Whenever ORDI and SATS are pumping we get crazy miner transaction fees... why

rhomelmabini

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Quote from: adaseb on January 13, 2024, 11:20:08 PM

So I wanted to do a transaction today and I look and again I need to pay something crazy like 200 sat/vbyte. Its also on the weekend. I look and of course there is some mempool spam going on.

Head over to Coinmarketcap and the only two coins that are pumping are ORDI and SATS. I noticed that whenever there is a mempool spam these are pumping and I am wondering how its related? What does transaction fees have to do with these coins going up slightly in value? I tried reading how Ordinals work but I am very confused since its nothing like regular mining or ERC20 tokens.

Just like what the dev was saying, these inscriptions was totally just a spam to the network and it needs to be removed but I wonder how they will do it. There's no consensus that has been made lately regarding how it will be managed accordingly and I think we may have to endure it but I'm still hoping that there would be a solution to it.

milewilda

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Quote from: adaseb on January 18, 2024, 12:38:02 AM

Quote from: retreat on January 16, 2024, 05:21:50 AM

I think the increase in fees last weekend was not only from ORDI and Sats but also because many traders tried to sell their Bitcoin after the Bitcoin ETF news, but it is true that Ordinal was the main reason why fees increased drastically. I can't even move my bitcoins because the fees are unreasonable, reaching 12 USD/transaction, that's pretty crazy. I don't know how long we will continue to be played by this ordinal community because it is quite annoying when you want to make a transaction but are hampered by high fees just because a number of people are playing their Ordinal in the network.

I would have assumed that the fees would be crazy during the etf approval but it was actually pretty cheap to make transactions during those days. Pretty much day prior to approval till Friday night, fees were cheap. You could have got many transactions approved with only 30sats/vbyte.

The mempool started to ramp up on Saturday when the only assets moving were these Ordinals. I think it’s because people are impatient and instead of using lower fees like 30-40sats they spam the mempool and we are stuck with these 200 sat/vbyte fees.

For those people who could really be able to afford on making use of that $3-4 transaction fee then they would really be willing to pay up with those fees and this is why it do really sucks on seeing the mempool
isnt really that going low when it comes to sat/byte thing. Its been almost 2 months on which im trying to watch and check out the mempool whether its still congested or not. Its true that we arent
that going below 30 sats/byte on which on the time that we do hit up into that level then it would suddenly be going up and even reaching out 200 sats/byte
on which causing up the fee in whooping $20.

Yes, it might not hurt someone who do have that huge funds or money that they do have which 20bucks is really just that a dust, but for those
people who are really that making micro transactions? Pretty sure it would really be that pain the ass.

Richbased

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Quote from: adaseb on January 18, 2024, 12:38:02 AM

The mempool started to ramp up on Saturday when the only assets moving were these Ordinals. I think it’s because people are impatient and instead of using lower fees like 30-40sats they spam the mempool and we are stuck with these 200 sat/vbyte fees.

Exactly, impatient is what is causing the congestion in mempool and high transactions fees as a lot of people are ready to pay the higher fees and bump their transactions for easier confirmation so whenever there is so much congestion, the ORDI tends to move faster than any other coin.

adaseb

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Quote from: retreat on January 16, 2024, 05:21:50 AM

I think the increase in fees last weekend was not only from ORDI and Sats but also because many traders tried to sell their Bitcoin after the Bitcoin ETF news, but it is true that Ordinal was the main reason why fees increased drastically. I can't even move my bitcoins because the fees are unreasonable, reaching 12 USD/transaction, that's pretty crazy. I don't know how long we will continue to be played by this ordinal community because it is quite annoying when you want to make a transaction but are hampered by high fees just because a number of people are playing their Ordinal in the network.

I would have assumed that the fees would be crazy during the etf approval but it was actually pretty cheap to make transactions during those days. Pretty much day prior to approval till Friday night, fees were cheap. You could have got many transactions approved with only 30sats/vbyte.

The mempool started to ramp up on Saturday when the only assets moving were these Ordinals. I think it’s because people are impatient and instead of using lower fees like 30-40sats they spam the mempool and we are stuck with these 200 sat/vbyte fees.

retreat

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I think the increase in fees last weekend was not only from ORDI and Sats but also because many traders tried to sell their Bitcoin after the Bitcoin ETF news, but it is true that Ordinal was the main reason why fees increased drastically. I can't even move my bitcoins because the fees are unreasonable, reaching 12 USD/transaction, that's pretty crazy. I don't know how long we will continue to be played by this ordinal community because it is quite annoying when you want to make a transaction but are hampered by high fees just because a number of people are playing their Ordinal in the network.

adaseb

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Quote from: SamReomo on January 15, 2024, 01:58:06 AM

Quote from: adaseb on January 15, 2024, 12:03:01 AM

Minting? What is this exactly? You mine for these BRC20 tokens? Aren’t these tokens already in circulation. How does minting BRC20 work exactly?

