Vod sending incompetent trust rating to me and few more legal sellers / buyers!

Golgoth

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Quote from: NotATether on May 17, 2020, 05:13:20 AM

Quote from: Golgoth on May 17, 2020, 02:42:42 AM

You're encouraging trust feedback abuses by this kind of dubious justifications. I hope you're not doing that yourself Embarrassed

It's a fraudulent hijacking of the trust feedback system.

Wrong. Tagging high-risk people before they are able to scam is an appropriate use of the trust system.

I agree with you but you must provide solid elements for that and not tagging people with 0 explanations like that, moreover what you are saying here is your own opinion on the case, until now I understand he has tagged him for scamming Amazon.

Quote from: NotATether on May 17, 2020, 05:13:20 AM

Think of it another way if you saw a high yield investment program with stupidly high return rates, it's appropriate to tag them before they are able to steal people's money.

Where have you seen that please? Every economists call Bitcoin a ponzi and a pump and dump scheme, you're willing to tag all users here? Cheesy

An HYIP would only be a scam if it presents itself as a safe investment. There is even a section for them here :

Quote

Gambling
Gambling and all "investments" that are so risky they might as well be gambling (HYIPs, pyramid schemes, etc.)

NotATether

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To the three posters above: selling an account, which then gets suspended specifically because of the transaction, and refusing to refund the account constitutes as a scam. I don't know if you guys are crackpots or just dumb but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this out.

Quote from: Golgoth on May 17, 2020, 02:42:42 AM

You're encouraging trust feedback abuses by this kind of dubious justifications. I hope you're not doing that yourself Embarrassed

It's a fraudulent hijacking of the trust feedback system.

Wrong. Tagging high-risk people before they are able to scam is an appropriate use of the trust system.

Think of it another way if you saw a high yield investment program with stupidly high return rates, it's appropriate to tag them before they are able to steal people's money.

Quote from: SergeJeletski on May 17, 2020, 01:53:11 AM

To all others who thinks this is so scam - how it is scam? It is not a scam by anyway, if I register accounts. My clients are adding their own credintals to accounts and paying bills. AWS does not ask KYC. For creating accounts, I do not use no one elses data or credit card, but my own generated card from bank. How its illegal? UH, its not.

Then why would people want to buy your accounts if they can just add their own credentials for free??

Hint: Given that you were banned in blackhatworld maybe it turns out that people can go to support and add SES limit by themselves. It's better than pointlessly buying your accounts and them getting deleted by Amazon and you definitely aren't going to provide warranty or refund them are you. No need to deny this. even your buddy admits this is true.

Quote from: Cean on May 16, 2020, 08:36:12 PM

Finally, even they do not fucking care about the bills and they would just suspend your account and leave it.

Here's a thread of someones SES account getting deleted because of buying it https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/scammed-by-seo-aka-annon-fenon-skype.893409/#post-9491093

Golgoth

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Quote from: suchmoon on May 16, 2020, 05:06:56 PM

Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on May 16, 2020, 04:40:51 PM

Quote from: suchmoon on May 15, 2020, 10:49:00 AM

So yes, they're scamming Amazon.

In this particular case, I'll take your word for it

Well, that wasn't my intent Grin

Anyone willing to verify it - all you need to do is try to create an AWS account anonymously (hint: you can't) and then decide if creating an account with fake personal/billing info is a scam or not. I think using deception to obtain a service is pretty much the definition of fraud, and reselling that service means profiting from fraud.

Edit: I guess another possibility is to believe that the account seller is using their own (not fake) personal info when creating those accounts but I don't believe that.

You're encouraging trust feedback abuses by this kind of dubious justifications. I hope you're not doing that yourself Embarrassed

It's a fraudulent hijacking of the trust feedback system.

Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on May 16, 2020, 04:40:51 PM

And you mentioned that these sorts of shenanigans give bitcointalk a bad name, and I agree with that.

IMO You are a little bit naive if you think people are willing to use bitcoin for buying children's toys or pizzas... Roll Eyes

Paypal is already here for that, with fewer fees.

SergeJeletski

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Quote from: Vod on May 16, 2020, 05:53:18 PM

This forum is not the only place the OP has been pulling this scam.

https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/amazon-ses-50k-account-sales-continuous-sale.1192955/

Are you mad dumb, Vod? Why you think its me? I have never had any sale thread at BHW and this particular user who was banned there is at this forum also under multiple alt accounts like digitaloceansales, googlecloud1000, rambobaba488, amazonses50k etc.
At some thread he even admits it, but I am too lazy to proove you something because as I see, you are just dumb. Enjoy your life by abusing trust system - just to let you know, I still have buyers and I still do it - no one cares about your e-balls what you try to grow, oldie.

