Why BTC & ETH falling simultaneously? Are they not different blockchain?

olumyd

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Quote from: suvo05 on February 16, 2018, 01:10:51 PM

I think the bigger percentage of ETH are being trade with BTC, rather than USD so When BTC price drops then the ETH also drops. But when the ETH price fall I don't think it affects much on the BTC price.

If that's true it means BTC has so much more influence over ETH and will make ETH always seem second rated in the crypto market. IMO, BTC by now BTC shouldn't have more attention compared to ETH when more than 85% of new ICO projects came as a result of Ethereum Network platform. So, if economic principle should be applied here, more demand for Eth should have been in play and that should have increased the worth of ETH by more than 1000 fold in the past 1 year.

suvo05

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I think the bigger percentage of ETH are being trade with BTC, rather than USD so When BTC price drops then the ETH also drops. But when the ETH price fall I don't think it affects much on the BTC price.

olumyd

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Quote from: BTCLovingDude on February 15, 2018, 03:14:59 AM

Quote from: jerry0 on February 15, 2018, 02:51:39 AM

Do people agree that holding altcoins are worthless than since everything depends on btc?

holding altcoins is not such a good idea. trading them is a much better one.

Quote

However, that altcoin could multiply a lot more than btc especially if that coin has a very low market cap right?

"can" does not mean "will" but yes they can get pumped so their rises can be a lot bigger.

Quote

Also is it pretty much 100 percent that its impossible for the altcoins to increase in price if btc drops in price?

there is nothing called 100% and we have nearly 2000 altcoins there will be exceptions as there have been. if an altcoin is getting pumped there aren't much that can stop that.

Quote

So if bitcoin hits a huge number, would that mean all these altcoins at the moment would at least multiply at least the amount btc multiplies in value?

no

This split reasoning can help people who don't know much about cryptocurrency trading to be more careful about how they handle their portfolio and interpret market data

Slash61

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This seems to attract a lot of investor attention, if bitcoin and ethereum fall together it is not strange to me because these two coins are equally nested behind blockchain. In the world of highly influential crypto coins is bitcoin if at any time the price of bitcoin down then other coins will also go down, actually can be spelled out that bitcoin is the mastermind of all the coins. The bad effect is if bitcoin is interrupted by government or central bank then other coins will also be just as disturbed.

BTCLovingDude

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BTC to the moon is inevitable...

Quote from: jerry0 on February 15, 2018, 02:51:39 AM

Do people agree that holding altcoins are worthless than since everything depends on btc?

holding altcoins is not such a good idea. trading them is a much better one.

Quote

However, that altcoin could multiply a lot more than btc especially if that coin has a very low market cap right?

"can" does not mean "will" but yes they can get pumped so their rises can be a lot bigger.

Quote

Also is it pretty much 100 percent that its impossible for the altcoins to increase in price if btc drops in price?

there is nothing called 100% and we have nearly 2000 altcoins there will be exceptions as there have been. if an altcoin is getting pumped there aren't much that can stop that.

Quote

So if bitcoin hits a huge number, would that mean all these altcoins at the moment would at least multiply at least the amount btc multiplies in value?

no

jerry0

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Do people agree that holding altcoins are worthless than since everything depends on btc? However, that altcoin could multiply a lot more than btc especially if that coin has a very low market cap right?

Also is it pretty much 100 percent that its impossible for the altcoins to increase in price if btc drops in price?

So if bitcoin hits a huge number, would that mean all these altcoins at the moment would at least multiply at least the amount btc multiplies in value?

f150

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their blockchain is the same, BTC & ETH will fall or not and always at the same time. If BTC down or up ETH will follow it, because BTC is the parent of all altcoin types. so ETH will always follow its parent BTC

olumyd

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Quote from: PalindromemordnilaP on February 15, 2018, 12:15:18 AM

I think, ETH and the rest of alternate coin have a pairing with bitcoin. That is, if bitcoin goes up or down, alternate coins' market value are also affected. Just take a look on how bloody crypto markets are when bitcoin's value plummets down.

But it ought not to be so. It still means that we are yet to grasp the very potential of blockchain products and comprehend how much value each has independently as an entity. I mean, if all these coins came out to address one issue or the other that was a major concern in the previous versions or generations, shouldn't they be doing better off when the so-called earlier versions are plummetting? IMO, each ALT should stand for itself. In fact, if BTC goes down, those ALTs paired with it should go up - an opportunity. But if everything turns red because BTC is in the RED ZONE, we truly know who's got the power of crypto market.

