Topic: Why would anyone want to use a paper wallet with raw private key? (Read 348 times)

I prefer hd wallets-trust,ownr,exodus. I think this is a more secure type of wallet.

There are plenty of safe ways to generate a paper wallet or simply a Private Key on a piece of paper. Many of which do not require internet, a printer (you can write it down), memorize, etc.

Having your actual private key on a physical storage medium is the only safe way to protect your cryptos. Your computers, wallets, accounts can all be lost.

That's right, because this paper wallet apart from its very lack of security is also very easy to hack and damage. and I also initially used something like this but after reading the pros and cons I started switching and not using paper wallets.
a very good post because basically there are a lot of new people who don't understand such a significant difference, at least by reading things like this they will understand and start to switch from paper wallets.

Any word can be a bitcoin key without a seed phrase. Any bit of an image. Any phrase or piece of music is random.

Just make sure that you have the software method that uses those seed phrases and its algorithm for however long you intend on storing them. Software and hardware eventually rot.  It may be that if you kept your bitcoin for ten years that you'd not have access to the type of port or software system to read it. It isn't certain that windows or a USB port would be around in ten, twenty, or fifty years. At least a (avoid smart printers) paper key will generally last, if you don't lose it.

 If you are storing significant wealth, you have to worry about how to not lose it from others taking it, but also from not losing it from yourself due to software, hardware, and memory rot. Those are opposite challenges.

Because of this, the safety factor is improved, and it is not easy for hackers to attack your wallet, but if you write it in a notebook, remember not to lose it.

Wallet Software is dangerous, free trojan horses.

Hardware Wallet is a joke, how do you really know its doing what you think? How can you trust the company.

Why have so many addresses you have ONE for your serious, like the big-miners, you see they have one address with 150k btc's

You have a few addresses for junk stuff

You run your own bitcoin full-node, your own electrum-server  if you wish to make lots of addresses, you use coin-join, if you wish to do your own mixing

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Everything is offline. Get a couple of dice, say roll the 32 times and write down the numbers, then enter the numbers on an offline laptop, that is virgin, no web-browser, sort of like the hive-model, virgin clean no chance of malware. You run "KU" for python bitcoin/pycoin, ku will take the generated random number and generate your WIF, you write that WIF down. Your done. You engrave that WIF on some metal, and put it away. If you want more special private-keys, do this again.

Now you have a private-key, on the same offline virgin, when you ran KU to get your WIF, you also got all the address formats, right now the one you with to use, comp, uncomp, bc up to you Your done.

Your PRIV-KEY has never seen the internet, your PRIV-KEY is hard saved permanently. You tell nobody, ever. Your security is 100%. NOTHING no random generator on earth can better the dice rolls, as all computers do pseudo-random generation.

Given that you have your own private full-node, and electrum server, you run the wallet software, so it only connects to your server internally, use TOR if you wish. Nobody on earth can connect your IP, to that address, I'm saying you have imported your secret priv-key into this private wallet node. This just be for coin-joining or mixing internally to save coins; You can always create throwaway addresses, bringing in new funds, but you can mix them back to your secret address.

Of course once you have gone to the trouble of making a 'super-priv-key' you never share it with COINBASE, or sweep using a wallet, you never use mobile-wallets, unless you fund toy-accounts for pocket money

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All wallet software online is a scam. All wallets on mobile's is a scam. The only safe wallet is on your own private wallet-server, that nobody can see what your doing. If you can't afford to lose it, don't use it with public domain software.

Most hardware wallets are a scam. Either they give you rub-off key, which they sweep your funds later, or the hw-wallet has a serial number where they can later activate malware, why would anyone think that companys making wallets are safe? It only takes 1-2 dishonest employees in cahoots with a Nigerian OP, to destroy a company. Hell anybody that gets into any wallet hw or sw is not to be trusted free or not.

At least with your own node you can monitor 'call 2 home', and prevent malware

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In summary making a super-secure private key is easy, just roll a few dice a few times. Keeping that private-key off of the computer, and off of the internet is the secret. Running your own wallet-server is most important of all to make sure NOBODY associates your high-value address with your geo-ip

What in the hell is a paper-wallet Paper is where you do your scratch work rather than on a computer, storage of your magic number is up to you, hell grind it into the bottom of your desk with a drill

'wallets' are 100% bullshit hw or sw, running your own BTC full-node, you can do your own transaction 100% anonymous

All exchanges are either ran by the GOV, or criminal in nature.

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10's of 1,000's of people have been robbed by buying cheap trezor clones online from ebay

Over $2Billion USD lost every year from BTC theft, but its a dirty little secret

hw-wallets are USB devices, the easiest thing in the world for NSA to hack is USB devices, these days lots of malware out there to scan, super easy to get into a device read-only dump the memory, and decrypt it later

but most hw-wallets use the ebay scam, where a scratch off key is included in the package, and of course as soon as you use the wallet with that key, your funds are swept by a 3rd party

but even making your own key isn't safe, because all wallets hw or sw are trojan horses

original btc design didn't even have 'wallets', it came later by criminals and exchanges and governments

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Seed words require a dictionary to map those words to a 12 bit digit, typically 12 or 24 seed words, what a pain in the ass. Not all sw even uses the same software mapping. This crap was invented by the same dildo that brought you 'brain-wallets', another scam that caused people to lose millions

Just roll two dice 3 dozen times writing down each pair of digts, and your done. U have your numeric private-key. Convert to WIF format offline secure, and tattoo that on bottom of foot. Done.

