Topic: Which bitcoin addresses are the bitcoin located in the nano ledger s? (Read 193 times)

If he only has two different BTC amounts judging by a different topic of his, it should be easy for him to recognize which one is his long-term storage and which one he uses for daily spending on the balance of the two accounts alone. If we are talking about bigger numbers, it gets more complicated. I am not sure exactly which user data can be copied from the old computer and pasted into the installation folder of the new one. It's certainly something the support can answer.

That's a long story, so I'll just answer out of the box: why don't you make a backup of your Ledger and Electrum data before you reinstall Windows again? Keep your data and your transaction descriptions.
Even better if you get a system that didn't need to be reinstalled so often.

If you buy a new computer, you are going to have to install Ledger Live on it again and re-add all the individual accounts. The accounts won't have the names you used on the old system because that is stored locally on your hard drive, not on some cloud or server. When you install the BTC app, for example, and start scanning for existing accounts, Ledger Live will find whatever has been previously funded and call them Bitcoin, 1, Bitcoin 2, 3, 4, etc. There will also be ticker to distinguish between nested segwit and native segwit accounts. After that, it's up to you to rename them to whatever you want.

If you have 1 nested and 1 native segwit account, both will be called Bitcoin 1, the only difference will be the description and the ticker. The balances in all accounts will be the same as you had on your previous computer, just the names aren't correct.

Not quite sure what you are asking. If your Nano S is still fully functional, then you don't have to recover anything from seed. The seed has already been entered into the device. You have only changed your computer. If the Nano S gets replaced, then you have to recover everything from seed. No need to worry about derivation paths. When Ledger Live scans and checks funded addresses, it does that on the standard paths. Those are the same paths you derived those addresses from on your old computer.

So if you have just one btc main account on ledger live... and now you want to create a second btc account called btc spending wallet... you create account and do that.  Then when you want to receive btc, you get the option of choosing either the btc main account or btc spending wallet correct?  So say you receive 0.05 btc to that btc spending wallet.  Say you do several send and receive from it and balance is now 0.5btc.


Say your btc main account has 5 btc.  So on ledger live, it show 5 BTC for btc main account and 0.5 btc for btc spending wallet.  Then say next time you have to format your windows pc and reinstall ledger live.  When you do this on your clean reinstall windows pc and connect your nano ledger s to the laptop, how would that total of 5 btc and 0.5 btc or 5.5 btc show up?   After you install the btc apps and other apps on nano ledger, then add accounts... once you add btc, are you going to see two different btc accounts, one with 5 btc and other is 0.5 btc?  it won't show total of 5.5 btc in one account right?  But what name would even show up when you restore it?  Because you still need to rename it correct?  Now is there a bigger difference here compared to someone having to enter their seed phrase into the nano ledger and have to reinstall ledger live etc?  Because what would you need to know about derivation path? 

Why would those questions matter?
It is not important to know how much people are using Ledger Live or Electrum. They are both good software, and have some similar purposes and functionalities.

if you need to use Electrum because you need more control over your transactions, that is fine. use it! It doesn't matter what other people do or do not. It is your money, your security, your privacy.

Do what is better for you and ignore what other people think or do.

Electrum and Ledger Live are both good software for their particular purposes. Choose whichever fits your needs.


It is the same. But some people prefer electrum interface. I prefer electrum.


There is nothing wrong in creating a new Account number. You just need to know what that means when recovering your wallet.

An account is not a label. It is a whole new set of derivation path for your private keys generation.

If you create a new account and funded the addresses there, you need to look for that account when recovering your wallet, otherwise you won't see the funds.

Meant for people who have nano ledger, besides ledger live and electrum, what other programs could they use the nano ledger with?


Well i wanted to know if most people are fine just using ledger live with nano ledger.  Because i has stopped using electrum a while back.  But coin control on ledger live is the exact same thing like on electrum... correct?  But why do people prefer using electrum with nano ledger compared to ledger live if you could do coin control on ledger live.


