Topic: WARNING ! Vircurex is freezing your BTC, LTC, FTC, TRC. (Read 3131 times)

I took this advice to heart but got caught anyway.

All I did was move some coins into Vircurex to trade them in late March and couldn't get them back. The whole transaction should have taken 15 minutes.   Kumala claimed there was a technical error he was fixing but then he froze (stole) them.  He promised to make up his losses without affecting user accounts then went back on his word.  He claimed he was fixing a technical withdrawal issue and stole those funds too.  That second lie costs me a lot of money and heartache.  Here's why:

My autistic son will be graduating from high school in June.  It has been such a long journey for us and we are very proud he has made it.  My wife and I asked him what he wanted as a graduation gift and he said he'd like a cruise to Alaska.  Normally we could never afford that trip but I had enough cryptocurrency to just swing it.  I tried to trade the coins on Vircurex so I could monetize them.  Instead, Kumala stole them from me.  I've tried everything to get him to return them and he won't even respond to me.  Monday, I saw Kumala unfroze .00026808 LTC of my total of 450 LTCs.  I guess I was fooling myself thinking somehow I may get my coins but now I know I won't.  My wife recently cancelled our trip and today I told my son we can't go because someone stole the money. He was heartbroken and I was humiliated.  I'm now selling all of my mining equipment in the hope of raising some cash for a more modest trip.

I don't need sympathy and I certainly don't need people telling me it's my own fault for trading on Vircurex.  I just want people to know (especially Kumala) that what he did had real consequences for people.  Does Kumala realize when he steals people's coins it could effect their lives? 

I'm beyond upset now.  I'm heartbroken that he could be so callous as to steal people's wealth with no regard to how he is hurting them.

Exchanges don't need anyone to store their fiat and coins  on their site, to stay in business. They make a profit on every trade. They don't make loans like a bank so it's only a risk to hold the coins. Unless of course, they plan on stealing  when it's worth it to do so. 

So don't leave large amounts on any of these exchanges. Unless you have a fetish "get off" by getting robbed. 

The point about private keys and control of your bitcoins is well taken and absolutely true.  Storing your wealth on an exchange is a very poor plan.

However, all functioning economic systems require trust.  Bitcoin does not prevent this, e.g. the "who goes first problem".  For one of the first altcoin exchanges to fold like this is not a good thing.  Everyone keeping their BTC in the virtual equivalent of their mattress wont build a very dynamic financial system.

Holiday, which exchange has the better exchange system?

The Vircurex bag holders, just like the Gox ones before them, have my sympathy.

Actually im semi-libertarian myself.  I just dont try to take it too extremes like some and realise no ideology is perfect in the real world and occasionally you need rules and regulations.

I hope Bitcoin gains the mass it needs.  We need Bitcoin or something like it.  But it seems like the people on the inside are doing their absolute best to kill it off while the community cheers them on and laughs at anyone burned.  Im worried one day the people doing this will wake up and realise trading volume worldwide is non-existent and the miners are pulling their machines as there is no liquidity.  Then wonder why it all happened.

So this is my addition to the conversation people need to have with themselves before they kill a good idea

Very much so thats why the Bitcoin community needs to come up with a better way.  Because the current response is to laugh at anyone being "goxxed" and saying its all your fault for trusting them.  Not productive in any way shape or form.

Without some level of liquidity created by exchanges Bitcoin is useless.  No business will accept it if they cant sell it for cash they need in the fiat economy they reside in. No person wanting to get involved can short of mining (and that now requires very expensive machines) if there are not exchanges to buy it on.

So things will stagnate without some level of order.  Bitcoin will become an interesting but failed experiment.

Hopefully someone will come up with a better exchange system.  One that requires somewhat less trust. 

But until the main community gets over its Libertarian circle jerk and realises some level of regulation (even if community driven) is not only inevitable but necessary this stuff will continue to happen and probably kill Bitcoin before long.

right.  everybody take all your cash and bitcoin out of exchanges.....  and then see what happens to the price of bitcoin.  more and more people will withdraw their money and crypto from exchanges, and that is why the price is going down (imo) and will continue to go down.  cryptos will not survive unless there are extremely reliable exchanges.  bc there aren't enough of them, i have sold all my bitcoin. 

going cold storage is nothing but a short-term fix for personal holders of bitcoin bc without reliable exchanges there is no liquidity and no new money coming into bitcoin. 

Takes time to build up enough trust to get the volume to really pull the big cash when you pull the plug and walk with everyone’s $$$$

At least it begins to look that way as exchange after exchange pulls similar stunts.


Which ones the oldest and has the biggest volume?  Its likely next

This really sucks!

I started a couple polls/threads where we can get idea of the distribution of BTC and LTC have been frozen and post when you have had your funds have been unfrozen so we can gauge the progress of the of the unfreeezing process.

BTC here -> https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5871976

LTC here -> https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5872019

-Lyddite

I'm just wondering which exchange is going to go next.