WIF is typcially about 28 characters, easy to write down.

I think memorizing 12 or 24 words in an order is as dangerous as 'brain wallets', people are constantly forgetting the order, or one word, read the net, not a day goes by somebody messes up and loses all their btc forever

Just convert the numeric key to a WIF, and write on system using a permanent marking system, welding rod if you wish, or plasma-ionic rifle, bury it with your gold, so know its in a safe place.

Why pick on paper, there are scrolls laying around with old ink 10's of 1,000's of years; going to last longer than you, especially if stored in dry place. Like a PVC gun tube, where you keep your gold buried.

Most of the time when people first start BTC they don't know what they're doing, they go online and get an 'address' and never backup that priv-key, then years go by they think their rich, and then when they go to spend their btc ( cuz they hodl ), they find out they don't have the key, or the password to the wallet; So many gimmicks and pitfalls in BTC to lose your money

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There are more 'fake' "Trezor Wallets" coming out of China, that there are 'fake' Apple Store, and iPhones; and that's a lot. In China, the people who work at the Apple stores don't even know they're not working for Apple, and its the same for the Trezor Universe.

U might trust Trezor as much as the baby-jeebuz, but its irrelevant, unless you bought your 'Trezor' in person from the CEO at the Company, and even then he probably doesn't know if its a real device. Often these things are fabricated by the 100's of 1,000's in China on contract, and the rejects that fail 'test' are thrown in a bin and sold for cheap, then end up in Nigeria where they're resold on ebay

Lot's of ways to scam the hw-wallet, the big one is the fake scratch-off key, the second is to have pre-determinstic random numbers, say you generate 1M random keys from a seed, then you send out the Trezor clones, now you have a database, and you scan all the addresses, on the mining-pool of BTC, when you see an address from your pre-deterministic database of priv-key/address-map on bloom-filter in real time, you 'sweep', or even better you flag and have a human watch&wait until big money appears on that address.

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Why indeed? Because most people can't remember where they left their car keys ten minutes ago.

Write it down, or lose it.


On Ethereum they tell you they intend to reduce eth  live holdings, to increase price, on btc they can count on people being stupid to reduce active addresses.

Like you already said, if you use an online wallet, and  use their private-key generated, then you have already lost your money.

[moderator's note: consecutive posts merged]

Private key wallets are usually at risk of being hacked, but hardware wallets are completely risk-free, so many large investors have turned their attention from software wallets to hardware wallets.

Hello Good Morning. Excuse my English but I really speak Spanish . I have been reading the post, however, seeing your message, I had a question. It is much safer to use the seed phrase of an open source non-custodial wallet and stored in a safe place before using a paper wallet?
What is your most sincere opinion?
I was somewhat interested in paper wallets because in Cuba it is impossible to acquire a Hardware Wallet. So, thank you very much.    Have a great day

Its not that the paper is wrong, but the idea of printing the private key on it is very dangerous. Thankfully they were replaced with seed words which are better.

You use your hands rather than an electronic device, to write the words in the paper, and secure it very well. The wallet can recreate the private key from those seed words. Of course the whole thing should be made/handled in an air-gaped computer using a secure OS etc.

So now when you want to cold store your coins, you do just that. Create a wallet, write those words, print/copy the addresses so you can send funds to, and delete the wallet. Your wallet can be recreated at anytime, and you can send funds all you want safely to it, you can monitor it in read only or with a blockchain browser.

In short, its the modern, safer version of it. Private keys should never be handled directly.

as you may already know there are a lot of people who are doing the HODL thing for years. for these people a single private key is more than enough since all they need is a single address where they keep buying and sending bitcoins there (some may do it once with a one time big purchase). so using a mnemonic is an overkill. not to mention that mnemonics have the problems of their own (eg. incompatibility of BIP39 vs Electrum vs other methods used by some implementations such as LN wallets, or the derivation paths being very different,...).

another usage of such paper wallets is "gifting". for example this year (at new year) i created and gifted some paper wallets to a couple of people i know.

P.S. i never liked the paper wallet page on wiki. it is focusing too much on the negative sides and the incorrect usage of paper wallets which could apply to any other method used too.
not to mention that almost all the things mentioned there also apply to mnemonics which ironically is the suggested replacement in a way that it seems like it is solving the problems listed below the suggestion!

I haven't try printing my private keys, but some who are too Organized in their assets and files will eventually try these. I have known someone who usually print all his big transactions and receipts and even so write in paper his private key or mnemonic codes for his reference, not really printing it but writing it on a paper. People prefers different thing and on what suits them best. It's for us to find what we feel comfortable and safest.