Also someone else posted that they would not recommend you create multiple accounts for a coin on ledger live.  Example like how some people have a btc main account... and a btc spending account.  That person mentioned they heard of examples when someone had to do recovery, there were some issues with this.  Have you heard of this?  Also when you use electrum, you aren't creating multiple accounts such as like ledger live where you would have one address labeled... say subscription to site right?  Could you do that on electrum such as give all your btc addresses on electrum a name?  Or you need to know which address is which?  Such that you could have lot of addresses... but one could be holding... another payment to x, another payment to y etc.

I will answer you that question as soon as you can tell me what percentage of people are wearing shorts RIGHT NOW in their own homes compared to those wearing pants. I am going to need precise stats and data for all EU countries + Brazil. 

There are tutorials on how to do it on this forum and outside sources. Anyone who can read and follow instructions can do it. 

I am not sure what you are asking. If the question is if you can connect 3rd-party hardware wallets (like Trezor) to Ledger Live, then the answer is no, you can't. Ledger Live is for Ledger hardware wallet only. But some other hardware wallets can be connected to Electrum.

Well i wanted to use numbers to ask if that is what is seen etc.


But what percentage of people are using nano ledger s with electrum as oppose to ledger live?  Got to be a very small percentage?  Can't imagine many non tech people using electrum since verifying electrum isn't that easy for most people.



You could only use ledger live or electrum with nano ledger correct?

Sometimes the levels of stupidity and unnecessary information that you are able to generate in a short amount of time just amazes me. Less than a week ago we talked about a similar case where you asked the same things in one of your other threads. Weren't you told to connect your Nano S to Electrum and check which addresses hold coins and are funded by clicking on the Addresses tab? That together with the total balance at the bottom of the software is everything you need.

The addresses that are funded are the addresses that are funded. It's that simple. Ledger Live might have a different interface but the funded addresses can't be different from the ones you see on Electrum. Electrum is easier to use when you spend Bitcoin anyways.

If you can refrain from posting blather and make your posts coherent the way normal people do, that would really help.

So to check how much btc is in what btc addresses on nano ledger s, you first need to open ledger live and then connect your nano ledger s to the pc.  Then once you do that, clicked on that advanced option and coin control.  So you would see all the btc addresses and the btc balance in each?  Then when you add it up, it will equal the btc main account balance etc?


So example of picture posted, that person btc is in two different btc addresses and that is the balance of each one?  



If you receive 0.06 BTC, that is your UTXO.

When you are going to send 0.05 BTC from your wallet to another site, you will send 0.06.
0.05 will go to your "another site" destination address, and 0.01 will come back to your wallet in a new address. This way nobody will know which address is yours, if any of them is.

This is how wallet software work by standard. You can change those settings, but you will lose privacy.




is what you posted above automatic with ledger live?  So that has nothing to do with coin control right?


So let say someone has 5.1 BTC in their nano ledger.  After they moved total of 5 BTC from electrum to nano ledger and doing many multiple 0.5 BTC transfers.  They then done many transactions of receiving and sending btc to sites where it could be 0.05 btc or 0.005 btc etc.  But throughout the entire time, the nano ledger ledger live not once has went below 5 BTC balance.  So say after all these transactions, BTC balance is 5.1 BTC.


So now when they receive 0.05 btc from a site, that site has no clue the nano ledger balance because you use a new receive address each time you request btc and nano ledger generate new btc address.  But say now you send 0.03 BTC to another site, what will that site know?  Do they know about the 0.05 btc you received prior to you just sending 0.03 btc to them?  What about say 5.1 BTC the nano ledger prior to those transactions?


So what if later on you withdraw say 0.05 btc and 0.10 btc several times from people but not sites.... and now your balance is 5.55 BTC balance.  But the people who sent you 0.05 and 0.10 BTC has no clue what your balance is correct because they see only one address?  But the moment you now send say 0.1 BTC or as big as 0.5 BTC to someone else or gambling site or coinbase, would those people who sent you 0.05 BTC and
0.10 BTC now can see you sent 0.5 BTC to someone else?


