What Happen if bitcointalk member pass away?

Sarah Azhari

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Quote from: KingsDen on November 05, 2022, 06:42:13 PM

I think there are still sane cultures and those of us from such backgrounds shouldn't betray it in internet.

True and in fact, there are some people around the world who have kind and really care about others. The lender Darkstar is Noble hearted to give up the money for his family. I used to have bad thoughts about forums that think 80% filled by bad people. but, I was wrong, there are still a lot of good people like an angels who very care to each other.

Actually, this thread for general case, but because I begin with pandu name and was fixed, I have to lock this thread, and will continue it open when happen again with other people in the same case.

Thanks a lot for your are kindly posts.

KingsDen

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

There is sad news in our local forum, a member who has active in long time ago died. ~ pandukelana2712 ~

I do not know exactly him even have read his post and his thread. so what makes me interested is, what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

I don't think so, because in my habit, if someone died, usually a lot of people on neighbors give it up,
but another financial company ask for heirs to pay it off.

Thanks alot.

If you read the below post by roycilik, you will understand that different people have their cultures and way of life. We are all gathered here but from different countries, races and tribes with different norms. While in some cultures, anyone could be dishonest and go away with it. But in the culture of roycilik and the deceased, it is obligatory to repay debts.
I think there are still sane cultures and those of us from such backgrounds shouldn't betray it in internet.

Quote from: ?? on ??

To be honest, Darkstar has asked me to give the money to the Pandukelana family, but it is an obligation in our place that the debt must be settled first, also dewo_sat said the same thing. And now it's up to Darkstar what to do with the money.

Thanks to Darkstar (:

Smartvirus

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People don't like to share any relations with a poor dead person but you would find a whole lot of persons claiming to have some relationship with a rich dead person. Maybe not consciously for some but the purpose is always about debt and inheritance. There are some poor guys that might have landed property past down through generations but most times, what they leave behind is debt and you would find almost no one, willing to take up the responsibility of paying off in the event of a non collateral loan.
When it comes to a rich guy, there is always something to share from money to properties in assets and all. An irony no doubt as to how the world works.

_BlackStar

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Quote from: The Cryptovator on November 05, 2022, 03:00:55 PM

I am assuming OP tried to ask what will happen died with a loan from the forum. Because his loan will default here automatically in case of death. Yes, it's pretty much a hard question.

His death can be confirmed by his family or forum friends as some previous users have done for Bruno.

Quote from: nutildah on April 11, 2020, 02:29:14 AM

Hey guys. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I just found this:

https://www.everhere.com/us/obituaries/nv/las-vegas/bruno-kucinskas-jr-10682556

Quote

March 4, 1960 - April 8, 2020 (60 years old)
Las Vegas, Nevada
..
It is with great sadness that we announce the death of Bruno Kucinskas Jr. (Las Vegas, Nevada), who passed away on April 8, 2020, at the age of 60, leaving to mourn family and friends. Leave a sympathy message to the family on the memorial page of Bruno Kucinskas Jr. to pay them a last tribute. You may also light a candle in honor of Bruno Kucinskas Jr..

He was loved and cherished by many people including : his parents, Bruno Kucisnkas Sr. and Juanita Kucinskas (Wonderly); his daughter Apryl Kusinskas of Minnesota; and his siblings, Bruce Kucinskas of Lafayette, Bryan Kucinskas of Sandwich Illinois, Belinda Slagle (Brenda Honn) and Beth Basurto of Oswego.

Thought you should know.

Quote from: The Cryptovator on November 05, 2022, 03:00:55 PM

There is no solution actually if the borrower doesn't tell his family to return lend amount.

There is no definite solution, but the negative tag is always justified for anyone who defaults loan without any information. In fact today all the negative tags on the pandukelana account have been deleted or changed, but this was done after the loan was paid off thanks to the help of two friends.

The Cryptovator

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I am assuming OP tried to ask what will happen died with a loan from the forum. Because his loan will default here automatically in case of death. Yes, it's pretty much a hard question. So this will be a p2p loan, not from the forum actually. So now depends on the lender if he wants to give it up or expect funds back. Also, it would possible we won't notice who died actually if we don't know in real life. So lender would think the borrower defaults on the loan if he isn't sure about death. There is no solution actually if the borrower doesn't tell his family to return lend amount.

dewo_sat

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Quote from: hilariousetc on October 26, 2022, 03:14:53 AM

---
Did it get paid?

