof of Stake, but unless everyone else is mindlessly running their nodes with a multibranch stategy, the attack that you try may cost nothing, but it will not work.

Quote from: kushti on August 13, 2015, 01:40:58 PM

The explanation is just superb!

Thanks Kushti, happy to know I got it correct

kushti

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The explanation is just superb!

monsterer

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Quote from: HCLivess on August 13, 2015, 05:42:28 AM

Why do you keep beating around this debunked myth? It does not cost nothing to produce a block. Wha t the fuck...

Where is the cost?

jabo38

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mining is so 2012-2013

that was a pretty good video. Thanks Jones

jones_

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Quote from: HCLivess on August 13, 2015, 08:04:27 AM

Quote from: Este Nuno on August 13, 2015, 07:10:01 AM

Quote from: HCLivess on August 13, 2015, 05:42:28 AM

Why do you keep beating around this debunked myth? It does not cost nothing to produce a block. Wha t the fuck...

Who are you replying to here?

Proof of stake in the PP/NVC fork is essentially different from NXT algo.
It is not true that no resources are used.
Everything is mixed up and confusing.

Yes, in the video I focus on nxt like 100% pos systems, but parallels can be drawn from this to other more complicated systems.

Este Nuno

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amarha

Quote from: HCLivess on August 13, 2015, 08:04:27 AM

Quote from: Este Nuno on August 13, 2015, 07:10:01 AM

Quote from: HCLivess on August 13, 2015, 05:42:28 AM

Why do you keep beating around this debunked myth? It does not cost nothing to produce a block. Wha t the fuck...

Who are you replying to here?

Proof of stake in the PP/NVC fork is essentially different from NXT algo.
It is not true that no resources are used.
Everything is mixed up and confusing.

Yes, I assume you're responding monsterer rather than OP then.

HCLivess

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=== NODE IS OK! ==

Quote from: Este Nuno on August 13, 2015, 07:10:01 AM

Quote from: HCLivess on August 13, 2015, 05:42:28 AM

Why do you keep beating around this debunked myth? It does not cost nothing to produce a block. Wha t the fuck...

Who are you replying to here?

Proof of stake in the PP/NVC fork is essentially different from NXT algo.
It is not true that no resources are used.
Everything is mixed up and confusing.

Este Nuno

legendary

Activity: 826

Merit: 1002

amarha

Quote from: HCLivess on August 13, 2015, 05:42:28 AM

Why do you keep beating around this debunked myth? It does not cost nothing to produce a block. Wha t the fuck...

Who are you replying to here?

r0ach

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I just made a thread talking about proof of capacity with a few references to nothing at stake attacks in that system here:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/lets-talk-about-proof-of-capacity-1151924

HCLivess

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=== NODE IS OK! ==

Why do you keep beating around this debunked myth? It does not cost nothing to produce a block. Wha t the fuck...

Este Nuno

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amarha

Nice vid. Thanks for posting it.

monsterer

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Here's nothing at stake explained in one sentence:

If it costs nothing to produce a block, then attacking the network also costs nothing.

jones_

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I made a short video explaining what nothing at stake means with proof of stake cryptocurrencies as well as what can be done about it and how much it effects the currency as a whole.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzIl3vmEytY

In this video I discuss what is generally called a short range nothing at stake double spend attempt. Nothing at stake could mean a few other potential issues, but this is the most interesting to study and the one that is potentially feasible in most Proof of stake systems.

thank you to kushti and the consensus research team (http://consensusresearch.org/) for their work on this subject.

Topic: [video] Nothing At Stake Explained in 4 Minutes (Read 666 times)