BTC-e, Cryptsy or Bitstamp.....

This is a real shame, Vircurex has been one of the most reliable exchanges on the market for some time.

I generally feel bad for anyone that's encountered exchange issues, as I've been very fortunate with my dealings.

Used BTC-E and Cryptsy mostly, and usually a painfree and efficient process.  Haven't tried Virucurex yet, so can't really speak on their validity.

What I do know is once I've made a trade from say Terracoin, Freicoin, Takcoin, Mazacoin etc to BTC, that sucka's going out to cold storage in -0.002 seconds and not a second longer.

Like others have been saying, never trust an online entity to hold anything you aren't willing to lose.

lesson 1.

if you haven't learnt by lesson 1 proceed to lesson 2
lesson 2.
if you don't know the CEO of an exchanges name, address and what he looks like.. don't give them sole control. a withdrawal request is just that, a request. it is not a court order. so they can simply say 'no'

if you haven't learnt by lesson 2 proceed to lesson 3
lesson 3.
if you cant:
give them a slap across the face with a wet fish if the wrong you, then don't
give them your hard earned money
giving them a slap across the face costs $15 at a fishmarket
giving them your hard earned money costs you more

if you haven't learnt by lesson 3 proceed to lesson 4
lesson 4.
if your still going to use exchanges, don't use them as a long term bank,

lesson 5.
even if an exchange is the most honorable exchange there is. their 'balance' database could become corrupt, they could get hacked, they could accidentally employ a 'temp' with negative intentions. or more simply whilst your locked out of your funds for 48hours or so, you are losing out on trading opportunities elsewhere...

it will always cost you one on way or another

Very well put, Peter.

Trust me guys.. I would not have bothered to log in, had that update been made available on the bookmarked page. Here is what I see after clicking on Vircurex's bookmark..



Verrrry sneaky..

Check out the new 'frozen balance' column..

This is very true.

Never leave any BTC in an exchange, online wallet, etc. that you cannot afford to lose. Transfer it in, conduct your transaction, and then transfer it out ASAP. These companies are not piggy banks, and due to the nature of Bitcoin they cannot be easily held liable. Just ask anyone who's been goxed.

Has anyone run the numbers, I wonder.

It seems like about 8 out of 10 exchanges gets shutdown or hacked, its a real war ground out there.

You bet I sure as hell fucking did.

I just exchanged my Bitcoins faster than I ever had.

Vital lesson of thread quoted above. Stop trusting strangers with your wealth, kids.

People are losing "their" bitcoins to incompetent or unscrupulous exchanges partly because these words do not mean the same thing; however, our experience with fractional-reserve banking and a lender of last resort has convinced people that they "basically mean the same thing".  I believe Holliday is working to reshape our understanding of what it means to "have" something: you have something when you are in control of that something.  

If you control the private key to 10 BTC, you have 10 BTC.  If you deposit 10 BTC to an exchange or gambling site, you are exchanging those assets for a promise.  You are credited with an account balance of 10 BTC to reflect that promise: you are a creditor of the exchange or gambling site.  You now have an account balance that represents a promise for 10 BTC.  

For the first time, bitcoin gives us the ability to store, transport and exchange wealth across the world, without the assistance of a third-party or the permission of an authority.  I know that it is useful to use the services offered by third-parties (trading bitcoins, for instance), but I really think a lot of people leave more coins than necessary on these exchanges because they don't understand the point that Holliday is trying to make.    

Yes, I have no idea why you would send them btc.  Not only that, but they might just use that deposit to start paying back account holders as per their new release. 

1. I would suggest people do not deposit more coins on this exchange as we don't know what will happen with those deposits.
2. As I suggested above, you may still be able to withdraw funds via dogecoin. 
Maybe someone can give it a try and report back here?

Peace

You sent them BTC?  Right now you will not be able to withdraw either the BTC or the FTC from them. 

I didn't choose that wording.. they did.

Btw.. this update did not appear until after I cleared the browser cookies..



After my initial attempts to withdrawal BTC failed, I bought some FTC. I have since sent 0.234xx BTC which has yet to appear on my account.
https://blockchain.info/address/15hpwsw7V55voV2ZrCvY8MXCVtzcafBdLR

In case anyone was further mislead by this post, he basically means the same thing just said with fancy words.

Yikes This sucks. Reminds me of the problems with Bter.

There aren't any coins left to honour deposits as a result of the hack last year. 

I withdrew coins in the form dogecoins a few days ago.  You may still be able to convert to doge and withdraw, I'm not sure about this.

I can't foresee trade fees being able to pay back all deposits, although we don't know actually number of coins we are talking.

I get this when I attempt to withdrawal BTC or FTC.

Talk about a nice kick in the ass !

https://vircurex.com/welcome/ann_reserved.html

SCREW YOU vircurex ! RETURN MY COINS !