Quote from: Woodie on October 29, 2022, 06:41:30 AM

Condolences to pandukelana2712's family MHSRIP .

Talking of loans and death, I want to believe that mostly if they are big loans the loaner can choose to give them out with a collateral but for non collateral loans it could end up as bad debt that the loaner will have to write off unless another family member is aware of such they could reach out to have this settled.

Just out of curiosity how did this information reach the forum of his passing, if loan is big maybe this could reach his/her family to try settle his book's.... In some cultures this is what happens. REST IN PEACE CHAMP.

Quote from: Sarah Azhari on November 01, 2022, 06:10:27 AM

---
I heard good news from His Friend.
Next week, dewo_sat as pandukelana's mandate promise to pay off the debt to darkstar, maybe not directly send to lender, but by middle man (roycilik), I don't know exactly how many, with interest or just a tree.

Quote from: Razmirraz on November 03, 2022, 10:26:22 PM

----

According to the information we found on the Local Board, this case has a bright spot. One of the guides friends 2712 has managed to contact Roycilik to help pay off the debt.
Now he is trying to raise money according to the trust reference in the account pandukelana2712.

Quote from: dewo_sat on October 19, 2022, 01:19:00 AM

Setelah menimbang, memikirkan dan berkonsultasi kepada beberapa teman saya tentang hutang-piutang; maka saya berketetapan untuk membayar 0.064 BTC dalam bentuk FIAT-IDR sesuai dengan referensi trust di akun pandukelana2712.

Pembayaran akan saya bayarkan kepada rekening bank yang diminta oleh bang Roy Cilik, tetapi saya perlu beberapa hari untuk mengumpulkan uang sejumlah tersebut.

And today I've paid to Roycilik with IDR, equal with 0.064 BTC nowday.

Quote from: roycilik on November 04, 2022, 01:18:04 AM

----
FYI: Saya sudah menerima dana sebesar 20.500.000 atau setara sekitar 0.064btc dari om dewo_sat, sayang nya akun beliau belum bisa di recovery (lupa pasword)

Saya akan segera menghubingi darkstar untuk menyelesaikan permasalah hutang piutang Almarhum
---

Hopefully DS will forgive me.

Razmirraz

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As announced by Roycilik at the Indonesian Local Board, the loan will be borne by the heirs to pay off to DarkStar_.

In the case of accounts payable between Pandukelana2712 and DarkStar_ with the approval of both parties (the lender and the loan recipient) there is no third party (one of the family members of the loan recipient) who is a key witness to the occurrence of the lending and borrowing transactions. The good news is that before he died (the recipient of the loan) had made a will to his friend to pay his loan to the lender.

Quote from: dewo_sat on October 19, 2022, 01:19:00 AM

Setelah menimbang, memikirkan dan berkonsultasi kepada beberapa teman saya tentang hutang-piutang; maka saya berketetapan untuk membayar 0.064 BTC dalam bentuk FIAT-IDR sesuai dengan referensi trust di akun pandukelana2712.

Pembayaran akan saya bayarkan kepada rekening bank yang diminta oleh bang Roy Cilik, tetapi saya perlu beberapa hari untuk mengumpulkan uang sejumlah tersebut.

lovesmayfamilis

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Quote from: DVlog on November 01, 2022, 03:13:03 PM

Sons, brothers, or other relatives got the dead person's property. So I am thinking what if a dead legendary forum member's son or brother starts using his account on his behalf? Are there any rules regarding this matter or general rules will be applied here?

Are you really interested in this, or is it just meeting your subscription company's quota? Maybe in this case it would be worth reading all the posts and not asking questions that have already been answered many times.
Among other things, how do you prove that a person is dead? Are you satisfied with the statement of a friend or a photo of this person? Nowadays, the dead can be taught to sing songs with the help of computer programs, and the living can be presented in the form of the dead.
Never believe on the Internet what your eyes have not seen offline.

