Topic: Xapo starting to charge outgoing transaction fees (Read 1804 times)

Quote from: flower1024 on June 02, 2017, 05:47:35 PM

their decision to give fees is reasonable but the fees is too high just for small transaction i sent 0.002 btc from xapo to other address the fee is 0.0014 btc although they give higher fee to the miner than that amount but for me 0.0014 btc is too high so from now i am quit from xapo Sad

As I am a "Dust-bug" this makes Xapo useless for me. Fees are prohibitive. End of Xapo for me.

Just now I checked to send 0.05 BTC they are asking to pay minimum 0.00184391 and for faster transaction fee is 0.00274439. It is almost equal to 4.5USD or 6.5 USD for faster withdrawal fee to send just 115 USD. It has become a worst than sending money through Paypal. Their charges are very high and not giving options to choose lower fee for the people who can wait long to receive funds. Yes, it is no more attractive to use their wallet for a daily transaction, but I'm using their debit card to withdraw only cash.

Recently seems like it's just getting worst. Right now the fees for low transactions are around 180k satoshis which in most cases are even bigger than the transaction itself, the problem gets even worst when you had several wallets with low amounts and try to send them to a non-xapo address. Researching for a not-so-expensive option at the moment seems like the best idea.

They made it into a business most specially when Bitcoin price went up. That's why I let go of xapo already, I used to like this site and now it has lots of issues already and people are always complaining about the transaction fees which is higher than the amount they would want to withdraw.

CriptoIngresos

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Quote from: Ludwig Von on June 02, 2017, 05:15:02 PM

Quote from: Ludwig Von on June 02, 2017, 05:15:02 PM

their decision to give fees is reasonable but the fees is too high just for small transaction i sent 0.002 btc from xapo to other address the fee is 0.0014 btc although they give higher fee to the miner than that amount but for me 0.0014 btc is too high so from now i am quit from xapo Sad

As I am a "Dust-bug" this makes Xapo useless for me. Fees are prohibitive. End of Xapo for me.

Just now I checked to send 0.05 BTC they are asking to pay minimum 0.00184391 and for faster transaction fee is 0.00274439. It is almost equal to 4.5USD or 6.5 USD for faster withdrawal fee to send just 115 USD. It has become a worst than sending money through Paypal. Their charges are very high and not giving options to choose lower fee for the people who can wait long to receive funds. Yes, it is no more attractive to use their wallet for a daily transaction, but I'm using their debit card to withdraw only cash.

Recently seems like it's just getting worst. Right now the fees for low transactions are around 180k satoshis which in most cases are even bigger than the transaction itself, the problem gets even worst when you had several wallets with low amounts and try to send them to a non-xapo address. Researching for a not-so-expensive option at the moment seems like the best idea.

flower1024

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Quote from: Ludwig Von on June 02, 2017, 05:15:02 PM

their decision to give fees is reasonable but the fees is too high just for small transaction i sent 0.002 btc from xapo to other address the fee is 0.0014 btc although they give higher fee to the miner than that amount but for me 0.0014 btc is too high so from now i am quit from xapo Sad

As I am a "Dust-bug" this makes Xapo useless for me. Fees are prohibitive. End of Xapo for me.

Just now I checked to send 0.05 BTC they are asking to pay minimum 0.00184391 and for faster transaction fee is 0.00274439. It is almost equal to 4.5USD or 6.5 USD for faster withdrawal fee to send just 115 USD. It has become a worst than sending money through Paypal. Their charges are very high and not giving options to choose lower fee for the people who can wait long to receive funds. Yes, it is no more attractive to use their wallet for a daily transaction, but I'm using their debit card to withdraw only cash.

richardsNY

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I am a "Dust-bug"

By you stating that, I assume that you are farming your way through many faucets as daily routine? Isn't it a pointless practice at current levels, and knowing that the fees are 3-5 times higher than your actual faucet "earnings"? Seriously, in order to spend dust that took you a few days to collect, it will cost you an additional 10 days of faucet farming just to collect the fees....