To all others who thinks this is so scam - how it is scam? It is not a scam by anyway, if I register accounts. My clients are adding their own credintals to accounts and paying bills. AWS does not ask KYC. For creating accounts, I do not use no one elses data or credit card, but my own generated card from bank. How its illegal? UH, its not.

Cean

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Vod, get a life and stop abusing the fucking trust system. You guys are the worst, fucking up this place with your nonsense. We are not scamming any individuals here. Never did. That's all I had to say to you.

Listen idiots (excluding Direwolfm14), Amazon is well-aware of the situation. How do I know that?

1. Amazon fingerprint like crazy. They know it's "you" regardless of any information you provide to them.
2. Service quotas are renewed regularly, so they let you go, and approve your requests, still knowing it's "you."

Finally, even they do not fucking care about the bills and they would just suspend your account and leave it.

No one buys these accounts to spam shit. How would they convert these emails into sales otherwise? Most do CPA and some even attach credits to their accounts.

Anyways, these unwarranted tags will not impact shit. SES is nothing new and many people including me have been doing it for years. Everyone is in each other's contacts. But here at Bitcointalk some loafer will always have reason to abuse trust system.

Vod

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This forum is not the only place the OP has been pulling this scam.

https://www.blackhatworld.com/seo/amazon-ses-50k-account-sales-continuous-sale.1192955/

suchmoon

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Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on May 16, 2020, 04:40:51 PM

Quote from: suchmoon on May 15, 2020, 10:49:00 AM

So yes, they're scamming Amazon.

In this particular case, I'll take your word for it

Well, that wasn't my intent Grin

Anyone willing to verify it - all you need to do is try to create an AWS account anonymously (hint: you can't) and then decide if creating an account with fake personal/billing info is a scam or not. I think using deception to obtain a service is pretty much the definition of fraud, and reselling that service means profiting from fraud.

Edit: I guess another possibility is to believe that the account seller is using their own (not fake) personal info when creating those accounts but I don't believe that.

The Sceptical Chymist

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Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 14, 2020, 06:02:40 PM

I would not say the OP is scamming Amazon/AWS as it appears he is selling AWS accounts that have high limits to send emails via their “SES” service.

Thanks for the partial explanation of what the problem is--I can't say I understand it fully since I don't deal with those types of digital goods sold here on bitcointalk.

Funny how OP is upset after Vod left him a neg, but he seems to not care at all about the other negs he got well before Vod's. Obviously I know why that is, but it tends to detract from OP's credibility in my eyes at least.

Quote from: suchmoon on May 15, 2020, 10:49:00 AM

So yes, they're scamming Amazon.

In this particular case, I'll take your word for it (and Vod's)--not that it matters in the least to OP, since I'm not one of the ones who gave him negative trust. And you mentioned that these sorts of shenanigans give bitcointalk a bad name, and I agree with that.

Vod

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Quote from: Golgoth on May 16, 2020, 11:17:01 AM

But AFAIK he is not a policeman and he doesn't know how SergeJeletski got these accounts.

He told me in PM.

suchmoon

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Quote from: Golgoth on May 16, 2020, 11:17:01 AM

If Vod wants to say this user is scamming Amazon, he must write it explicitly.

That's literally what he did.

Quote from: Golgoth on May 16, 2020, 11:17:01 AM

But AFAIK he is not a policeman and he doesn't know how SergeJeletski got these accounts.

Using the trust system doesn't require one to be a "policeman". If Vod thinks that the OP is high-risk he posts a negative trust rating. If other users think that Vod is wrong more often than not they exclude Vod from their trust lists (or for any other reason - that was just an example).

I don't think Vod is wrong in this case.

Golgoth

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Quote from: suchmoon on May 15, 2020, 10:49:00 AM

Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 14, 2020, 11:10:29 PM

I am not sure if you are trolling, or are unable to read:

There is a third option: you have no clue what you're talking about and you're just trying to waffle your way through it.

The scam is not just someone hypothetically defaulting on future obligations, which wouldn't be specific to SES account sales. The scam is also the "method" those account sellers use to obtain the accounts (hacked/fake payments/etc) and to move them from SES sandbox to production mode to get the 50k limit. Because sure as shit they are not using their own personal details, they have to lie to support to get the limits raised, and they can't create those accounts anonymously, otherwise it wouldn't cost $200+.

So yes, they're scamming Amazon.

So you mean his feed back is inaccurate then.

If Vod wants to say this user is scamming Amazon, he must write it explicitly.

But AFAIK he is not a policeman and he doesn't know how SergeJeletski got these accounts.