Sarah Azhari

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Quote from: Pandu Geddon on November 01, 2022, 07:37:32 AM

Quote from: Sarah Azhari on November 01, 2022, 06:10:27 AM

I heard good news from His Friend.
Next week, dewo_sat as pandukelana's mandate promise to pay off the debt to darkstar, maybe not directly send to lender, but by middle man (roycilik), I don't know exactly how many, with interest or just a tree.

it means that there has been good communication with the lender. no matter how they solve it, it looks like this case will soon be over.

the result may be different when the deceased does not give a will to his family or anyone to settle his debt case. that means no payments will ever be made. that's the risk of lenders everywhere.

This is the point, I never think this will be a big case if the family or the heir ever knows what the deceased did in past. we certainly don't need to pay attention if not married or live alone without anything else family. If married, his wife must know what the husband did, he should know bitcointalk and must care what husband did on front of PC daily, such as bitcointalk passwords. So if something happen, the wife must create announcement with husband account.

skarais

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Quote from: _BlackStar on November 01, 2022, 08:46:32 AM

I think we only need one thread for a better and organized discussion, so locking one of those would probably be good.

I wouldn't be too selfish to agree with your suggestion, so I hope I'll do it to avoid repeated discussion. You and other users can follow the progress in this thread and hope to get enough information. While, all the information about the loan can be said to be correct, the loan will be repaid soon which is planned this week.

So thanks for the advice.

Cryptomiles1

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In some circumstances if a debtor borrows money and he died, usually before borrowing or taken loan there is always a guarantor who would signed a shortee (whom to hold liable for not paying back) if there is any dead case then the guarantor could come pay his debt. But how authentic this could be because human being are very terrible these days. If any user here knows his real identity then his home should be visited and they should confirm from neighbors, parents and even children if at all such person has a family then that is the only place the truth could show up.

DVlog

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Sons, brothers, or other relatives got the dead person's property. So I am thinking what if a dead legendary forum member's son or brother starts using his account on his behalf? Are there any rules regarding this matter or general rules will be applied here?

_BlackStar

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on November 01, 2022, 06:10:27 AM

-snip-

Why force to have different thread for the same discussion and purpose?
I've been aware of that announcement or information before on another thread: Re: Goodbye Pandukelana2712 - Thanks for your contribution.

Quote from: ?? on ??

But can you tell us where the problem is now? Have his friend pay off the loan to Darkstar_?

There is good news about the loan situation, I got information on the local board that the loan will be repaid by his relatives to roylicik this week. Here's an excerpt, but maybe you need to use GT to read the information properly.

Quote from: roycilik on October 30, 2022, 10:36:34 AM

Hari ini Saya baru mendapatkan update dari yang bersangkutan, dia telpon saya melalui telegram dan mengatakan jika tidak ada halangan minggu ini dia akan segera transfer dana untuk melunasi tanggungan almarhum

I think we only need one thread for a better and organized discussion, so locking one of those would probably be good.

Pandu Geddon

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on November 01, 2022, 06:10:27 AM

I heard good news from His Friend.
Next week, dewo_sat as pandukelana's mandate promise to pay off the debt to darkstar, maybe not directly send to lender, but by middle man (roycilik), I don't know exactly how many, with interest or just a tree.

it means that there has been good communication with the lender. no matter how they solve it, it looks like this case will soon be over.

the result may be different when the deceased does not give a will to his family or anyone to settle his debt case. that means no payments will ever be made. that's the risk of lenders everywhere.

Sarah Azhari

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Quote from: Woodie on October 29, 2022, 06:41:30 AM

Condolences to pandukelana2712's family MHSRIP .

Talking of loans and death, I want to believe that mostly if they are big loans the loaner can choose to give them out with a collateral but for non collateral loans it could end up as bad debt that the loaner will have to write off unless another family member is aware of such they could reach out to have this settled.

Just out of curiosity how did this information reach the forum of his passing, if loan is big maybe this could reach his/her family to try settle his book's.... In some cultures this is what happens. REST IN PEACE CHAMP.

I heard good news from His Friend.
Next week, dewo_sat as pandukelana's mandate promise to pay off the debt to darkstar, maybe not directly send to lender, but by middle man (roycilik), I don't know exactly how many, with interest or just a tree.

Woodie

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Condolences to pandukelana2712's family MHSRIP .

Talking of loans and death, I want to believe that mostly if they are big loans the loaner can choose to give them out with a collateral but for non collateral loans it could end up as bad debt that the loaner will have to write off unless another family member is aware of such they could reach out to have this settled.