Ludwig Von

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Quote from: cicizhang on May 22, 2017, 07:14:34 AM

their decision to give fees is reasonable but the fees is too high just for small transaction i sent 0.002 btc from xapo to other address the fee is 0.0014 btc although they give higher fee to the miner than that amount but for me 0.0014 btc is too high so from now i am quit from xapo Sad

As I am a "Dust-bug" this makes Xapo useless for me. Fees are prohibitive. End of Xapo for me.

rozee

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their decision to give fees is reasonable but the fees is too high just for small transaction i sent 0.002 btc from xapo to other address the fee is 0.0014 btc although they give higher fee to the miner than that amount but for me 0.0014 btc is too high so from now i am quit from xapo Sad

itsArtie

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Man this is unbelieveable, I just went to send $20 to other address and had to choose between standard and high priority miners fee. It's $4 for standard and $6 fee for high priority.. that's CRAZY. If these numbers happen next time I decide to send some money I'm giving up on Xapo, I've never seen such high fees.

frowsiter

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I think xapo is right at their own place because they also have to do the business and maintain their position in the living market. Today the bitcoin is getting heavier in its value and miners are slowing down. This is leading to longer confirmation timings and fees ultimately getting intolerant. Xapo might be needing to cover these charges so that's their loss. If they keep doing that then they may end up with out of business situation. So this is the part where we should understand our very beloved wallet
:-)

Kotone

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because bitcoin price is so high and its crazy if they don't start getting some fees when people do transaction they need it for the better services and for the future then. If they don't charge those outgoing transaction fee where they do get some support?

alyssa85

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OMG, i hate those site when they get some known, they will start keep charge lot of type fee.

How else do you think they make their profits? There ain't no such thing as a truly free service. They might have reduced/no fees initially to build their membership, but after that it is business as usual.

cicizhang

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Quote from: salmanahmedone on May 20, 2017, 12:46:25 PM

Quote

Hi,

We have an important announcement about your Xapo account that will affect you - so please read!

In the next couple of days, all Xapo users will begin to pay the miners fee themselves in order to send transactions out of Xapo.

No portion of this fee goes to Xapo, it is simply the fee that needs to be paid to miners in order for an outgoing transaction to be processed via the bitcoin network! This fee will be dynamically calculated based on the current network conditions and will be paid by you at the time of the transaction.

Due to the increase in transaction volume of the bitcoin network, we'd like to give our users some control over their transactions. That being said, Xapo will give you the ability to select which type of fee you'd like to pay - a standard or high priority fee - thus allowing you to choose how quickly you'd like for your transaction to be processed!

Please keep in mind that this will apply to outgoing transactions that touch the blockchain, but all Xapo to Xapo payments will still be free of charge!

Thanks for your understanding,
The Xapo Team

This is an email that I received from Xapo saying that from the next couple of days I cannot send transactions without any fee...

Do you agree with their decision? I personally believe that a big part of their business was from people wanting to do a lot of micropayments, because coinbase, coinjar and other online wallet giants have added fees and they were the only ones left yet to add a fee. But obviously that probably hurt them a lot and set them back on a lot of extra income as transaction fees skyrockets.

Your thoughts?

OMG, i hate those site when they get some known, they will start keep charge lot of type fee.

dustboy

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Quote from: flower1024 on May 18, 2017, 10:00:25 PM

Quote from: flower1024 on May 18, 2017, 10:00:25 PM

Xapo has gradually tightened his terms of service for a few months ago when they set a minimum amount to carry out a transaction, which made this company inconvenient for micropayments. I am no longer convinced at this point if the service of Xapo is so good as to continue to keep my coins there.

Why do you think like that they are not good to keep or use their service?

Bitcoin transaction fees went up. So all these companies now can't afford to lose every day for all these transactions. I'm also using them for more than two years and never had any issues and mostly used them for everyday transactions because of no fee and quick transactions. Also using their debit card to withdraw cash from ATM. They got slightly higher fees but so far so good and will continue using their service.

I was using XAPO only for the reason of no tx fee on transactions. Now we will be needing to search any other service providers who offer free tx fee for trans. Any idea on this ?