Storing keys on hot wallet is an unnecessary risk, if you don't transact daily you're risking for nothing, and if you do so, then why not just have a small hot wallet for spendings and a cold wallet for savings?

You can go for years without getting infected, but one mistake can be enough to lose all your coins, and there's so many things that can go wrong. Maybe your friends or family will use your computer for a few min to install a pdf reader, or maybe you will accidentally click on an email link or a forum link - the possibilities are endless.

I had some litecoin in essentially a raw paper wallet for over 5 years.... When I needed them I got them back...

Unlike what I was holding in 2 exchanges which both went down.

Honestly I wouldn't recommend it. I'd feel a lot better if I had a mnemonic seed and memorized that.

That being said, human memory is really weird. Today I forgot my special number that gives me access to change the inventory at the grocery store I work for. A 3 letter user id....(I never forgot the password)  And I remember a 25 alphanumeric key from over 10 years ago flawlessly.

They were once the most safest way to store your Bitcoin but it is a decade old. At that time wallet technology was not so advanced and there were very less software wallets present. As of now paper wallet has become obsolete and it in no more recommended. They have a lo flwas and one of the major is in case if you lose the paper you cannot restore your wallet. Therefore it should be avoided.

Isn't it just more about ignorance? Ignorance or just lack of basic information with regards to wallets. They probably don't even know that others can plainly see their addresses and the like. Not to mention all the hassle you'd actually have to go through whenever you use a paper wallet. You can already legit see it when looking up paper wallets, it's already described as an unsafe method with a large number of downsides. Just the fact that printers have an internal log of what it prints is already a negative tbh.
True. Even if we just plainly use our commonly used laptop/pcs and use desktop wallets, as long as you were entitled to protecting the wallet, there's close to little chance that you'd get hacked. Of course, the chances are still there and that's why most would rather opt to use reliable hardware wallet.

There is also an old thread about the subject matter here, Time to bust a myth. Paper wallets are less secure than normal encrypted wallets.

I'm blessed for having used Coinomi with my paper wallets and emptying them out every time before even knowing change address was a thing.

I felt like they could be compromised without even having to go through any flaw: a hacker may gain access to my camera and easily use my privkey at any time. Paper wallets should have a little warning sign on them to know what you shouldn't do.

I know someone in the bitcoin ATM business and, as far as I remember these things had some pretty solid security. At least the models they had. They also suggest EVERYWHERE around the machine that if they're using paper wallets, to make sure not leaving their coins there for too long (fact reinforced by them using heat-print paper), these machines giving paper wallets like this was justa quick way to get your btc that you can transfer out of later on.

This isn't the best way to set up a paper wallet necessarily but if done correctly this is the safest form of cold storage.  Personally if I had a set up to make paper wallets safely myself, I would rarely use anything else.  I suppose I would use hot wallets or electrum to transfer my coins, but I'd never store them on hot wallets or hardware wallets. So it's simple, if made correctly, it's the safest way to store your coins.

Nope, I wasn't thinking paper wallet is the best option. Ain't that a reason having our wallet addy and private keys printed just to avoid from hacking but it only gives us difficulties accessing our wallet, typing again? No, it wasn't a comfortable way for me and the others also. We are in the computer era and that we move to paperless. I know to keep our wallet addy and keys to our laptop/pc is at risk but we have also another option is to keep it in a hard wallet if we store big amounts. In fact, for many years that I've stored my BTC in online wallet and keys are still on the computer but glad to see that it is still intact and no hacking experience.

It is not all about where we keep our funds but it really matters how careful we are in handling it and visiting malicious sites.

I hadn't suggested anyone to use paper wallet ever especially those are newbie in bitcoin. They just simply heard from someone about paper wallet and trying to create it without proper knowledge. Even you can see a user had created brand new private key/address but when he checked on block explorer then it has been used. Means user even don't know which website is perfect to genarate private keys offline. There is lots of security concern regarding paper wallet. If anyone don't want to download whole blockchain then better to use full SPV wallet like electrum, it's open source and easily could write seeds and export private keys.

Most important concern is during first transaction if they move fund partially. Because they have only one address and there is no wallet & change address. So its huge risk of lost fund. Mostly people want to hold funds on paper wallet for long time. But on this case it's been suggested to buy a hardware wallet which is more secure from paper wallet. Otherwise better to use non-custodial open source wallet and write seed phrase on multiple paper which would save on multiple safe place.

I'm speaking strictly about the paper wallets that print out the raw private key, and not about wallets that ask users to backup their mnemonic seed.

This type of wallets has a lot of flaws:

You need to use printer to create it, which can be malicious. Especially f it's owned by a third party like a store.

They create just one address, which means you'll be tempted to reuse it to receive multiple transactions.

According to Bitcoin wiki, they have less error correction than seed phrases:


They are often generated by websites, which can easily be malicious. Example - https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/vulnerability-discovered-on-bitcoinpaperwalletcom-do-not-use-it-5249129



A mnemonic seed wallet has many advantages - you only need pen and paper to make it, it creates a full wallet with as many addresses as you need, as well as change addresses, and you can even memorize the seed to additionally store it in your head.