Just out of curiosity how did this information reach the forum of his passing, if loan is big maybe this could reach his/her family to try settle his book's.... In some cultures this is what happens. REST IN PEACE CHAMP.

Sarah Azhari

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Quote from: Sandra_hakeem on October 26, 2022, 06:58:53 PM

Sorry, what you mean insurance?? You mean the borrower is gonna pay some more extra funds aside the collateral ( if there were any) to the lender just Incase he dies?? I mean......who the fuck is preparing to die?
Or, is the forum gonna settle borrowers bills? -- borrowers that are indepted to a lender and dies eventually? Is this what you call insurance?
Please, I would need more specificities on that as you points are unclear. I'd understand if you're bumping into a case like this for the first time, though.

Sandra 💇

yes, seem like that. but the insurance is a third party person besides the lender and borrower, The insurance is can be a member of the forum, an outsider company, or another. it;s the same like insurance healthy where if we got sick the insurance company can pay it to hospital. in this case, if borrower died, the insurance company will pay the kredit to lender until paid off

Sandra_hakeem

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Goodnight, ohh Leo!!! 🦅

Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 26, 2022, 02:13:36 AM

Quote from: yahoo62278 on October 25, 2022, 09:00:48 AM

From my understanding I thought the guy had left some money with someone to repay the debt? Maybe I misunderstood?

the deceased left about Rp. 8,500,000 to his friend, maybe $545 or 0.027 BTC, and it seems less than 0.064 BTC when he borrows.
and, I guess his friend trying to collect the lack of money, so late to repay the loan.

Quote from: Sandra_hakeem on October 25, 2022, 06:52:19 PM

Are you one of the deceased kin? If not, then how does the whole dilemma warrant your concern?

I don't the deceased kin, this is a unique case for me for the first time here.
maybe this case can bring pay attention between lenders and borrowers to take care about loan insurance, so if the borrower died, the rest of the loan is repaid by insurance.

Sorry, what you mean insurance?? You mean the borrower is gonna pay some more extra funds aside the collateral ( if there were any) to the lender just Incase he dies?? I mean......who the fuck is preparing to die?
Or, is the forum gonna settle borrowers bills? -- borrowers that are indebted to a lender and dies eventually? Is this what you call insurance?
Please, I would need more specificities on that as you points are unclear. I'd understand if you're bumping into a case like this for the first time, though. What keeps baffling me is your interest in the whole situation? INSURANCE?? Why create a topic with such a 'malapropos' title then?

Sandra 💇

LTU_btc

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First of all, it's sad to hear that pandukelana passed away. I wasn't familiar with him, but his username is known for me. RIP.
About loan, it's sensitive question. First of all, it's not bank where you give your personal details, sign contracts and etc. Here on Bitcointalk basically you lend money to random strangers. Even if that user have good reputation on Bitcointalk, still, in most cases he is nothing more than random stranger. And here it's vert difficult to prove that user really passed away. Even if it's possible, things like death certificates can be faked easily. Reality of Bitcointalk - if one or another Bitcointalk user will die one day, nobody will know about it in 95% and more cases. And id he had active loan, people simply will think that he made excit scam. C'mon, I can talk for myself - if I will be hit by car tomorrow, nobody on Bitcointalk will know about it. That's reality of forum where majority people think about privacy.
It's good if you will be able to contact family of that member outside Bitcointalk and they will repay loan. But in most cases it's not likely to happen. Probably such cases can be considered as force majeure situation, lender have to accept loss and move on.

SatoPrincess

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Your title and contents pose two questions. I will try to answer both of them. When a bitcointalk user dies, as in the recent case of , the users from the local board the person is part of, are supposedly the closest link to the forum and should be the first to bring the news to public notice. If the death is confirmed, a neutral tag with proper reference would be given. That is done so no one can sell the account, if the account is sold and becomes active after a year or more, the account will be painted red. For your second question, the dead can’t pay their debts. BTW who’s to confirm if the user has passed or defaulting a loan. I think it’s a risk the people in the loan section have calculated, there should be a collateral for every loan to discourage defaulters.

Doan9269

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

I do not know exactly him even have read his post and his thread. so what makes me interested is, what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

The lender does not need any further investigation on weather he's death or not as long as repayment is defaulted, he will be tagged, if the family continues with the account and think that having such tag is inappropriate then they will have to check in the purpose for the tag and if they wish, they can make the repayment on his behalf and the tagged will be removed by the lender, this is a simple things to deal with as long as the reference is there to give direction, but dont expect the account to be banned but can only limited to being tagged.