BRC20 tokens aren't mined like Bitcoin, these tokens are created with a few steps. First the token is simply deployed in a JSON file and then the same JSON file is inscribed to a Satoshi on Bitcoin blockchain. In the JSON file the developer sets the name, the maximum supply of the token, and the limit per mint is also applied in that JSON file. Now the developer deploys this file on Bitcoin network as ordinal inscription.

Consider this inscription as Bitcoin transaction and for it the developer sets a very high fee so it can get confirmed in next block. Now the token is deployed the developer will start minting the values that he added in limit per mint of the deployed file. If I'm not wrong then each mint is also a transaction or you can say an ordinal inscription and it has to be confirmed on Bitcoin blockchain and that's why for each mint the developer usually sets a very high fee to get it confirmed in next block.

That's what I know about the BRC-20 tokens if I have said something which's not correct or missed something then someone should add that extra information via a reply.

Thanks for explaining. This is the most accurate explenation I’ve come across. Because I was always puzzled why these people pay crazy amounts for the inscription to be approved next block, I didn’t think it made a difference but apparently it does hence the crazy fees.

What is your take on the future of these BRC20? I love bitcoin and all but I would rather do ERC20 on the Ethereum network. I don’t think it’s efficient on the bitcoin network at all.

SamReomo

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Quote from: adaseb on January 15, 2024, 12:03:01 AM

Minting? What is this exactly? You mine for these BRC20 tokens? Aren’t these tokens already in circulation. How does minting BRC20 work exactly?

BRC20 tokens aren't mined like Bitcoin, these tokens are created with a few steps. First the token is simply deployed in a JSON file and then the same JSON file is inscribed to a Satoshi on Bitcoin blockchain. In the JSON file the developer sets the name, the maximum supply of the token, and the limit per mint is also applied in that JSON file. Now the developer deploys this file on Bitcoin network as ordinal inscription.

Consider this inscription as Bitcoin transaction and for it the developer sets a very high fee so it can get confirmed in next block. Now the token is deployed the developer will start minting the values that he added in limit per mint of the deployed file. If I'm not wrong then each mint is also a transaction or you can say an ordinal inscription and it has to be confirmed on Bitcoin blockchain and that's why for each mint the developer usually sets a very high fee to get it confirmed in next block.

That's what I know about the BRC-20 tokens if I have said something which's not correct or missed something then someone should add that extra information via a reply.

adaseb

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I am still trying to understand how it all works. So BRC20 have two purposes on the bitcoin network.

Minting? What is this exactly? You mine for these BRC20 tokens? Aren’t these tokens already in circulation. How does minting BRC20 work exactly?

Transactions? Is this similar to sending an ERC20 transaction? Where you send BRC20 tokens on the bitcoin blockchain? This I actually understand.

JeffBrad12

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I guess when the price rise with ORDI and SATS many people are moving around their ORDI and SATS as a result the increase in fee, need to know that BRC20 taking advantage of exploit in bitcoin blockchain thats not supposedly being used for smart contract or anything that requires so many transactions (cmiiw) so the result is that whenever there are many BRC20 based token moving around its always gonna burden the bitcoin blockchain honestly people should just stick with the BTC L2 that allows implementation of smart contract for real like stacks or elastos they are good enough but it seem people are really keen to just implement their own smart contract within the bitcoin blockchain anyway.

logfiles

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Those are BRC20 tokens and all their activities (minting, transactions) are dependent on the Bitcoin blockchain. The worst thing about it is that these BRC20 token spammers don't usually care about how high the transaction fees are since they profit a lot more for selling off their shitcoins to other people, so they will always set high fees leading to cascade on much higher fee rates each time that passes.
So whenever the ORDI and SAT tokens pump, there is always that FOMO leading to more dust transactions, consequently raising the optimal transaction fees.