PalindromemordnilaP

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I think, ETH and the rest of alternate coin have a pairing with bitcoin. That is, if bitcoin goes up or down, alternate coins' market value are also affected. Just take a look on how bloody crypto markets are when bitcoin's value plummets down.

dothebeats

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Cashback 15%

Different blockchain, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the people involved in BTC couldn't buy ETH for their own investment portfolios, knowing that ETH is also one of the top performing altcoins available for purchase. Also, BTC and ETH price movements aren't completely identical at all times; it just so happened that everyone who are invested in BTC and ETH, together with all the coins on the top 100 altcoins list, decided to sell all of their holdings for profit bookings. Even the Dow is in a downfall right now, so I'm not surprised if crypto would go down as well. It is of the market's interest which coin would go up or down irrespective of any technical advancements a coin has.

olumyd

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Quote from: visiblehand on February 14, 2018, 08:20:13 AM

In the short term, their prices are being driven by the same factors (as are alt coins to a large extent). Long-term, there will be winners and losers. Much like the stock market.

It's really beginning to sound more like a game, where people lose and others win. But an sure once regulation steps in it will be more controlled. The damages won't be much.

visiblehand

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In the short term, their prices are being driven by the same factors (as are alt coins to a large extent). Long-term, there will be winners and losers. Much like the stock market.

Lovecove

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Such an over-sweeping statement is invalid on so many levels. Eth actually rose for a time, in the early days of this current bitcoin crash. It's because Eth had some developmental news coming out and hallmark changes being made.

Eth does not really follow BTC's price pumps and dumps. I wouldn't say they're polar opposites, though. Sometimes they do fall and rise together, but most times no.

You can't look at ETH as though it's falling with BTC. That's a very microscopic view of the cryptomarket in general.

All the alts are falling with BTC, and ETH is just one of many alts that are falling. It's crypto in general. It's the stock market in general. Everyone's bleeding both in crypto and in stocks. Now it's recovering though.

olumyd

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Quote from: STT on February 13, 2018, 12:32:36 PM

Quote from: olumyd on February 05, 2018, 06:08:50 PM

It bothers me that BTC affects all market especially when it isn't tied to the same blockchain. So what's the point buying other altcoins if I just want to simply store as digital asset value class.

Does this means that the crypto market is directly proportional to BTC welfare?

Bitcoin reacts to sentiment in similars ways that ETH does. Some argue ETH has more practical usage in various tokens but they both suffer from excess speculation over actual utility. The pullback is not as negative as you imagine, its a way for the market to match buyers and sellers equally so that regular use can occur.

The main point to any crypto use is not the price at all. Its the utility of and usefulness to the population of each blockchain.

Im quite bullish so long as transaction fees can be low and volume of use is rising, the price is probably secondary to these both:

https://i.imgur.com/ETMHdGY.png

That's some really interesting insight you've got there - 'speculation over actual utility' - I think that's what really drives people to join cryptocurrency. It's like a casino shop, where people just expect to hit it big by rolling dices. While there may be some math and probability functions to it, it all bores down to how the dice rolls.

Blockchain products are essentially being abused at the moment. So many shit coins and everything is onto the blockchain including the kitchen sink.

Quote from: STT on February 13, 2018, 12:32:36 PM

Quote from: olumyd on February 05, 2018, 06:08:50 PM

It bothers me that BTC affects all market especially when it isn't tied to the same blockchain. So what's the point buying other altcoins if I just want to simply store as digital asset value class.

Does this means that the crypto market is directly proportional to BTC welfare?

Im quite bullish so long as transaction fees can be low and volume of use is rising, the price is probably secondary to these both:

https://i.imgur.com/ETMHdGY.png

Hahahaha... You and everyone else who isn't wearing a government tag from China & USA.

STT

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Quote from: olumyd on February 05, 2018, 06:08:50 PM

It bothers me that BTC affects all market especially when it isn't tied to the same blockchain. So what's the point buying other altcoins if I just want to simply store as digital asset value class.

Does this means that the crypto market is directly proportional to BTC welfare?