BitcoinGirl.Club

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Quote from: hilariousetc on October 26, 2022, 03:14:53 AM

You can't make a dead man pay anything unless there's some sort of contract involved that accounts for these sorts of situations so it will be up the people who he owes money to try track it down but I doubt that will be very fruitful unless he put some safeguards in place or left instructions to his next of kin on what to do. How do you know he actually passed away?

It seems to me that the loan were from DarkStar_. In the forum I do not think when a person to person lending is in operation the lenders are asking if you die then your relative needs to repay it and such thing. Considering the no term, the lender has always risk to lose his money.

In some cases maybe the relatives are not aware too that their died family member was on this forum and they have xyz amount of debt to someone.

Question remains was it a collateral loan?
In that case the lender has something to cash out but if this was a no collateral loan then it's a lose the lender have to accept. That brings the last part, should he tag the account? The dead person is never coming back. Leaving a negative will not change anything except in the long future people who will visit the profile they will see this person scammed a loan which clearly was no correct.

Strongkored

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Quote from: hilariousetc on October 26, 2022, 03:14:53 AM

Quote from: Strongkored on October 25, 2022, 04:06:47 AM

The deceased had already entrusted funds to his partner to pay off his debts before he died I think it was the obligation of his colleague to pay them off immediately, and I read that his colleague also said that he would pay off even one of the reasons he created an account on this forum (if I am not mistaken) was to clear this matter, so nothing to be debated.

Did it get paid?

Not yet, because the lenders has not changed his trust rating to the deceased's account.
based on the discussion in the local section, his friend is collecting money to pay off, but please understand that his friend is not taking over the debt or like someone who is responsible but this debt has become his obligation because the money was already in his hands before.

hilariousetc

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

There is sad news in our local forum, a member who has active in long time ago died. ~ pandukelana2712 ~

I do not know exactly him even have read his post and his thread. so what makes me interested is, what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

I don't think so, because in my habit, if someone died, usually a lot of people on neighbors give it up,
but another financial company ask for heirs to pay it off.

Thanks alot.

You can't make a dead man pay anything unless there's some sort of contract involved that accounts for these sorts of situations so it will be up the people who he owes money to try track it down but I doubt that will be very fruitful unless he put some safeguards in place or left instructions to his next of kin on what to do. How do you know he actually passed away? Is there any public records of his death or is this info just someone else has passed on. Has anyone thought that this could just be a convenient way of getting out of paying his debts? Of course anyone can die at any time but when most of us are anonymous here it's not that hard to fake your own death or simply just log off the site and pretend so.

Quote from: Strongkored on October 25, 2022, 04:06:47 AM

The deceased had already entrusted funds to his partner to pay off his debts before he died I think it was the obligation of his colleague to pay them off immediately, and I read that his colleague also said that he would pay off even one of the reasons he created an account on this forum (if I am not mistaken) was to clear this matter, so nothing to be debated.

Did it get paid?

lovesmayfamilis

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How can you prove on the Internet that a person has died if not a single piece of information about him is left on the forum? This can be the most common deception, even if someone says a relative has contacted him. What can be done with an unpaid loan? If there were no conditions in advance, then information about the death of a person could be taken as truth, or maybe not.
In these difficult economic times, many people may resort to deception, pretending to be a hacked account or dead. If the forum welcomes anonymity, you need to put up with such stories.

Sarah Azhari

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Quote from: yahoo62278 on October 25, 2022, 09:00:48 AM

From my understanding I thought the guy had left some money with someone to repay the debt? Maybe I misunderstood?

the deceased left about Rp. 8,500,000 to his friend, maybe $545 or 0.027 BTC, and it seems less than 0.064 BTC when he borrows.
and, I guess his friend trying to collect the lack of money, so late to repay the loan.

Quote from: Sandra_hakeem on October 25, 2022, 06:52:19 PM

Are you one of the deceased kin? If not, then how does the whole dilemma warrant your concern?

I don't the deceased kin, this is a unique case for me for the first time here.
maybe this case can bring pay attention between lenders and borrowers to take care about loan insurance, so if the borrower died, the rest of the loan is repaid by insurance.