This still seems very confusing.  So what if say you want to receive say 0.5 btc from someone.  You give them btc address generated by nano ledger when you click on receive and cilck on your only bitcoin account segwit.  The next time someone else send you say 0.5 btc, you do the same thing.  But now let say you want to send 0.2 btc to several people later on.  How do you do so where you get the most privacy?  Because when you send 0.2 btc to them, you want it to show... hey i only have 0.2 btc in that address im sending you from... as oppose to say 2 BTC right?  So coin control is the most important here?  Because if you don't use coin control to send 0.2 btc to few people, it would link to your other btc in the other addresses which would contain more than the 0.2 btc you are sending them?  


So creating and having multiple btc account names such as a long term hold account vs savings etc... is not as important as coin control?  So when you use coin control... advanced... let say you have 5.1 BTC, would then show something like this?  Just making this and numbers up.


3bfjalksdfjasdjfadskjfasfsldlfksd    0.5 btc

3nafsduywafhasjkfhdasjfasdjfsad  0.65 btc

3kfasdjdasfkasdfkasfdkakdfsksf    0.55 btc

3asfnsauwewfajsfadhjfkdshkjfajk   0.25 btc

3wqfsdfadsfajsdfaklfasdlkfjdasjfks  2 btc

3rjtejwfksjkldsfjsdjkafkjladsfjlkadf  0.30 btc

3afdsjoasjflksafjladsljkfdalfjaklsljkd  0.05 btc

3wejkflsjadfjkaskjfkjadskfladsjklfasl  0.90 btc



This would add up to 5.1 BTC.


So when you receive say 0.05 btc from gambling site, now you have an additional 0.05 BTC and another btc address.  But when you now want to send say 0.03 BTC to another gambling site normally on ledger live, then all the btc in all those addresses above and the last one you receive would ALL MOVE?  Or some of them?  


So after you receive 0.05 btc from gambling site, let say btc address is


3vfsdkafjkajfasdjfasfadsfksfkasfdsfa    0.05 btc



But if you use coin control... you would then pick which of those 8 Dfferent BTC Addresses...where you want the 0.03 BTC deducted from?  So if its from the last btc address where you just received the 0.05 btc, then balance will be deducted from there and now balance is 0.02 btc?  So the 0.02 btc in that 0.02 btc address moves to another btc address right?  So that ste who sent you 0.05 btc can no longer see your new history or can they still do so?  But what about the other 7 BTC Addresses and their balances above?  Do those move addresses after these transactions?

Electrum and Ledger Live are just interfaces. You can use any of them or even both at the same time.

You don't send BTC from electrum to ledger live, you send between wallets. Electrum/Ledger Live are the interfaces to see your wallet.

Ledger Live interface does not allow you to see the balance of each address.

But there is an alternative way to see it. Click in the send, as you would send btc to someone.
THen just click advanced options > coin control
You will see each UTXO, and then each address with balance (some addresses may contain multiple UTXO)




The addreses will be here:


source: https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360015996580-Using-Coin-control?docs=true


Yes. This is for your privacy.

You cannot "split" a UTXO.

If you receive 0.06 BTC, that is your UTXO.

When you are going to send 0.05 BTC from your wallet to another site, you will send 0.06.
0.05 will go to your "another site" destination address, and 0.01 will come back to your wallet in a new address. This way nobody will know which address is yours, if any of them is.

This is how wallet software work by standard. You can change those settings, but you will lose privacy.

Okay so last few responses are about electrum and where you can find all the btc addresses and balance of each btc address on electrum.  Yes i understand that... as back then when i used electrum, thats when i saw btc in many different btc addresses.


But how do you find out which btc addresses contain btc on the nano ledger s then?  Electrum its right there like in your picture, what about nano ledger s? 