Bitcoin reacts to sentiment in similars ways that ETH does. Some argue ETH has more practical usage in various tokens but they both suffer from excess speculation over actual utility. The pullback is not as negative as you imagine, its a way for the market to match buyers and sellers equally so that regular use can occur.

The main point to any crypto use is not the price at all. Its the utility of and usefulness to the population of each blockchain.

Im quite bullish so long as transaction fees can be low and volume of use is rising, the price is probably secondary to these both:

https://i.imgur.com/ETMHdGY.png

olumyd

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Quote from: Lowryy on February 07, 2018, 11:49:30 AM

They are different blockchain.

However I'd say that one of the probable reasons behind this price decrease was people fearing regulators. I think some people fear that governmets could successfully kill bitcoin or make it obselete by shutting down exchanges or making bitcoin illegal etc. Ethereum sellers probably fear government coming hard on ICO's, which are a vital part of its ecosystem. That probably caused prices to start falling which made some panic sellers sell their entire portfolio.

I thought it was said the price decrease was because of the Chinese new year celebration and that people need money to celebrate during the festive period. Well if they make bitcoin illegal, people will simply return to the shadows and trade with it, besides, I don't think that that will happen anytime soon, not that it is not possible but so much is at stake. If the entire economy of bitcoin should crumble, there would be a wide scale of a recession on our hands.

Lowryy

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They are different blockchain.

However I'd say that one of the probable reasons behind this price decrease was people fearing regulators. I think some people fear that governmets could successfully kill bitcoin or make it obselete by shutting down exchanges or making bitcoin illegal etc. Ethereum sellers probably fear government coming hard on ICO's, which are a vital part of its ecosystem. That probably caused prices to start falling which made some panic sellers sell their entire portfolio.

alyssa85

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Quote from: olumyd on February 05, 2018, 06:08:50 PM

It bothers me that BTC affects all market especially when it isn't tied to the same blockchain. So what's the point buying other altcoins if I just want to simply store as digital asset value class.

Does this means that the crypto market is directly proportional to BTC welfare?

It's to do with trading bots - they are programmed to trade based on keywords in the press.

If there is ETH only news and it has some good keywords, only ETH will rise.

However if there is crypto news that affects the whole space, the whole space will fall. Lots of people sold off al cryptocs prior to the US Senate hearing on bitcoin, because they convinced themselves that if China has banned bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies, the Americans were sure to follow.

Turns out the Americans think differently - and now we have a relief rally where all cryptos are up.

trickyriky

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Quote from: European Central Bank on February 05, 2018, 06:16:18 PM

It's the same buyers. All people want is something to sell for more than they paid for it. It don't matter what the details are.

And ethereum's doing much better than bitcoin in dollar terms right now which ain't saying too much.

Correct, both cryptos as well as the other virtual currencies depend on demand a lot. Bad news can let them falling down.

olumyd

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The moment BTC turned green other coins followed suit. It's really a bitcoin's game. And the funny part is ETH is currently approximately and steadily 1/10 of BTC prices and the price values have been chasing themselves for the past few days. When BTC dropped to 9... Eth dropped to 9.. And when it got to 8.. BTC was also at 8...regardless of the figures I could say that BTC is really pulling ethereum along.

Barbarian

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Quote from: olumyd on February 05, 2018, 06:08:50 PM

It bothers me that BTC affects all market especially when it isn't tied to the same blockchain. So what's the point buying other altcoins if I just want to simply store as digital asset value class.

Does this means that the crypto market is directly proportional to BTC welfare?

Deal with it, bitcoin is the top cryptocurrency and in order to get most alts you either need bitcoin or ethereum so if bitcoin goes down significantly then you can expect the same to happen to the whole market this is why many people do no even bother to hold any other coin other than bitcoin.

Pursuer

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Where is my ring of blades...

Quote from: European Central Bank on February 05, 2018, 08:14:51 PM

Quote from: olumyd on February 05, 2018, 06:21:00 PM

How do you mean doing better in dollar terms, are you saying there are more losses in BTC than ETH? But they are still losing equivalent, comparatively huge value percentages.

yes. ethereum has lost less percentage in dollar terms than bitcoin. that's mainly because it has a lot of its own dollar markets these days. most alts are directly tied to bitcoin still.

a drop from $1430 down to $560 is a 61% drop.
considering ETH is heavily manipulated, has been advertised to death in the past week as a better investment than bitcoin (LOL), also has a smaller price I'd say it performed horribly in terms of fiat.

bitcoin has been under constant attack for the same period and it went from $19,600 down to $6000 which is a 68% drop! despite that 7% I still say ETH did horrible.