I think there is no other wallet with no sending fees for now, the only way to reduce transaction fee is by convert our btc to altcoin such as ltc/dash. It is what I do lately, bitcoin transactions is going crazy so we should be smart in order to avoid paying to much tx fees.

erikalui

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I don't agree with the decision of xapo as they will charge fees depending on the transaction size that we can't decide. Sometimes we may have just one-two inputs but they would charge a big fee of 300-500 sats as that's the fee they used to pay for my transactions earlier. Same goes will coinbase too that charges 0.0004-0.0005 fee for transactions of any amount. I can understand that they can't afford now to pay the fee but since they don't give the users any control over the wallet, it's not feasible to use them.

PokerFace3

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Quote from: salmanahmedone on May 20, 2017, 12:46:25 PM

Xapo has gradually tightened his terms of service for a few months ago when they set a minimum amount to carry out a transaction, which made this company inconvenient for micropayments. I am no longer convinced at this point if the service of Xapo is so good as to continue to keep my coins there.

Why do you think like that they are not good to keep or use their service?

Bitcoin transaction fees went up. So all these companies now can't afford to lose every day for all these transactions. I'm also using them for more than two years and never had any issues and mostly used them for everyday transactions because of no fee and quick transactions. Also using their debit card to withdraw cash from ATM. They got slightly higher fees but so far so good and will continue using their service.

First Coinbase did it and now xapo has put a fee on the end user who use their services. Seeing the minimum value of a good Tx fee is almost a dollar, XAPO cant afford a dollar expense of each transactions. I have been using XAPO for more than two years and will continue to use XAPO even after their decision of receiving tx fee from the customers as I am finding their services more useful and secured as per my past experiences.

BitHodler

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Quote from: flower1024 on May 18, 2017, 10:00:25 PM

Quote from: flower1024 on May 18, 2017, 10:00:25 PM

Xapo has gradually tightened his terms of service for a few months ago when they set a minimum amount to carry out a transaction, which made this company inconvenient for micropayments. I am no longer convinced at this point if the service of Xapo is so good as to continue to keep my coins there.

Why do you think like that they are not good to keep or use their service?

Bitcoin transaction fees went up. So all these companies now can't afford to lose every day for all these transactions. I'm also using them for more than two years and never had any issues and mostly used them for everyday transactions because of no fee and quick transactions. Also using their debit card to withdraw cash from ATM. They got slightly higher fees but so far so good and will continue using their service.

I was using XAPO only for the reason of no tx fee on transactions. Now we will be needing to search any other service providers who offer free tx fee for trans. Any idea on this ?

In current times basically every online wallet service has cut out free outgoing transactions due to the high costs.

Instead of relying on these services, you better start including proper fees with every transaction you send out. I know that the fees are on the far higher side, but really, there is no other option left.

It's a matter of adapting to the situation because things are likely to become worse as miners and other entities keep spamming the network for their own benefit.

salmanahmedone

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Quote from: xLays on May 19, 2017, 11:45:33 PM

Xapo has gradually tightened his terms of service for a few months ago when they set a minimum amount to carry out a transaction, which made this company inconvenient for micropayments. I am no longer convinced at this point if the service of Xapo is so good as to continue to keep my coins there.

Why do you think like that they are not good to keep or use their service?

Bitcoin transaction fees went up. So all these companies now can't afford to lose every day for all these transactions. I'm also using them for more than two years and never had any issues and mostly used them for everyday transactions because of no fee and quick transactions. Also using their debit card to withdraw cash from ATM. They got slightly higher fees but so far so good and will continue using their service.

I was using XAPO only for the reason of no tx fee on transactions. Now we will be needing to search any other service providers who offer free tx fee for trans. Any idea on this ?

ultrloa

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Maybe those charges has been taken up so that the transaction would become more faster since we know blockchain conformation got a huge delays nowadays and putting some huge network fee can be an immediate aid for that so the transaction with them will be done easily. And certain exchanger rises their withdrawal fees also so theirs no doubt that other sites will ask for bigger more fee's also.

shane

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this is very bad news for me, im using bitcoin for some little transaction, sometimes i want to top up my mobile number, but with curent fee to transaction, im not use bitcoin for top up my number phone again Sad

mrjoy15

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I received that email too. Well that will be a great move for everyone to confirm our transaction fast.