Explained it it detail in bold what i saw when i click on my old transactions on the nano ledger s in latest operations.  So say you go to all your old transactions of when you sent btc from electrum to nano ledger... you check each transaction in the blockchain.  But its normal for all those btc receive addresses you used to receive btc on nano ledger from electrum... that you see the btc amount received and sent so total balance available is now 0? 


And that balance to that btc receiving address is then changed into another btc address because of another btc transaction you did that has nothing to do with it?  Example say 1 BTC on the initial btc receiving address sent from electrum to nano ledger s could now be 0.95 BTC because of a 0.05 BTC sent transaction you did much later?  And that 0.95 BTC would be transferred to another btc address after that 0.05 btc sent transaction so no btc would be in the original btc receiving address of when you sent one BTC from electrum to nano ledger s a while back? 


So that would apply to all the other btc receiving addresses if you sent btc from electrum to nano ledger in increments many times years ago?  Thus imagine someone sent say 0.5 btc ten different times from electrum to nano ledger s years ago.  But all those ten different btc receiving addresses where the btc was received years ago... would all or most likely moved correct because whenever you do later transactions that has nothing to do with that, say you receive 0.06 btc from a site to your nano ledger... then send 0.05 btc to another site, this essentially would cause your old btc to move to different btc addresses... is that correct?

I think you are overcomplicating things with a big wall of text with little useful information.

Ledger Live/Electrum force you to create a new Account/Wallet when you want to change the address format.

For example, if you want to work with Native Segwit (addresses starting with bc1...), you need to create a Native Segwit account with  Ledger Live (or wallet if using Electrum).

If you never created a Native segwit account or wallet, you don't have any balance in those addresses



Follow this guide:

Click in the address tab. You will see all your wallet addresses and their balance:


image source: https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/97251/electrum-wallet-address-not-showing

There are two distinct ways electrum handles change addresses and these are set in your preferences. One of these optimises privacy and the other optimises fees.

Fee optimisation:
All of your wallets unspent outputs (coins that haven't been spent) are used to fund a transaction and are consolidated into one change address - consistently.

Provacy optimisation:
Change addresses are still handled sequentially but inputs are organised by their size and an input is selected to cover the transaction size (if possible or the smallest number of inputs that can do it are used). The change is still sent to a change address but a lot more addresses in these types of wallets can have funds in them.

(I haven't tried to explain anything with your examples or my own as I expect those would make things more confusing).

That issue was a while back.  Don't know why but a clear cache restored old transactions on the latest operations.  That is a question of mine so wanted to know how that is possible.  

My issue now is this.  The last time i had to wipe my windows pc, i had to reinstall lot of programs.  Had reinstalled ledger live as i mentioned this.  Now when i did this, it doesn't matter what you call your btc or bch account right?  Example back then before i wiped my windows pc, might have called it bitcoin one segwit.  And called it bitcoin cash.  Then there is that bitcoin native segwit account that never has a balance in it.  Doesn't matter if you name these accounts different when you add accounts again on ledger live right?

Now after i restored ledger live and installed the btc and bch apps on my nano ledger and added accounts, you see the amount and balance of btc and bch and all the old latest operation transactions.  So after that, i did a few transactions of me sending btc and receiving btc but these were not big amounts.  But after each transaction, would show up in my latest operations history and any amount added or deducted would be correct.

So at the moment when you click on accounts tab on ledger live, you see like this

bitcoin segwit
bitcoin main account           green check mark       BTC Amount        BTC Balance

bitcoin cash main account    green check mark      BCH Amount       BCH Balance

bitcoin native segwit
bitcoin one account              green check mark      0 BTC

So the amount and balance of BTC bitcoin segwit bitcoin main account and bitcoin cash main account is correct in both portfolio and in accounts tab.  Was told a while back the native segwit bitcoin account should have 0 BTC since i never used native segwit correct?

