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Topic: Why I think Harold Thomas Finney II (Hal) Invented Bitcoin. Real Bitcointalk (Read 301 times)

legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
i feel that hal was just another cypherpunk that had similar interests as satoshi. as did a few cypher punks..
but satoshi personality in messages is different to hals.

yes hal is one of the few true early adopters and bitcoin devs. but i dont see him as satoshi
Pretty sure he made PoW in 2006  so he was vested well before 2008.

pretty sure panasonic made batteries. but elon made a tesla car
does not mean panasonic is elon or vice versa

again yes many cypherpunks had many similar interests in electronic cash before bitcoin..
much like many car part manufactures had interests in cars.. but thats different to the guy they pieced them all together into a final product

also it does not mean that all cypherpunks that had known real names or any of the real known people for that matter used the satoshi name

satoshi could have been interested in cypherpunks and read their mails and posts and discussions and their white papers. but didnt say anything until late 2008
hero member
Activity: 1438
Merit: 513
though hal didnt sign up to this forum until late 2010.. satpshi and hal were interacting in jan 2009. via other communication platforms

hal helped with a few things and found a few bugs that satoshi didnt in the first versions of bitcoin in jan 2009.

i feel that hal was just another cypherpunk that had similar interests as satoshi. as did a few cypher punks..
but satoshi personality in messages is different to hals.

yes hal is one of the few true early adopters and bitcoin devs. but i dont see him as satoshi

here is the real thing
hals health was deteriorating in 2008-9 where by hal was interested to help in 2008-9 but had health issues so unable to be full time support. which is why he backed off after january..
he got diagnosed in august 2009, ill call this feb 2009-2010 as his adjustment period to his new limited life. where he then found a new way to live with his disease and got interested again in crypto in 2010

this gap is also backed up by the coins he had left in his will for his family and their coin-age

(ALS limits many things where by between doctors appointments, therapy, just getting around, bad days with flareups.. your not exactly able to be active daily)


however satoshi. was very active throughout 2009-2010 which showed no sign of any limitation of ability or limitation to be active and respondant


Pretty sure he made PoW in 2006  so he was vested well before 2008.
Maybe he got diagnosed and decided it was time that he needed to finish his work before his condition worsened.
Your black and white will gap is 100% irrelevant as something could have been passed down in life rather than death. And the secretive nature behind it all human words and actions are two different things.
I'm not clutching at straws as you say, there sure is a lot of obvious correlation.
Dudes first job was writing up cash register software (78) he helped Zimmerman  invent PGP 2.0 as we know it. invent POW (06) and you think some anonymous dude came up and stitched it all together? Not the guy writing about it most his life?   

http://fennetic.net/irc/finney.org/~hal/home.html

I think his rewrite on chaums digital cash systems in 1991 and revision in 1993 pokes holes in your he was inactive theory. 
I will say as far as I know from like 79-84 he was working on games and nothing else really.
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
I don’t see how working on software to run cash registers in 1978 brings Hal any closer to being evidence of him being Satoshi. Cash registers are checkout terminals, and programmers were probably eager to work on those incipient software driven systems back then (at least for a while).

from my memory the first versions of bitcoin code included a merchant POS system code. as part of the p2ip code where merchants would receive a request for a bitcoin address over IP and the merchant sends back the bitcoin address with some labels/order text stuff and such
...
but then again hal in the 80's,90's,00's was doing other projects not to do with cash register.. so trying to tie 2009 software to another guys EX- job 40 years prior is not a connection.. its a attempt of clutching at straws trying to create linkage

EG
40 years ago i wore diapers.. so did babies born in 2009..... so i must be everyone born in 2009
legendary
Activity: 2338
Merit: 10802
There are lies, damned lies and statistics. MTwain
<…> The fact that "satoshi" sent Hal the first BTC TX should be a pretty big eye opener.
Something as big as fintech pioneering , don't we all test in our own ecosphere before launching? <…>
Bearing in mind all the trouble taken to keep himself anonymous, it seems like a stretch to go and send the first Bitcoin TX from his alias to his real name (through TXs), leaving a permanent spotlight on the link as the first bitcoin TX in history does.

<…>
I don’t see how working on software to run cash registers in 1978 brings Hal any closer to being evidence of him being Satoshi. Cash registers are checkout terminals, and programmers were probably eager to work on those incipient software driven systems back then (at least for a while).
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
though hal didnt sign up to this forum until late 2010.. satpshi and hal were interacting in jan 2009. via other communication platforms

hal helped with a few things and found a few bugs that satoshi didnt in the first versions of bitcoin in jan 2009.

i feel that hal was just another cypherpunk that had similar interests as satoshi. as did a few cypher punks..
but satoshi personality in messages is different to hals.

yes hal is one of the few true early adopters and bitcoin devs. but i dont see him as satoshi

here is the real thing
hals health was deteriorating in 2008-9 where by hal was interested to help in 2008-9 but had health issues so unable to be full time support. which is why he backed off after january..
he got diagnosed in august 2009, ill call this feb 2009-2010 as his adjustment period to his new limited life. where he then found a new way to live with his disease and got interested again in crypto in 2010

this gap is also backed up by the coins he had left in his will for his family and their coin-age

(ALS limits many things where by between doctors appointments, therapy, just getting around, bad days with flareups.. your not exactly able to be active daily)


however satoshi. was very active throughout 2009-2010 which showed no sign of any limitation of ability or limitation to be active and respondant

legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 5937
More evidence that Hal is likely Satoshi. Odds are Hal started thinking of concept around this time.
If you do think that Hal is behind Bitcoin and respect him for everything that he did (which I guess you do) why don't you respect his wish to stay anonymous? Just to add that if I can chose one person I wish is behind Bitcoin that would be Hal but I stopped thinking about that long time ago and instead start seeing it as a big Bitcoin advantage, to have its creator real identity unknown.