I think it's become problematic, especially the newbie. They almost earn little, use faucet or other small task, so it can't accept anymore. Just imagine what his feeling after see that a half of his total income were vanished from the wallet incoming or outgoing fee though mainly the network fee.

xLays

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I received that email too. Well that will be a great move for everyone to confirm our transaction fast.

freedomno1

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Quote

Hi,

We have an important announcement about your Xapo account that will affect you - so please read!

In the next couple of days, all Xapo users will begin to pay the miners fee themselves in order to send transactions out of Xapo.

No portion of this fee goes to Xapo, it is simply the fee that needs to be paid to miners in order for an outgoing transaction to be processed via the bitcoin network! This fee will be dynamically calculated based on the current network conditions and will be paid by you at the time of the transaction.

Due to the increase in transaction volume of the bitcoin network, we'd like to give our users some control over their transactions. That being said, Xapo will give you the ability to select which type of fee you'd like to pay - a standard or high priority fee - thus allowing you to choose how quickly you'd like for your transaction to be processed!

Please keep in mind that this will apply to outgoing transactions that touch the blockchain, but all Xapo to Xapo payments will still be free of charge!

Thanks for your understanding,
The Xapo Team

This is an email that I received from Xapo saying that from the next couple of days I cannot send transactions without any fee...

Do you agree with their decision? I personally believe that a big part of their business was from people wanting to do a lot of micropayments, because coinbase, coinjar and other online wallet giants have added fees and they were the only ones left yet to add a fee. But obviously that probably hurt them a lot and set them back on a lot of extra income as transaction fees skyrockets.

Your thoughts?

It really can't be helped the fees that they would need to absorb are large so providing free transaction services in Bitcoin is becoming a real hassle. The difference from paying a penny before to a dollar per transaction just means it is not profitable or sound business to absorb those costs. I actually commend them for holding out this long with the fees as they are.
Until we solve the real issue of size that policy will remain in effect and people will likely start to demand we do something so its useful in a sense, until a route for Bitcoin is decided the market will pay.

flower1024

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Xapo has gradually tightened his terms of service for a few months ago when they set a minimum amount to carry out a transaction, which made this company inconvenient for micropayments. I am no longer convinced at this point if the service of Xapo is so good as to continue to keep my coins there.

Why do you think like that they are not good to keep or use their service?

Bitcoin transaction fees went up. So all these companies now can't afford to lose every day for all these transactions. I'm also using them for more than two years and never had any issues and mostly used them for everyday transactions because of no fee and quick transactions. Also using their debit card to withdraw cash from ATM. They got slightly higher fees but so far so good and will continue using their service.

angaper

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Xapo has gradually tightened his terms of service for a few months ago when they set a minimum amount to carry out a transaction, which made this company inconvenient for micropayments. I am no longer convinced at this point if the service of Xapo is so good as to continue to keep my coins there.

shinratensei_

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Quote from: mobnepal on May 18, 2017, 03:43:29 PM

Quote

Hi,

We have an important announcement about your Xapo account that will affect you - so please read!

In the next couple of days, all Xapo users will begin to pay the miners fee themselves in order to send transactions out of Xapo.

No portion of this fee goes to Xapo, it is simply the fee that needs to be paid to miners in order for an outgoing transaction to be processed via the bitcoin network! This fee will be dynamically calculated based on the current network conditions and will be paid by you at the time of the transaction.

Due to the increase in transaction volume of the bitcoin network, we'd like to give our users some control over their transactions. That being said, Xapo will give you the ability to select which type of fee you'd like to pay - a standard or high priority fee - thus allowing you to choose how quickly you'd like for your transaction to be processed!

Please keep in mind that this will apply to outgoing transactions that touch the blockchain, but all Xapo to Xapo payments will still be free of charge!

Thanks for your understanding,
The Xapo Team

This is an email that I received from Xapo saying that from the next couple of days I cannot send transactions without any fee...

Do you agree with their decision? I personally believe that a big part of their business was from people wanting to do a lot of micropayments, because coinbase, coinjar and other online wallet giants have added fees and they were the only ones left yet to add a fee. But obviously that probably hurt them a lot and set them back on a lot of extra income as transaction fees skyrockets.