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However, how do i check what btc addresses are the BTC located?  Because when i went to the oldest transactions, the ones where i send btc from electrum to nano ledger s, you see two transact i ons w i th the TO addresses when entered on blockchain explorer?  When you click on each transaction on ledger live, you are suppose to look at the TO Address correct?  There is a FROM and TO.  So i went to blockchain.com explorer and then copy and pasted the TO addresses of those transactions i sent from electrum to nano ledger s.  However, how come all the old transactions show on blockchain there are two transactions.   The total amount of btc send and received is the same X amount.  But it shows the total balance of 0?  Thats because those btc got sent to a change address correct?  When i look at one of my oldest transactions of sending electrum to nano ledger and copy and paste that TO Address on blockchain.com, it shows two transactions.

When i look at one of my oldest transactions of sending electrum to nano ledger and copy and paste that TO Address on blockchain.com explorer, it shows two transactions when you check that on blockchain explorer?

First transaction shows a recent btc transaction when i sent a tiny amount of btc to a site that has nothing to do with when i sent electrum to nano ledger s years ago?  Change address?

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My posts below is going to be in detail and from blockchain explorer.

s

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Am going to use 1 BTC to make the math more simple and easier to look at.

2022 Transaction


Does show -1 BTC in red on the right side.  What's that?


The transaction i did on this date was me just sending tiny amount of btc to a site.  Had nothing to do with when i sent btc from electrum to nano ledger s years ago.

Fee 0.0000xxxxxx btc
(x sat/byte - x sa/wu - x bytes)
(x sate/vbyte - x virtual bytes)

hash   xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Address starting with number 3               1 BTC              Address starting with number 1                      0.05  BTC
                                                                                  Another Address starting with number 3           0.95  BTC

What i notice is it seem to break the transaction on the left into two addresses on the right?  Can someone explain this?  When you subtract the total amount of btc i sent from electrum to nano ledger at that moment... thats the Address starting with number 3 of 1 BTC, you would get the balance to be the Another Address starting with number 3 after subtracting it from the Address starting with number 1?  So that means that BTC address contains 0.95 BTC?  Don't want to type like 0.0005 BTC on the left side and then like 0.0003 BTC and 0.0002 BTC on the right side so i use 1 BTC to make it simple.

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Right below it on the same blockchain explorer page, it shows one of the old transaction of when i sent btc from electrum to nano ledger years ago.

2019 Transaction

Also seems to show +1 BTC in green as oppose to the -1 BTC in transaction above?  So it cancels the other one out right that is why that receive address TO has no total balance?


Fee 0.0000xxxxxx btc
(x sat/byte - x sa/wu - x bytes)
(x sate/vbyte - x virtual bytes)

hash   xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Address starting with number 1          1.15 BTC               Another Address starting with number 1         0.15 BTC
                                                                                   Address starting with number 3                     1 BTC
Again seem to break the transaction on the left to the right?  Thus change address?

When i copy and paste that Address starting with number 3 into blockchain explorer, it does show one transaction, BTC amount received is 1 BTC.  None sent.  Total balance is 1 BTC.  

So that btc address of mine contain 1 BTC correct?  Again, im using 1 BTC to make it simple and not type so many 0.xxx btc.  

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So basically any btc receive address you ever used on nano ledger s, most likely the total balance of many of these receive addresses in the TO will be 0 because when you do future btc transactions, there will be change addresses which has the BTC sent to change addresses?

But how does it even touch those btc from the very old transactions?  Example say you made say 10 total btc transfers from electrum to your nano ledger s years ago to move all the btc to nano ledger. Let say all the transactions were 0.xxx btc amounts and to make the math simple, after you sent all the btc from electrum to nano ledger, you have a total of 5 BTC in nano ledger s.  Say you had total of 5.xxxxxxx BTC on electrum but after sending fees, balance on nano ledger s is 5 BTC.  

