Topic: Why Satoshi was dumb (Read 587 times)

Come to think that he was never intending for his creation to become this big because all the thing he do need to do is to make something a payment system which doesnt have 3rd party.
He was never intending to become rich or something like that and we dont know on what future holds and for those premined coins then if he has the plans then he would accumulate on bigger
percentage in overall current supply and had able to sell off into those ATH times and make himself rich but we've seen nothing.

Op, I'm not sure what stuff you were on when you came to this realization, but it seems far from the truth. Maybe Satoshi didn't spend the coins because it's not time for it yet, or maybe it's because Satoshi died. Also, while it's true that it's more in line with the decentralized project to not have the overwhelming influence of one person (which would've been the case if Satoshi remained involved), it's not removing the last form of authority. And I don't think Satoshi intended to get as much money out of BTC as possible or that having no premining was a mistake.

There's difference between incentive and greed. Incentive is when you're motivated to do something for you or/and the common good and has a nearly positive meaning. For example, we say that you're incentivized to recycle if there's a law that charges those who don't. On the other hand, greed is by definition, negative. You use it to describe bad things, such as eating while you're full.

Miners are incentivized to earn their reward as they only do good. Environmental issues? No problem, they're incentivized to switch to cheaper, renewable ones.

I don't think this is true at all.  Bitcoin is actually based on greed and without could not function.  Some might call it Game Theory which powers the beauty of Bitcoin's security model.  Miners are counted on to act in the most greedy way possible (using the most high value transactions from the mempool and as many as they can fit in a block) in order to earn rewards for their effort in security the blockchain.  Without the greed of miners, Bitcoin's security model would be severely flawed.  So while you say satoshi miscalculated the greed of the average person, I would say that he not only did not do that, he counted on their greed surpassing attempts by others to bring the transaction processing to a halt. 

My thinking is simply that silence is his way of truly “respecting” bitcoin.  Basically satoshi wallets can also be checked and marked thoroughly, so even if the genius is still alive, I think he was smart to keep the bitcoins anonymous which is also what makes the difference  greatness of bitcoin.

satoshi is not stupid but he is not greedy like most people, he wants to give knowledge to all that happiness is being able to give trust to others to be able to benefit from what has been done for now, later or in the future.

agree with my friend above, that satoshi is actually a genius and seems simple and not naive to want to take advantage of what can actually be done, but he doesn't want to be equated with other humans who are full of greed if they have something only for individuals and groups.

You are now good at reading people's minds, you even dare to say Satoshi is stupid, right as you said satoshi is stupid because he is not selfish and does not want to be seen as a genius, because he is not naive, and does not want to take advantage of his followers. , unlike other bosses who are good at enriching themselves, after they issue new coins.

ha yeah funny. Satoshi gave the world something pure, and by doing so it allowed a bunch of people to come make far worse versions to get rich off them. But of course if Satoshi had gone that route crypto never would have gained popularity in the first place and it would have died in its infancy. Funny how things work like that.

Not a bad presentation for being your first post in this forum... If Satoshi was so dumb why didn't you create a better bitcoin before him? It took you 13 years just to say that things could have been done in a different way? I hope this is a joke post because none of what you said makes sense.

I have great respect for him. Because if he had followed the steps you mentioned. You wouldn't be talking like that today. You would be lost in the false freedom that centralization gives you. Yes, it's hard to reject what you're talking about, but great victories require great sacrifices. If he had chosen the easiest way, we wouldn't call him satoshi, he would be Yoda7331 

One of the thing with inventions is that once the inventor releases their creation to the public at large what happens after it is not under their control at all, when it comes to the things that Satoshi could control everything was executed to perfection, however once he released bitcoin now it was up to the public to do their part, and while without a doubt the growth of bitcoin has been impressive, at the same time the market of shitcoins is probably way larger than what anyone could have imagined back then, but Satoshi is not at fault for this, the ones at fault are all of those that keep investing and losing their money on those shitcoins.