Your thoughts?

Or if they are still running the transaction without fees and it will obviously make their business to be bankrupt. I can imagine The transaction fees must be the user's responsibility.
it will not be hurting anyone. Do you want your transaction to get stuck on the network for several weeks?

XAPO already has taken a response for the bitcoin latest problem. Without any fee and it will be hurting his service. Roll Eyes

BitHodler

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Quote

begin to pay the miners fee themselves in order to send transactions out of Xapo.

Xapo have just followed coinbase on this, coinbase have already introduced fee on sending out bitcoin from coinbase account to other bitcoin wallets/addresses.

Their internal transactions (off-chain transactions, xapo to xapo address) is still free so I don't think this will make significant effect to their users. It is quite good for sustainability of their business as well as users can now have little control over their fees to get faster confirmation.

It depends. I wouldn't be surprised to see a whole load of people leaving Xapo just because they don't allow free external transactions anymore.

Don't forget that there are a lot faucet farmers that have been using Xapo only for that reason. I hope that they quit farming faucets now it's basically not worth the hassle anymore.

In order to spend worthless dust accumulated through faucets, the fee will top the earnings of these people in case they look to spend them. Less faucet farmers means less overall complaints.

mobnepal

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Quote

begin to pay the miners fee themselves in order to send transactions out of Xapo.

Xapo have just followed coinbase on this, coinbase have already introduced fee on sending out bitcoin from coinbase account to other bitcoin wallets/addresses.

Their internal transactions (off-chain transactions, xapo to xapo address) is still free so I don't think this will make significant effect to their users. It is quite good for sustainability of their business as well as users can now have little control over their fees to get faster confirmation.

shield132

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Currently price of bitcoin is rised and transaction fees are also extremely high. So I highly thing there were some users which were using bitcoin for sending 50$ or lower, so xapo had to pay fees and so much fees logically affected their business. Their income would be nothing if we conpare how much they had to pay in fees. That's also why so many gigant online wallet companies stopped paying fees on their own. Xapo did their best until they could, so we can't beat them for this.

Nagadota

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No one should see this as a bad thing. It would be extremely suspicious if they didn't do this and I would question what they were doing with their users' money behind the scenes, since a lot of people using Xapo will be sending and receiving small transactions with large actual sizes and Xapo would be running at a significant loss.

FLoving

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Quote from: Snorek on May 18, 2017, 12:49:16 PM

Quote from: Graphics on May 17, 2017, 04:19:32 AM

Quote from: mattermaster on May 17, 2017, 02:31:16 AM

Today i got an email from xapo anouncing that they will not charge any fees but bitcoin network has to take transaction fee on every transfer hereafter.
I was happily using xapo since past three years but alas! They changed their terms!

I also got the email, but I find it like a logical business decision. You can't expect from them to carry all the weight of fees. Because 3y ago, transaction fee was ~1c and now it's nearly $1. Which is insane! If segwit get enough support soon and lower the fees to reasonable level, they may revoke it.

There is no way that any company which offers online wallet services will be able to pay current transaction fees.
Current standard fee for 226 bytes/tx is more than 80k satoshi (according to: https://bitcoinfees.21.co/)
It is more than $1.5 fee for each on-chain transaction, it's insane.

But after reading the OP not found that they have provided the reason that they are charging the fees because of the current fees increase. I think they have now started their business till now it was their promo to their users and now they have decided to finish the promo.

Snorek

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Quote from: Graphics on May 17, 2017, 04:19:32 AM

Quote from: mattermaster on May 17, 2017, 02:31:16 AM

Today i got an email from xapo anouncing that they will not charge any fees but bitcoin network has to take transaction fee on every transfer hereafter.
I was happily using xapo since past three years but alas! They changed their terms!

I also got the email, but I find it like a logical business decision. You can't expect from them to carry all the weight of fees. Because 3y ago, transaction fee was ~1c and now it's nearly $1. Which is insane! If segwit get enough support soon and lower the fees to reasonable level, they may revoke it.