Just look at the recently confirmed block. Those small blocks are BRC20 related transactions. Look how few the genuine transactions in the block are;

https://mempool.space/block/00000000000000000003a7e7cbd40d55d862ccbf1c9b0497d4cac701b48c5a5c

cryptoknightt

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I think ordinal and sat are tokens that are on the BRC20 network, that is another version of the Bitcoin network, or something similar, that's why if the coins are traded then transaction fees will increase because the network is congested. I was following an NFT project that was released on the BRC20 network, and Of course the fee used is BTC, and Sat will increase if transactions on the network are busy, usually it will increase if there is a new project that will mint or inscribe.

lombok

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BRC-20 tokens are not just Ordi and Sats, there are many and reach dozens. Perhaps the large number of BRC-20 activities simultaneously in several tokens causes congestion in the Bitcoin network which causes an increase in transaction fees. However, BRC-20 token activity is not necessarily the main cause of network congestion and the increase in transaction fees on the BTC network. Long before the BRC token appeared the Bitcoin network also experienced congestion and increased transaction costs, this could also be another factor why transaction fees are expensive and the Bitcoin network is congested.

hd49728

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Quote from: BitMaxz on January 14, 2024, 12:38:59 AM

I don't think these tokens ORDI and SATS making transaction fees rise if you check the chart it is just a roller coaster of ups and downs but yesterday and a day ago as you can see it also pumped but the transaction fees are low around 36sat/vbyte.

There might be other reasons why transaction fees increase I think most nodes right now change their minimum relay fee to higher to help miners earn more incentives?

I think it is correlated like ORDI and SATS pump first to cause BRC20 token enthusiasts to be greed. When they can not control their greed, they will be ready to pay higher and more expensive transaction fee to mint new Inscriptions on Bitcoin blockchain.

I don't know those BRC20 token enthusiasts can always get profit from those Inscriptions by spending high on chain transaction fees. I never read any report to analyze cost and profit or loss of Inscription investors with correlation to transaction fee. Although, no report on it, I believe it won't be different from basics of any market. When many people are greed, there are consequently many people lose money.

FinneysTrueVision

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As we saw for the past week with fees being around 30 sats/vB, the hype surrounding Ordinals isn't organic. The mempool gets spammed in waves because there isn't steadily increasing demand for this garbage. Investors pour money into scammy useless token projects so they can prop up the price and then launch new tokens to keep this scam going a bit longer. A new BRC-20 token started minting and the high fees and pumping prices for anything BRC-20 related is great marketing for them.

Zaguru12

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Quote from: adaseb on January 13, 2024, 11:20:08 PM

Head over to Coinmarketcap and the only two coins that are pumping are ORDI and SATS. I noticed that whenever there is a mempool spam these are pumping and I am wondering how its related? What does transaction fees have to do with these coins going up slightly in value? I tried reading how Ordinals work but I am very confused since its nothing like regular mining or ERC20 tokens.

Yes i can say that the Ordinals are definitely contributing to the increase mempool congestion and high fees again. If you check this particular block 825734 you will notice a lots of dust amounts and mostly in batch payments. The transaction fee paid by this transactions if you care to check are always more than even what will get them in the next block and as they compete like this to get the next block they pay higher fees whereby increasing the overall fee rate.

This as a connection with the price increase which you saw because according to https://ordiscan.com/ it seems there is a heavy buy of this BRC20 tokens and as we know the demand actually increases the price of the tokens. I guess that this ordinal people are looking towards gaining profit from the upcoming bull run too and they are actually moving this tokens to probably there wallets and that’s why we are seeing lots of them in the mined blocks already

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I don't think these tokens ORDI and SATS making transaction fees rise if you check the chart it is just a roller coaster of ups and downs but yesterday and a day ago as you can see it also pumped but the transaction fees are low around 36sat/vbyte.

There might be other reasons why transaction fees increase I think most nodes right now change their minimum relay fee to higher to help miners earn more incentives?

bettercrypto

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Quote from: adaseb on January 13, 2024, 11:20:08 PM

So I wanted to do a transaction today and I look and again I need to pay something crazy like 200 sat/vbyte. Its also on the weekend. I look and of course there is some mempool spam going on.

Head over to Coinmarketcap and the only two coins that are pumping are ORDI and SATS. I noticed that whenever there is a mempool spam these are pumping and I am wondering how its related? What does transaction fees have to do with these coins going up slightly in value? I tried reading how Ordinals work but I am very confused since its nothing like regular mining or ERC20 tokens.

So what do you mean, when its Bitcoin transaction fee becomes normal again in the network, it is he who is having dumping in the price valye of Ordi and Sats? good and you noticed it op.

I think this is a big deal for crypto business traders. Now, regarding your question, I also have no idea if the increase in ORDI and SATS is related to the increase in fees in the bitcoin network. But it's possible that there is and it's also possible that it's just that simple.

adaseb

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So I wanted to do a transaction today and I look and again I need to pay something crazy like 200 sat/vbyte. Its also on the weekend. I look and of course there is some mempool spam going on.

Head over to Coinmarketcap and the only two coins that are pumping are ORDI and SATS. I noticed that whenever there is a mempool spam these are pumping and I am wondering how its related? What does transaction fees have to do with these coins going up slightly in value? I tried reading how Ordinals work but I am very confused since its nothing like regular mining or ERC20 tokens.

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