Torque

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Quote from: TERA2 on February 06, 2018, 09:17:30 AM

Therefore the price of alts is tethered to the price of bitcoin.

Which all the crypto kiddies and shitcoin traders fail to understand.

Because of this, there will never be a 'flippening'. Bitcoin is king.

TERA2

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Its the way exchanges have been set up since 2012. The majority of altcoins volume is done on ALT/BTC pairs and not ALT/USD pairs. Therefore the price of alts is tethered to the price of bitcoin. In addition, crypto coin is one asset class and all coins are affected by some of the same market forces, such as tether scam and whatever clusterfuck is going on in the stock market today.

Beerwizzard

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Altcoinsare losing in price because not every alt is traded to USD (and not on every exchange). So during the obvious bear market while people are trying to hide from the storm in fiat they are selling their alts to buy BTC and then selling it for USD. Pretty similar thing happens with tokens and ETH but Bitcoin is mostly a key indicator of the whole crypto market.

Quote from: European Central Bank on February 05, 2018, 08:14:51 PM

Quote from: olumyd on February 05, 2018, 06:21:00 PM

How do you mean doing better in dollar terms, are you saying there are more losses in BTC than ETH? But they are still losing equivalent, comparatively huge value percentages.

yes. ethereum has lost less percentage in dollar terms than bitcoin. that's mainly because it has a lot of its own dollar markets these days. most alts are directly tied to bitcoin still.

Right now ETH lost about 7,55% vs bitcoin's 8,25%. I haven't cmplared them on monthly / weekly periods but tbh everything looked pretty mych the same. ETH felt much better only during the fall from 20 to 15k

olumyd

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Quote from: Nosk on February 05, 2018, 08:22:02 PM

Here I sit, watching bitcoin fall and all the other shitcoin I own just falling more.
Downtrend concerns bitcoin bitcoin but also every other alts, look at that : https://coin360.io/

Even stock markets are going down.

Someone has got to throw the bear back into its cage. This show definitely has to end. The comedy has certainly lost its satire; from $20k to $6k in less than 2 months... we've got to get some helium to pump.

Nosk

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Here I sit, watching bitcoin fall and all the other shitcoin I own just falling more.
Downtrend concerns bitcoin bitcoin but also every other alts, look at that : https://coin360.io/

Even stock markets are going down.

European Central Bank

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Quote from: olumyd on February 05, 2018, 06:21:00 PM

How do you mean doing better in dollar terms, are you saying there are more losses in BTC than ETH? But they are still losing equivalent, comparatively huge value percentages.

yes. ethereum has lost less percentage in dollar terms than bitcoin. that's mainly because it has a lot of its own dollar markets these days. most alts are directly tied to bitcoin still.

nokati

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Thats the funny thing about it..... al the altcoin "O I want to get rich" people always wanted to see bitcoin falling but they dont understand that if bitcoin fall, al coins will go under too.
I love eth, monero, siacoin as they have a reall use case and I wish them al the best, but imagine btc go to zero for some reason.... Do you really think that even eth or monero will still stay? let alone al other shittycoins Undecided

Cryptocurrency community need get there act together first and use it for what it was created for......

olumyd

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Quote from: European Central Bank on February 05, 2018, 06:16:18 PM

It's the same buyers. All people want is something to sell for more than they paid for it. It don't matter what the details are.

And ethereum's doing much better than bitcoin in dollar terms right now which ain't saying too much.

How do you mean doing better in dollar terms, are you saying there are more losses in BTC than ETH? But they are still losing equivalent, comparatively huge value percentages.

European Central Bank

legendary

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It's the same buyers. All people want is something to sell for more than they paid for it. It don't matter what the details are.

And ethereum's doing much better than bitcoin in dollar terms right now which ain't saying too much.

olumyd

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It bothers me that BTC affects all market especially when it isn't tied to the same blockchain. So what's the point buying other altcoins if I just want to simply store as digital asset value class.

Does this means that the crypto market is directly proportional to BTC welfare?

Topic: Why BTC & ETH falling simultaneously? Are they not different blockchain? (Read 341 times)