That was a mind blowing reply indeed. I would have given a plenty of merits but you already have many. So I will reserve it for other posts 

What you say is very true. Being rich definitely doesn't mean one should have lots of money.
It simply means he should have enough food to survive through the day and happiness in his life to be satisfied with what he has.
Satoshi didn't seem to care about money and cared about his privacy because if it might affect his life and also his loved ones' lives.
So he pretty much didn't care about the money and vanished for good and I respect him for that.
Calling him dumb for this seems like a preposterous act.

Even the satoshi themselves aware of that like this can happen but what can they do to prevent it? Nothing. He just focused on his own business and do what makes him think right. I wouldn't call him dumb for his bitcoin invention but I will call him a genius because if I look in the process of how to make bitcoin, it's so complicated.

If there is someone that we can blame for the altcoins and shitcoin that we see right now, that is not satoshi but that is their own creators while there are coins that we think bad but they are actually helpful because they serve as an alternative to bitcoin, that is why there is that word "altcoins" that we are using when we talk about coins other than bitcoin.

It was merely my humble opinion, and you might disagree and you would also be right. But from my point of view, the intention was more technical than moral. Bitcoin had to be invented, and it was Satoshi that invented it first. If he failed, I believe another coder would have discovered that the Proof of Work was the most required component for something like "a Bitcoin".

But if Satoshi wanted to create a better money, a currency which is resistant to the abuses of those few people who are controlling fiat, I must say the intention was good. We have a generally bad fiat currency so if somebody wants to correct that and tries to create a much better alternative, the intention must be considered good. To innovate in order to provide freedom for the people is to mean good. Is there even a neutral intention?

OP is merely trolling. Satoshi left nothing, or tried to leave nothing, open for nefarious groups, or government agencies to use something like a "premine" in Bitcoin's boot-strapping phase to FUD the project. Satoshi himself also took extra steps, and made sure his identity is hidden. It might either be, he's someone "known" or he works for a tech company who doesn't want the intellectual property rights of his invention to belong to that company.

Remember that Satoshi only created bitcoins and no altcoins. Who cares about those shitcoins and if you invest in those altcoins, it's your own fault.
Satoshi has given us the best cryptocurrency, that is Bitcoin. If you invest in other altcoins, don't blame satoshi, blame yourself and your greediness.

Thinking one has fully understood other individual's reasoning is imho at least naive, if not plain dumb.
Thinking one knows for sure how much bitcoins other individual has is imho at least naive, if not plain dumb.

From my knowledge one important point in Satoshi's leaving was his own physical security/integrity.
If he's alive and well, I surely hope that he did buy or mine plenty of bitcoins around 2010 so he has a good life.
Since we don't know who is he, we don't know if he has known crypto business and lives between us or he's enjoying life somewhere far from all this.


And any wild guess about what he has done after leaving.. is just a guess. We will probably never know the truth.

Yes he was dumb based on your standard. We live in a world where selflessness has lost its place and value. Every invention or innovation that exists today is driven by profit maximization. Although is Satoshi anonymous hence we cannot say he/she is living or not living a life of luxury somewhere. But from the operations of Bitcoin, Satoshi was not totally driven by wealth or riches, and this indeed makes the Bitcoin founder an extraordinary human. For the fact that he remained anonymous also prove that he is not also motivated by fame. Rather his driving force was to accomplish what he dreamt of and helping people gain financial freedom.

There are no "good intentions"

There are no "bad intentions"

There are only

[Some action]

Intentions

 

Satoshi knew he had the "formula" for the censorship-resistant network/protocol for "money" that the Cypherpunks have always failed to build. Whatever Satoshi's intentions were, the secret component was adding Proof of Work in the "formula", and Satoshi needed to let the cat out of the bag.

The intention of Satoshi was good. And he was consistent in pursuing it. He simply was a person who have sort of foreseen everything. He seemed to have known everything that would make his invention successful. All things were considered. He made it perfectly. But more than that he made sacrifices for its success.

But to the surprise of everybody who saw and believed Satoshi's vision and invention, shitcoins which were all Bitcoin was not, also sold well to the people. Satoshi must have asked himself, where did I go wrong? Lol.

