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gene

sr. member

Activity: 252

Merit: 250

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: sarpar on August 28, 2012, 02:32:17 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: bitcoinBull on August 25, 2012, 01:14:38 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Bascule on August 25, 2012, 12:33:37 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Actually, I "know" what he was doing, and how he could make such profits. Now if on monday he hasn't paid back/post a news, I will explain the general concept. He was not a scammer, and it wasn't a ponzi, that's for sure. That doesn't mean he will be able to repay all of his debt.

Now I understand why you think pirate deserves to be thanked and everyone who called him a lowlife piece of shit should apologise.

Wait, what?

You'll understand what I meant on monday.

Do you promise on Monday?

Sure (but that could be thuesday for you, I live in France and will give Pirate his full day to give a payment or an explanation)

?

Considering that he will likely tell more on friday and that most here rely on assumptions and won't be open to discussion, I will just say that the general concept is probably exposed here. He was buying and selling coins

Quoting this too. Thanks for uncovering that specific jewel. Now, if you'll excuse me, I'll have to tend to my severe laughter-induced hemorrhage.

gene

sr. member

Activity: 252

Merit: 250

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Shadow383 on August 28, 2012, 08:08:48 PM

Welp, this thread's starting to look really fucking stupid:

" Bitcoin Savings & Trust has hereby given notice of default to it's account holders."

Oh you mean that only scams default, legitimate businesses don't?

Interesting.

By the way, yeah it was pretty obvious he was having troubles and would defaut, as it is obvious he is not a scammer. I stand by what everyword I said.

Quoting this for kicks.

proudhon

legendary

Activity: 2198

Merit: 1311

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 28, 2012, 08:13:31 PM

Funny that Pirate admits what already happened 12 days ago. He was in default the second he didn't pay someone who requested a withdraw.

Of course the question is now that he is in default what % can he repay. Will creditors get anything. If so how much. He spends time talking about things that aren't in dispute and then provides no new information.

This is just silly at this point.

finkleshnorts

sr. member

Activity: 336

Merit: 250

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 28, 2012, 08:13:31 PM

He spends time talking about things that aren't in dispute and then provides no new information.

lol.

DeathAndTaxes

donator

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1079

Gerald Davis

Funny that Pirate admits what already happened 12 days ago. He was in default the second he didn't pay someone who requested a withdraw.

Of course the question is now that he is in default what % can he repay. Will creditors get anything. If so how much. He spends time talking about things that aren't in dispute and then provides no new information.

BrightAnarchist

donator

Activity: 853

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Shadow383 on August 28, 2012, 08:08:48 PM

Welp, this thread's starting to look really fucking stupid:

" Bitcoin Savings & Trust has hereby given notice of default to it's account holders."

Yeah, just saw it, here's the full announcement:

[17:55] <@pirateat40> As much as I've tried to meet the deadlines within the community, there're conditions beyond my control which have escalated the process to the point it is today.
[17:55] <@pirateat40> Bitcoin Savings & Trust has hereby given notice of default to it's account holders.
[17:57] <@pirateat40> No timeline or further information is available at this time.

Shadow383

sr. member

Activity: 336

Merit: 250

Welp, this thread's starting to look really fucking stupid:

" Bitcoin Savings & Trust has hereby given notice of default to it's account holders."

bitlane

sr. member

Activity: 462

Merit: 250

I heart thebaron

Quote from: proudhon on August 28, 2012, 07:25:01 PM

Quote from: bitlane on August 27, 2012, 10:28:06 AM

I'm new here.

Is this where we say SORRY to Pirate ?

Yes, it's also where we can say "Thank You", too.

If you are thanking me, there's no need.

If you are telling me that I can say 'thank you' to Pirate, then by all means....Look forward to the response once I actually receive my payout.

proudhon

legendary

Activity: 2198

Merit: 1311

Quote from: bitlane on August 27, 2012, 10:28:06 AM

I'm new here.

Is this where we say SORRY to Pirate ?

