$1,000,000 would kill bitcoin - page 3.

Jet Cash

legendary

Activity: 2814

Merit: 2472

https://JetCash.com

Quote from: Welsh on June 25, 2019, 11:09:30 AM

I still personally believe that Bitcoin isn't really meant for a micro transaction currency, and will be used mostly for moving high amounts eventually.

I believe it was created by bankers as an experimental project. The idea was to tap the wealth of talent available in the "open source" communities, and to use this to finalise their ideas for the replacement of the debt laden fiat systems. The high transaction confirmation times, and the cap on the issued coins meant it would never become a volume service for daily transactions. They must be really pleased with the way it is providing them with a new source of massive wealth, as they remove coins from the available pools. They don't need to try to regulate Bitcoin, they just need to own most of the coins.

Welsh

staff

Activity: 3304

Merit: 4115

Despite all of us brushing this off like its nothing, and nonsense this was discussed at length a few years ago, and was a legitimate concern. Obviously, there's ways around it, and it appears that the majority of Bitcoin users are now aware of this fact. I still personally believe that Bitcoin isn't really meant for a micro transaction currency, and will be used mostly for moving high amounts eventually.

deisik

legendary

Activity: 3514

Merit: 1280

English ⬄ Russian Translation Services

Quote from: thirdprize on June 25, 2019, 04:52:56 AM

Even $100,000 would kill it. If 1 sat (or even 100 sat) == $1 then the fees would grind the system to a halt. The fees would be so high relative to the amount sent, that it wouldn't be worth it. From an investment perspective 1 sat==1$ is a nice round number. From a users perspective, only being able to buy things divisible by 1$ is crap

Bitcoin is not going to be a means of exchange

It is more and more becoming a store of value (sort of "digital gold", as they say). Real physical gold is a lot more expensive in terms of transaction costs (actually, it is a real pain in the ass to move it around in any significant amounts), but does that make it irrelevant or just cheap (not even speaking of killing it)? Not in the least, apparently. So why should Bitcoin be different in this regard? The point to take away from this is, transaction costs are not very important for a store of value. Use altcoins if you need to minimize your transaction costs

Mastrhiggins

jr. member

Activity: 31

Merit: 2

Quote from: thirdprize on June 25, 2019, 04:52:56 AM

Even $100,000 would kill it. If 1 sat (or even 100 sat) == $1 then the fees would grind the system to a halt. The fees would be so high relative to the amount sent, that it wouldn't be worth it. From an investment perspective 1 sat==1$ is a nice round number. From a users perspective, only being able to buy things divisible by 1$ is crap.

you are bad at math, can't take you seriously.

Vishnu.Reang

sr. member

Activity: 1988

Merit: 453

We are a long way away from $1,000,000 per coin. Even $100,000 per coin may take many years, if it happens at all. Now lets imagine a scenario in which the exchange rate of BTC rises to $100K. The market cap will be somewhere in the vicinity of $2 trillion and the real market cap (i.e after deducting the "lost" coins) will be somewhere between $1.6 trillion and $1.7 trillion.

Do you really think that the governments around the world would allow this to happen? They will never allow a decentralized currency to become the third largest one in terms of circulation volume.

And the second issue is with BTC mining. Right now cryptocurrency mining uses as much as 2% of the total electricity generation in the world. If the prices rise to $100K (i.e by 10x), then this proportion can rise to 20%. Do you think that this is viable?

Note that I was just talking about the $100K scenario. I didn't even considered one where BTC costs $1 million apiece.

Oceat

sr. member

Activity: 2506

Merit: 368

Don't worry it won't happen these days and we could still enjoy the bullishness of it until we get old. Let them predict as much as they can since it will worry them if they keep thinking about the things that's not going to happen yet. And if Bitcoin even touches $100k that shouldn't be a problem since we already have whales who hold more than that, did you see any problem of it besides of the transaction fees?

valentin68

full member

Activity: 459

Merit: 104

When Bitcoin has been invented in 2010, the intent was that the price of 1 Satoshi will be 1 USD somewhere in 2040 to 2070.
This will happen in approx 30 years from now, and the price of 1 Bitcoin will be approx 100 000 000 USD (that is 100 million USD).

1 000 000 would not kill the bitcoin, it is very probable that the price of 1 Bitcoin somewhere in 2023 will be 500 000 to 700 000 USD.

This will be the next bitcoin 20x price increase (in 2023), and very probable the next increase after this (30x) will happen in 2030.
Thus in 2030 it is very probable that the price of 1 bitcoin will be approx 10 000 000 USD/1 Bitcoin.

mk4

legendary

Activity: 2870

Merit: 3873

Paldo.io 🤖

Quote from: creeps on June 25, 2019, 06:55:13 AM

The excitement are on because the price are pumping, but if we saw another bear after this uptrend we might here news about dying bitcoin.

Bitcoin... dead? I wonder where(and how many times) I've seen this before.. https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin-obituaries/

BrewMaster

legendary

Activity: 2128

Merit: 1293

There is trouble abrewing

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on June 25, 2019, 08:20:28 AM

Quote from: mk4 on June 25, 2019, 05:41:34 AM

As far as I know, with 2nd layer technologies, you can pretty much have lower denominations than a satoshi.

Correct. The base unit in Lightning is already a millisatoshi (msat), or 0.001 of a satoshi. So even if one satoshi = $1 (which as pointed out above, would result in the marketcap of bitcoin being around 25 times higher than the amount of broad money in the entire world), you would still be able to divide down to the equivalent of 0.1 of a cent (which is obviously more divisible than fiat). And this is without even mentioning that fees on Lightning are generally a fraction of what they on chain.

lets not get carried away though. we still have a very long way to go before we can even begin to think about splitting bitcoin into units smaller than 1 Satoshi.
so far the smallest regular transaction paying the smallest fee is paying a total of a little less than 200 satoshi which is still 200 times more than the smallest unit which means we have 200 units to go before we reach the base unit.

