Topic: your thoughs about this coins? (Read 311 times)

Ardor definitely has future. It is gonna be like wordpress. Everyone will be able to easy deploy side chains. Consumer focused solution.

About QRL:
a. Join their discord for a week. You will have a good impression of the team and the community.
b. They have Leon Groot Bruinderink in their team, PhD in post-quantum cryptography, also working for the European Union. No other project has the advantage of such a team member. To emphasize his qualities: Cardano plans to use BLISS-B for their upgrade to quantum resistancy. But Leon has hacked BLISS-B already this year. https://eprint.iacr.org/2017/490.
So you are right as to how specialized post quantum cryptography is. Bt QRL has the right people in place. QRL uses the hash-based cryptography XMSS which makes it resistant to quantum computer attacks. XMSS comes highly recommended: The European Research project PQCRYPTO-EU recommends the use of XMSS as a method for stateful digital signatures.

They don’t go live before they 100% quantum proof. It’s the only way to prevent your circulating supply to have unprotected “lost coins” and “lazy users coins.”
c. It's an arms race right now and all the big tech companies are investing heavily. Development is speeding up fast. In may 2017 IBM had a 16 qubit quantum computer. In nov 2017 they had a 50 qubit quantum computer running for the first time. That's x 3 in a few months. Google announced to have a 49 qubit quantum computer at the end of 2017. Microsoft just released it's first quantum coding kit. Quantum computers will be a threath sooner than most think. The ammount of focus on the development is unheard of. And with good reason: he who got it first is the digital king.
And as for the need to be an actual threat: there is so much distrust towards big companies and states and banks wo will have acces to quantum computers. Just the fact that quantumm computers will have the ability, in combination with the fact that there will be great quantum proof alternatives, investors will dump the old and buy the new generation of blockchain.


d. As to implementing quantum proof cryptography in existing blockchains: Blockchains that already launched their genesis block, can't become quantum secure for 100% of their circulating supply. Here my thoughts on that:

For someone with some level of knowledge about blockchaintech, the way the following text is written might sound condescending. That's not my intention. But don’t blame me if it sounds basic, it's explained in basic terms for everyone to understand: A crypto has coins (or tokens). These coins are stored in wallets or on an exchange. As an owner of these coins, you want to be the only one to be able to access the coins and move them if you wish. So to protect your property, your coins are stored on an address: your public key. Your private key gives you the authorization to move them to another address (on an exchange it’s different because you don’t have the private key there yourself, but the result is the same: if someone cracks the main private key, they can steal your coins). Your public key can be known by others and is public, but your private key obviously not. If anybody gets your private key, they can get access and steal your coins. Now how do you get these public and private keys? If you get a public key (address), the blockchain gives you the private key that comes with that public key. If you lose the private key, you will be locked out of the public key (the address) and you will never be able to get your coins out of there ever again. Blockchains can’t just email you a new private key, because the only way a blockchain knows you’re the owner, is if you show the private key. So if you lose it, you can’t prove anything, and your locked out for good. That is why blockchains are so secure. Private keys can not be hacked by normal computers. But future quantum computers can hack the normal private keys. Now if a blockchain is quantum proof, they give you a public key with a quantum proof private key. So this private key can not be hacked by a quantum computer, and your coins are safe. Now you think “ok, so if a blockchain upgrades to a quantum proof blockchain, the problem is solved”. But the problem is, if a blockchain already exists, there are millions of coins out there that NEED to be accessible by their owners after the fork or upgrade.

To understand why that is a problem, and why that can’t be solved, we need to understand how a fork works: so how can a blockchain be upgraded and still give the owners of the coins access to their coins. After the fork, everybody needs to have the exact same amount of coins they had before the fork. So there will be a 1:1 tokenswap. Everyone who owns an amount of tokens of the old blockchain, will own that same amount of tokens of the new blockchain. To accomplish that, you will NEED to keep the old private keys active until the owner moves it’s coins to a new address with a public key that is accessible only through a new quantum proof private key. (Maybe another option would be that you wouldn’t need to move your coins to a new address, but the old private key would be de-activated after you claimed your new quantum proof private key. I don’t know if this last option is even possible, but if it would be possible, it would still mean that your old private key needs to be active after the fork until the owner uses it and actively de-activates it.) So:

    The blockchain "knows" the amount of tokens you have at that specific time, and thus the amount of tokens you are entitled to, by looking at your public key. (Like for example etherscan does.)

    They can only send these tokens to its rightful owner, by sending them to that exact public key (address). That way it is guaranteed that only the rightful owner can access them, because only he has access to that address (The old private key and old public key). So then the new coins are on your old address, that is still accessible through your old private key. Now, even if it would technically possible, the blockchain can't erase the old private key or replace it with a new one, because then the owner would not be able to access his coins. Remember: he doesn’t HAVE the new private key. It’s not like you can get your new private key by email. So the blockchain needs to allow you to enter with your old private key, even if they just upgraded itself to a quantum proof blockchain. This means your coins are NOT protected by that blockchains new and improved quantum proof private keys. Not until you have accessed your coins through your old private key. Then you would need to move them, or de-activate the old private key to lock your coins up in a way that it’s only accessible with a quantum proof private key.

So what you need to understand is this: after a blockchain is upgraded to a quantum secure blockchain, ALL coins are still accessible through the old private keys, and therefore still hackable by quantum computers. So even though this blockchain can claim to be quantum proof, their coins are NOT until the owner accesses them and takes action.