Yes, it's also where we can say "Thank You", too.

sarpar

member

Activity: 100

Merit: 10

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: bitcoinBull on August 25, 2012, 01:14:38 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Bascule on August 25, 2012, 12:33:37 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Actually, I "know" what he was doing, and how he could make such profits. Now if on monday he hasn't paid back/post a news, I will explain the general concept. He was not a scammer, and it wasn't a ponzi, that's for sure. That doesn't mean he will be able to repay all of his debt.

Now I understand why you think pirate deserves to be thanked and everyone who called him a lowlife piece of shit should apologise.

Wait, what?

You'll understand what I meant on monday.

Do you promise on Monday?

Sure (but that could be thuesday for you, I live in France and will give Pirate his full day to give a payment or an explanation)

?

bitlane

sr. member

Activity: 462

Merit: 250

I heart thebaron

I'm new here.

Is this where we say SORRY to Pirate ?

muyuu

donator

Activity: 980

Merit: 1000

Quote from: ?? on ??

I don't think i will see my money back on this one man, but I still don't think it's a ponzi.

I'll post later tomorrow or today how you can make insane profits, and how you can screw up by being exposed in USD when all things in bitcoins are bullish Cheesy

556j

sr. member

Activity: 252

Merit: 250

Quote from: ?? on ??

I'm french

surprised you haven't surrendered yet.

muyuu

donator

Activity: 980

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Nubarius on August 27, 2012, 08:09:57 AM

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 27, 2012, 07:58:20 AM

A word of advice. Use the word price to describe changes in price. i.e. price inflation or price deflation.

Ok, that makes sense. I didn't realise it was common here to regard inflation as the sheer change in coin supply.

Well, it makes sense to assume that. What else is there? prices are basically never set in bitcoin directly. People look to exchanges and covert fiat to set prices, that's the reality of the situation.

Nubarius

sr. member

Activity: 310

Merit: 253

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 27, 2012, 07:58:20 AM

A word of advice. Use the word price to describe changes in price. i.e. price inflation or price deflation.

Ok, that makes sense. I didn't realise it was common here to regard inflation as the sheer change in coin supply.

muyuu

donator

Activity: 980

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Nubarius on August 27, 2012, 07:55:14 AM

Quote from: muyuu on August 27, 2012, 07:28:26 AM

(...) Bitcoin is not deflationary. Right now inflation is still over 25% yearly, and in December it will drop to about 12%. That's still very high inflation short-term and mid-term. The question is how many people hoard, and what are the effects of the long term ~0% inflation, and also the fact that the underlying bitcoin economy might be growing faster than money supply right now.

But "deflationary" is a misleading word to describe bitcoin's planned money supply.

Well, we have 25% inflation if you define the word 'inflation' solely in terms of the coin supply. But the normal meaning of 'inflation' and 'deflation' is related to how prices change, and in that sense we can say there is deflation now in the Bitcoin economy. This is because the user base for the currency is expanding quickly and people are willing to pay more and more fiat for a bitcoin. Since most products and services sold for bitcoins get their price by converting the expected price in fiat currency, things have been getting cheaper in BTC.

Thing is, inflation in that sense doesn't translate well since most prices are decided in terms of whatever the exchange rates are against fiat references. We have no significant price indices that are native to the bitcoin economy and the exchange rates are highly speculative and volatile.

The inflation that matters for trusts, banks and funds to be able to return a given %APR is mainly defined by M1 and M2, which also define consumer prices for established currencies.

Quote from: Nubarius on August 27, 2012, 07:55:14 AM

The pizza that was sold for 10,000 BTC in 2010 would be worth around 2 BTC now. That's quite a deflation rate, and I expect that trend to continue during the next years.

Considering the volatility that would be a risky bet for any given point in time. The pizza that was sold for 10,000 BTC in 2010 would be worth 0.7 BTC in July 2011 and 2 BTC now. Because pizzas are priced in fiat, not in bitcoin and they won't be priced in bitcoin any time soon.