Iceblast

full member

Activity: 783

Merit: 100

Quote from: freedomgo on June 25, 2019, 06:05:54 AM

It's not practical to use bitcoin with that kind of fee, maybe that time a Lightning Network will be very popular.
Using blockchain with high transaction fee is only good for huge transaction but to get a massive adoption, we want huge numbers of small money coming in.

Lightning network can be used as an option that can decorate bitcoin transactions. but for small networks there is no need to do this because don't think because of costs

Jet Cash

legendary

Activity: 2814

Merit: 2472

https://JetCash.com

The beauty of Bitcoin is that it is self adjusting, and it reacts to market forces. This means that it will never die. It won't even die when all of the available miners' rewards have been allocated. The higher the price, the more stable it will become in my opinion.

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18748

Quote from: mk4 on June 25, 2019, 05:41:34 AM

As far as I know, with 2nd layer technologies, you can pretty much have lower denominations than a satoshi.

Correct. The base unit in Lightning is already a millisatoshi (msat), or 0.001 of a satoshi. So even if one satoshi = $1 (which as pointed out above, would result in the marketcap of bitcoin being around 25 times higher than the amount of broad money in the entire world), you would still be able to divide down to the equivalent of 0.1 of a cent (which is obviously more divisible than fiat). And this is without even mentioning that fees on Lightning are generally a fraction of what they on chain.

funchiestz

sr. member

Activity: 1134

Merit: 342

Quote from: thirdprize on June 25, 2019, 04:52:56 AM

Even $100,000 would kill it. If 1 sat (or even 100 sat) == $1 then the fees would grind the system to a halt. The fees would be so high relative to the amount sent, that it wouldn't be worth it. From an investment perspective 1 sat==1$ is a nice round number. From a users perspective, only being able to buy things divisible by 1$ is crap.

As long as we look at Bitcoin for $, we will always be the loser. We should look at how Bitcoin integrates into our lives rather than USD value. Because the USD value sometimes increases and sometimes falls. However, Bitcoin and Blockchain continue to integrate into our lives day by day.

BrewMaster

legendary

Activity: 2128

Merit: 1293

There is trouble abrewing

OP's statement is based on his assumption that bitcoin doesn't change at all. but the truth is that bitcoin of today is not like the bitcoin of early days and it won't be the same in a couple of years too. the fundamentals stay the same but the details change to match the need of that time and keep the network healthy.

Dapper

sr. member

Activity: 560

Merit: 260

So it'll become difficult to move around... like bars of gold.

partysaurus

sr. member

Activity: 574

Merit: 251

Quote from: thirdprize on June 25, 2019, 04:52:56 AM

Even $100,000 would kill it. If 1 sat (or even 100 sat) == $1 then the fees would grind the system to a halt. The fees would be so high relative to the amount sent, that it wouldn't be worth it. From an investment perspective 1 sat==1$ is a nice round number. From a users perspective, only being able to buy things divisible by 1$ is crap.

if that happends im more afraid of the massive sell off , its going to push us down in a bear market once again, only if it grows slow and steady and not flying up this wont happend.

creeps

full member

Activity: 742

Merit: 144

Quote from: ethersalvation on June 25, 2019, 05:28:26 AM

It won't reach that Top .. ever.. so don't worry:) Cheesy

Don't put too much period on that because we don't know the future yet, bitcoin is good to surprise all those haters. I know it can't happen for the short term but who knows the moment we welcome the two decades of bitcoin with the most expensive price ever. Cheesy

Quote from: mk4 on June 25, 2019, 05:41:34 AM

Quote from: ZenGo on June 25, 2019, 05:36:12 AM

Not sure we need to worry about this yet.

A bit too early that's for sure. There are smart people working on Bitcoin. Whatever problems arise, potential solutions will come.

The excitement are on because the price are pumping, but if we saw another bear after this uptrend we might here news about dying bitcoin. This is normal in market prediction, we can go as high as we think in time.

dothebeats

legendary

Activity: 3542

Merit: 1352

Cashback 15%

You can still further divide satoshis into an even lower number if it comes to that, and for sure it will take a long time before we even reached that figure, ever. For now, third-party solutions for network confirmations are around, but even that would be pretty detrimental for the fate of the miners if most people would choose to get their transactions off-chain. But then again, there'd be solutions to that if it ever comes to the said scenario, just like all the number of problems laid bare in front of us in the days.

freedomgo

legendary

Activity: 3248

Merit: 1160

Playbet.io - Crypto Casino and Sportsbook

It's not practical to use bitcoin with that kind of fee, maybe that time a Lightning Network will be very popular.
Using blockchain with high transaction fee is only good for huge transaction but to get a massive adoption, we want huge numbers of small money coming in.

NeuroticFish

legendary

Activity: 3668

Merit: 6382

Looking for campaign manager? Contact icopress!

Quote from: thirdprize on June 25, 2019, 04:52:56 AM

Even $100,000 would kill it.

Interesting that when the price is low everybody fears that the miners will not have enough revenue, so Bitcoin will die.

Now the high price kills Bitcoin? Just because some just play around with a couple of Satoshi they want to send and it's expensive? Well, there's the option to consolidate the inputs, also for so small amounts (even if they may mean a dollar or two) maybe it would worth thinking twice if a transfer is really needed.

And, also for small amounts, there's LN, with much lower fees, isn't it?

Topic: $1,000,000 would kill bitcoin - page 3. (Read 7926 times)