OP should just sleep again because you are not actually experiencing lucidity but somehow you think so.
Blockchain opens every possibility in the world that even if we count out BTC, it's still worth releasing the technology. I'm sure he didn't make BTC for money for if he did, he could have cashout already enjoying every second of his life instead blockchain helped individuals to have more freedom.

yeah exactly. people needs to remember that when they click on the "buy button" for bitcoin, they are signing an agreement that says "I agree that any bitcoin address that holds funds might sell at any time." they signed the agreement when they bought their btc 

One of the main ideals behind bitcoin is freedom, if people want to invest in shitcoins and lose their money that way they are free to do it, we may warn them about the dangers and why it is a bad idea but that is it, at the end it is their decision to make, now it is obvious that judging satoshi by his actions he was not interested in either the money or the fame, so since he got from bitcoin exactly what he was looking for I do not see how you can say those things about satoshi, maybe you would not have done what he did and that is why you do not understand at all his motivation, it is true that money and fame are almost universal motivators, the keyword here being almost, some people just do things to prove themselves they can do them, and at least to me satoshi falls into that category.

  Still after all these years and god knows how many premined shitcoins later Bitcoin is #1 and Satoshi the boss
and the future decentralised

Yes, that doesn't quite fit into today's narrative of all these shitcoins appearing like mushrooms after the rain, and they all aim to get rich quick at the expense of an army of naive people. Luckily for all of us, Satoshi was a little more intelligent than all those who want to invent hot water today, and I realize that some find it very difficult to understand that Bitcoin was invented for some reason other than to make the owner rich.

The problem with you and most people in this world is that you suffer from the need for someone to rule over you, to tell you every day what you can and can't do. The mental complex of modern slavery in the perverted ideology of the free world is not your dream from which you wake up lucid, it is the reality in which you live.

You're comparing the creator of Bitcoin and the originator of the entire cryptocurrency concept to some idiotic copy-paste developers (I'm not saying they're all like that)? Do you realize that these thousands of shitcoins you're talking about wouldn't even exist without Bitcoin?
Who's dumb now?


So he's a genius now?

satoshi wasn't a god. He wasn't the smartest person on earth neither. He accomplished some good stuff but people praising him like he was a godly being is kind of edgy.

How do you even know that he don't own the private keys of his coins? It is a big possibility that he still controls those coins. The point is you'll never know and since you can't know, you can't say stuff like "he was dumb" because he very well may surprise everybody.

Exactly each project has been working on the prime motive of profit making with the decentralisation concept also but have failed to do so.For example the if the project becomes successful they failed to implement the tokenomics properly as they airdrop themselves with the majority of supply again making it centralised and then pump and dump scheme.

But what Satoshi built was completely mathematical genius code taking each aspect for long term into mind that makes it completely decentralised with deflationary nature and network being secured so if you call him dumb for creating something unique which is out of your understanding capacity then you are the one who should be called dumb.

Name any other coins which stands above bitcoin in any aspect? Now some will say fees and speed so the LN has solved this issue also but do we care to read and explore more about them? So avoid creating such topics which are irrelevant and you are using the forum which was initiated by that genius whom you are calling dumb.

If I knew you in person and I found out you would do anything for the money, I would not be able to ever trust you again.  This is not how things should work.  There are some people who just do it for the humanity.  For the rest of us.  And I can not think of Satoshi as dumb for not taking advantage of us.  I can only admire him or them for it, it is a rare personality these days.

At least this is how you know there is one, little hope for humanity left.  If even Satoshi did to Bitcoin what today's dog breed coin creators are doing to their coins, there would have been no hope left in my eyes.

-
Regards,
PrivacyG

You know some people have different narrative of understanding, maybe he was expecting Satoshi to over shadow everything related to cryptocurrency in order to be contented, i think such ideology of op is so myopic from my view, some people are meant to create the means or the pathway of getting over rich but they Left it behind, that doesn't mean they are extremely deficiency of richness, no.

