Topic: [WTB] Kilogram bar of gold (Read 2000 times)

You can test a coin without drilling into it, but just past surface deep. You rub it on a piece of slate or frosted glass, which won't leave marks on the coin, then pour the testing solution over the scratch marks. One thing about numismatic gold though is that it is very common to find-say-a pre '33 gold coin made of 90% gold (as a real one is), but is in-fact counterfeit because of the collector/numismatic value that it holds. So if you ever decide to go numismatic gold, be VERY confident in the seller.

Also, I can understand your desire for a 1 kilo bar. I think there's some innate "ecstasy of gold" mentality built into all of us. The truth is though, its definitely not the smartest buy. 1 Kilo bars are purchased by BIG time investors, and not by the single bar-by the hundreds, maybe thousands. Since you (Teran) are such a nice guy, I want to do what I can to steer you in the right direction. So I'm sorry if I reiterate at all. But here are my compelling arguments:

1. The only reason for buying any precious in a larger increment is because you pay [negligible if you only buy one] less of a premium over spot. For example: it costs A LOT more to buy 10 x 1/10 gold coins than it does to buy 1 x 1oz. SO, buying 1oz bars may cost you a bit more over spot than a kilo bar would, but you get that money back in the form of the same premium over spot that you paid when you sell them. ALSO, more compelling, selling a 1 Kilo bar is A LOT harder than selling 1 oz bars. With 1 oz bars you can have as many paydays as you have bars. With a kilo bar, you get one payday. Also, if you got one ounce bars they would most likely be PAMP or Credit Suisse, which are universally recognized and thus easy to trade. A kilo bar would most definitely have to be assayed.
2. Refineries usually make 1kilo bars with the buyer in mind-they know they're not going to be looking at, appreciating their gold. One kilo bars are often-for lack of a better term-ugly. Also, you questioning if a kilo bar would be worth more doesn't hold any water. Any refinery can take 1oz bars and turn them into a kilo bar.
3. Finally, there is the argument of authenticity. If you buy 1oz PAMP bars from a reputable seller, you really don't have anything to worry about. Kilo bars, however, are sold by less vendors. Often they are even marked with a sharpie (told you they were ugly)! It is very easy to load a 1 kilo bar with something like Tungsten. And it would be relatively hard to detect. Think of the Tungesten in the I believe 10oz bars sold by a reputable dealer. If it happened with 10oz bars, it would/could certainly happen even easier with a 1 kilo bar.

Finally, the choice is yours (obviously). I know that having a kilo bar and playing with it would be fun. But bathing in a bunch of 1oz bars isn't so bad either!

I wish you the best in your buying decision!

Agreed. Listen to the folks on this thread, they're trying to save you from making a possible mistake that could cost you a lot of money. The way you are acting you're either trying to get ripped off or trying to persuade yourself that there's no downside risk. Get a grip of yourself. If you want a kilo, buy it from a LMBA approved mint, no-where else.

 


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For example:

Check:

http://www.lbma.org.uk/pages/index.cfm?page_id=147&title=good_delivery_lists

Ascertain guarantee:

http://www.perthmint.com.au/310-pm-cms-collect/content/investment_invest_in_gold_government_guarantee.aspx

Purchase:

http://www.perthmintbullion.com/au/Buy-Gold-Bars/1kg-Cast.aspx?productId=23


Now, based on your jurisdiction, find a mint that might be able to assist you. Or splash your cash, you might get lucky and hey, if you don't test your bar, maybe you can live in ignorance?

Good luck with it all.

Its really up to you, you can get the 1KG bar if you really want it, we are just letting you know the posible downsides. As an American that wants to use the Metric system, Troy ounces is a metric conversion as well 

Do your home work,  it was a 10oz pamp bar that sparked the whole tungsten scare -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXm8Ibax6JA

Stick to 1oz bars, best balance between liquidity and small premiums

I appreciate all of the advice here. I admit, I'm on the fence about the one-kilogram wonder bar.

I'm not looking for this to be my single investment, or SHTF stock. I have smaller coins and such that can more easily be traded with for that scenario.

I understand that fraud is more of an issue with larger bars. Both real fraud and speculative fraud and its affects on trade and trust. I am definitely most interested in a PAMP bar and they do seem to have a wonderful reputation.

But, let's consider the upsides and please tell me if you think they are not enough to outweigh the downsides:

It's a kilogram of gold. Probably the nicest thing to hold on earth, aside from more even gold.
It's a kilogram. As an American wanting to switch to the metric system, that's pretty cool in and of itself.
Some big investors may only deal with larger quantities of gold. They may not consider the one-ounce coins/bars, but only want to work in larger increments like the kilogram. As I understand it, the kilogram is the smallest unit at some exchanges.
Slightly less spot price overhead.
As a bartering tool, for say a house, it'd be pretty effective to the right buyer. Say a few years down the road that gold bar's market value is $200,000 and I want to buy a $250,000 house. Plopping down this gold bar might get me a deal on the spot.