And this consensus that you aim to reach via this thread ain't gonna happen as there's simply not enough evidence to prove beyond reasonable doubt that a specific person is behind Bitcoin (no matter how much I would like if it was Hal).
hero member
Activity: 1438
Merit: 513
https://www.ataricompendium.com/archives/interviews/hal_finney/interview_hal_finney.html

"Q: You graduated from the California Institute of Technology with a BS in Engineering in 1979, correct?  What was your first job after school?

Hal Finney: I was supposed to graduate in 1978 but I was short a few units. So I got hired full time at APh the summer of 1978 and just took the remaining classes at Caltech during that first year at APh, graduating in 1979.  I continued working at APh until about 1986.

Q: When did you start at APh?  Do you recall who you interviewed with?

Hal Finney: I think I was hired by Glenn Hightower, who was co-owner and the main manager at that time.  I knew Dave Rolfe well, who was already working there, and he put in a good word for me.

Q: What was the first game you did?

Hal Finney: Actually I did not initially work on games at APh.  My first year or so I was working on cash register software
.  APh had a number of consulting contracts with companies other than Mattel, although over the next few years the video game business became the largest effort of the firm."


More evidence that Hal is likely Satoshi. Odds are Hal started thinking of concept around this time.
I don't know why but my gut keeps venturing off on the possibility of Chaum's involvement as well.
hero member
Activity: 1438
Merit: 513
First off note this is a speculative posting but I believe after a few years of researching this is conclusive(to me), although not definitive this is where the evidence points.
I invite Debating , New evidence , Correlative thoughts , Oppositions. Any input!
Lets really talk about this from an social intelligence hypothesis on who invented bitcoin. lets reach it as a consensus opinion via collaboration.
I may edit this post to reflect updates as findings come out or need to be corrected.

Satoshi is Hal.

Ask yourself these questions.
Who invented PoW?
Who invented PGP?
What is bitcoin?

"And of course the price gyrations of bitcoins are entertaining to me. I have skin in the game.
But I came by my bitcoins through luck, with little credit to me. I lived through the crash of 2011. So I've seen it before. Easy come, easy go."
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitcoin-and-me-hal-finney-155054 (Bitcoin and me (hal finney))

-My theory here is Hal was creating disassociation, he is after all the backbone that is BTC with pow and pgp.

Another example of disassociation is
Hal created profile    November 29, 2010
Satoshi last posted        December 13, 2010       A 2 week overlap?
Bye Satoshi, Hello Hal. Almost no interaction between the 2 even though they had worked together since before November 19th 2008 (sourceforge add)

This isn't by any means definitive evidence ,correlative circumstances maybe.
But when you start adding up correlative circumstances that are separate, things get interesting.

Dorian Satoshi Nakamoto lived 2 blocks away from Harold, another circumstance that cannot be ignored.
https://cointelegraph.com/news/who-is-satoshi-the-hal-finney-dorian-nakamoto-connection
I believe Hal scapegoated behind this man's identity assuming he's elderly,
nearing homelessness and would be none the wiser and even "if" he and Dorian would have plausible deniability. on a "weird circumstance"

Lets dig a little deeper into the past.
"Here we are faced with the problems of loss of privacy, creeping computerization, massive databases, more centralization -
 ...offers a completely different direction to go in, one which puts power into the hands of individuals rather than governments and corporations.
The computer can be used as a tool to liberate and protect people, rather than to control them."
                           - Hal Finney, Cypherpunks Mailing List, 1992

 In 1994 Hal signed up to get frozen like walt disney at Alcor, who does that unless you just "know" your onto something?
Maybe he knew he may need to fix a potential world issue economy in 150-200 years.
(in reference to Hal being the 128th patient)
https://www.alcor.org/2014/12/hal-finney-becomes-alcors-128th-patient/

(Max knew hal about 20 years before he passed,15 years before BTC was invented)
Max- "He was the very first debugger and contributor to Bitcoin’s code and was the recipient of the
first Bitcoin transaction in January 2009,
receiving 10 bitcoins from Bitcoin’s possibly pseudonymous creator Satoshi Nakamoto."

Sounds like even Max More thinks/knows "satoshi nakamoto" is bullshit. Interesting?
I think Dr.More may have More answers then we know.
https://web.archive.org/web/20150212081404/http://lists.extropy.org/pipermail/extropy-chat/2014-August/082585.html
This man coined Extropianism back in the early 90's & Hal was immediately on board.

Here's the elephant in the room
The fact that "satoshi" sent Hal the first BTC TX should be a pretty big eye opener.
Something as big as fintech pioneering , don't we all test in our own ecosphere before launching?

If Hal didn't invent bitcoin one of these people probably did or someone relevant to cml or eff.
Michael Tiemann
Eric Hughes
Timothy C. May

Hal may even be scapegoated, who really knows?.
I personally think bitcoin is Hals life work it all added up to this.
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