Maybe it's not a big deal for Satoshi or maybe he is not a greedy person at all unlike most of us, Anyway it's just my opinion but who knows it was one of the reasons why Satoshi Nakamoto did not do any of that purposes for the sake of his own interest or maybe his not expect that the Bitcoin he was created will become popular and big after 10 years.

Nope, and actually I'm totally fine for him taking profits because he/she/they totally deserve it. But regardless, the sort of anti-capitalist people on social media would be spewing BS like saying that Satoshi has only been in it for the money or something like that.

that's probably because the word "premine" didn't even exist back then. so what he did is started mining blocks when very few other people were doing it. (low difficulty)



well clearly satoshi wasn't just doing it for the money. but what if satoshi popped up today and said the jokes on you guys, i'm cashing in. would that mean bitcoin was less valid then?

This is either a really bad troll attempt, or a really really dumb post. No in-betweens. Bitcoin wouldn't be in a great situation if everyone knew that Satoshi was just purely profit-driven.

Not only smart but also brave to start working and creating something that can change the world.

Satoshi makes Bitcoin for millions, not millionaires. If you can take it and are able to hold it tightly, you will become millionaire or even billionaire in future.

• Satoshi's lesson (should read this one)

People are mostly dumb because they naively believe in propaganda of governments, believe in fiat currencies and central banks. This pandemic opens our eyes on how governments can easily to add new supply of fiat currency and makes inflation worse in short period of time.

The title of this thread needs to change to 'Why op is dumb?' instead in my opinion. Why? Because your logic about Satoshi makes zero sense and I have no idea what someone like you is doing in this forum.

Anyone with a half-decent brain knows that Satoshi deserves credit for his/her/their contributions to the cryptocurrency world which is why op needs to grow up asap.

He wasn't thinking about himself but the future of his project and chose the best possible way. No premine and no spending, which means 0 influence over the coin. Pattern of spending, selling, trading can allow people to trace you, find patterns, know what kind of a person you are, your choices when and how much to sell, what to convert into (maybe fiat, maybe a stable coin, if fiat then which one). Each of Satoshi's move would be misinterpreted by an army of journalists and analysts. The way it is is the best for both bitcoin and Satoshi.

Lol true. He mixed it all , but i guess he is more to admiring satoshi intelligence through his weird vexation statement.
Satoshi did it for legacy .. that's for sure , we can feel it by now how cryptocurrency have a huge impact in our daily life.

He just a bit upset that satoshi did not take any advantage, not even a piece.
Well yeah satoshi is not average person like us , he might stand with einstein and hawking for what he have done.

He was right in doing so, otherwise, bitcoin wouldn't be the success it has been being year after year. Bitcoin has the trust and reputation no other cryptocurrency was able to build, so I think Satoshi was pretty accurate and responsible on his decisions. I believe with dumb and naive you meant he wasn't greedy, and if that is the case, the world really needs more dumb and naive people around and less clever, smart guys...

And how are the shitcoins satoshi's problem?

You might as well blame him for the Ponzi schemes that are using Bitcoin's success to lure in stupid and dumb investors

Maybe you should read the white paper again: https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

It seems to me you even don't know why Satoshi created Bitcoin.

I would be shocked if you are not one of them.

Yoda... are you a mind reader now?

So you think you know what went on in the mind of one of the greatest people that ever lived? Have you ever read the Bitcoin White Paper? ...Also how many of Satoshi's posts have you read on this forum?

Satoshi reacted just like every other person would, that was angry at the time.... They lashed out in different ways, but Satoshi decided to challenge them (Banks & Governments) by inventing something that would serve as an alternative option to Fiat currencies.

Satoshi made so many good decisions with the future in mind, that it would be foolish of people like you to criticize him for the Alt coin phenomenon/Fiasco.  

No. Satoshi is smart and the world get benefit from Satoshi's initiative.


Don't compare Bitcoin with shit coins or meme tokens. They are not at same levels so they are non-comparable.

He's trolling. Bitcoin would never be where it is currently if Satoshi had greed in the agenda for building the network. To truly be a success, it had to be bootstrapped by the community altruistically. It is always an open source project first, like Linux.