Moreover you should read another time what a negative feed back is for exactly :

suchmoon

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Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 16, 2020, 12:43:46 AM

I had also looked at the documentation for increasing SES limits, and I don't see anything about having to provide any kind of personal details. A google search did not yield any results that imply personal information needs to be provided to increase SES sending limits. If you have evidence the accounts being sold are hacked or require verification resembling KYC, I would recommend reporting the threads, and the sellers will be banned.

https://portal.aws.amazon.com/billing/signup#/account

Loading...

Edited 2020-11-30 to fix a broken image

Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 16, 2020, 12:43:46 AM

If you believe fibbing on a form that AWS support might review constitutes a scam, I would suggest moving to about 400 miles south of San Francisco to Los Angelos, where walking on dry sand might get you arrested, but walking on wet sand is okay.

Relevance?

NotATether

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Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 16, 2020, 12:43:46 AM

I had also looked at the documentation for increasing SES limits, and I don't see anything about having to provide any kind of personal details.

Because you don't need to provide personal details to open a support ticket to get an SES limit raise, but to make dozens of AWS accounts to resell you need to provide bogus identities when you create each AWS account.

PrimeNumber7

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Quote from: suchmoon on May 15, 2020, 10:49:00 AM

Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 14, 2020, 11:10:29 PM

I am not sure if you are trolling, or are unable to read:

There is a third option: you have no clue what you're talking about and you're just trying to waffle your way through it.

The scam is not just someone hypothetically defaulting on future obligations, which wouldn't be specific to SES account sales. The scam is also the "method" those account sellers use to obtain the accounts (hacked/fake payments/etc) and to move them from SES sandbox to production mode to get the 50k limit. Because sure as shit they are not using their own personal details, they have to lie to support to get the limits raised, and they can't create those accounts anonymously, otherwise it wouldn't cost $200+.

So yes, they're scamming Amazon.

I have not used Amazon's SES service, but I am a customer of AWS, GCP, and others. I have gotten various limits raised on various cloud platforms, such as GPU, ASIC and notebook limits, and I have never had to do anything more than enable billing (the first time), or occasionally give a one-sentence explanation of what I am working on and an offer to show the repo with my work.

I had also looked at the documentation for increasing SES limits, and I don't see anything about having to provide any kind of personal details. A google search did not yield any results that imply personal information needs to be provided to increase SES sending limits. If you have evidence the accounts being sold are hacked or require verification resembling KYC, I would recommend reporting the threads, and the sellers will be banned.

If you believe fibbing on a form that AWS support might review constitutes a scam, I would suggest moving to about 400 miles south of San Francisco to Los Angelos, where walking on dry sand might get you arrested, but walking on wet sand is okay.

DireWolfM14

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Quote from: TECSHARE on May 15, 2020, 06:34:47 PM

People have been flagged and tagged for much less.

If you feel I've done something that warrants a tag and flag, then by all means, tag&flag away.

Quote from: TECSHARE on May 15, 2020, 06:34:47 PM

Good thing you got your special boy pass

The ceremony was lovely. You should have been there, but you weren't invited.

TECSHARE

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Quote from: DireWolfM14 on May 15, 2020, 09:31:41 AM

Quote from: teeGUMES on May 14, 2020, 10:31:32 PM

Also DireWolfM14 you can explain further about this and why you feel you should provide escrow services here? "Allegedly".

It's not alleged, I did provide escrow for several of these transactions. If you're asking me to justify it, I won't because I feel I shouldn't. I was naive to provide my services for account sales in the first place, and it's not a mistake I intend to continue.

Tsk tsk! You are facilitating criminal activity Direpup! People have been flagged and tagged for much less. Good thing you got your special boy pass and your tin of scrotum polish to shield you from the penalties anyone else would be subjected to.

Vod

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Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 14, 2020, 11:10:29 PM

I am not sure if you are trolling, or are unable to read:

I thought you had stopped trolling? Sad

suchmoon

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Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 14, 2020, 11:10:29 PM

I am not sure if you are trolling, or are unable to read:

There is a third option: you have no clue what you're talking about and you're just trying to waffle your way through it.

The scam is not just someone hypothetically defaulting on future obligations, which wouldn't be specific to SES account sales. The scam is also the "method" those account sellers use to obtain the accounts (hacked/fake payments/etc) and to move them from SES sandbox to production mode to get the 50k limit. Because sure as shit they are not using their own personal details, they have to lie to support to get the limits raised, and they can't create those accounts anonymously, otherwise it wouldn't cost $200+.

So yes, they're scamming Amazon.

DireWolfM14

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Quote from: teeGUMES on May 14, 2020, 10:31:32 PM

Also DireWolfM14 you can explain further about this and why you feel you should provide escrow services here? "Allegedly".

It's not alleged, I did provide escrow for several of these transactions. If you're asking me to justify it, I won't because I feel I shouldn't. I was naive to provide my services for account sales in the first place, and it's not a mistake I intend to continue.