Now we come to the next point, where you will see why a big amount of the coins of an upgraded blockchain will never become quantum secure:

    Not all owners of coins will take the necessary action. That’s just human nature. (People don't read, or read half, don't understand, postpone, don't care, don't know how or don't see the point in any other way)

    There are a lot of coins without an actual active owner: the owners lost their private key, their password or got locked out in another way. It happens a lot. So especially with coins that exist for a while like BTC and ETH, there are a lot of coins that nobody even CAN move to a new wallet. Don’t underestimate the total amount of these coins. All these coins will still be accessible through the old private key after "quantum proving" the blockchain because the owners need to move them, or de-activate the old private key to lock your coins up with a quantum proof private key.

So lots of new quantum proof coins, will not be moved away from the old private key and be accessible through both their old private key and their new quantum proof private key. It’s like when your house has a cardboard front door anybody can walk through. And to fix that, your make an new unbreakable door and install that as your backdoor, while leaving your front door as it was. As long as you don’t build a brick wall where your cardboard door is, people can still walk in your house and steal your stuff. So the only conclusion can be: Even if you could upgrade an existing blockchain to a quantum proof blockchain (and wether or not that is possible is still open for discussion), then still, a big part of their circulating supply can be hacked. Is that a problem? Yes, even if you move and secure your own coins. The knowledge that there will be a % of the circulating supply vulerable for quantum computer hacks, will be enough to dump. So even without a (known) hack, it would be enough for quantum computers to reach the critical level. Then there is the case of an actual hack that would finnish the job. (Doesn't even need to be a hack to a blockchain. The hack of another 256 bit ECDSA protected entity would bring the news out and start an exodus. Ddon't underestimate the power of the masses + FUD. It's not the stolen coins from Mt.Gox that caused the price dump, it's the reaction of the people. Panic sales. It's part of crypto, it happened twice after the China FUD. Even if all China sold in a day, it wouldn't have caused the dump it did. It were people from the rest of the world that dumped when they heard the news about regulations that wouldn’t even apply to them personally.
Imagine you have your money in a bank. And they say: "From tomorrow, we will put your money in a different safe. Nobody will be able to steal it. You will still have 100$. We just need your autograph here, and here, thanks, you're set. ... Oh, and there will be some other funds, we're not sure how much, but we can't move that to our new safe. So that will be outside. ... It might likely be stolen somewhere in the future. But YOU will still have your 100$. ... Only it might be worth less. But the number is still 100, so you fine with that right?" No, you won't be fine with that. You would move your funds right away. As much as you love blockchain and the thought of beating the banks, the system, the thuoght of being part of something huge.. You still understand the value of money. Your money. And that will be your motivation, and the motivation of all other investors, your money and to be part of something greater: quantum secure blockchain. It will sink in with everyone sooner or later.. Most people are very protective of the projects they invest in. Naturaly.. Lots of people try to spread FUD. Competitors, but also banks, stock markets, governments, all enemies, all attacking. And people getting defensive. But people will distinguish FUD from real problems sooner or later.

So... Unless there is a competitor who does it better from the start then QRL, it's just a matter of time. QRL wil be top 25 at least in 3 years.

Wagerr: loved because they address a real use case. Decentralized apps + SmartC are ideal for gambling.
On top of that, their ICO was perfectly executed, in reasonable amounts. They now need to deliver.
Alongside Wagerr should be EGD (good hedge on the folio to have if you invest in gambling)

VIA+ARDOR: Bc i want some platform in my portfolio. ETH is in trouble, and if people are doubting about its capabilities to scale or anything, that means that there is room for others. It is not a surprise if Waves and Stratis raised so much. I prefer ARDR to VIA because of it relies on a better tech.
I'd add ARK as well in this category too (platforms)

DCORP: interesting ICO, not "Crazy" like EOS, TEZOS and co. Interesting product. Great team, with skills to address their target market.
(yes: what matters is NOT the dev talent anymore, but the business development team around him)

Underdog: QRL... (??)
I don't know what to think about this one...
Quantum computers are coming soon, and may impact the blockchain.. but I have mixed feelings about QRL
a- the team (difficult to get even serious linkedin references)
b- Quantum Computing is extremely specialized and requires lots of skills to even start addressing problems (but it can solve them quickly... or at least give you a good probability of the lowest energy "spot")
c- Quantum computing still have time (decades) before it hits the mainstream market. In the meantime, the business model will be CaaS (computing as a service, where you lease the calculation power): that would prevent some fraudulent use (cracking passwords or messing with blockchains).
d- Other blockchains will adapt to to be Quantum Resisstant. I still do not see how the QRL solution is unique and/or their IP protected.
...
e- but if I am wrong on b, c and d... then QRL is a hit.

Tokes : what is that ?
DCORP : the same
VIA : old altcoin
EDG : great potential, decentralised smart contract
LUN : had a nice ICO, do not know more about it
APX : I do not know what it is
QRL : the same
Block : the same
Minereum : the same
Ardor : on Poloniex so probably good
Wagerr : promising but has to show its potential
KMD : the best between all, has a great future

So for me, if I should pick three they would be : KMD, EDG and Wagerr. You should however have invester in their ICOs, now price is a lot more inflated than during the crowdsale ...

hey
guys whats your thoughs about this coin?

Tokes /DCORP /Via / EDG / lun / apx / qrl / Block / Minereum / Ardor / Wagerr & kmd

do u see any future for these?

pick 3 one & pls write actual reasons that you like that one.

tnx