The fact that one person^* didnt premine and didnt spend what was mined
cements the fact that the vision of Satoshi was to the future, the goal was to make sure
Bitcoin would succeed , not consider a personal bank account, after all Bitcoin is not
a $hitcoin.

OP should stay in their dreams.

^* Satoshi's identity has not been determined so the use of 'he' and 'himself'
is not accurate, kind of suits the thread OP.

You're right. He's dumb. Not naive.

If he did it like the rest of shitcoins did, he wouldn't have created something new. Because plenty of other types of premined digital money existed before Bitcoin. So he's dumb if we think he disappeared and got nothing out of it.

He couldn't have been naive though.

Bitcoin was the first popular cryptocurrency to achieve great success, but in its early days it was used among geeks and ideologues who didn't care much about money. Satoshi's idea was quite different - to give people a superior tool, and he succeeded. And then copies, shitcoins, and other rubbish started appearing, whose creators dreamed of getting rich.

Not so.

Without bitcoin leading the way, those shitcoins could never have gotten off the ground.

There were already shitcoins before bitcoin but none of them solved the decentralization problem (as well as the problem of how to create value from nothing), and eventually failed because their creators were shut-down. These shitcoins also have limited potential growth precisely because of their premine. Do you want a globally useful currency? You're going to have to give up some of that centralized ownership. No country is going to adopt a currency when they know a few individuals own tens of percents of it.

Bitcoin showed that it was possible. It took several years for bitcoin to become worth anything meaningful, and it's worth the most of any crypto. It would have taken a lot longer if Satoshi didn't allow people to mine at any time because no one would have trusted a known individual to not screw them in the long run. With a known individual, it also becomes easier to make a 'why not use visa/mastercard/paypal instead?' argument because that individual can be targeted to disrupt the currency.

The anonymity of bitcoin's creator also provides a support for shitcoins because the little pups can hide behind the big bull of the pack. They would be so much more easily adversely targeted without bitcoin existence.

Bitcoin also works and increases in value precisely because of the greed of the average person. The number goes up because the number goes up. Even with bitcoin, until some addresses have more distributed ownership, bitcoin will be limited in its highest growth potential. Arguably, this is also why shitcoins increase in value -- because of the greed of individuals -- but there has to be a buy-in+reward mechanism for later adopters or eventually you run out of investors. Most shitcoins don't have a consistent reward for later investors and have nothing close to guaranteeing it.

Besides, a large initial pump means nothing for long term success. Any form of currency has to demonstrate long term stability, which bitcoin dominates.

Learn the S-curve. Most shitcoins have fulfilled their S-curve. They may grow rapidly, but they can only do so once. You can argue about where bitcoin is in its S-curve, but it's definitely not at its top.

I can't tell if you are trolling, are sarcastic or serious. The tone is not being conveyed in text form.

In case you are serious is there is anyone thinking this way, I have to tell them that not everyone is doing everything for the "money". You don't necessarily have to be rich to not want money, one can be not-rich and still be content at the same time.
If you can't understand this, it means you are not and will never be content in your life even if you had all the money in the world.

I woke up today, completely lucid, with the following realization: Satoshi was naive at worst and plain dumb at worst.

Back in 2008/2009 when Satoshi created/launched Bitcoin, he made the decision to 1) Have no premine 2) Never spent any of the coins he minted. 3) Disappear to eradicate himself as the last form of 'authority'. His reasoning probably being that nobody in their right mind would buy into a crypto that was unfairly distributed from the beginning, of which its creators would stand to benefit most and was controlled by them. I think at this point, you realize where I'm going with this.

13 years later, there are many thousands of shitcoins, most of which had some form of premine, made the creators bank and are still in control to a high degree. These shitecoins are worth millions and some even 100s of billions.

Even a genius like Satoshi miscalculated the stupidity, ignorance and greed of the average person


Do not ever forget, we live in a clown world.


Cheers




favorite shitcoin meme: https://i.redd.it/wwsiw79sa4l81.jpg