Sandra_hakeem

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Goodnight, ohh Leo!!! 🦅

Are you one of the deceased kin? If not, then how does the whole dilemma warrant your concern? We're not under some unforseen exigencies and nobody complained 'bout how unlucky Darkstar has been, -- that' he won't utilize any possible means to get his funds back? Is that what you mean?? If not, then why did you suggest that he let go of the funds in the deceased familys' custody? Just being too curious 😶

Except otherwise stated, Darkstar is eligible to request for refundment. Agreement remains agreement, no matter what happens at the long run. Stop suggesting that he'd let go of the funds; you're just gonna look like a piece of shit buddy. Allow the user (Darkstar,) himself to decide wether or not to donate, WILLINGLY....... take note

Sandra 💇

Mr.right85

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I originally thought that your thread was concerned about what happens to a bitcointalk account after the users passes away but, it seems that is not the major concern here as it is instead focused on the possible scenario of a running loan.

Well, death is an unfortunate situation but if I may be a little sarcastic, I'll suggest those that are aware of when the would die to please pay up there loan. You know how some people would die on the forum and be alive in the real world, perhaps return with a different account.
Anyway, its important that one tries to pay up there debts so as not to discourage those offering these services. It's helping a few people on this platform.

Meanwhile, from my high school days, there is something called bad debt and its usually what was owed by a dead person which is often unrecoverable. For some though.

TelolettOm

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

pandukelana2712

You put the wrong link. It is not a profile link of pandukelana2712 account, it is the link to a thread made by roycilik.
You should change it with the right link https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/pandukelana2712-1304130.

Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

I don't think so, because in my habit, if someone died, usually a lot of people on neighbors give it up,
but another financial company ask for heirs to pay it off.

In Pandukelana's case, he already gave the payment to his friend (@dewo_sat). So, the heirs have no responsibility to pay again. @dewo_sat is the person who must give the money to @ DarkStar_. But I don't get updated news of whether he already sent the payment to @DarkStar_ or not. Ideally, @dewo_sat must send the payment as soon as possible when Pandukelana gave it to him. But I don't know why @dewo_sat didn't do it, he just announced it to us now. I think it is a bit too late.

indah rezqi

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?

Instead of creating a thread I might suggest you PM Darkstar (if it's about pandukelana loan) or a lender for an accurate answer if it's about another user.

I don't know for sure if someone has ever written off a loan and forgotten it when someone out there had gotten the money to pay off the loan to the lender before death. In the pandukelana case, he had asked his friend to pay off the loan (in progress) so maybe it would be different from other cases.

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Quote from: yahoo62278 on October 25, 2022, 09:00:48 AM

Is this person's real full name known? Do we know 100% this isn't a scam where someone is trying to dodge repaying a debt? Can a death certificate be produced?

Ultimately, it's up to Darkstar as to whether he wants to pursue the colle ting of the debt and clear the account of any bad trust. From my understanding I thought the guy had left some money with someone to repay the debt? Maybe I misunderstood?

The loan has been over 2 years now, clearly the user is a loan defaulter who had no intention of paying, and his account is already useless as we speak, so I don't understand why he would fake his own death over a loan he had no intention of paying.

Nobody is going to submit a death certificate because we don't have any leverage to demand it, and death announcements aren't something we should politicize. If his local community declares him dead, he is dead. Perhaps a good samaritan will pay off his forum debt and release his soul from the bonds of the other world.

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

I do not know exactly him even have read his post and his thread. so what makes me interested is, what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

There is some info that I read about pandukelana loans, but can you confirm this information?

Quote from: ?? on ??

But the surprising thing is, Pandukelana2712 managed to leave some money with a relative to pay off the loan to DarkStar_ (before he died) but he failed to find the right person before communicating with roycilik.

Quote from: ?? on ??

This is a misunderstanding. He was actually responsible at the end of his life, by entrusting money to his relative/colleague to pay debts in this forum (because at that time he was seriously ill and given the mandate). However, for several logical reasons, this fact can only be conveyed several days ago, when 1000 days after his death.

Hopefully, with this, his good name will be clean again and there will be no more misunderstandings regarding the debt. And currently, the loan repayment seems to be in process.

Quote from: ?? on ??