PrimeNumber7

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Quote from: suchmoon on May 14, 2020, 06:27:30 PM

Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 14, 2020, 06:02:40 PM

I would not say the OP is scamming Amazon/AWS as it appears he is selling AWS accounts that have high limits to send emails via their “SES” service.

Yeah, it's totally fine to steal from Amazon, Bezos is too rich anyway. Next time you see an Amazon package on someone's porch - feel free to help yourself to it.

I am not sure if you are trolling, or are unable to read:

Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 14, 2020, 06:02:40 PM

I am not entirely sure if AWS would be able to secure payment for the SES service the OPs customers would be able to use. If not, the OP would be crossing the line into helping people default on their obligations to AWS in addition to the above, which would be scamming.

teeGUMES

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Quote from: SergeJeletski on May 14, 2020, 11:12:48 AM

I do always agree escrow service and have used DireWolfM14 escrow service. He escrows the funds always without problems.

Can you explain any further about your relationship here?

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on May 14, 2020, 12:38:24 PM

The review states that you're scamming Amazon Web Services, and it's true that selling these accounts violates Amazon's terms of service.

Also DireWolfM14 you can explain further about this and why you feel you should provide escrow services here? "Allegedly".

NotATether

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Here is a hypothetical scenario how someone could get scammed buying these accounts:

People selling AWS accounts, and azure, and digitalocean, and any other cloud account, implicitly sell the credit card attached to it which they can revoke at any time by filing a fraud complaint to their bank. Then the accounts cannot be billed anymore and are terminated. At least that's how I imagine people are selling these accounts.

So if that happens, the people buying these things lose the accounts they buy which is sufficient to be called a scam and get red tagged over it.

I'm not accusing OP of pulling this trick because I don't know if he in particular did this. I see dozens of accounts like him making AWS and co. account sale threads in the Digital Goods section.

suchmoon

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Quote from: PrimeNumber7 on May 14, 2020, 06:02:40 PM

I would not say the OP is scamming Amazon/AWS as it appears he is selling AWS accounts that have high limits to send emails via their “SES” service.

Yeah, it's totally fine to steal from Amazon, Bezos is too rich anyway. Next time you see an Amazon package on someone's porch - feel free to help yourself to it.

PrimeNumber7

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I would not say the OP is scamming Amazon/AWS as it appears he is selling AWS accounts that have high limits to send emails via their “SES” service.

My presumption is that the target market of the OP is spammers and scammers emailing mass spam and/or scam emails.

I am not entirely sure if AWS would be able to secure payment for the SES service the OPs customers would be able to use. If not, the OP would be crossing the line into helping people default on their obligations to AWS in addition to the above, which would be scamming.

I don’t think the OPs business is something that is giving BitcoinTalk a good reputation, nor reflects positively on the forum. I also can’t say I disagree with the concept of giving red tags for the OPs business.

Vod

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Quote from: SergeJeletski on May 14, 2020, 11:12:48 AM

What to do? Is it normal to leave red trust for honest sellers? Vod left it also to user Cean, Telim, JWick83 and niddss. I have worked with all of them and all of them are legit, atleast as much as I have done co-work with them.

I don't leave red trust for honest sellers. I showed you where you were violating terms and instead of discussing it, you chose to attack. :/

I often give people chances if they realize they were scamming, but you seem to think it's OK if the company is large and rich.

DireWolfM14

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Vod is within his rights to leave negative reviews for whatever reason he sees fit. Reviews are not moderated, and the only recourse you have is convincing him to remove the tag.

If the community determines that Vod's reviews are unwarranted and inaccurate, then maybe enough DT1 members will exclude him, and his reviews will become "untrusted." I would venture to guess that will not happen as a result of this situation. I don't think SES sellers are going to conjure up a lot of sympathy or community support, and Vod's review is actually pretty darn accurate. The review states that you're scamming Amazon Web Services, and it's true that selling these accounts violates Amazon's terms of service.

SergeJeletski

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Hello,

User Vod wants to help the world again and he tries to ruin now our business / accounts. Though my customers does not care about that -1 trust rating, I do still feel its not right, as I have not ever scammed anyone. Not a single user has complained about me or my accounts. I do always agree escrow service and have used DireWolfM14 escrow service. He escrows the funds always without problems.

There is lot of real scammers, alt account scammers etc. who are scamming users every day and Vod does not red trust them. It does not feel right at all for me.

What to do? Is it normal to leave red trust for honest sellers? Vod left it also to user Cean, Telim, JWick83 and niddss. I have worked with all of them and all of them are legit, atleast as much as I have done co-work with them.

Topic: Vod sending incompetent trust rating to me and few more legal sellers / buyers! (Read 587 times)