Are any of these legitimate points here, or do you think my carnal mind wanting to feel a kilogram of gold is overruling good logic? If I have other goods and bullion to trade, having a single large bar and other smaller bars shouldn't be so much of an issue. I'm planning on this being a long term investment bar, not so much something to get me out of a bind.

All of that said, it is harder to find investors willing to plop down $40k for a bar. Let alone, $150k which it could be "worth" in a few years.

Maybe 100 or 250 gram bars are a better option? What do you guys think, if you were millionaires, would a kilogram bar be more alluring, or several smaller bars equaling a kilogram? If this is really the wrong thing to do I can buy smaller bars. Ultimately, I hope to moving up and up the ladder trading with people of deeper pockets, rather than moving down the ladder. But, I also want to be quite realistic here. Smaller denominations give me the ability to sell to multiple parties which can be helpful.

Just as dangerous with silver. I ultrasound test large silver bars as well, because lead is dimagnetic, so you can put a lead insert into a silver bar, and the difference when doing the magnet test may be negligible. Really lead is less diamagnetic, but there will still be a force. Some base metals have a very similar ring, and the shape of your bar also changes the sound, so a good fake manufacturer can figure out how to shape the bars so that the sound comes out right. That takes a lot of effort, but for larger bars its worth it for them.

Sorry for being slightly off topic, I don't know quite as much about testing gold, so I would probably make sure you buy from a reputable dealer. If you are going to acid test small 1oz bullion, be sure you aren't getting anything for its collector value, as you need to cut into the coin to properly acid test it, and it will completely ruin any collector value.

#3 --  I think that's why I favor silver over gold for the larger bars.  You can easily do a test with a rare earth magnet and mix in the "ping" test for proper sound.  With gold, you need to be extra extra careful and fire up that ultrasound machine. 

I'll just put in my two cents here...don't go for a kilogram bar. Yeah it would be awesome, but there are a lot of cons.
1. You can only have 1 payday (as opposed to buying several 1oz bars and trading as desired)
2. Larger bars are more commonly weighted w/lead or something because there are barely any manufacturers that produce 1kg bars...so you have smelters doing it themselves. A PAMP bar is a lot better than some bar you'd have to assay anyway.
3. You won't be saving a ton of money. There are plenty avenues to buy gold in increments of an oz for hardly over spot.
Just a few things to think about!

Oh yeah, that. I really wouldn't buy a bar that large without acess to an ultrasound machine to make sure there isn't a tungsten insert somewhere.

I've been using amagimetal without one complaint. Quick shipping and good packaging.

Fear the tungsten in buying big bars

You should try bitcoin commodities 
price for a 1kg gold bar: 120,9228BTC, EU seller also offering dropshipping for us. I think you have to provide a valid ID.
You can trust dennis, i've done a few purchases 

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Don't use Coinabul! They are a bunch of scammers. They owe a lot of people money.
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This, Coinabul is very untrustworthy. I'd recommend Angora, or Amagimetals
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Thanks for the heads up folks, was very close to clicking the "buy" button today with the price drop in Gold,

This forum is a mine of great info :-)

I would agree. If you are buying only 1kg, break it up.

If I were you go for smaller bars for better liquidity.

In the future you may need to free up a few $1000 and could just sell a couple of bars.

Also easier to shift smaller bars and 1oz isnt that much more of a premium

a kg is currently around 120btc. i think i would want f2f and guard for that amount.

This, Coinabul is very untrustworthy. I'd recommend Angora, or Amagimetals

Hi alinix,

That's for sure! I love Bitcoins, but there's nothing quite like gold in hand.

Algora Commodities actually has them for sale. I've not personally worked with them before, but the site looks pretty nice and they are the only place I've seen that sells kilogram gold bars: https://agoracommodities.com/product/1-kilo-gold-bar-32-15-oz/

It's amazing what's for sale online with Bitcoin these days!

Sincerely,
Teran

Hi Teran,

Have been looking into doing something similar on a smaller scale my self, since I can get a lot more Gold for my BTC now

1oz Bars for 4.0900 BTC on www.coinabul.com

Not found anywhere online that sells 1KG bars for BTC though,

Keep us posted :-) 

Hey everyone,

As Bitcoin rises in value, I am considering making a switch to gold. I don't quite have the money yet, but am possibly interested in trading Bitcoins for a kilogram bar of pure gold. Looking to pay less than Agora Commoditie's rate, but I imagine you'd want me to pay more than their buying rate.

Again, I can't quite do this at the current market rate, but probably can very soon. Please PM me or email me if interested.

Thanks,
Teran