The repayment will be handled by Pandu's friends, dewo_sat, and with the help of Roycilik. He will send the IDR amount of 0.064 BTC, and then Roycilik will send the bitcoin repayment to DarkStar_.

At least that is the current plan, he still needed a few days to collect the money.

In my opinion, because pandukelana has entrusted money to his friend to pay his debt to Darkstar_ then I think now his friend must be responsible for paying it off to the lender. But either way Darkstar_ may have an answer to your question and I don't think we ever know how it will be decided.

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Quote from: yahoo62278 on October 25, 2022, 09:00:48 AM

Is this person's real full name known?

roycilik should know that info since deceased relative contacted him, telling what happened.

Quote from: yahoo62278 on October 25, 2022, 09:00:48 AM

Do we know 100% this isn't a scam where someone is trying to dodge repaying a debt?

I guess there's always a chance that this is a scam attempt, but what would be the benefit of faking your own death? Its not like you can reactivate your account or year or two later and just continue like it never happened and since his real identity was unknown, chances of lender finding him was slim to none.

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Quote from: Strongkored on October 25, 2022, 04:06:47 AM

The deceased had already entrusted funds to his partner to pay off his debts before he died I think it was the obligation of his colleague to pay them off immediately, and I read that his colleague also said that he would pay off even one of the reasons he created an account on this forum (if I am not mistaken) was to clear this matter, so nothing to be debated.

This not legally true since there is no written contract to enforce this kind of transfer of debt. All loans here in the forum is not legally binded by the law since the contract is just between the lender and the borrower. This is the risk that lender willing to risk by providing loans on anonymous borrower. Only trust is the one connecting both parties to this loan agreement.

The loan will die here if the user didn't respond for a long time or forfeit. Many user already defaulted on there loan and none of them is put on jail or being pursue by the law. This is loan default is same when the user passed away.

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

I do not know exactly him even have read his post and his thread. so what makes me interested is, what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?

He obviously can't pay for his lending anymore if he is dead, and it's up for the guy who lend him coins what he is going to do.
Some family members could probably pay this if they inherit his account with Bitcoin and will instructions, but I wouldn't count on that, and I don't like the idea of inheriting accounts.

Quote from: ?? on ??

But about the legality, their family, spouse or friend have no legal obligation the debt in most cases. It's different case if that person wish to keep asset which isn't fully paid yet or cosigned a loan with the deceased one.

Any debt is usually passed on spouse or other family members, but I have no idea how this would apply for coins someone borrowed in bitcointalk forum.
Legality of this is not cleat in many jurisdictions, and people could also remain private, not connecting bitcointalk account with their real identity.

Quote from: yahoo62278 on October 25, 2022, 09:00:48 AM

Is this person's real full name known? Do we know 100% this isn't a scam where someone is trying to dodge repaying a debt? Can a death certificate be produced?

This sounds very much like deja vu case of Bruno aka Gleb Gamow aka Phinnaeus Gage Tongue

but I am certainly not expecting any death certificate will be produced here.

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

I expect normally nobody pays that up. I expect normally nobody knows about such loans.
What can happen? The account will get negative trust rating and gets ruined? Since nobody else will use it (nor know) it doesn't matter much.

So imho for the lender there's not much of a difference whether the "customer" runs with the money or dies.
The amounts of money are usually small and the expense of getting after his family would be greater.

However, this kind of stuff doesn't happen much, so imho you're worrying for no use.

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Is this person's real full name known? Do we know 100% this isn't a scam where someone is trying to dodge repaying a debt? Can a death certificate be produced?

Ultimately, it's up to Darkstar as to whether he wants to pursue the colle ting of the debt and clear the account of any bad trust. From my understanding I thought the guy had left some money with someone to repay the debt? Maybe I misunderstood?

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

There is sad news in our local forum, a member who has active in long time ago died. ~ pandukelana2712 ~

I do not know exactly him even have read his post and his thread. so what makes me interested is, what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

I don't think so, because in my habit, if someone died, usually a lot of people on neighbors give it up,
but another financial company ask for heirs to pay it off.

Thanks alot.

Do you have valid proof about pandukelana2712 have pass away? he has still loan and validate last weeks about he was pass away.