DeathAndTaxes

donator

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1079

Gerald Davis

Quote from: Nubarius on August 27, 2012, 07:55:14 AM

Quote from: muyuu on August 27, 2012, 07:28:26 AM

(...) Bitcoin is not deflationary. Right now inflation is still over 25% yearly, and in December it will drop to about 12%. That's still very high inflation short-term and mid-term. The question is how many people hoard, and what are the effects of the long term ~0% inflation, and also the fact that the underlying bitcoin economy might be growing faster than money supply right now.

But "deflationary" is a misleading word to describe bitcoin's planned money supply.

Well, we have 25% 'inflation' if you define the word 'inflation' solely in terms of the coin supply. But the normal meaning of 'inflation' and 'deflation' is related to how prices change, and in that sense we can say there is deflation now in the Bitcoin economy. This is because the user base for the currency is expanding quickly and people are willing to pay more and more fiat for a bitcoin. Since most products and services sold for bitcoins get their price by converting the expected price in fiat currency, things have been getting cheaper in BTC. The pizza that was sold for 10,000 BTC in 2010 would be worth around 2 BTC now. That's quite a deflation rate, and I expect that trend to continue during the next years.

A word of advice. Use the word price to describe changes in price. i.e. price inflation or price deflation. Many people use the a definition of "change in money supply" as the meaning of inflation/deflation so if you are talking about change in price explicitly saying so avoids a lot of unnecessary back and forth (on ever single post).

The counter and then counter counter post and the probably still to come counter counter counter post ...

Nubarius

sr. member

Activity: 310

Merit: 253

Quote from: muyuu on August 27, 2012, 07:28:26 AM

(...) Bitcoin is not deflationary. Right now inflation is still over 25% yearly, and in December it will drop to about 12%. That's still very high inflation short-term and mid-term. The question is how many people hoard, and what are the effects of the long term ~0% inflation, and also the fact that the underlying bitcoin economy might be growing faster than money supply right now.

But "deflationary" is a misleading word to describe bitcoin's planned money supply.

Well, we have 25% inflation if you define the word 'inflation' solely in terms of the coin supply. But the normal meaning of 'inflation' and 'deflation' is related to how prices change, and in that sense we can say there is deflation now in the Bitcoin economy. This is because the user base for the currency is expanding quickly and people are willing to pay more and more fiat for a bitcoin. Since most products and services sold for bitcoins get their price by converting the expected price in fiat currency, things have been getting cheaper in BTC. The pizza that was sold for 10,000 BTC in 2010 would be worth around 2 BTC now. That's quite a deflation rate, and I expect that trend to continue during the next years.

DeathAndTaxes

donator

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1079

Gerald Davis

Quote from: Nubarius on August 27, 2012, 07:00:29 AM

Some people's perceptions about the nature of "investing" seem to be muddled by the effect of inflationary fiat currencies. In an inflationary currency system (defined as a system with an ever-growing monetary base), changing the format of your wealth to an asset like a house or some company's shares may give you a "return" in terms of the fiat currency simply because the value of the currency has decreased. This is why an interest rate around 2% in America or around 10% in India may be perfectly reasonable, and not a Ponzi scheme.

I would just point out that Pirate's "yield" was so high as to make any inflation or deflation adjustment to be immaterial. All investors are seeking REAL returns and thus the inflation risk is part of the interest calculation however 7% per week is 3,400% APR. The inflation component (or lack thereof) is utterly immaterial compared to that asinine interest rate.

3,400% APR in any currency under any circumstances is almost certainly a ponzi scheme and if it isn't the investor should have clear and detailed prospectus outlining why and be able to explain in their own words why. The fact that "this one might not be a ponzi" isn't sufficient. If that is what one is relying on well then it IS a ponzi.

gene

sr. member

Activity: 252

Merit: 250

Quote

People like Pirate are basically short-sellers who bet that Bitcoin will collapse (or who delude themselves thinking they can manipulate the market).

Nah. He's just a scam artist.

Quote

It is those who claimed that they could understand what Pirate was doing and that he was legit who should apologise for giving the guy any credibility.

Many (most?) of the supporters are more than just gullible fools - they are knowing and willing participants (in some cases, alternate accounts or pirate) who are simply extending the scam for greatest effect.

There really isn't any mystery here.

Topic: - - page 3. (Read 26925 times)