Then any future transactions you did on your nano ledger s, your nano ledger s balance was never below 5 BTC.  Example after you sent the entire balance from electrum to nano ledger in increments, you then receive tiny amounts of btc from sites and then you sent those tiny amounts of btc to other sites.  Say you receive 0.05 btc and then send 0.03 btc to another site.  Thus nano ledger s balance went from 5 BTC to 5.05 BTC to 5.02 BTC.  You do many of these transactions but your nano ledger s balance never touched below 5 BTC.  So those BTC you transferred earlier always moves as long as you done some transactions after it even tough you never touch any of that original 5 BTC balance?  Could imagine change addresses if you start going below your 5 BTC balance.  So say in the example the person has total of 5.1 BTC balance on nano ledger s after all this.  That would mean that person has 0.95 BTC in one of those change addresses that start with number 3 and another 1 BTC in the other change address that start with a number 3?  

Then there would be 5 BTC - 0.95 BTC -  1 BTC = 3.05 BTC remaining total in many of the other change addresses?  So you need to manually add them up yourself?  Recall electrum was much simpler as you go to address tab and change addresses and you could literally see all your addresses just like that and add them all up?  So with nano ledger s, it takes lot more work going through each btc address and change address?

That is correct?  Again i want to make the math simple so wanted to use 1 BTC and 5 BTC as the math wlll be more simple and easier to look at.

So what you're asking is why ledger live showed the correct balance but didn't show the missing transactions? This is probably due to it loading up both separately from their servers and sending the values to you, or it could be due to your client not loading the transactions you say were missing but I don't think we'll be able to find out for definite as it's just a cache bug.

So back then i used electrum to send and receive btc.  Recall whenever i would receive btc, always used the same receiving address and did that a lot.  Then after a bit, was told you should choose different receiving address so i then started to do that.  After a while, i then bought a nano ledger s.  When i set up the nano ledger s, i sent tiny amount of btc from electrum to nano ledger s and when i did that, i saw the tiny amount shown on ledger live.  This was years ago.  Then i would send the btc multiple times from electrum to the nano ledger s and each time i did that, you see a new transaction so i did many transactions back then when transferring the btc from electrum to nano ledger s.  Also each time i sent btc from electrum to nano ledger s, you would see the balance get added for each transaction etc.  So after those transactions, i have done several transactions of receiving and sending btc to gambling sites for example with the nano ledger s.  Almost all the btc that i had first sent from electrum to nano ledger s years ago, those stay there and after some btc transactions the last few years, the balance is a bit higher than when i first sent the btc from electrum to nano ledger s in many increments.  


But a while later, nano ledger stopped working and had to get a replacement.  Then after restoring the seed phrase with the help of some people here, and then removing and re-adding the accounts in ledger live, the btc balance showed up.  Then a while later, recall downloading electron cash on a pc and claiming the bch and it showed there.  Then i added bch account on nano ledger s and then sent the bch to the nano ledger.  When i did this, you see the btc balance and bch balance and total balance etc.


Then last time i had to wipe my computer.  Was told if i do that, just install ledger live again and once you connect your nano ledger s to your laptop, it would recognize it.  Then i installed the btc and bch apps and once i did that, saw my balance there.


So at the moment, when you click on portfolio tab, you see the total portfolio balance.  You also see btc and bch and the amount and balance of each.  Then you see the latest operations below where it goes back to all your transactions.  Now one weird thing happened a year or two ago... i forgot when but when i went to look at my latest operation history, some old transactions didn't show up.  Forgot if it was btc or bch but it didn't.   Has anyone here ever had this happen to them ever.  Recall someone telling me that is not possible.  But when i clicked on clear cache and then logged out and then logged back in, then i saw some missing transactions show up again.  That is a glitch?  However, don't recall once the amount or balance of btc or bch not correct in portfolio or accounts.


So everytime i ever received btc, i would have the nano ledger s connected and click on that btc account segwit and then it show the receiving address.  Then i copy and paste it to site that i want to withdraw and each time i do that, the btc would show receive in latest operations and it would be added to the balance.  Pretty certain i never reused a receiving address.  When i sent btc, and it goes through, would show the btc deducted from balance as well.