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in the case in general, the forum will not be responsible for it. The settlement will occur between the lender and the borrower. if the borrower has died, and still leaves an active loan. no one can solve it. If the family finds out, I think it can still be resolved.

in the case of Pandukelana2712, he has already given a will to his friends or relatives. it can be solved although it turns out to take quite a while to figure it all out.

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

There is sad news in our local forum, a member who has active in long time ago died. ~ pandukelana2712 ~

I do not know exactly him even have read his post and his thread. so what makes me interested is, what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

I don't think so, because in my habit, if someone died, usually a lot of people on neighbors give it up,
but another financial company ask for heirs to pay it off.

Thanks alot.

This is bitcointalk not a banking community, we can't actually find who is the real user behind the name because bitcointalk never asked for KYC ( apart from April fool's day) while registering so we don't know them unless they expose their real idenitiy to community or someone in the community via personal message.

If someone died they can't pay anything because that is their end with banking sector they may have collateral so they can seize it and auction them to collect the loan value or other practices like legal heirs have to pay the remaining debt. Here, if someone died they can't login to anymore so obviously the red tag will be under their name forever.

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Quote from: Sarah Azhari on October 25, 2022, 03:45:56 AM

-snip
does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

Of course, the lender expects that return regardless of the borrower's life status. Furthermore, it is up to the heirs or relatives of the deceased whether they believe the loan was ever made (this is a pseudo-anonymous forum) or even care about it. In this case the lender has only a glimmer of hope, but according to our belief, the dead should not leave debt unless the lender give it up.

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Quote from: Strongkored on October 25, 2022, 04:06:47 AM

The deceased had already entrusted funds to his partner to pay off his debts before he died I think it was the obligation of his colleague to pay them off immediately, and I read that his colleague also said that he would pay off even one of the reasons he created an account on this forum (if I am not mistaken) was to clear this matter, so nothing to be debated.

But there can be exceptional cases. Example is someone that is travelling and had a car accident and instantly died. It could be in a way he had no friend or family that will pay back the loan. Family is even what we can consider more because friends can know about it and do not do anything because only family can be concerned if they are capable of paying the loan. Even the deceased family may not know anything about bitcointalk, not to talk of knowing anything about the deceased having loan to pay back.

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It's similar like what Bitcointalk will do if someone got scammed, the forum didn't even do anything to the scammer and also with the victim, but DT members will put negative feedback and flag on the scammer account.

It's more correctly to say does pandukelana2712's wife/children/siblings/parents etc that has family connection with him is owe the money? I'd say it's yes, but I think his family doesn't know this forum.

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Your question is not clear.

What happen after a death of a forum member is related to what was done by that member in the forum: contributions, active loan must be repaid, scam accusations ...

Not all death cases will be reported and verified as many of us don't know other members in person. We just know them via the forum, the Internet and that's all we know about each other. To verify death cases, it requires more information, more contact in person and mostly we don't have it.

After a forum member passed away, if the member has great net-effect and contributions, the head admin (theymos/ Cyrus) can give some special treatments as follow

A special badge like In Memoriam
Lock that account permanently for security reason like what were done for accounts of satoshi and Lauda
Investigate further like case of paraipan

Community members can keep investigation going with scammers who suddenly passed away or faked their deaths as well as flow of scam money.

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The deceased had already entrusted funds to his partner to pay off his debts before he died I think it was the obligation of his colleague to pay them off immediately, and I read that his colleague also said that he would pay off even one of the reasons he created an account on this forum (if I am not mistaken) was to clear this matter, so nothing to be debated.

Z-tight

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Bitcointalk is not a financial company, so loans are between the lender and the loanee. If a person dies while having an active loan with someone in the forum, that should be the end of it because there is no way an heir or next of kin is going to pay back the loan, except the loanee is a kind of person that communicates to his family about any loan taken even from a forum like ours, and directs them to always pay back should anything happen to him, in that case if the member is that kind of person and his family have the password to his forum account, then the loan can be repaid.

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There is sad news in our local forum, a member who has active in long time ago died. ~ pandukelana2712 ~

I do not know exactly him even have read his post and his thread. so what makes me interested is, what happen with his lending, does he still have to pay?, give it up?.

I don't think so, because in my habit, if someone died, usually a lot of people on neighbors give it up,
but another financial company ask for heirs to pay it off.

Thanks alot.

Topic: What Happen if bitcointalk member pass away? (Read 717 times)