There is no way that any company which offers online wallet services will be able to pay current transaction fees.
Current standard fee for 226 bytes/tx is more than 80k satoshi (according to: https://bitcoinfees.21.co/)
It is more than $1.5 fee for each on-chain transaction, it's insane.

FLoving

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I heard about this for the first time as I am using xapo from my android phone and on that app I not received any message or any announcement from them and today I used their wallet and I think they not charged any fees from my wallet. I think they not reached to me yet.

alyssa85

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As long as it's the basic miners fee, it's perfectly OK. It's what you should have paid all along.

However, if they suddenly hike the fees to something like 0.001 btc (10 x the basic fee), then you know they're in trouble. One of the signs Cryptsy was in trouble was the high withdrawal fees, as they sought to clawback money and prevent withdrawals.

RamBahadur.Gurung

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I don''t think that we can blame them on this. Right now, there is a huge backlog of unconfirmed transactions, and the minimum tx fee needed for instant (i.e within 3 blocks) confirmation is around 400 Sat / byte. Xapo didn't had any other option.

sana54210

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Quote from: olushakes on May 18, 2017, 01:46:37 AM

I got the mail for the notification to that effect and I was not surprised because whether they like it or not, they just cannot continue to pay for it from their revenue if any or else they will just run down. Other free wallet providers have even implemented the fee when receiving and if Xapo is now implementing now, I don't see any thing wrong only that they should try and keep it to the minimum after all you will still wait several hours before confirmation.

I am not sure how Xapo is generating revenues other than buying/selling bitcoins services because I am not seeing any advertisements within their services like blockchain.info is doing. Xapo was a crowd fundded start up and they are processing out going transactions in stage hence paying tx fees was under feasible for them as per my assumptions.

But it is time for them too to start collecting network fees from users as high priority fees are peaking like 400 satoshi per byte it would be unpractical fees and I am afraid people will use bitcoins as before.

olushakes

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I got the mail for the notification to that effect and I was not surprised because whether they like it or not, they just cannot continue to pay for it from their revenue if any or else they will just run down. Other free wallet providers have even implemented the fee when receiving and if Xapo is now implementing now, I don't see any thing wrong only that they should try and keep it to the minimum after all you will still wait several hours before confirmation.

dustboy

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I got the same email as well, and I think it is reasonable why they decide to charge sending fee. If they do not do it, it may give so bad financial problem for their business.

MMysterious

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I think a few months back they already had to charge fees for withdrawal amount less than 50k, not really sure if that was the right amount so I was expecting in time it'll charge fees for every transaction you make whether into Xapo or outside. I just hope the transaction fees wouldn't be that much though.

gribble

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Quote from: Graphics on May 17, 2017, 04:19:32 AM

Quote from: mattermaster on May 17, 2017, 02:31:16 AM

Today i got an email from xapo anouncing that they will not charge any fees but bitcoin network has to take transaction fee on every transfer hereafter.
I was happily using xapo since past three years but alas! They changed their terms!

I also got the email, but I find it like a logical business decision. You can't expect from them to carry all the weight of fees. Because 3y ago, transaction fee was ~1c and now it's nearly $1. Which is insane! If segwit get enough support soon and lower the fees to reasonable level, they may revoke it.

I have received the announcement from xapo too, yes it is business service of bitcoin wallet
if the xapo doesn't apply the fees transaction on their service,
they will not survive for long time because there are not peoples who pay their bill monthly
their service will not run without pay webhosting and other.

Graphics

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Quote from: mattermaster on May 17, 2017, 02:31:16 AM

Today i got an email from xapo anouncing that they will not charge any fees but bitcoin network has to take transaction fee on every transfer hereafter.
I was happily using xapo since past three years but alas! They changed their terms!

I also got the email, but I find it like a logical business decision. You can't expect from them to carry all the weight of fees. Because 3y ago, transaction fee was ~1c and now it's nearly $1. Which is insane! If segwit get enough support soon and lower the fees to reasonable level, they may revoke it.

mattermaster

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Today i got an email from xapo anouncing that they will not charge any fees but bitcoin network has to take transaction fee on every transfer hereafter.
I was happily using xapo since past three years but alas! They changed their terms!

paffie

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